Jewelers say

[greensky]

...They "won't negotiate". What should we do? We're seeking a stone from a B&M jewelery store (not from an internet vendor) that's 1 -1.20 carat and anticipate the diamond will cost $5-7,000. So far, two jewelry stores -- including the one where we bought the band - have told us flat out they "do not negotiate" the price of their loose diamonds. They say it is "already discounted" and that they "don't play games".

From what I've read on the internet, diamonds are as negotiable as anything else. In fact, I'm told the price SHOULD be negotiated - similar to when you buy a car. Is the attitude of these two jewelers typical? Should we just forget about these jewelers altogether?

These jewelers are in the St. Louis metro area. They are both independently owned (not mall jewelers, or chains), for what that's worth. Any advice appreciated. Thank you.

 

[jaz464]

I would go to the top of this page and type in the specs for the diamond you are looking for (under Pricescope Your Diamond). Then you will be a good judge of whether a diamond is overpriced or not. I don''t think not negotiating is bad if the prices are good. After all, few online vendors willl negotiate more than a few hundred dollars (and some will not come down at all). If you love a diamond and the price seems competitive, I would go for it. If a jeweler is asking too much for his diamonds and will not negotiate, I would look elsewhere.

 

[belle]

hey greensky

welcome to ps!
i''m sure you will get some interesting answers to this question.
can you negotiate? sure, you can try...why not. i think if a store says they don''t negotiate, i would guess they don''t however. if you feel that negotiations need to be part of the sale, perhaps you should find someone willing to do so. hopefully you will find a business you are comfortable working with, negotiations or not.

 

[Lorelei]

I don't know if you would meet with much success negotiating with online vendors, they are operating under slim margins as it is in order to bring the best price to the consumer. If you have been looking in B&M jewellers you may find with searching online that you might find the prices are better than you thought as B&M jewellers have much higher overheads and this reflects on the prices. However there is no harm in trying I guess.

 

[Regular Guy]

I think your concern about whether they will negotiate or not is misplaced.

Consider some 1 carat G VS2 for sale at two jewelers that are next to each other, with 2 different names, with 2 store fronts, but actually they are connected at the back, and so they only have one stock of diamonds they share between them.

One guy sells it for $9K and will bargain with you down to $7, the other guy is firm at $6500, and won''t budge. Who will you really like better?

For helpful negotiation strategies, otherwise, see this.

 

[denverappraiser]

Date: 12/8/2005 10:05:47 AM
Author: Regular Guy
I think your concern about whether they will negotiate or not is misplaced.

Consider some 1 carat G VS2 for sale at two jewelers that are next to each other, with 2 different names, with 2 store fronts, but actually they are connected at the back, and so they only have one stock of diamonds they share between them.

One guy sells it for $9K and will bargain with you down to $7, the other guy is firm at $6500, and won''t budge. Who will you really like better?

For helpful negotiation strategies, otherwise, see this.

Great advice Ira. Look at each deal for what it is. I''ve always had a strong preference fo stores that are upfront about their pricing strategies where the quality of the deal you get isn''t a function of how well you play the game. I''m far happier if they just tell me what it costs and I will then decide it I want to buy or move on. I hate car shopping for this reason. Frankly, I get offended if a dealer offers me something at one price and, when I refuse, they make a better offer. This tells me that they lied the first time and were just hoping I was a sucker. Why should I believe them the second time after I''ve already got solid evidence that they''re liars?

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver

 

[greensky]

OK - well this is actually good news and makes my job easier. I got the impression from the research I''ve done on the internet (and I''ve done quite a bit) that all jewelers *should* negotiate - that it was expected. But it sounds like most of you are saying that is not the case.

Thanks to everyone for their replies.

 

[oldminer]

As others have told you, look for and value honesty and fairness in the initial pricing. Inform yourself in advance of what is a nearly correct level of price and then go shop. A lot depends on personalities and there is no single way to handle it. Some people love or need to haggle. Some stores don't mind and others are fixed price places.

I bet the places with fixed prices often take a trade-in. That's when even they will bargain over the price. Just like buying a car from a 1 price dealership, the trade-in always creates a bargaining situation in spite of the advertising which misleads many into being sheep and not smart shoppers.

You can't hope to bargain over a very good price, but if you are well informed, you won't be out of line to ask for a better deal when the profit might allow it.

 

[SeaOats]

Date: 12/8/2005 11:22:01 AM
Author: denverappraiser

Date: 12/8/2005 10:05:47 AM
Author: Regular Guy
I think your concern about whether they will negotiate or not is misplaced.

Consider some 1 carat G VS2 for sale at two jewelers that are next to each other, with 2 different names, with 2 store fronts, but actually they are connected at the back, and so they only have one stock of diamonds they share between them.

One guy sells it for $9K and will bargain with you down to $7, the other guy is firm at $6500, and won''t budge. Who will you really like better?

For helpful negotiation strategies, otherwise, see this.

Great advice Ira. Look at each deal for what it is. I''ve always had a strong preference fo stores that are upfront about their pricing strategies where the quality of the deal you get isn''t a function of how well you play the game. I''m far happier if they just tell me what it costs and I will then decide it I want to buy or move on. I hate car shopping for this reason. Frankly, I get offended if a dealer offers me something at one price and, when I refuse, they make a better offer. This tells me that they lied the first time and were just hoping I was a sucker. Why should I believe them the second time after I''ve already got solid evidence that they''re liars?

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ISA NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver

I absolutely agree with Neil and Regular Guy. Who cares whether they will negotiate (I''d rather they didn''t personally). All that matters is the price they are asking. To find out whether their prices are reasonable, use the "Pricescope Your Diamond" feature on the top of the page. Just keep in mind that B&M stores have more overhead costs, which should result in a slightly higher cost over the online prices. But, with a B&M, you are getting more services than with an online store, i.e. you can go back to have it cleaned, repaired, checked, etc. It''s always nice to have a jeweler in your area that you trust instead of having to ship your ring back to an online vendor everytime something is damaged or needs minor repair work, etc.

So in the end, if they are asking a fair price, there is no need to negotiate. Think how silly it would be if I went grocery shopping, put everything on the conveyor belt at the register, and everytime the cashier rang up an item I said "Hmmm...you say $2.50...I''ll give you $1.99. Deal?"

 

[Brighter_Suns]

I am in sales myself and have learned from customers some of the art of negotiating. Some people are uncomfortable with the subject and don''t know how to bring it into a conversation. My advice is this; if you do nothing else just simply ask this simply question "Is that your best price?". Inexperianced sales people will often pause and then admit they might be able to do something and you will immediately know there is room to move. The above posed advice is excellent.....don''t negociate until you have already researched what the correct market price should be. Negotiating a $9k diamond to $7500 might feel good but if the diamond is only worth $6.5 you still overpaid.

I know of one professional purchaser who immediately talks to sales people like the decision is already made to buy, he is asking questions about the purchase details that are sending closing messages to the salesperson, who is now already in his/her mind spending his/her commision and caluculating how this sale will help meet budget. The trick he explains is ensuring all details are accounted for.......shipping, packaging, insurance, taxes etc. and then hitting them up with price objection. By this point the sales person is not trying to make a sale but rather fighting to save one he/she already had (at least in their mind). If there is room to move..................nothing will motivate them like the thought of loosing somthing they felt they already had.

 

[greensky]

I know of one professional purchaser who immediately talks to sales people like the decision is already made to buy, he is asking questions about the purchase details that are sending closing messages to the salesperson, who is now already in his/her mind spending his/her commision and caluculating how this sale will help meet budget. The trick he explains is ensuring all details are accounted for.......shipping, packaging, insurance, taxes etc. and then hitting them up with price objection. By this point the sales person is not trying to make a sale but rather fighting to save one he/she already had (at least in their mind). If there is room to move..................nothing will motivate them like the thought of loosing somthing they felt they already had.

This is great advice on how to obtain a critical psychological advantage very simply. Thank you. It''s simple but makes a whole lot of sense. I will remember it forever, whenever I buy anything!

 

[cinnabar]

My husband and I both absolutely loathe "haggling". While many consumers prefer to buy from B&M shops for that "personal" experience, we just wanted to do the deal and get on with it, so we loved being able to buy a diamond online from a vendor who didn''t offer the option of "negotiation".

Arguing over prices always reminds me of that scene in Monty Python''s Life of Brian, where Brian just wants to get on with his life and not waste time pointlessly haggling over the cost of a gourd.

I''d rather spend the haggling time asking half a dozen sellers, "Is that your best price?" once, rather than asking the same seller "Is that your best price?" half a dozen times.

 

[Patty]

I also would much rather buy something knowing that there is a set price.

 

[elmo]

Try to make sure you're comparing apples to apples when you "go to the top of the page and type in the specs". It's not fair to compare AGS ideal to something with AGS 0 proportions only; drop shippers to stone stockers; stones with GIA to EGL reports; 1.3 carats to 1.0 carat; rounds to ovals; etc. If you've read through the info here I guess you know this already

.

Instead of getting just the lowest pricescope price, a more realistic comparison might be to look at Blue Nile in addition to the range of pricescope prices. I think a B&M should be able to offer pricing more or less competitive with BN and still run a successful business. If you're really comparing apples to apples and the price is in the same range, chances are the they should be commended for trying to address the internet head-on, with the additional benefit of seeing multiple stones hands-on. If price is significantly more, I'd have to question the cost of the additional services they're providing.