Is professor Klein guilty of racism or equality?

[kenny]

Professor suspended after refusing lenient marking of black students

Gordon Klein, a professor of accounting at the UCLA's Anderson School of Business, rejected a request from a group of non-black students for leniency for their black peers.

www.dailymail.co.uk

UCLA college professor is suspended after refusing request for lenient marking of black students' final assessments due to the trauma they have suffered from George Floyd's death and civil unrest

• Gordon Klein, professor of accounting, has been suspended for three weeks
• Non-black students emailed asking for leniency in marking black peers' work
• Klein replied that he had no idea who was black given the course was online
• He asked how he should grade people of multiple ethnicities
• Klein noted MLK's fight for people to not be evaluated based on skin color
• UCLA's Anderson School of Business described his email as 'disturbing'
• A petition to see Klein removed now has almost 20,000 signatures
• Academics have defended Klein for 'treating students on the basis of equality'

 

[missy]

This is troubling because of the way he responded IMO. He could/should have handed it more sensitively. His reply was IMO mocking the students and that isn't OK. Whether or not one agrees with the request is one issue but the way one replies is another. He should have been more respectful and sensitive in his reply. He made the situation worse IMO.

"
Klein wrote back and declined their request, composing an email that some students felt was mocking them.

'Thanks for your suggestion in your email below that I give black students special treatment, given the tragedy in Minnesota,' he wrote.

'Do you know the names of the classmates that are black? How can I identify them since we've been having online classes only?

'Are there any students that may be of mixed parentage, such as half black-half Asian? What do you suggest I do with respect to them? A full concession or just half?'

Klein asked the students whether any of them - black or otherwise - were from Minneapolis, where George Floyd was killed by police on May 25, sparking a wave of protests.

'I assume that they probably are especially devastated as well,' he wrote.

'I am thinking that a white student from there might be possibly even more devastated by this, especially because some might think that they're racist even if they are not.

'My TA (teaching assistant) is from Minneapolis, so if you don't know, I can probably ask her.'

"

Do I think he deserves to be fired over this? No. But he needs a lesson in sensitivity training IMO.

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Yowsers @missy

He should have stuck to some boring generic "No" if he didn't want to do it. There was no need for all that! He brought the drama on himself!

I'd be more sympathetic if he'd given a boring old no and crazy Twitter descended on him (as they tend to randomly).

 

[missy]

Yowsers @missy

He should have stuck to some boring generic "No" if he didn't want to do it. There was no need for all that! He brought the drama on himself!

I'd be more sympathetic if he'd given a boring old no and crazy Twitter descended on him (as they tend to randomly).

Exactly. Whether or not one agrees with his thinking isn't the (main) problem here as I see it. It was the way he responded. Condescendingly and disrespectfully. IMO.

 

[alittlelight]

Oh, he thought he was being so clever! Ugh, the worst kind of academic.

 

[Missie1]

It’s so difficult to now express your opinion or even ask a question as other tend to always find something offensive.

In this particular situation the Professor simply could have stated “No” and been done with it. Every answer to a question doesn’t require an explanation.

 

[Tekate]

He should be fired - sorry MIssy girl he's insensitive and probably really racist. He could have said, "I feel your pain, I feel your anger, but I cannot change grades just for a certain group" he should have checked on what management thought also before a blanket snark comment, he should not be teaching either.

 

[1ofakind]

Snark aside..he was following UCLA policy. And that should have been his simple answer. His mistake was to attempt thought provoking dialogue with the student who inquired.

he's insensitive and probably really racist.

This is a wildly inappropriate and reckless accusation unless you have anything to back it up other than your emotional reaction to the response to the student.

 

[Karl_K]

I like his reply.
These are college adults and should be able to engage their brain.
But yea he should be fired for daring to try and make them think.

 

[MissyBeaucoup]

He sounds snarky and insensitive to me. Why couldn’t he have said something like, “This is a stressful and traumatic time for all of us. It’s unprecedented, and we are coping as best we can. We will get through this together. Thank you for voicing your concern for your peers. I hear you.“

There are lots of different kinds of intelligence, and the math people are not necessarily overflowing with emotional intelligence. He sounds like he needs to attend some workshops.

 

[missy]

He should be fired - sorry MIssy girl he's insensitive and probably really racist. He could have said, "I feel your pain, I feel your anger, but I cannot change grades just for a certain group" he should have checked on what management thought also before a blanket snark comment, he should not be teaching either.

That’s ok. I love you bunches and this doesn’t change how I feel about you.
He responded insensitively no question. He needs sensitivity training to be sure. I just don’t think this is a fireable offense.

 

[MissyBeaucoup]

Unfortunately racism, sexism, homophobia, or being a general @$$hole are more of a continuum than an all or nothing thing. A lot of people need to do the work or waking up and becoming more aware of what other people experience. Read books about it, for example.

When we know better, we do better. This fellow just got a big “wake up” call.

And, he wasn’t necessarily wrong that you can’t single out one group and give them bonus points. That’s not the issue. It’s a strange time and a lot of students have been unable to do their best work. He was supposed to express some compassion, even if he then went and marked everybody on the numbers.

 

[lovedogs]

Snark aside..he was following UCLA policy. And that should have been his simple answer. His mistake was to attempt thought provoking dialogue with the student who inquired.




This is a wildly inappropriate and reckless accusation unless you have anything to back it up other than your emotional reaction to the response to the student.

That email wasn't "to start a dialogue". It was rude, snarky, and mocking.

 

[1ofakind]

Snarky and insensitive....there seems to be some agreement this is how he comes across. Still, meaningless and subjective evaluations that should bear no weight in determining whether a man should be expelled from his professional position unless maybe he's a therapist. There is no right to remain unoffended.

@lovedogs Your interpretation is no more correct or incorrect than mine. Given he did ask questions (I've already conceded unnecessarily) rather than make blanket statements, also given the teaching history and background of this professor, there is room to believe he may have been genuinely interested in hearing a response. Instead he is now the latest Twitter bonfire. Looks like the professor got schooled while none of his questions got answers.

 

[Karl_K]

Honestly if they can not handle that they are in for a very very rude awakening once they get out in the real world.

 

[doberman]

Some questions are so stupid it's best not to answer them. Dont expect the askers of these questions to be able to reason when their request is unreasonable. He should have just said no and left it at that. I didn't see anything snarky or racist in his response, but the pendulum is swinging wildly these days and to say less is best.

 

[natasha-cupcake]

Rude and snarky comments are everywhere and on both sides of the political aisle. They are sometimes vilified and sometimes enthusiastically endorsed. I'm okay with free speech, even for jerks.

That being said, I'm a teacher. I teach in a Title 1 high school that's somewhere north of 95% minority. I have a lot of students that need flexibility and I give it to them without being asked or directed to do so. I also try to keep them accountable for their actions and try to keep them focused on their education. I don't want anyone slipping into poor habits and excuse-ism, or giving up hope because life is hard. It's not easy, but I love my students and I owe them my professional and personal emotional support. Sometimes that support is obvious and transparent to them, sometimes it's not.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

I liked his answer. In fact, I think he was justified in replying that way. How dare students ask him to fudge grades. His answers were perfectly true.

Annette

I am beginning to find that some PS persons value a brand of sensitivity over dealing with issues that require clear thought or action.

 

[Arcadian]

These are not children, these are adults. Adults have to make adult decisions. If you decide to take the day off to go protest and you get fired. its on you. Yes I'm saying this. same thing if you decide to skip school.

So I have to agree a simple NO would have sufficed. Though I don't think his answer is inaccurate. I also don't find it to be racist. was he being an ass? yeah sure but not racist.


The firing was an over reaction based on the current environment we find ourselves in.

 

[marymm]

Based on what's been posted in this thread, I see the professor's questions as legit, not snarky.

I also take issue with his TAs thinking they should go easy on grading anyone's work ... to my way of thinking about the world and society, the concept of applying a different (grading) standard based on race/ethnicity (or other identification data) is just plain wrong.

 

[nala]

These are not children, these are adults. Adults have to make adult decisions. If you decide to take the day off to go protest and you get fired. its on you. Yes I'm saying this. same thing if you decide to skip school.

So I have to agree a simple NO would have sufficed. Though I don't think his answer is inaccurate. I also don't find it to be racist. was he being an ass? yeah sure but not racist.


The firing was an over reaction based on the current environment we find ourselves in.

You mention that it’s an over reaction based on the current environment—but isn’t that the goal of the BLM movement? To make us pause and examine the behaviors that are rooted in systemic racism—such as the fact that this professor is blinded by his privilege and cannot acknowledge that some students might be profoundly affected by all this unrest in multiple ways? I would also add that the request should have been extended to other students—not just blacks or non-black people of color, but also to their white peers who are out there marching against racism. And the peers whose parents had businesses looted. Etc.
ETA: In the adult world, empathy is extended from employers to employees during unforeseen circumstances such as family death, home fires, family leave, threats of fires and possible evacuations, paternity leave, baby bonding, etc.

 

[Arcadian]

You mention that it’s an over reaction based on the current environment—but isn’t that the goal of the BLM movement? To make us pause and examine the behaviors that are rooted in systemic racism—such as the fact that this professor is blinded by his privilege and cannot acknowledge that some students might be profoundly affected by all this unrest in multiple ways? I would also add that the request should have been extended to other students—not just blacks or non-black people of color, but also to their white peers who are out there marching against racism.

Its not just a pause but a real over reaction in areas that maybe there shouldn't be, lots of examples of this going on right now.

I go back to these being adult men and women. In college yes but they're adults. As an adult you (general you) have to make choices in whats important. If protesting is important, fine, no skin off my nose, but you also have to know that by making that choice, by not doing your classwork or skipping out, you won't be given a favorable grade.

Should the professor fudge grades and pass these people? no.

Flip the script, if he gave all the white people a pass and no one else would it be fair? No.


The professor is an ass. I still don't find the email fireworthy. But hey IL, is an At Will state so they can do whatever.

I will say he should fight it though.

 

[nala]

Its not just a pause but a real over reaction in areas that maybe there shouldn't be, lots of examples of this going on right now.

I go back to these being adult men and women. In college yes but they're adults. As an adult you (general you) have to make choices in whats important. If protesting is important, fine, no skin off my nose, but you also have to know that by making that choice, by not doing your classwork or skipping out, you won't be given a favorable grade.

Should the professor fudge grades and pass these people? no.

Flip the script, if he gave all the white people a pass and no one else would it be fair? No.


The professor is an ass. I still don't find the email fireworthy. But hey IL, is an At Will state so they can do whatever.

I will say he should fight it though.

I added to my post to address the definition of adulting. And Please note that I didn’t advocate for just an exception for black people bc many others were affected in different forms by this unrest. But I think his first defense was to make it a race issue and thus, deny it. Ironically, the students who approached him also erred by making it a specific race issue and not including all the others who were affected.

 

[MJ_Mac]

These are not children, these are adults. Adults have to make adult decisions. If you decide to take the day off to go protest and you get fired. its on you. Yes I'm saying this. same thing if you decide to skip school.

So I have to agree a simple NO would have sufficed. Though I don't think his answer is inaccurate. I also don't find it to be racist. was he being an ass? yeah sure but not racist.


The firing was an over reaction based on the current environment we find ourselves in.

I watched a documentary a few weeks ago called A$$holes: A Theory. It was very good and thought provoking and at times funny. I agree with your above statement. This falls into that category.

 

[cmd2014]

I think he should have been more professional in his response. He should have also involved the University HR department before responding, and if his answer was no, to cite university policy only.

But, I hate the new normal of using the internet as a weapon, of villainizing people online, of subjecting them to death threats and calls for their jobs, and posting their home address online just to make them feel and be that much more threatened. It's taking things that should be private matters best dealt with by an individual's employer into the court of public opinion and the response is a form of mob mentality and public punishment without discretion that typically goes grossly overboard. No one deserves to be threatened. No one deserves to be made to feel afraid for their safety or the safety of their family. And honestly, I'm not convinced that people deserve to be fired (as they have been) or to have their lives destroyed (as they have been) for some of the kinds of things that this has happened over. NB: In this particular case, I do believe that disciplinary action is warranted by the employer due to the unprofessional nature of the response.

 

[doberman]

You mention that it’s an over reaction based on the current environment—but isn’t that the goal of the BLM movement? To make us pause and examine the behaviors that are rooted in systemic racism—such as the fact that this professor is blinded by his privilege and cannot acknowledge that some students might be profoundly affected by all this unrest in multiple ways? I would also add that the request should have been extended to other students—not just blacks or non-black people of color, but also to their white peers who are out there marching against racism. And the peers whose parents had businesses looted. Etc.
ETA: In the adult world, empathy is extended from employers to employees during unforeseen circumstances such as family death, home fires, family leave, threats of fires and possible evacuations, paternity leave, baby bonding, etc.

I don't think that the professor's note was rooted in white privilege just because he's white. Giving certain students a break on their grades while enforcing stricter requirements on others - no, I hope that this is NOT the goal of the Black Lives Matter movement.

Furthermore I dont think that black (or brown) people were the only ones affected by the murder and subsequent protests that followed, so the student's premise was off. Had I been the professor I would have chosen to say that anyone with any feelings at all has been affected by this. The murder should be deeply disturbing to all races - and I would argue that that is the point of the BLM movement - that white people should be disturbed and motivated to change.

Better grades for black students doesnt really fit in here.

 

[nala]

I don't think that the professor's note was rooted in white privilege just because he's white. Giving certain students a break on their grades while enforcing stricter requirements on others - no, I hope that this is NOT the goal of the Black Lives Matter movement.

Furthermore I dont think that black (or brown) people were the only ones affected by the murder and subsequent protests that followed, so the student's premise was off. Had I been the professor I would have chosen to say that anyone with any feelings at all has been affected by this. The murder should be deeply disturbing to all races - and I would argue that that is the point of the BLM movement - that white people should be disturbed and motivated to change.

Better grades for black students doesnt really fit in here.

That’s exactly what I posted. All groups were affected—not just people of color.

 

[Elizabeth35]

Several issues.
First, Daily Mail UK is not a preferred news source for me, so I tried reading other articles online about this incident.
In my reading I did not find anywhere the original email that was sent to Professor Klein, nor was the student(s) who sent it identified. That is a large gap in knowledge. The student who shared the email with the media is NOT the person he was responding to. From what I have read--and I certainly am no expert--the non-black students asked him to change the final exam to 'no-harm' grading. Meaning it can only boost a students final course grade, not harm it. Additionally they asked for additional time for final assignments and projects.

Tone is very difficult to read in emails and texts and can be misinterpreted. In this case, I think he asks some very legitimate questions.
I think his one large error was invoking MLK---that was really tone-deaf.

I would like to read the original email to Klein and his response in their entirety before saying anything else. We only have part of the story at this point.

I agree he would have been better off simply saying 'no' and quoting UCLA policy on changing final exam procedures.

 

[autumngems]

Equality. Everyone gets graded the same. While perhaps his wording could have been improved he is correct.

 

[HollyJane]

Did anyone else find the TAs' request for lenient grading as patronizing to minorities, especially because they did it on behalf of students and not involving them.

I think if the class collectively asked the professor to postpone a test or give additional time to complete an assignment to ALL the students to make accommodations for students to participate in the very important cause of the protests, I think that would have been a total different situation and one that I (if I was the professor) would have granted if able.