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How do you compare 2 ''excellent'' cut diamonds? Need help!

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rocking80s

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
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hi everyone,

I''m finding myself in a dilemma. I''ve purchased a beautiful stone (1.21 FSI1 ACA) from WF, but another jeweler has shown me a stone that he says has a better cut, and is cheaper. My gut (and HCA) tells me the WF stone is better, but I''m not sure anymore. Could someone please help me? Here are the specs:

Stone1:
. Report: AGS
. Shape: A Cut Above H&A
. Carat: 1.260
. Depth %: 61.3
. Table %: 55.8
. Crown Angle: 34.6
. Crown %: 15.3
. Star : 51
. Pavilion Angle: 40.7
. Pavilion %: 42.9
. Lower Girdle %: 77
. Girdle: Thin to Medium Faceted
. Measurements: 6.95-6.98X4.27
* HCA = 1.0 (X,X,X,VG)
* Price: 7900

Stone2:
Measurements: 6.94 - 6.99 x 4.19 mm
Carat Weight: 1.23
Color Grade: F
Clarity Grade: SI1
Cut Grade: Excellent
Proportions:
Depth: 60.2 %
Table: 58 %
Crown Angle: 33.5°
Crown Height: 14 %
Pavilion Angle: 41.2°
Pavilion Depth: 43.5 %
Star length: 55 %
Lower Half: 85 %
Girdle: Thin to Medium, Faceted
Culet: None
Finish:
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluorescence: None
HCA: 2.4 (VG,VG,VG,X)
Price: 7200

This is really gut-wrenching, as I''m clueless as how to tell which is the better cut stone? I know this is purely an academic exercise, as both stones will be beautiful to the naked eye. However, I''d like to know for my own sanity.
 
I hope I can save your sanity very quickly! You have already bought one of the best cut diamonds money can buy from Whiteflash! You will not find better than the diamond you have and especially not the other one the jeweller is suggesting! It is a decent make of diamond, but nowhere NEAR the calibre of the ACA you possess!

Please know you have already made the best decision you could have, and that the jeweller is wrong in saying his diamond is better cut, and that is what he would say anyway- he wants the sale!

You have the best cut diamond, no contest between the 2. Period. Relax and let your gut wrench no more. The other PSers will tell you the same.
 
Ditto Lorelei!!

Your stone is wayyyyyyy better.

*Spanks the jeweller*

x x x
 
Date: 2/26/2008 6:20:50 AM
Author: Cleo
Ditto Lorelei!!

Your stone is wayyyyyyy better.

*Spanks the jeweller*

x x x
rollpin.gif
 
Thritto - the jeweller is trying to take you for a ride. At least you know now to find a more honest jeweller.

Post piccys as soon as you have them! Congrats on the stone - it will be awesome!!!
 
Thanks for the prompt reply! In my gut, I do believe that the WF stone is better - but I have no way to quantify it!
7.gif


I feel awful going to the other jeweler (a friend of mine) and simply saying, "Sorry, I just know my stone is better". I want to know if it really is. And if it''s not, I''d like an honest opinion on why not. The HCA score is the only objective measure I can think of that compares these 2 stones. Again, thank you for your help - as I know this is purely for my knowledge, and not any physical difference (maybe!).
 
The diamond you have has been graded by AGS and given the most highly desired cut grade available by the neutral AGS lab, this is a fact and a diamond with this cut grade is inarguably one of the finest cut diamonds available. Furthermore to get this cut grade, it has been cut to the strictest possible standards, and the ACA title isn't given lightly for a hearts and arrows diamond. It has also been evaluated by experts, tested and proven for light performance with by every means possible. The other diamond falls outside AGS0 proportions and has not been cut and crafted to near the standards of your diamond. Also GIA rounds the numbers for crown and pavillion angles and AGS does not. GIA Excellent cut grade standards are broader than those required to get the AGS0 cut grade, so these diamonds need evaluating on a case by case basis. As you say the jeweller is also a friend of yours, is it possible he is feeling a little hurt that you didn't buy from him and that is influencing his opinion of your diamond?

I think you can relax in the knowledge that you have the superior diamond - it is a fact. Anyone can argue this if they want!
25.gif


Also out of interest, how does this jeweller justify that his diamond is the better cut??
28.gif
 
Thanks Lorelei. That is a likely possibility, and has contributed significantly to my ''gut-wrenching''. He did initially help me understand diamonds, how to use a loupe, and patiently provide advice. However, this is a large purchase, and I think it should be made based on facts, not friendship.

I feel that if I had some ''hard evidence'' supporting (or contradicting) my claim, it would make the argument less personal, and more scientific?
 
Date: 2/26/2008 6:38:52 AM
Author: Lorelei



The diamond you have has been graded by AGS and given the most highly desired cut grade available by the neutral AGS lab, this is a fact and a diamond with this cut grade is inarguably one of the finest cut diamonds available. Furthermore to get this cut grade, it has been cut to the strictest possible standards, and the ACA title isn''t given lightly for a hearts and arrows diamond. It has also been evaluated by experts, tested and proven for light performance with by every means possible. The other diamond falls outside AGS0 proportions and has not been cut and crafted to near the standards of your diamond. Also GIA rounds the numbers for crown and pavillion angles and AGS does not. GIA Excellent cut grade standards are broader than those required to get the AGS0 cut grade, so these diamonds need evaluating on a case by case basis. As you say the jeweller is also a friend of yours, is it possible he is feeling a little hurt that you didn''t buy from him and that is influencing his opinion of your diamond?


I think you can relax in the knowledge that you have the superior diamond - it is a fact. Anyone can argue this if they want!
25.gif



Also out of interest, how does this jeweller justify that his diamond is the better cut??
28.gif

Excellent points, thank you. The jeweler mentioned that a pavilion angle of 42.9% was of concern. I have/had no idea what that meant.
7.gif


Just one follow-up question:

How do you know the stone falls outside of AGS0 standards? Is there somewhere I can find the ranges for AGS000?
 
Date: 2/26/2008 6:59:59 AM
Author: rocking80s
Thanks Lorelei. That is a likely possibility, and has contributed significantly to my ''gut-wrenching''. He did initially help me understand diamonds, how to use a loupe, and patiently provide advice. However, this is a large purchase, and I think it should be made based on facts, not friendship.

I feel that if I had some ''hard evidence'' supporting (or contradicting) my claim, it would make the argument less personal, and more scientific?
Then it is likely the case he may be feeling a little miffed shall we say, that he has invested time to help you and is a bit hurt that you purchased elsewhere, especially online - which can be an old bone of contention it seems.

Regarding hard evidence, I would base it more on the AGS0 cut grade than that your diamond has hearts and arrows. See if this info helps you find the evidence you seek, if not do a search for AGS0 using the search tool and that may help you to collate your evidence!

http://diamonds.pricescope.com/agsideal.asp
 
Date: 2/26/2008 7:07:46 AM
Author: rocking80s




Date: 2/26/2008 6:38:52 AM
Author: Lorelei



The diamond you have has been graded by AGS and given the most highly desired cut grade available by the neutral AGS lab, this is a fact and a diamond with this cut grade is inarguably one of the finest cut diamonds available. Furthermore to get this cut grade, it has been cut to the strictest possible standards, and the ACA title isn't given lightly for a hearts and arrows diamond. It has also been evaluated by experts, tested and proven for light performance with by every means possible. The other diamond falls outside AGS0 proportions and has not been cut and crafted to near the standards of your diamond. Also GIA rounds the numbers for crown and pavillion angles and AGS does not. GIA Excellent cut grade standards are broader than those required to get the AGS0 cut grade, so these diamonds need evaluating on a case by case basis. As you say the jeweller is also a friend of yours, is it possible he is feeling a little hurt that you didn't buy from him and that is influencing his opinion of your diamond?


I think you can relax in the knowledge that you have the superior diamond - it is a fact. Anyone can argue this if they want!
25.gif



Also out of interest, how does this jeweller justify that his diamond is the better cut??
28.gif

Excellent points, thank you. The jeweler mentioned that a pavilion angle of 42.9% was of concern. I have/had no idea what that meant.
7.gif


Just one follow-up question:

How do you know the stone falls outside of AGS0 standards? Is there somewhere I can find the ranges for AGS000?
That is the pavillion depth. The pavillion angle is 40.7 and absolutely fine!
 
Date: 2/26/2008 6:09:08 AM
Author: Lorelei
I hope I can save your sanity very quickly! You have already bought one of the best cut diamonds money can buy from Whiteflash! You will not find better than the diamond you have and especially not the other one the jeweller is suggesting! It is a decent make of diamond, but nowhere NEAR the calibre of the ACA you possess!

Please know you have already made the best decision you could have, and that the jeweller is wrong in saying his diamond is better cut, and that is what he would say anyway- he wants the sale!

You have the best cut diamond, no contest between the 2. Period. Relax and let your gut wrench no more. The other PSers will tell you the same.
I quit reading here. There''s your answer.

Now I''ll read the rest of the thread.
9.gif
 
Date: 2/26/2008 6:59:59 AM
Author: rocking80s
Thanks Lorelei. That is a likely possibility, and has contributed significantly to my ''gut-wrenching''. He did initially help me understand diamonds, how to use a loupe, and patiently provide advice. However, this is a large purchase, and I think it should be made based on facts, not friendship.

I feel that if I had some ''hard evidence'' supporting (or contradicting) my claim, it would make the argument less personal, and more scientific?
You''re absolutely right.
 
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