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HELP with search for new upgraded e-ring

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Phoenix

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I've decided (finally!!) that I'd really like a bigger and better upgraded e-ring. I have several choices, and sub-choices, available:

(1) return it to the original vendor in Hong Kong, but I'd incur a re-stocking fee of 5% (originally it was supposed to be 10% but I've negotiated with them). I'd get my money back (well, 95% of the originally cost) straight away. They've confirmed they will do this. Then: I have either choices 1a), 1b) or 1c):

1a) I can use this cash and top it up to purchase a stone on line from a vendor like ERD or Diamond Source of Virginia (I've contacted both WF and GOG before but they didn't respond with any infor on the kind of stone I'm looking for);

1b) buy a really amazing Tiffany Lucida from Signed Pieces; or

1c) buy from a reputable auction house like Christies or Skinner (or any others you'd like to recommend)

(2) trade it in and buy a bigger stone from a local vendor in S'pore. I've asked for them to offer me a better price and theoretically i'd be able to do this but they've not committed to any price yet. They do have some really amazing stones, totally eye-popping!

Ideally, I'd like something a little unusual and less *mainstream*. I reckon the main reason I've been *struggling* with the decision whether to keep my current stone (a RB, 3.02ct, F VS2) is because, despite the fact that it is a beautiful stone, I personally don't find it extraordinary enough (pls don't throw eggs at me, I know I'm rather spoilt!
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). I think my best bet would be to return it to the original vendor (and accept the 5% loss) as this would give me more freedom as to what to do with the money. I'd prefer something like a secondhand Tiffany's Lucida or Cartier's or HW . I've always liked the quality of their stones. If I can't find anything from either Signed Pieces or the auction houses within the next couple of months, I might go to a local/ regional vendor/ dealer. So really option 2 is not an option, but the 5% loss is so painful. As far as on-line vendors, both ERD and DSV have offered me several stones inclg some cushions but I have no idea if I'd like a cushion as they are not widely available here and I've not had a chance to try on many, so don't want to take this kind of risk. Not sure what these vendors are like with other cuts.

My total budget (inclg the money I'd get back from my current stone) will be around USD80-100k though I'd prefer to spend less than more! As far as carat weight, something in the region of 3.5-4ct or larger if possible. Shape and style-wise, I'd like, again a Tiffany's Lucida, or a Cartier's or HW's emerald or a pear. My style - meaning my clothes (more Armani, Gucci and Valentino) and accessories - is more what I'd call elegant and sleek, perhaps a little glamorous (but not over the top, ie. not gaudy) but I do dress down, ie. jeans and t-shirts on lots of days. And I wear my e-ring practically everyday. Funnily enough, the Lucida is rather funky (you might think more suitable for someone who wears things like Prada and Marc Jacobs) but looks really really nice on my finger (have always liked it). Btw, I don't think 4ct and above are too big, not unless your're talking 10ct and above and trust me, we don't have that kind of money anyway, LOL! Oh, colour and clarity-wise, I'd still like an F VS2.

So, what shall I do? What would YOU do? Where should I best concentrate my effort? TIA.
 
Just re-read my post and realised that what I've written is a bit confusing. So basically, what I am asking is: should I return my current 3.02ct stone to the original vendor in HK and get back 95% of what I paid, or should I trade it in at the local store? If I decide to return it to the original vendor, should I then concentrate my effort on Signed Pieces and auction houses?

One of my main criteria is that I must be able to see the stone in person before I buy and do not wish for the stone to be shipped to me in S'pore. I could do this in the US when we go over there in August or I could go to HK where Christie's is also located. I'd like the stone, if one happens to come along soon that I like, to be shipped to an independent appraiser and then I could come along and see if I like it, if not then he/ she could return it to the vendor.
 
I would return the stone to the original vendor, even with the 5% restocking fee. That will give you the most options by far! And I don''t know if you could wait this long, but if I were you I''d wait to get something until August when you''re in the US.

I don''t think you said where you were going in the US, but I''d go to NYC and go to all the big jewelry stores (Harry Winston, Cartier, etc.) as well as Engagement Rings Direct and Good Old Gold. It seems like you''re not quite sure what you want and that might help you decide.

My other choice would be to get a great stone in Singapore or Hong Kong, send it to Leon Mege and get a pave masterpiece made! Then you could go meet him in August and pick up your ring. (I''m not sure if this is feasible time-wise, but it would be nice!)

And as just an aside, I spoke with Diamond Source of Virginia during my diamond search and they were super nice and helpful. Their prices weren''t as good as PS vendors for what I was looking for, though, and I''m not sure if they do photos, Idealscopes, etc.

I can''t wait to see what diamond ring you end up with! I know it''s going to be absolutely stunning!
 
Date: 6/30/2007 9:02:56 AM
Author: thing2of2
I would return the stone to the original vendor, even with the 5% restocking fee. That will give you the most options by far! And I don''t know if you could wait this long, but if I were you I''d wait to get something until August when you''re in the US.

I don''t think you said where you were going in the US, but I''d go to NYC and go to all the big jewelry stores (Harry Winston, Cartier, etc.) as well as Engagement Rings Direct and Good Old Gold. It seems like you''re not quite sure what you want and that might help you decide.

My other choice would be to get a great stone in Singapore or Hong Kong, send it to Leon Mege and get a pave masterpiece made! Then you could go meet him in August and pick up your ring. (I''m not sure if this is feasible time-wise, but it would be nice!)

And as just an aside, I spoke with Diamond Source of Virginia during my diamond search and they were super nice and helpful. Their prices weren''t as good as PS vendors for what I was looking for, though, and I''m not sure if they do photos, Idealscopes, etc.

I can''t wait to see what diamond ring you end up with! I know it''s going to be absolutely stunning!
Ditto.

I can''t wait to see what you get either. What an absolutely fantastic budget.
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Thank you, Thing2of2 and Ellen. I was actually leaning towards returning my current ring to the vendor in HK, so thank you for that extra "nudge"!
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, not that I really needed it, hehe! I''d really like to get one of the more brand name rings mentioned, from Signed Pieces or Christie''s or Sotheby''s or any other reputable auction house, though not sure how long I''d have to wait for. We''re going to Chicago and not NYC, unfortunately. That''s interesting what you''ve said ''bt DSV, Thing2of2. I found Denny to be really superb and the stones he offered are basically the same as what Mark T was also offering and at more or less the same prices. But you''re right, they don''t offer any photos, Idealscope etc.

I wonder if anyone has had any experience with buying at an auction house and what you think abt this route?
 
Hi lienTN,

If it's important to have a distinctive make or brand associated with your diamond, have you considered a branded cut as opposed to a branded ring? You could get an absolutely smashing Royal Asscher in your budget, then have a ring made bespoke for you by a top designer. You could have something made by Taffin, Verdura, etc., or you might be able to get Van Cleef & Arpels to do it. The Cartier sales manager in NYC readily admitted that my Royal Asscher was a nicer stone than most of the Asscher-cuts they carry, albeit not in size.

At the price you can pay, and given your taste for luxury (which I can appreciate myself), I'd want something bespoke, not something 'off-the-rack'.
 
I''d return the stone to the HK vendor. you''ve got an amazing budget with lots of good options. Then you can start hunting signedpieces and other auction houses to see if yo spot your dream ring. you could always just buy a fabulous cushion and have Leon set it into something spectacular too..
 
Another nudge to return the stone to the original vendor since it''ll give you the most freedom to upgrade.
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I can''t wait to see your upgraded ring!
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Date: 6/30/2007 12:36:39 PM
Author: fanboy
Hi lienTN,

If it''s important to have a distinctive make or brand associated with your diamond, have you considered a branded cut as opposed to a branded ring? You could get an absolutely smashing Royal Asscher in your budget, then have a ring made bespoke for you by a top designer. You could have something made by Taffin, Verdura, etc., or you might be able to get Van Cleef & Arpels to do it. The Cartier sales manager in NYC readily admitted that my Royal Asscher was a nicer stone than most of the Asscher-cuts they carry, albeit not in size.

At the price you can pay, and given your taste for luxury (which I can appreciate myself), I''d want something bespoke, not something ''off-the-rack''.
Thanks for your reply and input, Fanboy. You''re right, I''d like to have a ring which stands out and was thinking of going the secondhand route with SignedPieces or an auction house, because then I could have the brand and the beatiful ring without having to pay the hefty premium. But I''d be happy to have one of the more well known designers (houses) do the ring too. When you say I could have something made by VCA, do you mean I could get a stone somewhere else and then ask VCA to do it? I remember reading somewhere that Cartier will set yr stone too. How would that work? Would they still issue you with their own cert and you''d still be able to bring it back to any of their store to have it serviced in the future?

I must admit I don''t know anything abt Taffin or Verdura! Thanks, you;ve just added to my list of luxury brand names that I can spend our hard-earned moolahs on! he he
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.

I do like the Asscher but must admit, again, that I don''t know if I''ve actually seen a RA. It is not a popular brand in Asia. I guess I could order it online and go pick it up in August.

There''s one problem I could forsee, if I were to do this, how long does it all take? We have a trip to Chicago in August and another trip to Boston in October. I guess I could make my final decision with the stone in August and then pick up the ring in October. To be honest though, it makes me nervous to have all this done long distance. What if I don''t like the stone when we go over in August, what if the bespoke work does not please me when I go see it in October?

Thank you for yr suggestions. Pls keep them coming. I''m a novice at all this and really appreciate yr advice.
 
Date: 6/30/2007 12:41:20 PM
Author: mrssalvo
I'd return the stone to the HK vendor. you've got an amazing budget with lots of good options. Then you can start hunting signedpieces and other auction houses to see if yo spot your dream ring. you could always just buy a fabulous cushion and have Leon set it into something spectacular too..
Thanks, MrsSalvo. I will definitely do all that.

I hope other Singaporeans will chime in and tell me where to go look at some cushions. I've only seen maybe a handful in all my time in S'pore and have no idea if I'd actually like it. Same goes for Asschers too.
 
Date: 6/30/2007 12:58:53 PM
Author: snlee
Another nudge to return the stone to the original vendor since it'll give you the most freedom to upgrade.
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I can't wait to see your upgraded ring!
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Ditto!! Also I would contact vendors that you mentioned Cartier, Tiff's and HW before you make your trip to the US in August so that they will have the stones you want, so no wasted time there... I can't wait to see what you end up with lien, I'm sure it will be fabulous!!!
Auction houses are great too. You have so many options, you're in the cat bird seat as they say!!!
 
I would also return to the original vendor, I think that this option will give you the most money towards your new project. Good luck, I can''t wait to see what you come up with!
 
Date: 7/1/2007 12:32:39 AM
Author: lienTN

When you say I could have something made by VCA, do you mean I could get a stone somewhere else and then ask VCA to do it? I remember reading somewhere that Cartier will set yr stone too. How would that work? Would they still issue you with their own cert and you'd still be able to bring it back to any of their store to have it serviced in the future?

I must admit I don't know anything abt Taffin or Verdura! Thanks, you;ve just added to my list of luxury brand names that I can spend our hard-earned moolahs on! he he
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.

I do like the Asscher but must admit, again, that I don't know if I've actually seen a RA. It is not a popular brand in Asia. I guess I could order it online and go pick it up in August.

There's one problem I could forsee, if I were to do this, how long does it all take? We have a trip to Chicago in August and another trip to Boston in October. I guess I could make my final decision with the stone in August and then pick up the ring in October. To be honest though, it makes me nervous to have all this done long distance. What if I don't like the stone when we go over in August, what if the bespoke work does not please me when I go see it in October?

Thank you for yr suggestions. Pls keep them coming. I'm a novice at all this and really appreciate yr advice.
VCA will only set client-supplied stones that they deem 'exceptional'. My Royal Asscher wasn't exceptional enough for them (1.93 ct. D VVS2), but I figure for the amount you are willing to spend, your stone might qualify. Cartier, from what I was told by multiple sources at the NYC boutique, will no longer set client-supplied stones and ceased doing so several years ago. Harry Winston and Tiffany's won't do it either.

Taffin is a jewelry design firm headed by James de Givenchy (the nephew of the famous fashion designer). Their jewelry is all custom and is frequently auctioned by Sotheby's and Christie's; he is reputedly the most significant jewelry designer of his generation. You have to meet James at his NYC atelier, however, and it's by appointment only. Verdura is a famous 20th century firm (perhaps the most significant private jeweler of its time?) that also does design work.

Of course, you could also use Leon Mege, forum favorite. My eyes cannot distinguish between the quality of his work and Taffin's, HW's, etc. In fact, if you examine a micro-pave HW ring, it looks very similar to what Leon does, right down to his signature double claws . . .

6-8 weeks appears to be the typical wait for a custom ring to be completed.

Admittedly, you swallow more risk with bespoke, but it's also potentially more rewarding I think. At the price you are paying, the stones will probably all be astonishing. The simpler your design request, the more likely it will look the way you expect it to. Also, firms like Taffin and Garrard will draft illustrations of the ring for you to approve. You already know what VCA rings look like, and you can extrapolate a lot by viewing Leon's catalogue of past commissions.
 
Date: 6/30/2007 12:58:53 PM
Author: snlee
Another nudge to return the stone to the original vendor since it''ll give you the most freedom to upgrade.
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I can''t wait to see your upgraded ring!
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Thanks, Snlee, on both counts!
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Date: 7/1/2007 12:50:55 AM
Author: Kaleigh

Date: 6/30/2007 12:58:53 PM
Author: snlee
Another nudge to return the stone to the original vendor since it''ll give you the most freedom to upgrade.
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I can''t wait to see your upgraded ring!
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Ditto!! Also I would contact vendors that you mentioned Cartier, Tiff''s and HW before you make your trip to the US in August so that they will have the stones you want, so no wasted time there... I can''t wait to see what you end up with lien, I''m sure it will be fabulous!!!
Auction houses are great too. You have so many options, you''re in the cat bird seat as they say!!!
Thanks for your input, Lisa. I am afraid we can''t really afford to buy directly from these brand names, at least not in the size I''d like. For sure though, we''ll go have a lookie!
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Auction houses and Signed Pieces are for sure my best bet, though I am worried they may not have what I''d like by the time we go to the US. Ah well, we''ll see...
 
Date: 7/1/2007 11:54:19 AM
Author: Diamond*Dana
I would also return to the original vendor, I think that this option will give you the most money towards your new project. Good luck, I can't wait to see what you come up with!
Thanks, Diamond Dana!
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I LOVE LOVE LOVE Graff's emerald ring, btw, but there's no way we can afford it!
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http://www.graffdiamonds.com/flash.php


ETA: the link doesn't take you to the ring, but it's under Engagement Rings, page 2, btw.
 
Date: 6/30/2007 8:17:51 AM
Author: lienTN
Just re-read my post and realised that what I''ve written is a bit confusing. So basically, what I am asking is: should I return my current 3.02ct stone to the original vendor in HK and get back 95% of what I paid, or should I trade it in at the local store? If I decide to return it to the original vendor, should I then concentrate my effort on Signed Pieces and auction houses?

One of my main criteria is that I must be able to see the stone in person before I buy and do not wish for the stone to be shipped to me in S''pore. I could do this in the US when we go over there in August or I could go to HK where Christie''s is also located. I''d like the stone, if one happens to come along soon that I like, to be shipped to an independent appraiser and then I could come along and see if I like it, if not then he/ she could return it to the vendor.
2 questions: 1. If you trade it in at a local store, how much of a hit is there?; 2. Will the local store have something that will satisfy you?
 
Date: 7/3/2007 11:09:29 AM
Author: Harriet



Date: 6/30/2007 8:17:51 AM
Author: lienTN
Just re-read my post and realised that what I've written is a bit confusing. So basically, what I am asking is: should I return my current 3.02ct stone to the original vendor in HK and get back 95% of what I paid, or should I trade it in at the local store? If I decide to return it to the original vendor, should I then concentrate my effort on Signed Pieces and auction houses?

One of my main criteria is that I must be able to see the stone in person before I buy and do not wish for the stone to be shipped to me in S'pore. I could do this in the US when we go over there in August or I could go to HK where Christie's is also located. I'd like the stone, if one happens to come along soon that I like, to be shipped to an independent appraiser and then I could come along and see if I like it, if not then he/ she could return it to the vendor.
2 questions: 1. If you trade it in at a local store, how much of a hit is there?; 2. Will the local store have something that will satisfy you?

Hi Harriet,

I've decided to return my existing stone to the HK vendor so didn't really pursue tne matter with the local vendor further (I'd have had to wait for the owner who lives in KL and only comes to S'pore once in a while). They do have some large beautiful stones but not what I'd call unique.

Hey, since you've frequented these high-end jewellery stores, can you telll me something? I like the fire and brilliance of the RB and have only found the Lucida (a 3.6 ct in a local store here) to offer better fire and brilliance than my RB (maybe my RB is not that top-notch after all!). Asides from the Lucida, is there any other cut (brand or non-brand name) that would offer the same or better? maybe a cushion? But to be honest, I find the reading of varying cuts of cushions so confusing and not being able to see the stones in person makes it so much harder.

The above question is open to everyone else too!
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Thx.

ETA: I love Asschers and Emeralds - they're simply beautiful and elegant - but I personally think you'd really have to go for something like 6 carat or above for the stone to really make an impact and I don't think our budget stretches to this size, at least not in the colour and clarity I'd like.
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Date: 7/1/2007 4:52:46 PM
Author: fanboy

Date: 7/1/2007 12:32:39 AM
Author: lienTN

When you say I could have something made by VCA, do you mean I could get a stone somewhere else and then ask VCA to do it? I remember reading somewhere that Cartier will set yr stone too. How would that work? Would they still issue you with their own cert and you''d still be able to bring it back to any of their store to have it serviced in the future?

I must admit I don''t know anything abt Taffin or Verdura! Thanks, you;ve just added to my list of luxury brand names that I can spend our hard-earned moolahs on! he he
9.gif
.

I do like the Asscher but must admit, again, that I don''t know if I''ve actually seen a RA. It is not a popular brand in Asia. I guess I could order it online and go pick it up in August.

There''s one problem I could forsee, if I were to do this, how long does it all take? We have a trip to Chicago in August and another trip to Boston in October. I guess I could make my final decision with the stone in August and then pick up the ring in October. To be honest though, it makes me nervous to have all this done long distance. What if I don''t like the stone when we go over in August, what if the bespoke work does not please me when I go see it in October?

Thank you for yr suggestions. Pls keep them coming. I''m a novice at all this and really appreciate yr advice.
VCA will only set client-supplied stones that they deem ''exceptional''. My Royal Asscher wasn''t exceptional enough for them (1.93 ct. D VVS2), but I figure for the amount you are willing to spend, your stone might qualify. Cartier, from what I was told by multiple sources at the NYC boutique, will no longer set client-supplied stones and ceased doing so several years ago. Harry Winston and Tiffany''s won''t do it either.

Taffin is a jewelry design firm headed by James de Givenchy (the nephew of the famous fashion designer). Their jewelry is all custom and is frequently auctioned by Sotheby''s and Christie''s; he is reputedly the most significant jewelry designer of his generation. You have to meet James at his NYC atelier, however, and it''s by appointment only. Verdura is a famous 20th century firm (perhaps the most significant private jeweler of its time?) that also does design work.

Of course, you could also use Leon Mege, forum favorite. My eyes cannot distinguish between the quality of his work and Taffin''s, HW''s, etc. In fact, if you examine a micro-pave HW ring, it looks very similar to what Leon does, right down to his signature double claws . . .

6-8 weeks appears to be the typical wait for a custom ring to be completed.

Admittedly, you swallow more risk with bespoke, but it''s also potentially more rewarding I think. At the price you are paying, the stones will probably all be astonishing. The simpler your design request, the more likely it will look the way you expect it to. Also, firms like Taffin and Garrard will draft illustrations of the ring for you to approve. You already know what VCA rings look like, and you can extrapolate a lot by viewing Leon''s catalogue of past commissions.

Hi Fanboy,

Many thanks for your detailed reply. I did a search on the search engines for both names but couldn''t find much, other than just some tidbits of info abt them. Is there any websites or links you''d recommend where I''d be able to find more infor like prices and particular stones/ rings on offer by these people?

Also, I talked to the local high-end jewellers and all of them, inclg VCA just looked at me either with a blank or confused face and after a lengthy explanation by moi, they all said they couldn''t set my own stone, that either I buy the complete deal from them or nothing! Do all VCA in the US offer this service, do you know? or is there anyone in particular you''d recommend?

I am also wondering what kind of stone I should select (pls see my reply to Harriet).

Appreciate very much yr input and advice
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I know you said it''s not in your budget, but that Emerald from Graff is jawdropping gorgeous.
 
Date: 7/4/2007 11:09:18 AM
Author: KimberlyH
I know you said it's not in your budget, but that Emerald from Graff is jawdropping gorgeous.
Isn't it just?!! he he
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. Total drool-fest!!
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Lien,

Cushions, emeralds, and asschers are all amazing and unusual, but do not hold a candle IMO, to the brilliance of a RB. So if the crazy sparkle factor is what you want, RB is the best of the bunch.

BUT that being said, the other cuts have distinctly different sparkles which make them unique and interesting. There is just no contest between the sparkle factor of a RB or a cushion IMO.
 
Like the others, I''d return the stone you have. A 5% loss is terrific! I have never heard of such a great return policy! I''d also suggest calling Signed Pieces to tell them what you are looking for. I doubt very seriously if they''d buy an $80,000 ring to put on their site. But they very well may have the opportunity to buy if they know they have a buyer. It seems like they recently had a 3 ct. Lucida.

None of the vendors has constant access to 3 and 4 carat stones. They are rare. I''d suggest connecting with someone like Good Old Gold who does carry stones such as Flanders which is similar to the Lucida, and tell him what you want and just wait. It''ll eventually come along. But it won''t be like ordering a new car with all the features you want since diamonds are natural and not created by us!

As far as custom goes, if you approve the design, you are stuck with the finished product. So from what you are saying, you might be better off buying directly from Graff, HW, Cartier, or Tiffany so you can see exactly what you are buying. That new store Lievev (forgot how to spell it) looks like it carries fabulous larger stones as well.
 
LienTN, I see you''ve made your choice, so you probably don''t need to know this, but for anyone else:

My stone came through Diamond Source of VA two years ago and Denny was *great* to work with. He found a number of stones that were in the range we were looking for, we narrowed them down from the specs and got my stone in. He went over it in great detail with us -- he pointed out not only the good but also the bad about the stone.

The stone was listed at a lower price at a different vendor (don''t remember which one!) and Denny matched that price for us.

I highly recommend him to any friends that are considering buying a diamond and when we get around to upgrading my stone, I have no doubt that we''ll be back working with him.


-- RPS
 
I just wanted to add that IF you decide you want to pursue a cushion, just start a thread and I''m sure at least a few of us will chime in our thoughts.... they are cheaper per carat so for your money you might be able to get to like 5 carats... is there any way you can call in a stone to view?
 
Thank you, Neatfreak, DS, RPS and Cehra. I still haven''t decided what shape I''d like, so I will take Cehra''s advice and start a new thread on cushions.

Btw, I went to VCA today and spoke to the manager (previously I spoke to a SA who didn''t know much). He said that they only set clients'' stones that are D-E, IF-VVS2, and it would cost me abt US$35k to set it (that''s just for their labour and material (wG only), but I guess mostly it would be for them to stamp their name on the ring). I guess I will not be going that route after all. Well, at least I tried....
 
Date: 7/4/2007 10:23:51 AM
Author: lienTN
Hi Harriet,

I''ve decided to return my existing stone to the HK vendor so didn''t really pursue tne matter with the local vendor further (I''d have had to wait for the owner who lives in KL and only comes to S''pore once in a while). They do have some large beautiful stones but not what I''d call unique.

Hey, since you''ve frequented these high-end jewellery stores, can you telll me something? I like the fire and brilliance of the RB and have only found the Lucida (a 3.6 ct in a local store here) to offer better fire and brilliance than my RB (maybe my RB is not that top-notch after all!). Asides from the Lucida, is there any other cut (brand or non-brand name) that would offer the same or better? maybe a cushion? But to be honest, I find the reading of varying cuts of cushions so confusing and not being able to see the stones in person makes it so much harder.

The above question is open to everyone else too!
1.gif
Thx.

ETA: I love Asschers and Emeralds - they''re simply beautiful and elegant - but I personally think you''d really have to go for something like 6 carat or above for the stone to really make an impact and I don''t think our budget stretches to this size, at least not in the colour and clarity I''d like.
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I think RBs are the blingiest. Modern cushions are also sparkly, especially at HW.
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