Flip this Diamond :)

[walkersareit]

Okay, I have this crazy idea. I seem to have a knack for finding great deals. It probably comes from being analytical in nature. In fact, the other day, I had an opportunity to pick up a diamond for $2,300. I did my homework. It was GIA certified and it had been listed on Whiteflash in the past for 4K back in 2005 (I believe). I plugged the numbers into HCA and it came back at 1.7. Of course, I would have verified the diamond in question with a jeweler.

Since I have discovered old european cut diamonds, I would love to buy a ring within the upcoming year. Because I can't justify buying jewelry at this point in my life (one kid in college and one coming up), I came up with an idea that may be a little more palatable.

1. If I am not looking for a huge profit, how hard would it be to resell a diamond? I would be concentrating on diamonds in the 2-7K area.

2. Where would be the best place to sell it?

I know.....probably a crazy idea, but I am curious of your thoughts.

 

[denverappraiser]

Here's some places you can sell:

Craigslist
Ebay
Friends of friends
Neighbors
Coworkers
Online advertising (diamondbistro, loupetroop, etc.)
Consignment with a jeweler
Sale to a jeweler
Pawn shops and their equivalents

How hard are these? That depends. A lot of that has to do with you, not diamonds. There are a LOT of people trying to make a living or just spending money buying and selling diamonds and not so many that really pull it off. Yes, it's possible. No, it's not as easy as it looks.

'Concentrating on diamonds in the $2-7k area' is tricky to arrange. Supply is going to be your problem. If you've got a reliable source for GIA/xxx's in the popular size and grade ranges for under market prices you're sitting pretty, but most people have trouble with that. For example, shopping on Craigslist shows the occasional bargain but the vast majority are crap that the seller thinks are worth the moon. As they say, you've got to kiss a lot of frogs before you find a prince.

By the way, be careful of your own personal security. What you're considering is known in the industry as a 'vest pocket jeweler'. These are wheeler dealers with no location that buy and sell as the opportunity comes along. They've been around forever and there's certainly nothing wrong with that but they're easy victims for the criminals when they're not careful. One pocket full of diamonds for sale and one pocket full of cash so you're ready to buy makes you a target.

 

[WinkHPD]

Denver Appraiser is totally correct about the personal security issue.

In the early 70's when I lived in Rio de Janeiro, I was essentially a "vest pocket jeweler" selling gems to friends as well as to jewelry stores. I would buy from the garimpeiros who came to town Friday nights needing money for the weekend, getting some tremendous bargains. I would keep the cream and sell the bulk of what I bought to jewelers in downtown Rio.

I was attacked one evening while walking down the street carrying an empty briefcase with only one sheet of paper in it. Fortunately I walked away from that attack with only a slight injury to my right arm, the scar from which reminds me to this day how lucky I was not to have ever lost anything while so foolishly walking around with no idea of the constant danger I was in. Had I not seen the attacker a split second before the pipe he was swinging hit my head, I probably would not be writing this today. As it was he hit my arm and I hit him with all the might a young stupid Marine could muster.

I immediately thereafter took up jiu jitsu lessons with Carley Grace for the next two years. It made me better prepared to face the next idiot who might come after me. More importantly, it also gave me a certain awareness that kept me away from many other potential problems. Staying out of trouble was probably the second most important lesson I got from Carley.

The first you ask? That is simple. Hanging around with Carley and his brothers, also all jiu jitsu experts, I learned that there are some VERY TOUGH people in this world, and that I am not one of them.

Wink

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Here's some places you can sell:

Craigslist
Ebay
Friends of friends
Neighbors
Coworkers
Online advertising (diamondbistro, loupetroop, etc.)
Consignment with a jeweler
Sale to a jeweler
Pawn shops and their equivalents

How hard are these? That depends. A lot of that has to do with you, not diamonds. There are a LOT of people trying to make a living or just spending money buying and selling diamonds and not so many that really pull it off. Yes, it's possible. No, it's not as easy as it looks.

'Concentrating on diamonds in the $2-7k area' is tricky to arrange. Supply is going to be your problem. If you've got a reliable source for GIA/xxx's in the popular size and grade ranges for under market prices you're sitting pretty, but most people have trouble with that. For example, shopping on Craigslist shows the occasional bargain but the vast majority are crap that the seller thinks are worth the moon. As they say, you've got to kiss a lot of frogs before you find a prince.

By the way, be careful of your own personal security. What you're considering is known in the industry as a 'vest pocket jeweler'. These are wheeler dealers with no location that buy and sell as the opportunity comes along. They've been around forever and there's certainly nothing wrong with that but they're easy victims for the criminals when they're not careful. One pocket full of diamonds for sale and one pocket full of cash so you're ready to buy makes you a target.

I wholeheartedly agree with Neil's advice. In fact, I will take the cautionary advice up a notch.

Yes, it is possible to be successful as a pocket dealer. But it is NOT possible to do it safely. Even the successful ones have setbacks. For the lucky ones it is only a financial setback which they can rebound from.

Without a solid support and security structure, attempting to operate in the diamond and fine jewelry business is a matter of constantly rolling the dice. You know craps will come up, you just don't know when.

The financial and physical dangers exist everywhere in the process from buying the right goods at the right price to finding sincere legitimate buyers, to making safe financial transactions. Even professionals with proper support frameworks who have been working in the business for decades and who have finely honed instincts about goods, people and situations are constantly on guard.

As a pocket dealer selling to the public at large, it is not just about having to kiss alot of frogs. It is the fact that some of those frogs are poisonous.

My advice to anyone thinking about transitioning their interest in diamonds and jewelry from personal hobby to commercial enterprise is to first do an apprenticeship with a good jeweler to begin to learn the business from the inside. Establishing that relationship could also serve the purpose of gaining access to nice things at good prices. In the meantime you can get a feel for whether you truly want to go wading in the frog pond.

For your sake and the sake of your family, you do NOT want to bring the wrong frogs home with you.

 

[cflutist]

Wow, scarry. Glad you are okay Wink. Security is really important when one is in the jewelry business.

For a similar reason, I asked Tiffany & Co to give me a plain paper bag to carry my blue box, blue bag, books, paperwork, etc. out of the
store because I didn't want to be walking around Carmel CA advertising to everyone that I had just bought Tiffany jewelry. The Tiffany Yellow Diamond ring was sent to NY for sizing anyway (they also gave me a choice there, I could wear it out, then get it sized back home where it would still go to NY anyway) With security in mind, I just had them ship directly to NY.

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Denver Appraiser is totally correct about the personal security issue.

In the early 70's when I lived in Rio de Janeiro, I was essentially a "vest pocket jeweler" selling gems to friends as well as to jewelry stores. I would buy from the garimpeiros who came to town Friday nights needing money for the weekend, getting some tremendous bargains. I would keep the cream and sell the bulk of what I bought to jewelers in downtown Rio.

I was attacked one evening while walking down the street carrying an empty briefcase with only one sheet of paper in it. Fortunately I walked away from that attack with only a slight injury to my right arm, the scar from which reminds me to this day how lucky I was not to have ever lost anything while so foolishly walking around with no idea of the constant danger I was in. Had I not seen the attacker a split second before the pipe he was swinging hit my head, I probably would not be writing this today. As it was he hit my arm and I hit him with all the might a young stupid Marine could muster.

I immediately thereafter took up jiu jitsu lessons with Carley Grace for the next two years. It made me better prepared to face the next idiot who might come after me. More importantly, it also gave me a certain awareness that kept me away from many other potential problems. Staying out of trouble was probably the second most important lesson I got from Carley.

The first you ask? That is simple. Hanging around with Carley and his brothers, also all jiu jitsu experts, I learned that there are some VERY TOUGH people in this world, and that I am not one of them.

Wink

Wink,
We were posting at the same time. I am very happy that you dodged catastrophy.

Most pocket dealers are not working in foreign countries or in unfamiliar surroundings. They operate on their own turf and therefore tend to develop dangerous false sense of security.

It's important to understand that the bad guys are here too. In fact many of the professional criminals that specialize in preying on the jewelry industry come up from South America. But they by no means have a monopoly. There are fraudsters and criminals of many persuasions.

Some of the slickest are the ones you would never suspect.

 

[digether]

How difficult is it to get an apprenticeship with a jeweler if you do not already have any connections in the jewelry business? Do you have recommendations for ways to educate yourself and get a foot in the door, if the goal is to transition from a prosumer/hobbyist into working in the industry in some capacity?

Thanks for all your help and advice!

 

[denverappraiser]

Nearly everyone starts out on the sales floor. That's a place to learn the skills, to meet the people and to get a feel for whether it's the right industry in the first place. Pick a store or 5 and go apply.

 

[walkersareit]

Thanks denverappraiser, wink, and, Texas Leaguer for your response.

I totally agree with safety and kissing a few frogs, before the prince comes along. Craigslist has become my friend over the years. However, I am extremely cautious. I am not looking at this as a job. It would purely be a hobby. I guess what I am after, if I listed the diamond for 4k with specs listed below, do you think it would sell relatively quickly on loupetroupe or diamondbistro.

GIA Report

Carat Weight: 1.06

Color Grade: J

Color Clarity: SI1

Depth: 60.8

Table: 56

Crown Angle: 34.8

Pavillion Angle: 40.9

Crown Percent: 15.5

Measurements: 6.64x6.74x4.0

Girdle: Thin to medium

Culet: None

Polish: Excellent

Symmetry: Excellent

Fluorescence: None

Clarity Characteristics: Crystal, Cloud, Feather, Needle

 

[Texas Leaguer]

How difficult is it to get an apprenticeship with a jeweler if you do not already have any connections in the jewelry business? Do you have recommendations for ways to educate yourself and get a foot in the door, if the goal is to transition from a prosumer/hobbyist into working in the industry in some capacity?

Thanks for all your help and advice!

Apprenticeship was probably not the best term. Essentially I am recommending you work in the industry as a first step. The good news is that during the high season jobs are pretty easy to come by. Especially part time jobs. Look for a high quality independent jeweler. Chain stores may be easier to get jobs in but I think there is less to learn.

Go shopping. Get a feel for different jewelers, the quality they sell and the nature of their operation and clientele. Let them know you are a knowledgeable hobbyist with a passion for diamonds and jewelry and that you are interested in the business. This is the way to start getting a feel and opening up some doors.

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

Thanks denverappraiser, wink, and, Texas Leaguer for your response.

I totally agree with safety and kissing a few frogs, before the prince comes along. Craigslist has become my friend over the years. However, I am extremely cautious. I am not looking at this as a job. It would purely be a hobby. I guess what I am after, if I listed the diamond for 4k with specs listed below, do you think it would sell relatively quickly on loupetroupe or diamondbistro.

GIA Report

Carat Weight: 1.06

Color Grade: J

Color Clarity: SI1

Depth: 60.8

Table: 56

Crown Angle: 34.8

Pavillion Angle: 40.9

Crown Percent: 15.5

Measurements: 6.64x6.74x4.0

Girdle: Thin to medium

Culet: None

Polish: Excellent

Symmetry: Excellent

Fluorescence: None

Clarity Characteristics: Crystal, Cloud, Feather, Needle

Reasons why it could sell fast: the price seems relatively attractive on a consumer-level.

Reasons why it could not sell fast:
- Who are you? What is your track-record? Can you be trusted?
- Will you surely deliver a diamond?
- Will you surely deliver this diamond?
- Is that diamond still in its original state? Not damaged?
- Did you obtain this 'apparently' cheap diamond in a legal way?
- What can you truly tell me about this diamond?
- Can you assist me in the jewelry-making-process?
- What kind of guarantee do I get from you? And how valuable if that guarantee if I do not know you?
- Is this diamond 'truly' cheap, or only at first sight?

If you really want to know what will actually happen, you need to try it out. Personally, I am not interested to buy at that price. But then again, I see a lot of diamonds sold in which I have absolutely no interest .

Live long,

 

[apacherose]

Table: 56

Reasons why it could sell fast: the price seems relatively attractive on a consumer-level.

Reasons why it could not sell fast:
- Who are you? What is your track-record? Can you be trusted?
- Will you surely deliver a diamond?
- Will you surely deliver this diamond?
- Is that diamond still in its original state? Not damaged?
- Did you obtain this 'apparently' cheap diamond in a legal way?
- What can you truly tell me about this diamond?
- Can you assist me in the jewelry-making-process?
- What kind of guarantee do I get from you? And how valuable if that guarantee if I do not know you?
- Is this diamond 'truly' cheap, or only at first sight?

If you really want to know what will actually happen, you need to try it out. Personally, I am not interested to buy at that price. But then again, I see a lot of diamonds sold in which I have absolutely no interest .

Live long,

Paul-Antwerp---- allllll that, yes, as least as a consumer, echoes my personal feelings on buying such a diamond.

Fascinating thread! Good luck, OP!