Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buying?

[sarak]

I am seriously considering purchasing a 1.34 carat H/VS2 diamond that I looked at in person today with the following dimensions:

Depth = 62.4
Table Width = 57%
Crown Height = 15%
Pavillion Height = 44%
No culet (put in 0%)

The H color does not bother me because my ring is a solitaire and my wedding band is plain metal, so it isn't noticeable.

... but I just put in the numbers and it received a score of 4.5 on the HCA (very good light return, fair fire, fair scintillation, very good spread). I know that under 2 is "ideal" so that really concerned me. The current stone in my engagement ring is a .87 carat E/S1, which gets a 2.1 on the HCA. Budget is a limiting factor but I don't want to pay more and seriously "downgrade" the quality of my engagement ring just to get a bigger diamond.

[If it had a pavillion height of 43%, it would score a 1.3 on the HCA. How can that 1% make such a big difference??]

I also looked at a 1.18 carat D/SI1 stone (that was roughly the same price)

Depth = 63.4
Table Width = 58%
Crown Height = 16%
Pavillion Height = 44%
No culet (put in 0%)

This one also got a 4.5 on HCA, but with grades of "good" across the board.

I thought they were both very pretty in person, but now I am second guessing myself! Would I be making a big mistake in getting either of these?

 

[sarak]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

I should add the the 1.34/H/VS2 is "excellent" cut, and the measurements are 7.08 - 7.05 x 4.41, while the 1.18/D/SI1 is "very good" cut with dimensions of 6.74 - 6.69 x 4.26. They are both EGL International, which I know doesn't have the same reputation as GIA, and that the grading might be fudged a bit, but I am more concerned with numbers and how well it performs in light right now. Thanks

 

[MissGotRocks]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

The second stone is deep which means that it probably won't face up as large as it could for a stone that size.

The pavillion angles are throwing off the HCA as well as the second stone's crown angle.

I think I'd keep looking a bit although I don't know what your price range is so I can't really recommend a stone. The EGL certs are not something I'd be willing to gamble on although I understand your concern is for cut quality vs. color/clarity. In terms of color/clarity, you are from a D to an H and a VS to and SI - do you have any preference? You can also use the toolbar at the top of the page to search for stones in various sizes, colors and clarities.

 

[kenny]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Diamonds are expensive.
I buy them for what they do with light and the HCA helps me reject diamonds that throw light away.

I'd never consider any diamond that scores over 2.0 (CERTAINLY not over 4.0) unless it is 10 ct and sells for 10 bucks, in which case I'd have it polished so it scores under 2.0.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

You get what you pay for, so having a reliable cert is really important. EGL stones aren't less expensive. They just are really lower than their stated grades in most cases.

Stick with GIA Excellent or AGS Ideal cut. Diamonds are too expensive to buy an inferior cut, in my opinion.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

What lab graded these? Is it EGL? That is more concerning to me than the HCA.

 

[sarak]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Yes, EGL. Why is why I was hesitant to mention that in the first place. I looked at/compared a LOT of diamonds in person and these two are both eye clean and the color is fine. There were indeed other EGL stones that were noticeably more yellow at H or were not eye clean at SI1.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

But you could look at GIA I color if you were pleased with the EGL H stone.

One thing you do need to do is absolutely limit the depth to 62.3. As MGR already said, too much depth may result in the stones diameter being smaller than it should. So always look and the diameter measurements.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Listen, EGL is not an issue because the diamonds are BAD. But it is a lab that basically exists so that diamond vendors can screw consumers. Not to put too fine a point on it . This is not snobbery or fanism of GIA, as your jeweler likely told you. Diamond wholesalers send stones to the lab that will yield them the most on the market. Most/all diamonds sent to EGL are sent there because the *same diamond* with a GIA lab report would *cost less*. It is simply not in a consumer's interest to buy and EGL diamond. You may think you are getting a deal for the specs, but you are not. And that is why I never recommend EGL.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

I should add the the 1.34/H/VS2 is "excellent" cut, and the measurements are 7.08 - 7.05 x 4.41, while the 1.18/D/SI1 is "very good" cut with dimensions of 6.74 - 6.69 x 4.26. They are both EGL International, which I know doesn't have the same reputation as GIA, and that the grading might be fudged a bit, but I am more concerned with numbers and how well it performs in light right now. Thanks

The way that EGL grades cut is also an issue, the method they use for measuring and reporting the propotions is very imprecise. I think in this case you cannot really rely on the HCA to tell you much. If you are going to buy an EGL diamond despite all the information on this site urging you not to then use your eyes, or purchase an ideal scope to help you out ($25). Don't judge based on the cut label, and don't rely too heavily on the proportions on the lab report.

 

[sarak]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Ah, that is very helpful thank you! I knew that the color/clarity is (very) likely lower than what the EGL report says, and I did take that into consideration in thinking about what value I would really be getting for the price. I wanted something more objective to compare, which is why I was looking at the HCA. But I did not know that EGL also has imprecise proportion measurements!

 

[sarak]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Can I ask what price (roughly) you think it should actually be worth, considering that it is from EGL? As in, what is a reasonable price for whatever you think its lower GIA-graded equivalent might be?

 

[kenny]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Maybe price GIA stones with color and clarity that is 2 or 3 grades worse.

IOW, since it is EGL E SI1, I'd price GIA G I1s and H I2s.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Can I ask what price (roughly) you think it should actually be worth, considering that it is from EGL? As in, what is a reasonable price for whatever you think its lower GIA-graded equivalent might be?

There is no way to really tell you this. If EGL were consistently off by a certain amount you could do such a comparison. But EGL is not consistent, it is inconsistent, and so you cannot pick a comparable GIA stone. You can use the search tool above to see what comparable EGL stones would cost. But I will tell you that you would likely pay less for this diamond if it had a GIA lab report. That is why the cutter/wholesaler decided to send the stone to EGL in the first place. Is that not enough information for you? It is very unlikely you are getting a deal on this stone. The best we as consumers can hope for is to pay fair market value, because sellers really know what they are doing.

 

[Lula]

Re: Help - diamond scores a 4.5 on HCA, is it not worth buyi

Listen, EGL is not an issue because the diamonds are BAD. But it is a lab that basically exists so that diamond vendors can screw consumers. Not to put too fine a point on it . This is not snobbery or fanism of GIA, as your jeweler likely told you. Diamond wholesalers send stones to the lab that will yield them the most on the market. Most/all diamonds sent to EGL are sent there because the *same diamond* with a GIA lab report would *cost less*. It is simply not in a consumer's interest to buy and EGL diamond. You may think you are getting a deal for the specs, but you are not. And that is why I never recommend EGL.

I couldn't agree more. And if you haven't looked at AGS 0 or GIA Ex stones in person, it may be worth your while to stop in at a Jared's in your area and ask to take a look at their Peerless (AGS0) line of diamonds, or take a look at Hearts on Fire diamonds (also AGS0). If all your jeweler has to show you is EGL graded diamonds, your eye really doesn't have enough of a sample to make an educated comparison.