Jewelers Mutual Insurance - Now I'm really confused.

[Cricketcat]

So, a couple days ago I applied for Jewelers Mutual Insurance. I have a loose Brian Gavin diamond and a setting. I've been waiting to get the diamond set, until the policy goes through underwriting and I have a policy definitely in place. I called Jewelers Mutual to check on it this afternoon, as I don't like having the diamond loose, and would really like to get it set. They told me the policy is still in underwriting/processing, but I could go ahead and get the diamond set. I told Jewelers Mutual that I was waiting because I wanted everything in place, just in case, for example, the diamond were to be chipped during setting. Jewelers Mutual told me that's something the jeweler setting the diamond would be responsible for even if you have Jewelers Mutual insurance. That statement goes against what I've read here on Pricescope. Now I'm a little worried about Jewelers Mutual in general. Any thoughts about what to do?

 

[msop04]

So, a couple days ago I applied for Jewelers Mutual Insurance. I have a loose Brian Gavin diamond and a setting. I've been waiting to get the diamond set, until the policy goes through underwriting and I have a policy definitely in place. I called Jewelers Mutual to check on it this afternoon, as I don't like having the diamond loose, and would really like to get it set. They told me the policy is still in underwriting/processing, but I could go ahead and get the diamond set. I told Jewelers Mutual that I was waiting because I wanted everything in place, just in case, for example, the diamond were to be chipped during setting. Jewelers Mutual told me that's something the jeweler setting the diamond would be responsible for even if you have Jewelers Mutual insurance. That statement goes against what I've read here on Pricescope. Now I'm a little worried about Jewelers Mutual in general. Any thoughts about what to do?

This is true. It was my understanding that the jeweler setting the stone is always responsible -- which is one of the reasons why some vendors won't work with outside stones. Why are you worried about JM -- did you read your policy? It should state everything in there regarding what they will cover.

 

[Cricketcat]

Jewelers Mutual said I will have coverage as of 7/30/14 pending what comes out of underwriting, and I have paid Jewelers Mutual (charges have posted already to credit card), but technically not until underwriting/processing is finished maybe sometime next week. It seems like I've read on here that you want to have insurance on the diamond in case anything happens to it during the setting process, especially if someone else is setting it. But, if the jeweler setting the diamond is responsible for chipping or damage to the diamond during setting, then I don't need to worry about having insurance for setting purposes?

 

[Cricketcat]

I meant to say, even though I've paid for insurance, I technically don't have a policy yet, hence nothing to read.

 

[WinkHPD]

Jewelers Mutual will pay you and then go after the Jeweler. Unless, of course he has a Jewelers Mutual Policy. Which I an many other jewelers do. They will not bother going after themselves. None of this affects you.

Wink

 

[drk14]

Jewelers Mutual told me that's something the jeweler setting the diamond would be responsible for even if you have Jewelers Mutual insurance.

I will soon face your same situation (buying insurance to have a loose diamond set), and I agree that something does not seem right about this. At face value, of course the statement is correct -- if the jeweler damages the diamond they would be liable by default. However, I think that among jewelers who will actually agree to work on a customer's loose stone, many would only do so if you release them from liability by signing a waiver. If that's the case, then the jeweler would no longer be responsible.

What is more troubling is that it sounds like the JM representative was implying that damage during setting by a jeweler is not a covered loss under their policy. Hopefully the representative was simply misinformed. If I were you I would trust only what is in writing in the policy. You should be able to ask them to send you a sample policy that contains all the terms and exceptions, even if your policy has not gone through underwriting yet.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[WinkHPD]

We have had this conversation with JM before and with some of the top officers of the company and they assured us that the individual is covered if they have the appraisal for the ring and the diamond and buy insurance.

I think you may have been talking with someone who is not familiar with this policy of JM's, which is entirely possible as they are a fairly large company.

Their explanation to us some years ago was that they would pay the claimant and then seek redress from the jeweler involved. Unless of course the jeweler had a JM policy.

I would suggest you speak to someone higher up in the company if you have a question, but without insurance you will NOT get a jeweler who will guarantee you against any damage to your diamond.

Think about it. You are going to be paying a small fee, say $50 to $200 dollars, to set a diamond worth many thousands of dollars. If you were the jeweler, would you accept the commission on a diamond you did not sell?

Wink

 

[msop04]

We have had this conversation with JM before and with some of the top officers of the company and they assured us that the individual is covered if they have the appraisal for the ring and the diamond and buy insurance.

I think you may have been talking with someone who is not familiar with this policy of JM's, which is entirely possible as they are a fairly large company.

Their explanation to us some years ago was that they would pay the claimant and then seek redress from the jeweler involved. Unless of course the jeweler had a JM policy.

I would suggest you speak to someone higher up in the company if you have a question, but without insurance you will NOT get a jeweler who will guarantee you against any damage to your diamond.

Think about it. You are going to be paying a small fee, say $50 to $200 dollars, to set a diamond worth many thousands of dollars. If you were the jeweler, would you accept the commission on a diamond you did not sell?

Wink

+1 This exactly.

 

[msop04]

However, I think that among jewelers who will actually agree to work on a customer's loose stone, many would only do so if you release them from liability by signing a waiver. If that's the case, then the jeweler would no longer be responsible.

What is more troubling is that it sounds like the JM representative was implying that damage during setting by a jeweler is not a covered loss under their policy. Hopefully the representative was simply misinformed. If I were you I would trust only what is in writing in the policy. You should be able to ask them to send you a sample policy that contains all the terms and exceptions, even if your policy has not gone through underwriting yet.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Would you agree to release all liability on a stone you paid thousands for??? I know I wouldn't.

I would imagine any reputable jeweler would never ask you to do this -- it's an "occupational hazard" they face daily in their line of work, and they should have insurance to cover such things... or only set stones they have sold.

FWIW, I was told that by JM that I was insured after my payment, even before the underwriting was complete.

 

[WinkHPD]

However, I think that among jewelers who will actually agree to work on a customer's loose stone, many would only do so if you release them from liability by signing a waiver. If that's the case, then the jeweler would no longer be responsible.

What is more troubling is that it sounds like the JM representative was implying that damage during setting by a jeweler is not a covered loss under their policy. Hopefully the representative was simply misinformed. If I were you I would trust only what is in writing in the policy. You should be able to ask them to send you a sample policy that contains all the terms and exceptions, even if your policy has not gone through underwriting yet.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Would you agree to release all liability on a stone you paid thousands for??? I know I wouldn't.

I would imagine any reputable jeweler would never ask you to do this -- it's an "occupational hazard" they face daily in their line of work, and they should have insurance to cover such things... or only set stones they have sold.

FWIW, I was told that by JM that I was insured after my payment, even before the underwriting was complete.

We can not buy reasonable insurance to cover such things, so we can not accept liability for diamonds that we did not sell. Stating this upfront would, in my opinion, make us more reputable than hiding it until or unless the need arose. We have declined many times the "privilege" of accepting this risk for a $50 setting job. It just makes no sense to make a few dollars on a setting and be at risk for thousands of dollars every time we do so.

When we sell both the mounting and the diamond, then we have to do it and most times waste no time in worrying about it. Although I am sweating an 11ct custom cut golden yellow apatite that our bench made us sign a waiver for. If it breaks, I write a refund check. If it does not, my client and I will both be happy.

I sold the mounting, and the stone, so I am willing to take the risk. However, if you brought either to me, the risk would be all yours. It would be fine with me if you chose, with full knowledge and ahead of the work being done, to not have the work done. I think both parties need to go into such a deal with their eyes open and then chose whether or not to do the deal.

Wink

 

[msop04]

However, I think that among jewelers who will actually agree to work on a customer's loose stone, many would only do so if you release them from liability by signing a waiver. If that's the case, then the jeweler would no longer be responsible.

What is more troubling is that it sounds like the JM representative was implying that damage during setting by a jeweler is not a covered loss under their policy. Hopefully the representative was simply misinformed. If I were you I would trust only what is in writing in the policy. You should be able to ask them to send you a sample policy that contains all the terms and exceptions, even if your policy has not gone through underwriting yet.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Would you agree to release all liability on a stone you paid thousands for??? I know I wouldn't.

I would imagine any reputable jeweler would never ask you to do this -- it's an "occupational hazard" they face daily in their line of work, and they should have insurance to cover such things... or only set stones they have sold.
FWIW, I was told that by JM that I was insured after my payment, even before the underwriting was complete.

We can not buy reasonable insurance to cover such things, so we can not accept liability for diamonds that we did not sell. Stating this upfront would, in my opinion, make us more reputable than hiding it until or unless the need arose. We have declined many times the "privilege" of accepting this risk for a $50 setting job. It just makes no sense to make a few dollars on a setting and be at risk for thousands of dollars every time we do so.
When we sell both the mounting and the diamond, then we have to do it and most times waste no time in worrying about it. Although I am sweating an 11ct custom cut golden yellow apatite that our bench made us sign a waiver for. If it breaks, I write a refund check. If it does not, my client and I will both be happy.

I sold the mounting, and the stone, so I am willing to take the risk. However, if you brought either to me, the risk would be all yours. It would be fine with me if you chose, with full knowledge and ahead of the work being done, to not have the work done. I think both parties need to go into such a deal with their eyes open and then chose whether or not to do the deal.

Wink

There would be no way I would sign a waiver if "someone" didn't have insurance (whether it be me or the jeweler)... so this was my point. I probably should have been more clear.

I can only imagine what that type of insurance would cost a jeweler... not feasible at all. Yikes! I've only had one diamond set (in a bezel) by a different jeweler... the first thing he asked me was if it was insured -- "in the event something happened during setting." He said even though they'd never had anything happen, he just couldn't agree to work on it [in good conscience] if I didn't have it insured. And I signed a receipt stating that it was insured by me, and that I fully understood. Upfront and honest.

 

[WinkHPD]

Excellent. First I thought we agreed, then thought, hmmm, no we don't and now I see, that if I read more completely that we do agree.

Agreeing is good!



Wink

 

[msop04]

Excellent. First I thought we agreed, then thought, hmmm, no we don't and now I see, that if I read more completely that we do agree.

Agreeing is good!



Wink

Totally my fault!! I reread my post and was like, "Ummm... I need to be more clear with this or risk looking like a crazy person!" HA!

 

[WinkHPD]

Excellent. First I thought we agreed, then thought, hmmm, no we don't and now I see, that if I read more completely that we do agree.

Agreeing is good!



Wink

Totally my fault!! I reread my post and was like, "Ummm... I need to be more clear with this or risk looking like a crazy person!" HA!

LOL! Okay, you win, it's your fault. If we ever meet face to face you get to buy the first drink...

Wink

 

[msop04]

Excellent. First I thought we agreed, then thought, hmmm, no we don't and now I see, that if I read more completely that we do agree.

Agreeing is good!



Wink

Totally my fault!! I reread my post and was like, "Ummm... I need to be more clear with this or risk looking like a crazy person!" HA!

LOL! Okay, you win, it's your fault. If we ever meet face to face you get to buy the first drink...

Wink

HA! Deal**!!

**will trade drinks for diamonds

 

[drk14]

We can not buy reasonable insurance to cover such things, so we can not accept liability for diamonds that we did not sell. Stating this upfront would, in my opinion, make us more reputable than hiding it until or unless the need arose. We have declined many times the "privilege" of accepting this risk for a $50 setting job. It just makes no sense to make a few dollars on a setting and be at risk for thousands of dollars every time we do so.

For the record, I agree with all the above, and it is a perfectly reasonable position for a jeweler to take (arguably, the only rational position). But this highlights the absurdity of the statement made by the JM representative to OP ("...the jeweler setting the diamond would be responsible for [damage] even if you have Jewelers Mutual insurance")!

 

[WinkHPD]

Agreed, that person obviously does not have the full picture. The insurance company will always try to recover from the jeweler's insurance if they can, but will not go after a Jewelers Mutual insured jeweler because they are in effect going after themselves.

We went clear to the upper management circles to make sure this was correct some years ago, and somewhere here are a couple of posts from JM stating what has been said in this thread.

Maybe Gypsy or Ame, who are MUCH better at searching things out than I am can find those comments to reassure our OP.

Wink