Frenemies

[pearlsngems]

A fascinating opinion piece in NYT got me thinking about ambivalent relationships (mostly in my past) and to understand how they impacted my life and why I eased away from those relationships. I was sorry the article didn't allow comments as I think it would be interesting to read about others' experiences.

This is a gift link:

Opinion | Your Most Ambivalent Relationships Are the Most Toxic

Science shows that seesaw relationships can be more damaging than those that are purely negative.

www.nytimes.com

 

[LilAlex]

Of course! It's like chronic disease vs. an acute illness. It wears you down. There's no "hump" you can get over and get on with your life.

That said, every relationship has an element of this, imo -- I don't think any are unalloyed joy. And when they appear to be, somebody isn't been honest with somebody.

We are the most vulnerable to the opinions of people whom we respect or whose attention and approval we crave. We tend to not hang out with people for whom neither is true so they have limited capacity to inflict pain.

And some people do just let themselves be others' punching bag for one reason or another.

 

[JV36912]

@pearlsngems thanks for sharing this. What an interesting read! I can relate to a lot of what was said and, totally agree, comments would have been interesting!

 

[kenny]

I'm thrilled that I am exceptionally good at ending toxic relationships.

If you are a toxic person I won't be a loyal friend or family member.
Life's too short.

 

[kenny]

...
That said, every relationship has an element of this, imo -- I don't think any are unalloyed joy. And when they appear to be, somebody isn't been honest with somebody.
...

In my long life I have had only 4 friends who were truly and honestly "unalloyed joy".
FWIW, all four were women.

 

[Lookinagain]

We are the most vulnerable to the opinions of people whom we respect or whose attention and approval we crave.

Or whom we work for and have no choice but to quit or stay in a stressful situation.

 

[Ibrakeforpossums]

kenny, I don't know what to make of that. It's like holding a hummingbird, it's not mine but it's beautiful.

 

[MissGotRocks]

Always so interesting to find that a person you consider toxic might be a good friend to others. Always depends on the nature of the relationship. I have no problem at my age and stage in life walking away. You can spend a good deal of your time trying to make things work with some people. It is honestly refreshing to realize some things are never going to work (based on past experiences) and just be able to walk away. No feeling bad, no guilt, no worries. Just pure clarity and realism of the situation.

 

[LilAlex]

Or whom we work for and have no choice but to quit or stay in a stressful situation.

Oh, that's completely different. I don't consider a boss as a friend. Or anyone else you are forced together with like a neighbor, co-worker, client, etc. They may be kind or they may be awful but there is no push-pull there.

 

[mellowyellowgirl]

Thank you so much for that article! Very interesting and insightful read.

I think when I was younger frenemies were frenemies with all the stress of the ambiguity mentioned in the article. These days anyone who is a frenemy is really an enemy that is kept around for a set purpose so there is no stress.

 

[kenny]

kenny, I don't know what to make of that. It's like holding a hummingbird, it's not mine but it's beautiful.

... make of what?

Which comment of mine (from my two posts) are you responding to?
And, kindly explain your hummingbird comment?

Curious here.

 

[kenny]

Always so interesting to find that a person you consider toxic might be a good friend to others. ...

IMO that's because we vary.
What irks me about ... Jerry, may endear Jerry to another person.

So that "irksomeness" isn't in just Jerry.
It results from the Jerry & Kenny combination.

IOW if I don't like someone, it's not all that person's fault.
I share responsibility.

 

[missy]

I feel so fortunate. I have a group of friends who are truly the best. There is no fakeness and they are truly happy for the good things that happen for us as I am for them. Unlike what Alex wrote they are true friends who are pure in their joy for me as I am for them. And truly sad when unhappy events occur for me as I am for them. True friends in every sense of the word. These women are the best and I am so so lucky they are in my life.

The true opposite of frenemies. Genuine friends. They are super supportive and always there for me as I am for them. You're familiar with the quote...happiness shared is happiness doubled and sadness shared is sadness halved.
And with true friends that is the truth.

I did have frenemies in the past. But I learned my lesson and I allow no toxicity in my life anymore. The opposite of love and friendship isn't hate- it is indifference. And I am indifferent towards these women now. I do not hate them in any sense of the word. I just don't care about them at all anymore. I actually met two of them here and thought they were true friends. But I was naive at the time and had never experienced anything remotely close to this unhealthy relationship before. But live and learn and I don't regret the experience. It made me wiser and my heart even more full of love because it taught me to appreciate healthy friendships and true friends even that much more and actually opened my heart to even bigger proportions figuratively speaking.

True friendships do exist. But they are few and far between which makes them even more sweet and powerful.

 

[MissGotRocks]

IMO that's because we vary.
What irks me about ... Jerry, may endear Jerry to another person.

So that "irksomeness" isn't in just Jerry.
It results from the Jerry & Kenny combination.

IOW if I don't like someone, it's not all that person's fault.
I share responsibility.

Excellent point!

 

[Ibrakeforpossums]

" . . . 4 friends who were truly and honestly "unalloyed joy" This struck me as so beautiful. The fact that they were women is partially explained by your subsequent post. Maybe the best of us comes out when you remove mating from the relationship.

I'll never be this enlightened. I refer to Mr.CarParts and his ilk as "you people."

 

[dk168]

I'm thrilled that I am exceptionally good at ending toxic relationships.

If you are a toxic person I won't be a loyal friend or family member.
Life's too short.

Same!

Life is too short indeed.

DK

 

[seaurchin]

Even though I have cut the “frenemies” (friends and family members) out of my life, I still find the whole issue very confusing (and painful).

I wonder if confusion is a main reason people put up with it at all. If I don’t like someone, my first reaction is to stay away from them. Either completely or at least for the most part, if the situation is more complicated due to them being part of the larger family or friend group or whatever.

I would not continuously try to connect with a person I didn’t care for, then disrespect them and all those other nasty little actions that add up to being a frenemy. I still don’t get it tbh.

The closest thing I can think of is doing the mean girl thing where a couple of girls picked on another girl or something like that. But that was as children. And even then, I'd/we'd soon start feeling icky about it and stop.

The people I've known well who do this do not generally have good relationships with others. And I don't think their targets necessarily contribute anything to it, aside from somehow falling into the trap and having to wrestle with getting out of it. But of course the topic covers zillions of relationships so fwiw.

 

[canuk-gal]

HI:

Great read! Thanks for sharing. Lots of take-aways here.

cheers--Sharon

 

[MissGotRocks]

Even though I have cut the “frenemies” (friends and family members) out of my life, I still find the whole issue very confusing (and painful).

I wonder if confusion is a main reason people put up with it at all. If I don’t like someone, my first reaction is to stay away from them. Either completely or at least for the most part, if the situation is more complicated due to them being part of the larger family or friend group or whatever.

I would not continuously try to connect with a person I didn’t care for, then disrespect them and all those other nasty little actions that add up to being a frenemy. I still don’t get it tbh.

The closest thing I can think of is doing the mean girl thing where a couple of girls picked on another girl or something like that. But that was as children. And even then, I'd/we'd soon start feeling icky about it and stop.

The people I've known well who do this do not generally have good relationships with others. And I don't think their targets necessarily contribute anything to it, aside from somehow falling into the trap and having to wrestle with getting out of it. But of course the topic covers zillions of relationships so fwiw.

I think a lot of it is guilt. We have been taught to be nice, play nice and overlook meanness. That person has had a hard life, has problems, whatever. That means we are supposed to excuse the meanness. It takes life experience, age and wisdom to finally understand that we don’t have to accept everything and turn the other cheek. Some of the most life challenged people I have known are some of the nicest so all those excuses don’t quite cut it. We finally learn that we are not responsible for everyone’s happiness nor do we have to tolerate everything that anyone throws at us. You finally give yourself permission to walk away with no guilt. It is a process; some learn it sooner than others.