How important is it with a certificate?

[Kashmira]

I guess that smaller diamonds don''t come with a certificate- for what size would you "require" a certificate?

 

[Rockdiamond]

HI Kashmina,
I am firm believer in getting a GIA report.
I generally think of the parameters as to when it MUST have the report on a basis of "importance", as opposed to size.
For example, a 2 ct diamond for $5,000 is going to be a very commercial stone.
A trusted dealer offering such a stone sans GIA report is not necessarily a problem.

But a $5000 one carat stone should never even be considered sans the GIA or AGSL report....to say nothing of a half carat stone for $5000
Many people ask about side stones, such a trilliants, having reports. This is very uncommon unless we''re talking about really large side diamonds

Important note: Accept NO substitutions to GIA or AGSL when a report is called for.

 

[marcy]

It would depend on the size of diamond and how much I was spending. I would probably only care if it was for me ering.

 

[Kashmira]

Thanks for your replies! I am looking for a pair of diamond studs in the 1 ct (total weight) range and have been looking for G-H colour, SI1 clarity, excellent cut and GIA certificate. I guess that I could get slightly bigger diamonds if there is no certificate and I now wonder if it would be worth it or if I shall stick to what I originally had in mind?

 

[kenny]

Date: 12/27/2009 11:01:19 AM
Author:Kashmira
I guess that smaller diamonds don't come with a certificate- for what size would you 'require' a certificate?

Most of the public could not tell the difference between two diamonds that would cost $2000 and $10,000

A report tells you what you are getting.
It also supports the price.

Without a report you are trusting the seller.

I'd only do that with an amount of money I can afford to throw away, which is about one dollar.

 

[bgray]

Kenny and Rockdiamond both give very astute advice....

 

[yssie]

I think it depends very much on your vendor - general reputation, and how much you trust him/her.


For 0.5ct each... that's definitely in "want-cert" territory for me, but if I was working with a trusted vendor who could offer other guarantees of cut quality - sarin scans, IS images, etc. I'd go for it. For studs I only want the cert to assess cut quality - I wouldn't care about having "certed stones" for that itself, so other assessments would be perfectly adquate.


I wouldn't trust any vendor with thousands of dollars without some sort of satisfactory documentation, though.

 

[Londongirl1]

My FI bought me 1ct studs for Christmas - they're not GIA but they came with a certification and they're super white, eye clean, huge and sparkly

I know he didn't get ripped off because my FI is the most financially astute person I know and can get blood out of a stone

My ering is GIA cert'd which i's more important to me 'as far as a certificate goes' as I know that costs a lot more $$$. If you really want the reassurance of a GIA cert then spend the extra cash.

 

[kenny]

Danger Danger.

Unless your FI is a qualified diamond grader you can not be certain of the color and clarity of your diamonds.
He is trusting the seller's word.

The difference between a color and clarity grade or two is VERY subtle but the price difference is dramatic.
Say the seller says they are G VS1 and the price is X. (Most certainly an inflated price in anticipation of negotiation)
Your guy gets them for 30% below X, because he can squeeze blood out of a turnip.

But if they were graded by an independent reputable lab you may learn they are actually be I SI2 and would have sold for 40% less with the GIA report.
So even after all that skillful negotiation he may have paid 10% too much.
But we'll never know because the grades of your diamonds have not been independently verified.
You trusted the seller so you cannot be certain of what you bought.
One thing is for sure, sellers DO know what they are selling but buyers rarely know what they are buying.

A GIA report does NOT make a diamond more expensive.
Sure the cost, around $100, is factored into the price you pay but is worth it because it makes it impossible to lie to the customer about the grades.

BTW, may I recommend you take your diamonds to a competent professional appraiser who does not sell anything.
Find out what grades and cut they really are.
Compare the price to PS vendors.
If you paid too much return them if possible and buy smarter.

 

[Veee]

I agree...when buying a loose diamond make sure it comes with a diamond grading certificate...an average customer cannot examine a diamond and understand precisely what they're looking at and how it relates to specific gradings. GIA(Gemological Institute of America), EGL(European Gemological Laboratory) and AGS(American Gem Society) independent grading laboratories are the most reputable in the United States. GIA and AGS has the best reputation for diamond grading accuracy. Also keep in mind, this type of purchase sould certainly be insured. Some insurance companies require a diamond grading certificate from GIA, EGL, or AGS.

 

[Dreamer_D]

I want a cert for anything over .20ct. Less than that is melee size to me and rarely comes with a cert anyways. I want it for the reasons that Kenny describes.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Date: 12/27/2009 7:50:02 PM
Author: Londongirl1
My FI bought me 1ct studs for Christmas - they''re not GIA but they came with a certification and they''re super white, eye clean, huge and sparkly

I know he didn''t get ripped off because my FI is the most financially astute person I know and can get blood out of a stone

My ering is GIA cert''d which i''s more important to me ''as far as a certificate goes'' as I know that costs a lot more $$$. If you really want the reassurance of a GIA cert then spend the extra cash.

HI Everyone,
I find this to be an interesting conversation.
Without question diamond shoppers need to be cautious, and we all agree this is a site designed to assist consumers.

Londongirl- Based on the photo- and what you wrote, I''ll bet you got an awesome pair of studs- Congratulations!
Please don''t pay a lot of mind to people who may make it seem like your husband just fell of a turnip truck.
Although he''s not a diamond expert, I believe you that your hubbie is quite astute ( he got you, right

)
As such, I''ll bet he did due diligence, and picked a seller he was comfortable with. It''s entirely possible he got a very good deal.

Is it bad practice to trust a seller?
Actually, if you want to buy anything, you''ve got to find a seller you trust.
When it comes to diamonds, it''s critical you find one you are very comfortable with- considering how much money is at stake.

If one wants to learn all the angles, and subscribe to the "optics theories" promoted here, that still does not remove the importance of trusting the seller.
After all, how will you know if they are giving you the correct diamond?

What about if you want that diamond set by the seller? Are you going to attempt to stand behind the setter to make sure he does not switch your stone?
We can''t get around the issue of trust that needs to exist for the sale to take place.

Sorry to have to use Veee as an example, but his post is designed to confuse the issue of gem labs, and which ones count.
Placing EGL in the same category as AGSL and GIA is doing a horrible disservice to consumers.
Looking at the site he linked to gives us a lot more re-enforcement of that misleading idea.
In addition, the site seems to "pretend" to have photos.
Each listing has a photo of a diamond- and even an invitation to look at a larger image- yet nowhere does it mention these are sample photos, and NOT photos of the diamonds being offered.
Veee- I say this with all due respect- your intentions may be totally honorable- but these are BIG red flags for consumers.
We all know EGL''s grades do not match up with AGS, or GIA''s- and as such, the trade totally discounts EGL gradings- while actually basing prices on GIA and AGSL grades.
To me, this bit of info is one of the MOST important warnings we need to give consumers.

 

[Londongirl1]

Date: 12/28/2009 2:29:18 PM
Author: Rockdiamond

Date: 12/27/2009 7:50:02 PM
Author: Londongirl1
My FI bought me 1ct studs for Christmas - they're not GIA but they came with a certification and they're super white, eye clean, huge and sparkly

I know he didn't get ripped off because my FI is the most financially astute person I know and can get blood out of a stone

My ering is GIA cert'd which i's more important to me 'as far as a certificate goes' as I know that costs a lot more $$$. If you really want the reassurance of a GIA cert then spend the extra cash.

HI Everyone,
I find this to be an interesting conversation.
Without question diamond shoppers need to be cautious, and we all agree this is a site designed to assist consumers.

Londongirl- Based on the photo- and what you wrote, I'll bet you got an awesome pair of studs- Congratulations!
Please don't pay a lot of mind to people who may make it seem like your husband just fell of a turnip truck.
Although he's not a diamond expert, I believe you that your hubbie is quite astute ( he got you, right

)
As such, I'll bet he did due diligence, and picked a seller he was comfortable with. It's entirely possible he got a very good deal.

Rockdiamond - Thank you! My FI did tons and tons of research before he bought my engagement ring and my earringsl. He's no expert but he knows a lot more than the average man in the street. He's happy with the price he paid for my studs and I'm very happy with how they look so that's all that matters

 

[Kashmira]

Thank you everyone. I now hopefully have found a pair of diamonds for my earrings- they come with a GIA cert. I am just keeping my fingers crossed for that they are eye clean (they are SI1).

 

[Rockdiamond]

HI Kashmira- small point, but may be important: You said GIA Report- did you mean reports
I ask because GIA only reports on one diamond at a time.

 

[dssxxxx]

Good point.

H

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Well, the last diamonds I bought were all between .41-.42 and there were three of them and all had AGS certs. Personally, I wouldn''t pay for any loose diamond unless it was certified by either AGS or GIA. The only time I buy diamonds w/out paperwork is when they are fun things like roberto coin pendants or itty bitty studs.

 

[Kashmira]

Date: 12/28/2009 4:27:10 PM
Author: Rockdiamond
HI Kashmira- small point, but may be important: You said GIA Report- did you mean reports
I ask because GIA only reports on one diamond at a time.

Yes! One per diamond (I think it is GIA dossier reports for these two diamonds)