How do I say no?

[kenny]

Can you believe I, harsh, direct, honest, rude-assed Kenny, is having trouble with this? . . .


Our next door neighbors are wonderful, I love them.
They keep saying, "Oh we have to invite you and your SO over for dinner."
I respond evasively.

They have two little girls, maybe 2 and 3 years old.
They are spoiled brats, crying and screaming ALL the time.
They are not capable of just talking in at a normal volume, they can only yell.

I don't want to sit at their table and act polite for hours as my eardrums are punctured because someone's mashed potatoes touched her peas.

How do I say no?
Do I just come out and tell them it's because of the kids ,and that we'd accept if they store shipped the kids off for the evening?

Shouldn't parents be less clueless?
Is it I who is the rude butthead here?
After all my SO would be in heaven; he LOVES kids and is wonderful with them.

Do YOU invite dinner guests over while you have small children at the table?

 

[Missy]

Is there any way you could see it clear to accept for the sake of your neighbors and SO? I mean, it's only 1 evening and it would make others happy. I would notmention about their kids being loud and bratty. They are inviting you to their home to be their guests for the evening so I would say just suck it up for the one evening and maybe just maybe it won't be as you envision and you will enjoy yourself. In any case you would have made your neighbors and SO happy. Who knows, maybe the kids are better behaved than you think...

ETA: I totally empathize with you btw. My nieces, who I love dearly, were once the ages of 2 and 3 and OMG they could be loud. Heck, who am I kidding, even now at 3 and 5 they certainly know how to scream etc. It's perfectly normal for kids that age to behave like that sometimes. They cannot always be sweetness and light. And believe me, I am not tolerant of that kind of behavior for too long. However, it's only for a few hours and then you get to go home again. Might just be worth doing and you might just have fun. The kids might be having a good few hours when you visit. Just don't bring a drum set for them LOL.

 

[iheartscience]

It sounds like you're being an inflexible grouch, honestly. One night isn't going to kill you, and if your SO would love it, I don't see why you wouldn't just suck it up.

 

[iluvcarats]

Can you believe I, harsh, direct, honest, rude-assed Kenny, is having trouble with this? . . .


Our next door neighbors are wonderful, I love them.
They keep saying, "Oh we have to invite you and your SO over for dinner."
I respond evasively.

They have two little girls, maybe 2 and 3 years old.
They are spoiled brats, crying and screaming ALL the time.
They are not capable of just talking in at a normal volume, they can only yell.

I don't want to sit at their table and act polite for hours as my eardrums are punctured because her mashed potatoes touched her peas.

How do I say no?
Do I just come out and tell them it's because of the kids and that we'd accept if they store shipped the kids off for the evening?

Shouldn't parents be less clueless?
Is it I who is the rude butthead here?
After all my SO would be in heaven; he LOVES kids and is wonderful with them.

Do YOU invite dinner guests over while you have small children at the table?

Yes, you are the rude butthead here, and yes, sometimes I had dinner guests when I had small children at the table. Hmmmm, all that preaching about tolerance is a one way street , I guess

 

[MissStepcut]

What have your interactions with the children been like so far (in terms of setting and circumstances)? I ask because when my baby brother was a small child, he was an absolute terror in, say, the grocery store. Or trying to get him to go to daycare? Yelling, screaming, hair-pulling. But would have been pleasant if not a little shy around dinner guests. You might be surprised by how even the brattiest children have more than one side

 

[LJL]

I just wouldn't go and would possibly be honest if asked... but I'm also a rude butthead
I'm a big subscriber to the idea that you should do what makes you happy and avoid things that bring negativity into your life....even if that's someone else's kids. You don't have to tell them that their kids are horrible - I don't believe in purposely hurting people's feelings...but maybe wait a couple years and they'll be calmer/better behaved. If pushed, I think its better to make it sound like youre the problem - Oh I'm not good with kids. Oh I have no patience. Idk - find some harmless way to say it that gets the point across. Or if your SO really wants to go, then go to make him happy. Luckily my SO has the same minimal tolerance for children that I do, so I won't be having this problem

 

[marymm]

I understand what some of the above posters are saying, but really, if the invitation were accepted, it probably wouldn't be "just one night" - if they are your neighbors and you both go over once for dinner, no doubt they will continue to invite you - how would you say no in the future? And in the interests of true neighborliness and courtesy, you and your SO would probably have to return the favor and invite them for a meal (including the children since really the whole family would have hosted you both). Basically, if you go once, you will have set a precedent for having occasional meals with the neighbors - this is what you'll be accepting if you do indeed say yes to one invitation.

Plus, if what they are saying is "oh we have to have you over for dinner sometime" but not actually extending a direct invitation ("we'd love it you two could join us for dinner this Saturday") - I think a noncommittal response is entirely appropriate (since no actual invitation has been proffered).

 

[Skippy123]

It is just one night! Sometimes when i am not looking forward to something it ends up being the most fun! Go, you might have fun. I think it is nice to be friendly with the neighbors; I am lucky I live in a neighborhood were we look out for each other. Keep us posted how it goes and no you can't tell them their kids are brats! lol It is like if they told you your doggies were obnoxious!

 

[lovemybling]

Maybe If you would like to get to know them better you could suggest an adult only night out. Then you get to spend time with them and avoid the kids. (at least for the time being). I am not sure where you live but maybe you could but off a get together at thier house until summer when you could have an outside b-b-que. Some how the noise of kids is easier to handle when it is not in a inclosed space.

Good Luck

 

[iugurl]

I feel for you! I don't like being around bratty, spoiled, wild kids! I don't understand how that makes you the butthead? Why do people need to think bad behavior is acceptable? If YOU recognize the bad behavior and find it annoying YOU are the one in the wrong? OK...

My parents would have never let me act like that. My grandparents sure as heck wouldn't have allowed their kids to act like that. Unfortunately, it seems as though everywhere I go, I see screaming kids. I really doubt in my parent's and grandparent's day so many people allowed their kids to act like that.

 

[Haven]

I wouldn't go.

I like the idea of suggestign a night out with the adults only.
If the neighbors really press you for a reason that you'd prefer to go out sans kids, I think you can say "I'm just not very good around spirited young children."

I'm a big believer in saying "no" when you really don't want to accept a social invitation.

I totally feel for you on the bratty kids front, Kenny. I have three terribly behaved first cousins. The oldest is 9, and her twin sisters are 5. They are really, really difficult to be around for more than 20 minutes. We spent my birthday with them at my mom's house this year, and it was really the worst birthday I've ever had. They're ill-behaved in every way I can imagine--they're defiant, whiny, spoiled, and crazy loud. It's sad because I want to have a relationship with them, but they really are miserable to be around. There is no discipline whatsoever. We keep a close eye on them in our own home, and they've learned by now that we aren't going to tolerate some of the behavior that their parents tolerate so they do act better around us. But even then, they're still miserable, and frankly, they often ruin family gatherings with their behavior. If I wasn't related to them, I would never spend time with them. Entirely my aunt and uncle's fault, of course, not the kids'. But that still doesn't make me want to spend more time with them.

ETA: Before I get flamed for being a horrible cousin, these children are really bad. Like get kicked out of restaurants bad. I'm not talking about things that get eye rolls. I'm talking about things that get stern talkings-to from managers whenever we're in a public place. Lots of broken dishes, food stuffed into water glasses, etc.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Wow, Haven, you need to send a letter to Super Nanny and hope they get chosen! What in the world is wrong with parents???!!!

Kenny, since your situation isn't that extreme, I'd be nice and go visit the neighbors if your SO would enjoy going! Sometimes we do things to please those we care about, ya know?

 

[kenny]

Thanks.
I appreciate the suggestion that I put it on me.
I can say, "I'm sorry, I'm really not good with kids", or something that does not blame their kids or parenting competence.

I have to admit, while the brattiness IS for real, I honestly would not want to go no matter how well-behaved their kids were.

When I was in psychoanalysis years ago my analyst told me my discomfort around kids comes from my discomfort about my OWN childhood.

Perhaps if I ever get back into therapy (for a few thousand years) I'll come out more comfortable around kids.
My bad.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Okay, well now you have offered new information that helps us understand better. But I don't think that explanation will fly. Since when does "not being good with kids" become an excuse not to have dinner? That's the excuse to use if they ask you to babysit!

 

[Arkteia]

To be quite honest, I never liked kids till I got my own. And I did not like the noise they created, or toys everywhere, till I got my own. Now I love it all, but one has to live with kids...to raise them... Hard to tell if you being uncomfortable around kids comes from your childhood or not, not everyone loves kids, it is that simple (till one gets his own).

But if your SO likes kids, shouldn't you do it for him? It is just one evening, and if it will bring him joy...

 

[MissStepcut]

Well why don't you be the one to suggest it next, and say, "there's this restaurant that SO and I have been dying to try, but it's definitely not child-friendly. If you are ever feeling in the mood to get a break and bring in a babysitter, we'd love to try it out with you guys!" Might resolve some of the tension and make it clear that you don't have anything against socializing with the neighbor, even if they never get around to taking you up on it.

 

[kenny]

To be quite honest, I never liked kids till I got my own. And I did not like the noise they created, or toys everywhere, till I got my own. Now I love it all, but one has to live with kids...to raise them... Hard to tell if you being uncomfortable around kids comes from your childhood or not, not everyone loves kids, it is that simple (till one gets his own).

But if your SO likes kids, shouldn't you do it for him? It is just one evening, and if it will bring him joy...

He can go without me.

I oppose the thinking that couples/families HAVE TO do things together.

 

[movie zombie]

suck it up and do it for your SO.....seriously. think of the things your SO does for you......even if you don't want him to do so! just do it, kenny! its an excuse to earn more and better karma....

 

[Imdanny]

The surgery makes it impssible to eat with others. Th doctor told me o be on a very social diet. SO doesNt need new friends to play with. Sorry all the way around. Just say no.

 

[Imdanny]

Eta yes he can go himself just as long as u don't have to. It's not like it's Christmas and these people are you parents shush EVEN THEN I wouldn't go if I didn't feel like it. I live in Polynesia for many reasons. You can bloody well believe this is one. I will not spend my time with people I "hate" that's why the lady is a tramp. so to speak.

 

[Jennifer W]

To be quite honest, I never liked kids till I got my own. And I did not like the noise they created, or toys everywhere, till I got my own. Now I love it all, but one has to live with kids...to raise them... Hard to tell if you being uncomfortable around kids comes from your childhood or not, not everyone loves kids, it is that simple (till one gets his own).

But if your SO likes kids, shouldn't you do it for him? It is just one evening, and if it will bring him joy...

He can go without me.

I oppose the thinking that couples/families HAVE TO do things together.

Well Kenny, you are what you are. Most people don't like or enjoy certain things that other people think they should or can't understand their aversion to. Nothing rude about that. However, you're part of a couple and part of a neighbourhood, so maybe think about the longer term here?

Would your SO be comfortable and happy going without you, or embarrassed and awkward? (Not do YOU think he SHOULD be happy, but would he actually be happy.) If he's happy, then problem solved. If not, and assuming you love this man more than you dislike children, it would be a kindness to accompany him. Y'know, in the way he most likely does things because of you...

I don't care for poorly behaved children either. If it's a dinner invitation, I would expect children who are too young / badly behaved to sit through an adult dinner in the evening to be in bed before it begins. If I'm hosting and I'm at home, my daughter will be there and we can eat together, but her bedtime is 7pm, so that's more likely to be a lunchtime gathering than a dinner. You could be worrying about nothing - they might have the kids tucked up in bed long before you arrive! Find out, gently.

As to your question, should parents be less clueless, I think you answered it yourself in the next line - your SO would be in heaven, so it's not cluelessness on the part of the parents, it's a problem on your part. That doesn't suggest to me that they are clueless or that there is an objective standard here.

I'm sorry to hear of your difficult childhood. Mine wasn't awesome either, so I do feel for you. I hope you can find greater peace of mind.

 

[Lottie]

If its a dinner invitation are you sure the children will even still be up? Mine are 16 months and 3 yrs old and go to bed at 6-6.30pm. Unless its someone that particuarly wants to see them or a relative then they are usually in bed before any dinner guests arrive.

 

[TristanC]

You can explain to them that you are terrible with kids. All kids, and you aren't sure what the root of it is. That's about as self deprecating a statement as you can make without hurting anyone's feelings. And it isn't THEIR kids either. It seems that this is all kids.

You can do the neighbourly thing and really apologise and offer to host THEM instead at your place? If you and your SO won't mind having just the parents over. Then they can politely consider, and likely decline. I doubt it makes very much sense to get sitters just to be able to go next door for dinner. So this kind of salvages putting them in the spot. Or something.

Or, your SO could go over alone. But that is awkward too, as you would be alone at home with no reason for antisocial behavior.

Anyway, on to the kids thing. Apparently this is a ridiculously divided topic that most people have. Why can't everyone just agree to disagree? You can't see why some of us don't adore kids? We can't see why you do.

Or actually, both parties can enunciate all the logical reasons why, from both camps, but the emotive liking just isn't there. There are many reasons, most are personal.

Why call someone a butthead because he is being honest with himself? You must tolerate children to not be a butthead?

 

[kenny]

Thanks all.

Hey Tristan, I just saw the 6 Argyle Tender pinks Leibish bought.
They are not listed yet in the regular inventory but here is how to find them.
Go to the site and click on one of the new Pink Diamond Festival icons.
It will take you to a page, scroll down and find the Argyle Tender stones.

Three have me drooling...
0.36 ct Fancy Vivid Pink Asscher
0.42 ct Fancy Deep Pink Emerald cut
0.65 ct Fancy intense Purplish Pink Emerald cut.

 

[Jennifer W]

You can explain to them that you are terrible with kids. All kids, and you aren't sure what the root of it is. That's about as self deprecating a statement as you can make without hurting anyone's feelings. And it isn't THEIR kids either. It seems that this is all kids.

You can do the neighbourly thing and really apologise and offer to host THEM instead at your place? If you and your SO won't mind having just the parents over. Then they can politely consider, and likely decline. I doubt it makes very much sense to get sitters just to be able to go next door for dinner. So this kind of salvages putting them in the spot. Or something.

Or, your SO could go over alone. But that is awkward too, as you would be alone at home with no reason for antisocial behavior.

Anyway, on to the kids thing. Apparently this is a ridiculously divided topic that most people have. Why can't everyone just agree to disagree? You can't see why some of us don't adore kids? We can't see why you do.

Or actually, both parties can enunciate all the logical reasons why, from both camps, but the emotive liking just isn't there. There are many reasons, most are personal.
Why call someone a butthead because he is being honest with himself? You must tolerate children to not be a butthead?

I think a lot of people find it hard to know that their loved one is disliked or not tolerated because of a characteristic outwith their control, in this case age. There are all sorts of groups of people who feel the prejudice and intolerance of mainstream society, and I don't imagine their families enjoy hearing of it either. Personally, I think you have to tolerate all members of society not to be a butthead. You don't have to adore them, but that's not the same thing.

 

[Imdanny]

I don't think I owe it to my SO to have dinner with the neighbors. Honestly we do a lot for each other every day. I like to make my own decisions about whether I socialize with people and frankly if we did not both want to it would never happen.

I wanted to have a friend of mine from our old neighborhood and her friend over for a dinner party. He didn't. I can see his point. he likes his privacy, he needs his rest because he works 60 hours and commutes, he'd have to pay for this, and he's the cook in the family so he'd end up cooking. It would be a disaster if I did it. Ultimately, it didn't happen because my landlord won't allow overnight guests and woldnt like this either. It's a small space basically under his house. Add all this to the fact my friend just had gastric bypass and got confused and called me up looking in fact for "the other Daniel"!(the pot dealer, yeah, not me, awkward) and it seemed like a nice idea but it just got too comPlicated.

He would probably do it if I insisted but I don't think he owes it to me.

I'm reading all of your replies and find them interesting. I admit I'm not a very social person. I like having my SO around. I could be around him every hour of every day with about 1 week apart a year and I'd be pretty much good. Of course life doesn't work that way and I can't always be with him but truly his mother's 10 day visit while it was great (truly) knocked me out. It took me weeks to recover my energy. I guess I just don't view this kind of thing as something we have to do for each other except in extraordinary circumstances. He had to work a year to get 1 week off
and hadn't seen his mother in 5 years (she lives in Florida, a long way away).

I had no choice about that but owe him to be eating dinner with the neighbor? As a practical matter I doubt I'll even try to arrange something like that again. It sounds like fun but easier said then done when you have to consider four different people, getting us all here, feeding them what they like, and getting SO to be enthusiastic about people who aren't his friends, probably not going to happen.

 

[swingirl]

Just a suggestion. If you do decide to accept your neighbor's invitation, take along a couple cheap gifts for the kids--age appropriate. Stuffed animal, coloring book, something that will keep them busy and quiet. Kids always like something new and it usually occupies them for longer than something they already are familiar with.

If the kids still are totally obnoxious the parents might realize they are too young to be part of a dinner party and will not invite you over again for a few more years.

 

[zoebartlett]

Well, your neighbors haven't actually invited you over yet (with a set day/time), so I wouldn't put too much thought into how to get out of it until that happens. I don't know, I'd be inclined to accept once and see how it goes. They might surprise you! Of course you have every right to say no, but it would be very rude to tell them you're declining because of their children. You know that though...

 

[Imdanny]

I do have actual advice- don't say one word to them about kids, theirs or anyone's. I've seen neighbors hold a grudge for decades for saying something like that. No kidding.

 

[Pandora II]

Until I had a child I was a lot less tolerant - now I have one I am more child friendly.

We do invite people over for dinner when our child is there, but she tends to be very well behaved at home. She has a late bedtime so would definitely be up.

Getting 2 year-olds to behave is not always that simple, they don't understand consequences at that age and if you get a non compliant, stubborn one then you have to do your best till they are old enough to understand cause and effect.

iugurl - I get the feeling you either don't have kids or were lucky enough to get a very compliant child - 3 years ago I could have written your post myself, now I am THAT mother. I was exactly like my daughter, as were my parents - my grandmother literally beat my father black and blue everyday for years. Didn't improve his behaviour, but made him hate her and traumatised him for the rest of his life.