Is your e-ring UN-insured?

[Harriet]

Date: 7/16/2007 3:55:52 PM
Author: Nicrez
Harriet, I understand. Insurance in NY is INSANE. Because so is the mugging and loss...

As a matter of fact, in my company (and most on 47th) the largest expenses are Insurance #1, then Shipping or rent. Truly. Insurance is ALWAYS the highest cost. BUT, in your case, I would consider it a necessary evil of having a pricey stone.

he must be into hedge funds! LOL I-bankers all want to cut the insurance costs. Honestly, it''s because of their hedging bets all day long, shorting stocks and playing with numbers they think they have it figured out. Tell DF that in the end it''s going to pay off if you pay as much insurance as HALF the cost of the ring. Thereafter you can just take that SAME amount you spent on insurance premium and put it into an account, should the ring get stolen. If not maybe it''s another piece of jewlery. Insuring is not pittance here in NY, but maybe cut out the cleaning lady and cook at home...

It''s worth it. To me jewlery requires upkeep like a car. Cleanings, updating appraisals, etc. Like buying a Rolex and getting it wound...

Also, look into getting a rider off of your renter''s insurance, or even car insurance. If not, what I learned is tha Jewler''s Mutual was a bit pricer, but had the best coverage. Chubb was a bit cheaper, and decent. Get quotes, or if you have any union or affiliations, try those companies. I have a friend who''s a teacher and she got her ring specially insured through her union...?

Nicrez,
I''ve gotten a number of quotes and the premium is obscene.
He is. I should ask him what we should short to hedge the risk of something happening to my ring (touch wood).
I''ll look into those things you suggested. Thanks.

 

[jstarfireb]

Mine was uninsured until last week. My reasoning behind not insuring it was that I live in a pretty safe area, I''m VERY careful with my ring, and I''m not planning on having it reset. My other big concern was that the cost of insurance over ~50 years (I''m only 24, and I estimate that I have at least a 74-year life expectancy) would add up to the cost of the ring if the premiums were 2%/year. So basically, if I never needed to have it replaced, I still would have paid for the ring over again. However, my premium is actually a good bit less than that, so I may end up keeping it insured for my lifetime if the premium doesn''t skyrocket when I move to a higher-crime area next year.

What convinced me to get it insured (with Jewelers Mutual) was the wisdom of a few PSers. The consensus was that if (god forbid!) your ring got damaged, lost, or stolen, and you can foot the bill to replace it without breaking the bank, then there''s no need for insurance (except if it helps give you peace of mind). In my case, we couldn''t afford to replace the ring now. My fiance is living on student loans and used what little savings he had to pay for the ring. On top of this all, my stone is a princess cut, and with all the horror stories about corners chipping and whatnot, I think a princess pretty much has to be insured. IIRC, yours isn''t a princess, but any stone that''s being reset is exposed to an increased risk of chipping.

 

[diamondfan]

I just do not see how where you live etc ultimately matters. You could smash it, travel and have it stolen or have loose prongs and lose it god knows where. I just would not leave things to chance without knowing I could replace it out of pocket with no concerns. Otherwise, there are so many variables that one cannot account for...

 

[Cathers]

My ER is insured, for the appraised value. However, since the appraisal, I was told that the ring had structural damage(by the place that manufactured the ring) so I am not sure where that leaves me, insurance/replacement cost wise now. I hope that if *god forbid* something happens, that they replace it, for what it was appraised for! Oh, it cost me 65.00 to add the floater/replacement cost policy to my house insurance, and the ring was appraised at 3925.00.

 

[rainbowtrout]

Not yet, right now its in a safety deposit box in Boston. Hopefully it will get put in under our renter''s insurance next year in New York.

 

[Steel]

As always I agree with the prevailing sentiments expressed.

I have insured my jewellery through sheer perseverance (and against the better efforts of many insurance brokers and having been driven to the brink of insanity by the inane jingles on the hold button).

I have a huge issue with the cost : benefit ratio.

Firstly, the cost of the policy will overtake replacement values, more so when I upgrade. As I plan to have a significant collection I could pay the cost of Wf ACA .8 D Si1''s yearly for nothing.

Secondly, as you may know I live in Ireland. I have issues with the level of services available here and this sentiment is not failed on the insurance industry. Chubb will only insure me via the UK Chubb office and that is if my collection reaches £100''000. What nonsense. So I was forced to go as an add on to my home policy. Any question I ask involved being put on hold by the lady on the phone for a small age while she rang ''head office''. I was not allowed to call ''head office'' so the game of Chinese whispers continued. It took 30 mins (no less) to confirm that the policy was a buy out replacement policy at my request/approval. Surely this is a basic question? Therefore to come to my second issue, I am entirely confident that should the worst occur, (in spite of the above clarification) I am faced with a wait longer than reasonable wait (in anybodies book) on the telephone trying to explain the requirements of ideal cut and certification, while they try to pawn me off on a lower stone (I am expert selection D VS1). I can see it in my tea leaves....

So like the spineless wonder I am, I fork out for the benefits of a service I hope to goodness I never ever have to use. Moreover because I dread that the saga which will no double ensure will be of epic proportions

.

 

[pyramid]

Date: 7/16/2007 4:21:49 PM
Author: jstarfireb
Mine was uninsured until last week. My reasoning behind not insuring it was that I live in a pretty safe area, I''m VERY careful with my ring, and I''m not planning on having it reset. My other big concern was that the cost of insurance over ~50 years (I''m only 24, and I estimate that I have at least a 74-year life expectancy) would add up to the cost of the ring if the premiums were 2%/year. So basically, if I never needed to have it replaced, I still would have paid for the ring over again. However, my premium is actually a good bit less than that, so I may end up keeping it insured for my lifetime if the premium doesn''t skyrocket when I move to a higher-crime area next year.

What convinced me to get it insured (with Jewelers Mutual) was the wisdom of a few PSers. The consensus was that if (god forbid!) your ring got damaged, lost, or stolen, and you can foot the bill to replace it without breaking the bank, then there''s no need for insurance (except if it helps give you peace of mind). In my case, we couldn''t afford to replace the ring now. My fiance is living on student loans and used what little savings he had to pay for the ring. On top of this all, my stone is a princess cut, and with all the horror stories about corners chipping and whatnot, I think a princess pretty much has to be insured. IIRC, yours isn''t a princess, but any stone that''s being reset is exposed to an increased risk of chipping.

So are you saying that if you chipped the corner off the stone next year, then you would have to wait until your 74th year to replace it because only then would you have saved enough to cover the cost of it. I know that is not true because you will earn different amounts, and things change for the good and worse, but just looking at it from the other side as you said about by the time you were that age you would have paid for another. Not directed at you just that is a different way of looking at it.

 

[pyramid]

Steel

There was a webinar here a few months back, that was when Surfgirl who posts here arranged her insurance through this agent, anyway I will look for the text from it I saved, because during the conversation, it was with the late Rockdoc, it was his webinar, I asked about Chubb insurance in the UK and I have not contacted the person who he had come into the webinar but they replied in the text that I could contact them from the UK and they would try to help me arrange over here I assume the same as the USA pricescopers are getting.

Here is the text from part of that webinar, Surfgirl was more into it than I was and would be able to explain it better to you, she ended up getting hers sorted by this person I believe:

I asked him about Chubb Insurance in the UK if there was one, because I didn't know and his reply was

tinsure: Pyramid, I work primarily in the US but have placed insurance all over the world with contacts that we have developed in our time in business. If you contact me I will try to help.
tinsure: I'm sure I can get you a name that you can deal with locally completely apart from anything I do.
tinsure: www.touchstoneinsurance.com his name was Mr Ralph Cohen, he was an agent for Chubb for the Denver area I believe.

Just thought maybe it is Irish Republic rather than Northern Ireland but I think from the way he spoke he would try to help.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/16/2007 4:21:49 PM
Author: jstarfireb
Mine was uninsured until last week. My reasoning behind not insuring it was that I live in a pretty safe area, I''m VERY careful with my ring, and I''m not planning on having it reset. My other big concern was that the cost of insurance over ~50 years (I''m only 24, and I estimate that I have at least a 74-year life expectancy) would add up to the cost of the ring if the premiums were 2%/year. So basically, if I never needed to have it replaced, I still would have paid for the ring over again. However, my premium is actually a good bit less than that, so I may end up keeping it insured for my lifetime if the premium doesn''t skyrocket when I move to a higher-crime area next year.

What convinced me to get it insured (with Jewelers Mutual) was the wisdom of a few PSers. The consensus was that if (god forbid!) your ring got damaged, lost, or stolen, and you can foot the bill to replace it without breaking the bank, then there''s no need for insurance (except if it helps give you peace of mind). In my case, we couldn''t afford to replace the ring now. My fiance is living on student loans and used what little savings he had to pay for the ring. On top of this all, my stone is a princess cut, and with all the horror stories about corners chipping and whatnot, I think a princess pretty much has to be insured. IIRC, yours isn''t a princess, but any stone that''s being reset is exposed to an increased risk of chipping.

Might you cancel the insurance in the future?

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/16/2007 5:34:03 PM
Author: Çã†hër§
My ER is insured, for the appraised value. However, since the appraisal, I was told that the ring had structural damage(by the place that manufactured the ring) so I am not sure where that leaves me, insurance/replacement cost wise now. I hope that if *god forbid* something happens, that they replace it, for what it was appraised for! Oh, it cost me 65.00 to add the floater/replacement cost policy to my house insurance, and the ring was appraised at 3925.00.

Oh no! What happened?

 

[boston_jeff]

Date: 7/16/2007 10:43:48 AM
Author:Harriet
My DF thinks the probability of damage/loss is too low to warrant insurance. But, mine is being re-set this week, and risk-averse me is concerned about chipping.

This same argument can be made with respect to any insurance-- it is always a "bad deal" if you are risk-neutral-- this includes term life insurance, car insurance (to the extent it is not required by law), casualty insurance, etc.

Most of us are risk-averse, however, and insurance is a very nice thing to sooth the conscious. I would only not insure if I had literally millions of dollar in the bank, and then I probably would anyway, just for piece of mind (no regrets).

 

[Skippy123]

how much is the insurance?

 

[jstarfireb]

Date: 7/16/2007 5:58:49 PM
Author: Pyramid

Date: 7/16/2007 4:21:49 PM

Author: jstarfireb

Mine was uninsured until last week. My reasoning behind not insuring it was that I live in a pretty safe area, I''m VERY careful with my ring, and I''m not planning on having it reset. My other big concern was that the cost of insurance over ~50 years (I''m only 24, and I estimate that I have at least a 74-year life expectancy) would add up to the cost of the ring if the premiums were 2%/year. So basically, if I never needed to have it replaced, I still would have paid for the ring over again. However, my premium is actually a good bit less than that, so I may end up keeping it insured for my lifetime if the premium doesn''t skyrocket when I move to a higher-crime area next year.


What convinced me to get it insured (with Jewelers Mutual) was the wisdom of a few PSers. The consensus was that if (god forbid!) your ring got damaged, lost, or stolen, and you can foot the bill to replace it without breaking the bank, then there''s no need for insurance (except if it helps give you peace of mind). In my case, we couldn''t afford to replace the ring now. My fiance is living on student loans and used what little savings he had to pay for the ring. On top of this all, my stone is a princess cut, and with all the horror stories about corners chipping and whatnot, I think a princess pretty much has to be insured. IIRC, yours isn''t a princess, but any stone that''s being reset is exposed to an increased risk of chipping.

So are you saying that if you chipped the corner off the stone next year, then you would have to wait until your 74th year to replace it because only then would you have saved enough to cover the cost of it. I know that is not true because you will earn different amounts, and things change for the good and worse, but just looking at it from the other side as you said about by the time you were that age you would have paid for another. Not directed at you just that is a different way of looking at it.

Well, no...what I was really trying to say (and not very eloquently at that) was that if I live until 74 WITHOUT damaging or losing the ring, that''s equivalent to having to replace the ring without insurance if I chipped it in a year. In the former case I pay for a "second" ring over 50 years, and I don''t even get the second ring (because I still have the first ring). In the latter case, I lose the first ring and have to pay for the second ring in a lump sum out of pocket. But either way, it''s still paying for the ring a second time. I think what you''re saying above is that I''m sort of comparing apples and oranges there, and I agree that the logic isn''t the greatest. But something about the insurance premiums adding up to equal the full cost of the ring rubbed me the wrong way. I just don''t like paying for something that I don''t expect or hope to use. Of course that wasn''t my only reason, and I still got the insurance anyway last week.

And Harriet, yes, I can cancel the policy in the future once I can comfortably replace the ring, and I may very well do that, depending on what the premiums are where I''ll be moving. If the premiums skyrocket, then I''ll definitely only keep the policy until I can afford to replace it out of pocket. That''s all up in the air because it depends on where I match for medical residency.

 

[Diamond*Dana]

Mine was uninsured until today, when I finally put it on my homeowners policy! I actually do feel a bit better now that it is!

 

[Cathers]

Hi Harriet!

I am not sure what happened, I am the 3rd(as far as I know) owner of this ring. It was Mums, and she bought it at a pawn shop..I am kind of embarrassed to admit that, but, it''s the truth. I think the owner before Mum might have been going thru a divorce..honestly, not sure. I was told by Birks, that there was major structural damage, and the bezel could not be repaired. I am sending the ring out for a 3rd opinion, to David Keeling(the Doctor) tomorrow. Hopefully he can rebuild it. I have a thread under the title "bezel repair" as well as photos of my ring.

Take care!

Cathers

 

[Kaleigh]

My ering is insured, as well as a few other pieces. But my hubby is in your camp Harriet. He thinks, I will never lose a piece, take such good care etc.. I wish I could say all is insured. Anyway, of all the things you have, the ering should be the one that is insured!!! Didn't read this whole thread, back from vacation, so if you already had it insured, phew!!

 

[snlee]

Date: 7/16/2007 12:09:31 PM
Author: Harriet
DivaDiamond007, Indy,

That makes 3 of use who are living on the edge.

Add me to the list. My husband thinks the same way as your DF. I''m still undecided.

 

[Beacon]

I''ve been on both sides of this one.

Insurance companies price policies to make money and understand well the likelihood of improbable events. Therefore insurance is generally priced to profit the insurer.

For years I never insured anything beyond a rider on my household policy that doesn''t do much and is very cheap. Remarkably I did lose a pearl bracelet (fell off at the opera) and it was covered by this policy and I got the full amount. I was very pleased! Recently I started a policy with Chubb b/c there were a rash of burglaries in my area. Not all my things are insured, but it does make me feel better about leaving jewelry at home, rather than in the bank all the time.

For that I would say the premium I am paying is more about peace of mind than an economic analysis.

 

[katebar]

My ering is not insured but all my other jewellery is! When I got my new ring I asked Garry at precious metals his take on insurance. I had had my precious ring insured for 20 years and my husband worked out we could have bought a ring with the premiums.
garry''s take was and mine as well is if you never take it off then there is less chance you willl lose it. It the things you wear occoasionly that need to be insured. I never ever take my ring of except when I go on holidays overseas to some countries then it would tucked up in the safe.
I do feel slightly uneasy but insurance on my ring would be very expensive ane I just have to have faith that it is unlikely that the stone would ''fall out'' or chip.

 

[diamondfan]

I cannot agree with not taking it off much, since I swell and when I was pregnant there were months I could not wear rings. No chance a ring was staying on me, it would have to have been removed with a hacksaw. I have a safe, but still, if I were tired one night and did not open the safe, it could get lost, and then I would feel terrible. Again, it could also be hurt if you smack your hand, and someone could take it off you. I totally get someone thinking it is not worth the money over the long haul, but it is unrealistic to suppose you are much better off if you rarely remove it.

 

[Kissmark]

Date: 7/16/2007 4:07:46 PM
Author: Harriet

Date: 7/16/2007 3:55:52 PM
Author: Nicrez
Harriet, I understand. Insurance in NY is INSANE. Because so is the mugging and loss...

As a matter of fact, in my company (and most on 47th) the largest expenses are Insurance #1, then Shipping or rent. Truly. Insurance is ALWAYS the highest cost. BUT, in your case, I would consider it a necessary evil of having a pricey stone.

he must be into hedge funds! LOL I-bankers all want to cut the insurance costs. Honestly, it''s because of their hedging bets all day long, shorting stocks and playing with numbers they think they have it figured out. Tell DF that in the end it''s going to pay off if you pay as much insurance as HALF the cost of the ring. Thereafter you can just take that SAME amount you spent on insurance premium and put it into an account, should the ring get stolen. If not maybe it''s another piece of jewlery. Insuring is not pittance here in NY, but maybe cut out the cleaning lady and cook at home...

It''s worth it. To me jewlery requires upkeep like a car. Cleanings, updating appraisals, etc. Like buying a Rolex and getting it wound...

Also, look into getting a rider off of your renter''s insurance, or even car insurance. If not, what I learned is tha Jewler''s Mutual was a bit pricer, but had the best coverage. Chubb was a bit cheaper, and decent. Get quotes, or if you have any union or affiliations, try those companies. I have a friend who''s a teacher and she got her ring specially insured through her union...?

Nicrez,
I''ve gotten a number of quotes and the premium is obscene.
He is. I should ask him what we should short to hedge the risk of something happening to my ring (touch wood).
I''ll look into those things you suggested. Thanks.

Harriet how much are the premiums that you were quoted? I got a quote for my area and it is 1.73%.. wondering if that is reasonable. I live in a fairly safe urban city.

 

[Steel]

Date: 7/16/2007 6:13:29 PM
Author: Pyramid
Steel

There was a webinar here a few months back, that was when Surfgirl who posts here arranged her insurance through this agent, anyway I will look for the text from it I saved, because during the conversation, it was with the late Rockdoc, it was his webinar, I asked about Chubb insurance in the UK and I have not contacted the person who he had come into the webinar but they replied in the text that I could contact them from the UK and they would try to help me arrange over here I assume the same as the USA pricescopers are getting.

Here is the text from part of that webinar, Surfgirl was more into it than I was and would be able to explain it better to you, she ended up getting hers sorted by this person I believe:

I asked him about Chubb Insurance in the UK if there was one, because I didn't know and his reply was

tinsure: Pyramid, I work primarily in the US but have placed insurance all over the world with contacts that we have developed in our time in business. If you contact me I will try to help.
tinsure: I'm sure I can get you a name that you can deal with locally completely apart from anything I do.
tinsure: www.touchstoneinsurance.com his name was Mr Ralph Cohen, he was an agent for Chubb for the Denver area I believe.

Just thought maybe it is Irish Republic rather than Northern Ireland but I think from the way he spoke he would try to help.

I'm just back online today.

Thanks for the help, I will look into it!

ETA- Oh I am in R.O.I.

 

[crown1]

hi harriet! i feel that insurance is like betting against yourself. i don''t think it is worth loosing sleep over not having insurance of any kind. i do however think if you have the cash to pay for premiums it is ill advised to not insure yourself against some things.

i am not sure how much you want to push the issue but i would simply not go without on the e-ring. i suspect if the ring is lost, stolen or damaged your df would be able to handle it since it is not likely he would be responsible. you, on the other hand, might feel the pain more due to responsibility issues. if he is willing to take the risk, that is fine, but he is causing you undue concern over a small amount of money in the scheme of things. just judging on the posts you have made about your lifestyle i think he is swallowing an elephant and gaging on a gnat.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/16/2007 9:40:43 PM
Author: boston_jeff
This same argument can be made with respect to any insurance-- it is always a ''bad deal'' if you are risk-neutral-- this includes term life insurance, car insurance (to the extent it is not required by law), casualty insurance, etc.

Most of us are risk-averse, however, and insurance is a very nice thing to sooth the conscious. I would only not insure if I had literally millions of dollar in the bank, and then I probably would anyway, just for piece of mind (no regrets).

DF agrees, not that we have millions stashed away.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/16/2007 9:48:57 PM
Author: Skippy123
how much is the insurance?

Over $1k.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/17/2007 12:19:37 AM
Author: Çã†hër§
Hi Harriet!

I am not sure what happened, I am the 3rd(as far as I know) owner of this ring. It was Mums, and she bought it at a pawn shop..I am kind of embarrassed to admit that, but, it''s the truth. I think the owner before Mum might have been going thru a divorce..honestly, not sure. I was told by Birks, that there was major structural damage, and the bezel could not be repaired. I am sending the ring out for a 3rd opinion, to David Keeling(the Doctor) tomorrow. Hopefully he can rebuild it. I have a thread under the title ''bezel repair'' as well as photos of my ring.

Take care!

Cathers

Good luck, Cather!

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/17/2007 12:26:02 AM
Author: Kaleigh
My ering is insured, as well as a few other pieces. But my hubby is in your camp Harriet. He thinks, I will never lose a piece, take such good care etc.. I wish I could say all is insured. Anyway, of all the things you have, the ering should be the one that is insured!!! Didn''t read this whole thread, back from vacation, so if you already had it insured, phew!!

Welcome back, Kaleigh! It''s not my camp, but DF''s.

 

[pyramid]

Date: 7/17/2007 5:51:19 AM
Author: Steel

I'm just back online today.

Thanks for the help, I will look into it!

ETA- Oh I am in R.O.I.

Hello Steel. I just thought I would post it incase you wanted to just check by email if it is as good cover you have as we see people on the forum writing they have in USA and he said he had contacts so maybe he can check and ease your mind even about what you have got. I just remembered him when I read what you were saying about your insurance.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/17/2007 12:42:50 AM
Author: Beacon
I''ve been on both sides of this one.

Insurance companies price policies to make money and understand well the likelihood of improbable events. Therefore insurance is generally priced to profit the insurer.

For years I never insured anything beyond a rider on my household policy that doesn''t do much and is very cheap. Remarkably I did lose a pearl bracelet (fell off at the opera) and it was covered by this policy and I got the full amount. I was very pleased! Recently I started a policy with Chubb b/c there were a rash of burglaries in my area. Not all my things are insured, but it does make me feel better about leaving jewelry at home, rather than in the bank all the time.

For that I would say the premium I am paying is more about peace of mind than an economic analysis.

He made this argument last night!

 

[Harriet]

Date: 7/17/2007 4:02:20 AM
Author: Kissmark
Harriet how much are the premiums that you were quoted? I got a quote for my area and it is 1.73%.. wondering if that is reasonable. I live in a fairly safe urban city.

1.97%. My quote is based on less than my ring''s appraised value. This is because I need the insurance in a hurry. To insure my ring for its full appraised value requires extensive underwriting.