Help me choose between 2 beautiful diamonds!!!!

[dms23]

I am going back and forth and have done quite a bit of research to narrow down my choices to the following 2 diamonds. Which, in your opinion is the better "deal?" I am going through Mervis -- while they may be a tad more expensive than Blue Nile or other internet retailers, I know someone there that is wonderful, and their service is unparalleled. Thus, I am happy paying a bit more of a premium for this type of establishment. These are the two round diamonds:

1) GIA
1.75 carat / VS2 / G
Since it is an older GIA report (late 2005), it does not have all the information such as crown and pavilion angles. Here is the info it does have:
7.94 - 7.98 x 4.61mm
Depth: 57.9%
Table: 59%
Girdle: Very thin to thin, faceted
Culet: None
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Very good
Fluorescence: None
PRICE: $17,500

2) AGS
1.73 carat / VS1 / E
7.68 - 7.72 x 4.80mm
Table: 57%
Depth: 62.3%
Crown: 15.5%; 35.6 degrees
Pavilion: 43.3%; 41.0 degrees
Faceted 1.0% to 1.9%
Pointed
AGS Ideal (0) Cut Grade
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
Proportions: Ideal
Fluorescence: Inert
PRICE: $19,400

My question is, is the difference in price worth it? Both are spectacular diamonds, and either way, I will likely be happy, right? I''m just looking for nit-picking... either way. Your help is appreciated!

 

[JulieN]

Is the AGS report on #2 light performance based?

Looks and numbers aside, I do not like the VTN girdle on #1. If you have the GIA number, you can look up the angles, though the shallow depth is probably not a good sign.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I don''t think it is nit-picking because I don''t see these two stones as equal. #1 is waaaay too shallow and has a very thin girdle. It would not be considered ideal or excellent cut, I don''t think (but I''m too lazy to go look up the numbers for you!).

#2 is better, but it faces up a little smaller than others it''s size because it is pretty deep. It''s better if you can stay at 62% depth or above.

I totally respect your wanting to buy from a particular jeweler, so I am not attempting to sway you except to suggest that you ask your jeweler to bring in some more stones for you to see. Here''s an example of a similar size stone with ideal cut:

H VS2 1.76 cts., 7.75mm $16,470. http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/2366/

 

[dms23]

I''m not sure if it is light-performance based. I am just using the information off of the AGS certification that is online. The link to find the actual certification is here: http://www.mervisdiamond.com/inventory/diamonds/dia_results.php3?shape=ROUND&fromprice=15000&toprice=22000&fromsize=&tosize=&order=order+by+size+asc

You can find it by item # (80170) or by other stats (1.75/G/VS2)

Also, I am a relatively new buyer, so I don''t know too much about why a specific depth or girdle is bad or good. Any more details would be greatly helpful.

 

[JulieN]

A very thin girdle poses durability problems.

The purpose of a diamond is to return light to the viewer. There some variables that the cutter can control in order to return more light to the viewer.

The first stone is very shallow, which will not return light in the direction of the viewer. The crown angle was 33, and the PA was 40.4 The second stone is overly deep, and will allow light to leak out of the diamond. Also, the second stone's AGS report is 2006, but it is not light performance-based. A cautious shopper may assume that such a stone would not pass the light performance test.

 

[dms23]

Thanks Julie (and others). This is a big help. Tell me if this diamond is better or worse?

It is AGS performance-based 1.62 / F / VS2
7.52-7.56 x 4.62mm
Depth: 61.3%
Table: 56.3%
Crown: 15%; 34.6 degrees
Pavilion: 43.1%; 40.8 degrees
Pointed
Faceted: 1.1% to 4.0%
Light Performance: 0
Proportion Factors: 0
Finish: 0
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
PRICE: $17500

This is a little smaller than I intended (as compared with the previous stones) but if it will reflect more light, its probably worth the difference, right?!

 

[JulieN]

You do get to see these in person, right? The F looks very nice on paper.

 

[Ellen]

The F sounds great! And visually you are really not losing much.

 

[dms23]

Unfortunately I don''t... Mervis is around the Washington DC area. I lived there over the summer with my girlfriend and we went into the store and really liked their selection. Most importantly though, she is very picky on the settings and we looked long and hard for one she liked. She finally picked out one from Mervis, and although I have the designer and model number, no other store in the country seems to carry it (and trust me, I''ve tried!). I''m a guy, so obviously I wouldn''t be able to tell exactly what she likes, and I feel like their diamond prices are competitive, so I would feel more comfortable going there because I know the setting is the perfect one that she wants.

Unfortunately, I have since moved to North Carolina, and don''t plan on going back to DC. I suppose, if its important I can make the drive (its only about 4 hours). What can I see in person that I don''t see on paper? I''m not a diamond aficionado, so I''m not sure I''d even be able to tell a D color from a G, let alone any of these cut proportions. Now I''m stressing out that I won''t get the perfect one! Advice?

 

[Ellen]

dm, could you ask the jeweler if he can get you a Sarin report, and possibly an IS image? That would help greatly. Or, could you purchase the stone with the stipulation that if it doesn''t pass inspection with an independant appraisor, you get a full refund? That might be best anyway, if they will agree.

 

[dms23]

I can surely ask. Pardon my ignorance, but what is a SARIN report or IS report? Is it something that can''t be told from just looking at the certification? Also, what is an independent appraiser likely to tell me? Wouldn''t they just produce a report similar to a GIA or AGL report?

If I were to stipulate that I want an independent appraiser, would I need to order the loose diamond without the setting, or is it possible to get it appraised already set?

I know these questions probably seem basic (and maybe stupid), but all the help you are giving me is truly appreciated. I''m learning (just slowly!).

Not to mention I''m in law school, so if they try anything funny, they''re in trouble!

 

[JulieN]

Sarin is an instrument that scans the proportions of the stone. You do not need one for the F VS2. Ideal Scope: www.ideal-scope.com I have yet to see a "bad" Ideal Scope image of an AGS 0 stone. An independent appraisal is always a good idea, money and time permitting, just so you know exactly what you're getting, be it durability issues, slight disagreements with the lab report, or performance. An appraisal is best done with the stone loose. Yes, some appraisals are very basic...giving you pretty much the same details as a lab report. Some are much more thorough. Also, there are pre-purchase appraisals where the vendor ships the stone to a local appraiser and you can view it before buying. Great thread here on what you can expect from some appraisers who post on PS: https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/appraisers-walk-us-thru-a-typical-session.37560/

 

[Ellen]

Julie is right, I totally forgot it was an AGS000 stone, which really does rule out the need for sarin and IS.

 

[dms23]

Wow thanks guys... those other posts are more than helpful. I think thats what I''m going to do -- and just to think that I almost purchased the stone without listening to the advice on here!

So, as far as the F VS2 stone, that one doesn''t need a Sarin or IS but the others do? Thats because the others (G VS2 and E VS1) don''t have the information? Or is it that they likely wouldn''t pass the test?

 

[Ellen]

Date: 9/6/2006 9:04:53 PM
Author: dms23
Wow thanks guys... those other posts are more than helpful. I think thats what I''m going to do -- and just to think that I almost purchased the stone without listening to the advice on here!

So, as far as the F VS2 stone, that one doesn''t need a Sarin or IS but the others do? Thats because the others (G VS2 and E VS1) don''t have the information? Or is it that they likely wouldn''t pass the test?

Stick with the FVS2, it is by far the best stone. A real winner. No need for the other info.

And to your last question, answer is, both.

 

[dms23]

Does it change your opinion at all that I went to GIA''s website and entered the GIA number for the 1.75 G stone, and entered in all the dimensions, angles, etc. into the cutadvisor on pricescope and it came back with a score of 1.2?

 

[JulieN]

Yes, I saw that. There are certain usage warnings with HCA. http://diamonds.pricescope.com/ideal.asp There are many different environments and viewing conditons that the stone will be in, and certain proportions are better under different circumstances. Unfortunately, you can only have one diamond, and it would be good to have a combination that performs well in more conditions. If you try table=59, CA=34, PA=40.7, that is also HCA=1.2, but it is a combination that will probably be much more pleasing to your eyes. And since that combination isn't a "sweet spot," any variations in symmetry would negatively impact the stone.

Also, the GIA stone is a GIA "VG" cut at best due to the girdle, and only VG on finish. That would make it very overpriced compared to: http://www.niceice.com/certcopies/gia15170365/index.htm $17160

Oh, yeah, what's the designer of the setting she liked?

 

[dms23]

Its a Judith Conway, but a particular model that very few have even heard of, let alone that they can order. I think it may be a discontinued model, although I''m just guessing there. Judith Conway LS-0183

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Date: 9/6/2006 8:08:00 PM
Author: dms23
Thanks Julie (and others). This is a big help. Tell me if this diamond is better or worse?

It is AGS performance-based 1.62 / F / VS2
7.52-7.56 x 4.62mm
Depth: 61.3%
Table: 56.3%
Crown: 15%; 34.6 degrees
Pavilion: 43.1%; 40.8 degrees
Pointed
Faceted: 1.1% to 4.0%
Light Performance: 0
Proportion Factors: 0
Finish: 0
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
PRICE: $17500

This is a little smaller than I intended (as compared with the previous stones) but if it will reflect more light, its probably worth the difference, right?!

This one looks great!

I could probably order this one without further info. I totally understand the setting issues. It''s worth it to get the one she really loves because they are hard to find!!!

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 9/6/2006 10:24:02 PM
Author: diamondseeker2006

Date: 9/6/2006 8:08:00 PM
Author: dms23
Thanks Julie (and others). This is a big help. Tell me if this diamond is better or worse?

It is AGS performance-based 1.62 / F / VS2
7.52-7.56 x 4.62mm
Depth: 61.3%
Table: 56.3%
Crown: 15%; 34.6 degrees
Pavilion: 43.1%; 40.8 degrees
Pointed
Faceted: 1.1% to 4.0%
Light Performance: 0
Proportion Factors: 0
Finish: 0
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
PRICE: $17500

This is a little smaller than I intended (as compared with the previous stones) but if it will reflect more light, its probably worth the difference, right?!

This one looks great!

I could probably order this one without further info. I totally understand the setting issues. It''s worth it to get the one she really loves because they are hard to find!!!

Ditto ''Seeks! I would snappity snap this one up

 

[Giangi]

The G and the E are not exciting to me. The F looks, on paper, much better. I''ll second everyone else as I think this one is worth a look.