How do you tell your boss they''re awful?

[April20]

I''ve been in my job a little over a year and the more time I spend in it, the more I realize just how awful a manager my boss is. I mean awful. The worst I''ve ever had. My other co-worker is of the same opinion and the third person that was just hired at the new year already feels this way too. Already. With no hints from us. I don''t want to go into too much detail, but this manager is the worst or close to the worst any of us has ever dealt with. And we don''t even all sit in the same office!

I think things are going to reach a boiling point pretty soon. I''m trying to figure out how we can talk to our manager without it blowing up in our faces. One co-worker is ready to bring HR in. It may come to that, but I''d really rather try and resolve this without them at first. The person our manager reports to is very reasonable. So much so, that''s we really wished we reported directly to them!

It is becoming a hotter mess every day. Just looking for some been there, done that perspective.

 

[jewelz617]

It''s sometimes best to get the conversation started on a vague, rather than accusatory note. A good opener might be "We''ve been noticing a lack in communication for some time now and would like to resolve it."

See where it goes from there. Gauge manager''s reaction and move forward. If all else fails, run to HR or a higher-up in the company.

 

[elrohwen]

I was in a similar situation in my last job and it did not end well. I don't really know if there's a way to bring it up ... I would expect anything you do will make him/her worse.

Once you go to HR, it is you against your manager and you will probably lose. I was in this position - I lost. My manager will probably be fired soon, but that doesn't give me my job back. I would not go to HR.

Sorry I'm not more help ... I feel like this situation is more or less hopeless and I would try to get moved to a different department if possible, or start looking for a new job.

eta: Everyone at my company thought my boss was horrible and an idiot. Most people thought I did a good job and they liked working with me. However, my boss was able to find a few people who didn't like me (those people didn't like anybody really) and used their feedback in all of my reviews and HR dealings. HR did follow up with other people and found out the real story, but there was really nothing HR could do. It didn't help that my boss' boss backed him up no matter what, but still, as I said, if it becomes you vs him, you will in all likelyhood lose even if you are right.

 

[April20]

What''s interesting is that the new employee is a no holds barred kind of person. The manager has accused them of things and they''ve given it RIGHT BACK and proved they''ve done what they were asked to do. At which point the manager shuts down and has not much to say.... It''s a nasty cycle that keeps getting worse. It''s SO weird. I hate it.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 3/4/2010 12:01:50 PM
Author: April20
What''s interesting is that the new employee is a no holds barred kind of person. The manager has accused them of things and they''ve given it RIGHT BACK and proved they''ve done what they were asked to do. At which point the manager shuts down and has not much to say.... It''s a nasty cycle that keeps getting worse. It''s SO weird. I hate it.

That person was me. I no longer have a job. I tried to get out in time, but obviously the job market wasn''t very good. At least you might be the one who stays under the radar.

 

[April20]

One other point. DH and I have been making plans to go do some things we''ve been talking about for over a year. It involves simplifying our lives and moving. I am planning to quit this job in early fall. I''m just trying to figure out if we try and make it better now or I let it all out in an exit interview..... I''m not so much a fan of the latter as I DO NOT believe in burning bridges. In the industry I am in, you run into the same people again and again and again.

 

[ladypirate]

Date: 3/4/2010 12:03:29 PM
Author: elrohwen

Date: 3/4/2010 12:01:50 PM

Author: April20

What''s interesting is that the new employee is a no holds barred kind of person. The manager has accused them of things and they''ve given it RIGHT BACK and proved they''ve done what they were asked to do. At which point the manager shuts down and has not much to say.... It''s a nasty cycle that keeps getting worse. It''s SO weird. I hate it.

That person was me. I no longer have a job. I tried to get out in time, but obviously the job market wasn''t very good. At least you might be the one who stays under the radar.

Ditto Elro--this happened to me as well and it was really frustrating. Crappy managers often go through employees quickly and not just because they quit.

 

[elrohwen]

That''s great that you''re leaving soon anyway! In that case, I would sit down with the manager and discuss improving communication. See if something very non-confuntational like that works out. If not, I would just leave it. Maybe bring it up a little in your exit interview, but like you said, no need to burn bridges.

 

[April20]

Date: 3/4/2010 12:03:29 PM
Author: elrohwen

Date: 3/4/2010 12:01:50 PM
Author: April20
What''s interesting is that the new employee is a no holds barred kind of person. The manager has accused them of things and they''ve given it RIGHT BACK and proved they''ve done what they were asked to do. At which point the manager shuts down and has not much to say.... It''s a nasty cycle that keeps getting worse. It''s SO weird. I hate it.

That person was me. I no longer have a job. I tried to get out in time, but obviously the job market wasn''t very good. At least you might be the one who stays under the radar.

Yeah, the person doing that doesn''t care if they get fired or quit. They don''t necessarily need the job and have already found other opportunities out there. They''re really the type to not take it. Maybe I should let them push the nuclear button!

We are ALL in a meeting tomorrow. I am waiting for a show down because none of us are happy this week.

Add to it, our boss is like Jekyl and Hyde. Nice one instant, nasty the next. It''s like a friggin magic 8 ball as to what they''ll be like today!

 

[steph72276]

I''m of the opinion, you should just suck it up until you move unless you are okay to be without a job. Often times, horrible managers will let people that challenge them go and it could be your word against theirs...you don''t really want a firing on your record, right?

 

[April20]

Date: 3/4/2010 12:14:20 PM
Author: FL Steph
I''m of the opinion, you should just suck it up until you move unless you are okay to be without a job. Often times, horrible managers will let people that challenge them go and it could be your word against theirs...you don''t really want a firing on your record, right?

I don''t at all and I''m not the one to dig my heels in and challenge.. Others however will and don''t really care what happens!

 

[monarch64]

I wrote everything out that I had issues with, sat down in his office with his wife/assistant present, and told him exactly what I thought. I work for a family-owned business so I wouldn''t typically recommend this approach. However, I just got a very substantial increase in pay.

 

[April20]

Date: 3/4/2010 12:42:33 PM
Author: monarch64
I wrote everything out that I had issues with, sat down in his office with his wife/assistant present, and told him exactly what I thought. I work for a family-owned business so I wouldn''t typically recommend this approach. However, I just got a very substantial increase in pay.

Good for you! I''m glad it worked out in your favor!

 

[Shoopy]

April,

What type of company do you work for in terms of size?

I don't have experience with small companies but I know that most larger companies have a Leadership Development Review and set Performance Objectives.

These two forums are usually my platform for getting my manager to change something about himself/herself. I indirectly mention a performance objective I have and how the manager can help me get there. For example, if I feel that my manager has a really hard time communicating projects effectively I'll say that one of my objectives is to reevaluate our audit process to reduce project time and he can help me by holding weekly project status update meetings. That way I'm not screaming "hey boss, you suck at communicating priorities" and instead am saying "let's work together to reach a common goal" since he has to complete his project plan as well.

Oh and by suggesting this, as an example, I can take ownership of these weekly status updates and use that to my benefit during the year end review.

"Look at how awesome I am, I came up with these meetings that made us more effective. GIVE ME MY BONUS!"

 

[oddoneout]

I''ve had horrible bosses before (did not do their job at all yet still kept their job even though people quit all the time and complained). I ended up just sticking it out (needed the job) and trying to ignore their unprofessional behaviour. Good luck.

 

[decodelighted]

Yeah, geez, I''ve been in that situation before and I just don''t think you CAN tell your boss they''re awful & still work there. Ultimately its not your job to manage your boss. Of course its infuriating when everyone else seems to see it except the person directly supervising them. Or maybe they even see it but don''t want to admit there''s a problem because then they''re admitting *they* made a bad decision on hiring the person etc etc. I had to leave the job to be free of the situation -- but it was comforting to hear that after I left it became even more apparent that I''d been doing all her work all along.

What you COULD do is mention more neutral "problems" and propose solutions without directly saying YOU ARE WRONG! YOU ARE AWFUL! If the "bad boss" thinks you''re on their side and working to make them look better then they are more apt to be open to your suggestions. This was my tactic until I could find a new job! Gah, so glad to be done with that and it was 15 yrs ago. Fun fact: another job caught her stealing $$$ later! Goodness knows the trouble she could have gotten me into if I''d stayed!

 

[kittybean]

After I read your first post, I was wondering if you were my co-worker! I know how you''re feeling.

I am definitely not courageous enough to say anything--at least not yet. I need my job, and I know I just have to deal with the person in the least confrontational way possible.

 

[havernell]

Date: 3/4/2010 11:49:18 AM
Author:April20
The person our manager reports to is very reasonable. So much so, that's we really wished we reported directly to them!

If the person above your manager is reasonable, is there any chance you could talk with her/him about the problems your department is having with your boss? Again, like others have said, I wouldn't go in saying "Our boss is awful" but rather say that communication is lacking or some other concrete issues. Perhaps this isn't an option in your company, but this sentence from your post just stood out to me, so I figured I'd throw it out there.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!!

 

[iheartscience]

I''ve actually been in the exact same situation you''re describing. My direct supervisor (Bad Boss) was AWFUL and their supervisor (Good Boss) was great.

I pushed back against Bad Boss for a while but then realized that Bad Boss never followed through on anything they said, so I just started ignoring them and doing exactly what I wanted. I''m not sensitive and I knew that Bad Boss wouldn''t follow up with any of the awful policies they tried to implement so I just didn''t care. This worked for me but not 2 of my coworkers. Both of them are younger than me and more sensitive and (for lack of a better word) obedient than me.

One of my coworkers took the first job she could find and quit and the other one decided we should talk to Good Boss about Bad Boss, which I was more than willing to do with her. We were lucky in that Good Boss knew exactly how awful Bad Boss was and was extremely supportive of us. Good Boss wished we had spoken up earlier, but our positions were new so we were all brand new to that office and none of us were comfortable enough to speak up right when we started.

The story ended with a twist because Bad Boss got sick of Good Boss giving them grief for never doing their job and ended up resigning RIGHT after we spoke to Good Boss. So Bad Boss never even found out about everything. Kind of a bummer because maybe it would have helped Bad Boss improve, but oh well. That probably wasn''t likely anyway!

Sorry-that was long and probably confusing, but if I could do it all again I would speak up to Good Boss a lot sooner than I did. I just kind of got over it because I learned how to deal with Bad Boss (ignore). If you think your Good Boss would be supportive, I would speak to him/her about the situation.

 

[yssie]

No input, but it would probably be a good idea to avoid this thread - perhaps ps - altogether when you're at work. They can trace your IP/posts and bring up old web content more easily than one would think, and if you do come under fire I'm betting this awful boss won't hesitate to use your statements here against you.

 

[April20]

Date: 3/4/2010 7:15:03 PM
Author: yssie
No input, but it would probably be a good idea to avoid this thread - perhaps ps - altogether when you''re at work. They can trace your IP/posts and bring up old web content more easily than one would think, and if you do come under fire I''m betting this awful boss won''t hesitate to use your statements here against you.

Excellent point, however I actually home office and am not on the network. Never have been actually. I wouldn''t have posted if I thought it could get traced back.

 

[yssie]

sorry about the boss, though

 

[April20]

Thing2- My situation sounds somewhat similar. Our positions are new as well. We do something that is very different than everyone else. Our manager can't actually do our jobs, though they'd never admit it. I could take almost anything but the condescending way they choose to question us about how we're doing our jobs, questioning what we KNOW is right and coming at us with stuff that is patently incorrect, pushes us all over the edge. I tend to stay under the radar as best I can and do what I need to do and go around when possible, but get occasionally hit. The other two get hit much more. And I'm not talking about young, inexperienced people here. I'm talking about people with 15+ years of experience in the field.

Thanks everyone else for the input thus far. I appreciate it.

I've been talking to my co-workers this afternoon. They're ready to go to HR about their individual issues. Knowing our manager's passive aggressive ways, we're thinking if we say anything at all, it has to be all of us or none of us and we need to go to our manager's boss and see if we can outline the issues calmly and rationally.

We'll see what happens. We're all together tomorrow. We don't even live in the same cities, so this doesn't happen that often. It'll either go well or horribly, impossibly wrong.

Nothing would give me more evil pleasure than all three of us planning exit strategies and then wallking out on the same day.....

 

[Gypsy]

April we do yearly third party sponsored ''anonymous) reviews on our managers. And for the last two years our managers have failed spectacularly, and I with big huge fireworks displays that say "Manager sucks the big one in every way, in fact they are deterimental to a productive work environment, period." , and what''s happened as a result? Nothing.

HR is there to protect that company. Your bosses boss is there to protect themselves. Good luck.

 

[April20]

Date: 3/4/2010 8:26:00 PM
Author: Gypsy
April we do yearly third party sponsored ''anonymous) reviews on our managers. And for the last two years our managers have failed spectacularly, and I with big huge fireworks displays that say ''Manager sucks the big one in every way, in fact they are deterimental to a productive work environment, period.'' , and what''s happened as a result? Nothing.

HR is there to protect that company. Your bosses boss is there to protect themselves. Good luck.

Yeah, our last departmental survey said everything sucked and all that earned us with a monthly conference call to "share". HUGE waste of time.

I''m biding my time till I quit. I want enough time under my belt to be able to land a different and better job once the market loosens up.

This manager has lost two employees in the last year. How many do they have to lose before someone pays attention?

 

[sugarpie honeybun]

I've been in a similar situation with my boss and a few other staff members on my team. Basically, we all disliked our boss. I mean, reeeally disliked. Her attitude stunk, her delivery was poor and everything had a negative undertone associated with it. The rest of us got fed up, and it got to the point that every free second we had, we'd get together in one of our offices and b*tch out the boss. Eventually, it started to wear on me and I decided (for the sake of my sanity and job) to try and distance myself from the others (esp whenever they got into a heated discussions re: boss) and deal with this on my own. Rather than approach the situation as "we" have an issue, I made a point to sit with my boss outside of work and communicate my problems/concerns - not once mentioning the others. I figured they could handle their own. Based on my work ethic and personality, I would never want to burn a bridge with the person(s) that I report to, regardless if I was planning to stay at this job long-term or not.

As an aside- after having a great one-on-one conversation with my boss and putting it all out "on the table", I learned that she has been going through some personal health issues and has been under enormous stress. She thanked me for speaking directly to her and apologized for letting her personal business affect the way she manages her team. We still have our 'moments', but overall, things have improved considerably.

 

[reader]

After reading of many of your struggles, I am now glad I have a union job. Bad bosses are the rule where I work, and I have pulled more than one off the floor and told them their shortcomings. The results are a mixed bag: one manager quit sexually harassing his female employees and another learned the plant functions well enough that he was teaching his new boss how to function in our office.

Another supervisor is too bull headed to listen, and constantly has issues with call offs, and people dropping off the overtime desired list, leaving him critically short handed. He insists we have racial issues with him, but we honestly are just mad he always shows up a couple hours late for work, and forces people to split days off and working every holiday.

 

[elrohwen]

Date: 3/4/2010 8:13:16 PM
Author: April20
Thing2- My situation sounds somewhat similar. Our positions are new as well. We do something that is very different than everyone else. Our manager can''t actually do our jobs, though they''d never admit it. I could take almost anything but the condescending way they choose to question us about how we''re doing our jobs, questioning what we KNOW is right and coming at us with stuff that is patently incorrect, pushes us all over the edge. I tend to stay under the radar as best I can and do what I need to do and go around when possible, but get occasionally hit. The other two get hit much more. And I''m not talking about young, inexperienced people here. I''m talking about people with 15+ years of experience in the field.

Thanks everyone else for the input thus far. I appreciate it.

I''ve been talking to my co-workers this afternoon. They''re ready to go to HR about their individual issues. Knowing our manager''s passive aggressive ways, we''re thinking if we say anything at all, it has to be all of us or none of us and we need to go to our manager''s boss and see if we can outline the issues calmly and rationally.

We''ll see what happens. We''re all together tomorrow. We don''t even live in the same cities, so this doesn''t happen that often. It''ll either go well or horribly, impossibly wrong.

Nothing would give me more evil pleasure than all three of us planning exit strategies and then wallking out on the same day.....

This was exactly my situation. My boss would write me up if I did anything against his suggestions. But all of his suggestions were wrong! He had nooo idea what he was doing and couldn''t have done my job for the life of him. He just felt the need to offer "suggestions" constantly that turned out to be "orders".

Good luck! I really hope you guys don''t shoot yourselves in the foot. I would love to see the employees win one!

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 3/4/2010 8:13:16 PM
Author: April20
Thing2- My situation sounds somewhat similar. Our positions are new as well. We do something that is very different than everyone else. Our manager can''t actually do our jobs, though they''d never admit it. I could take almost anything but the condescending way they choose to question us about how we''re doing our jobs, questioning what we KNOW is right and coming at us with stuff that is patently incorrect, pushes us all over the edge. I tend to stay under the radar as best I can and do what I need to do and go around when possible, but get occasionally hit. The other two get hit much more. And I''m not talking about young, inexperienced people here. I''m talking about people with 15+ years of experience in the field.

Thanks everyone else for the input thus far. I appreciate it.

I''ve been talking to my co-workers this afternoon. They''re ready to go to HR about their individual issues. Knowing our manager''s passive aggressive ways, we''re thinking if we say anything at all, it has to be all of us or none of us and we need to go to our manager''s boss and see if we can outline the issues calmly and rationally.

We''ll see what happens. We''re all together tomorrow. We don''t even live in the same cities, so this doesn''t happen that often. It''ll either go well or horribly, impossibly wrong.

Nothing would give me more evil pleasure than all three of us planning exit strategies and then wallking out on the same day.....

Wow April, are you sure we''re not talking about the same person?!

Can''t do our job, is condescending and questioning, gives WRONG information and is the epitome of passive aggressive...sounds EXACTLY like my bad boss.

Good luck today-hopefully all 3 of you saying the same things will be effective. I''m sure you know this, but keeping calm and sticking to the issues that affect your work is the way to do it. That''s what my coworker and I did when we went to Good Boss about Bad Boss and it did the trick. Keep us posted!

 

[April20]

World War III did not occur. We walked into the meeting and found out our boss'' boss had taken over the meeting. Our general meeting was fine, but our morale is in the dumps. We''re strategizing how we broach the subject with the superior in a way that doesn''t backfire. We''ll see what happens with time. I have three hours of quality time with our boss'' boss in the car on Monday.