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Did I Make a Mistake?

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ML2014

Rough_Rock
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Apr 20, 2007
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I''ve posted before (back in May) about purchasing a center stone for a 3 stone ring. I wanted to use my local B&M because they have a great trade-up policy and I trust them. After spending some time with one of the owners and looking at a variety of stones (all round brilliant), I narrowed my choice down to 3 stones- 2 of which were GIA Excellent cuts and 1 which was a GIA VG cut.

My jeweler had me look at all 3 stones in various lighting conditions- even had me go outside and walk around the parking lot with them. I immediately removed one of the GIA Ex cuts from consideration because it looked cloudy/milky (does that make sense?) around the outer perimter (it was a 1.3 carat G VS1). The 2 remaining were a 1.2 carat G VS1 Ex cut and a 1.51 carat H SI VG Cut. After looking at these sones at lenghth and under as many lighting conditions as possible, I went with the 1.51 H SI because it looked the same as the better cut diamond, but bigger.

I picked up my ring a few weeks ago- a picture is attached. I love it but I keep reading all the threads here on PS and am questioning if I should have just gotten the Ex cut stone for piece of mind. The 1.51 stone scored a .7 on the HCA, and while it didn''t fit in the boxes of the GIA Ex or AGS Ideal areas, my heart kelpt telling me it was still a lovely stone. Now that I am wearing it, I can see the brilliance and fire in most light settings, but not all. So I have a few questions...

1.) Can someone take a look at the specs and tell me if this is indeed a nice stone based on the numbers, or should I have held out for an excellent cut? I know that it''s a matter of preference, and I really don''t need to see it on a piece of paper to feel that it is a great diamond, but I have come to respect the opinion of the folks on this board. If someone could take a look at the specs and tell me that the proporations are in line with a well cut stone, I''d feel more confident with my choice.

2.) I''ve read some threads about the difference btwn Vg and EX GIA and I know that there are some VG Cuts that can can provide equal if not better performance that Ex cuts in certain lighting conditions. Would you say this could be one of those stones or are the angles out of proportion?

3.) Does it make sense now, since the stone is already set, to get an ideal scope and look at the stone for leakage?

4.) Should a well cut diamond sparkle in all lighting conditions? Mine does in most, but not all.

5.) Why do you think this was rated as a VG cut? Is it just thatthe girdle is on the thick side, or is there something elese going on here?

This is an odd case of buyers remorse in that I am glad I made the move to a 3 stone ring, I just feel that I may have acted too quickly and even though I was armed with more info than I ever was before, am second guessing my choice in the center stone. I still have the opportunity to change the stone if I want to. I think that my issue is that the stones on my eternity band sparkled like mad, and this ring has a completely different personality (one I like and am getting used to- but different nonetheless). Perhaps since the stones on the eternity band were smaller, they gave out more flashes of fire?

Here are the specs again: 1.51 ct; CA is 34.5 degrees, PA is 40.4 degrees, table is 57%, Depth is 61.2%. Girdle is Med-Thick Faceted. There are two other % on the GIA report. I think one is the lgf% which is 85% and the other the star facet which is 55%. Here is the ring! Sorry for the long post (and any typos). You have all been so great!






Sparkle 1.jpg
 
Here is another picture in different lighting.

Not so sparkly.jpg
 
I can''t speak for the numbers, but I just wanted to say that your ring is gorgeous. It sparkles like a star, and the 3 stones are very well matched!
 
Date: 6/18/2007 5:05:44 PM
Author:Kajamie
I''ve posted before (back in May) about purchasing a center stone for a 3 stone ring. I wanted to use my local B&M because they have a great trade-up policy and I trust them. After spending some time with one of the owners and looking at a variety of stones (all round brilliant), I narrowed my choice down to 3 stones- 2 of which were GIA Excellent cuts and 1 which was a GIA VG cut.

My jeweler had me look at all 3 stones in various lighting conditions- even had me go outside and walk around the parking lot with them. I immediately removed one of the GIA Ex cuts from consideration because it looked cloudy/milky (does that make sense?) around the outer perimter (it was a 1.3 carat G VS1). The 2 remaining were a 1.2 carat G VS1 Ex cut and a 1.51 carat H SI VG Cut. After looking at these sones at lenghth and under as many lighting conditions as possible, I went with the 1.51 H SI because it looked the same as the better cut diamond, but bigger.

I picked up my ring a few weeks ago- a picture is attached. I love it but I keep reading all the threads here on PS and am questioning if I should have just gotten the Ex cut stone for piece of mind. The 1.51 stone scored a .7 on the HCA, and while it didn''t fit in the boxes of the GIA Ex or AGS Ideal areas, my heart kelpt telling me it was still a lovely stone. Now that I am wearing it, I can see the brilliance and fire in most light settings, but not all. So I have a few questions...

Relax and enjoy....

1.) Can someone take a look at the specs and tell me if this is indeed a nice stone based on the numbers, or should I have held out for an excellent cut? I know that it''s a matter of preference, and I really don''t need to see it on a piece of paper to feel that it is a great diamond, but I have come to respect the opinion of the folks on this board. If someone could take a look at the specs and tell me that the proporations are in line with a well cut stone, I''d feel more confident with my choice.

2.) I''ve read some threads about the difference btwn Vg and EX GIA and I know that there are some VG Cuts that can can provide equal if not better performance that Ex cuts in certain lighting conditions. Would you say this could be one of those stones or are the angles out of proportion?

3.) Does it make sense now, since the stone is already set, to get an ideal scope and look at the stone for leakage?

4.) Should a well cut diamond sparkle in all lighting conditions? Mine does in most, but not all.
Sounds good!!!

5.) Why do you think this was rated as a VG cut? Is it just thatthe girdle is on the thick side, or is there something elese going on here?

This is an odd case of buyers remorse in that I am glad I made the move to a 3 stone ring, I just feel that I may have acted too quickly and even though I was armed with more info than I ever was before, am second guessing my choice in the center stone. I still have the opportunity to change the stone if I want to. I think that my issue is that the stones on my eternity band sparkled like mad, and this ring has a completely different personality (one I like and am getting used to- but different nonetheless). Perhaps since the stones on the eternity band were smaller, they gave out more flashes of fire?

Here are the specs again: 1.51 ct; CA is 34.5 degrees, PA is 40.4 degrees, table is 57%, Depth is 61.2%. Girdle is Med-Thick Faceted. There are two other % on the GIA report. I think one is the lgf% which is 85% and the other the star facet which is 55%. Here is the ring! Sorry for the long post (and any typos). You have all been so great!




Sounds like a gorgeous Diamond.
 
Hi Kajamie,

I''m sorry that you''re not totally happy with your stone. It''s so easy to second-guess ourselves with all the information that is available here.

GIA will ping a stone if the girdle is thick. this can downgrade from an Excellent to a Very Good with all else being equal.

However I plugged you numbers in to this handy-dandy tool - GIA Facetware
and changed the girdle to medium all round and it still came up a Very Good. You can have a play and see which parameter is making the cut VG.

I think it looks wonderful. No stone will look fabulous in all lightings. In sun lots look awful.

Hopefully someone with more knowledge will be along shortly to help out more.

a
 
No, I think you did fine! Sometimes GIA is weird with their grading methods for cut, and this one might have just had an odd number combo. Means you saved some $ on a good stone.

Remember, at this point all that matters is that YOU LOVE IT!
 
I can''t help with the technical stuff, but I have to say that your ring is amazing! It''s beautiful!
 
I can''t help with the technical stuff either... but I think the ring is just beautiful. In the end it''s all about pleasing you. If you''re happy with it, then you definitely did the right thing!
 
Sometimes too much "knowledge" is a bad thing. Especially when it makes people question stones that they would otherwise think are PHENOMENAL!!!!

I don''t know RB #s at all -- but those pictures are GORGEOUS and your description of your reaction to the stone & rational & how you loved it before the analysis set in makes me think this is just the focus of mild buyers remorse & will pass.

CONGRATS on a lovely, lovely ring!!
 
just a tad on the shallow/shallow side but the long lgf% helps min. any problems.
if you love it enjoy!
 
It is gorgeous! Stunning. Your eyes are one of THE most important measure of beauty and your eyes picked this stone. I''m not an expert, but the numbers don''t look bad at all. You need to do what will make you happiest in the end, but from the looks of it you did very good!
 
Thank you for all of your responses and compliments jstarfireb, DiaGem, Neatfreak, Stephanie, thumbelina and decodelighted! I used to get so many compliments on my other ring and I haven''t gotten any on this one since I started to wear it, and I started to think...uh oh. (Maybe I just need to get out more
1.gif
). I really appreciate your kind words!

I just want to make sure I did indeed pick a winner based on the combination of the specs - I really got taken for a ride a few years back (I purchased a different stone from another B&M)and I guess I am still nervous based on that experience.

If any of the experts could take a look at the proportions and give me their thoughts, that would be great.
Thanks!
 
You know, I was looking at my original diamond last night next to my new ideal cut diamond, and I thought to myself, the old diamond is just as pretty as the new one! It does worry me that we critique numbers on here all the time, and we probably dismiss some great diamonds. My old diamond might not even be very good cut, yet it is just as bright and sparkly as the "better" one.

Your pictures look great and if you compared it to an excellent cut stone and liked it better, you shouldn''t give it another thought! I think it is the pavilion angle that is off, though. I think people usually look for 40.6-40.9.
 
Hey, I don''t know much either but from reading around I came to the understanding that both the angles at which the light hit the diamond and the very nature of the light would affect the manner in which the diamond appears.
That is the reason that the grading of diamonds is done under particular light conditions--becuase performance might be different if viewed under other light conditions, and why jewelry stores have particular lights set up in different ways. Some of them seem to me to be intending to mask inclusions and make their very poorly graded I''s and fair cuts look better by making even D ideals look bad, and others have lights spread out all over the place so that no matter where you put the diamond it is giong to give you maximum light performance and appear flawless to the naked eye.
Given that, and from my own observations, different lighting defiantly does affect the all around light performance of a diamond, and the angle at which the light hits the diamond even greater affect on the light performance.

Further, you might want to research more about the LGF and star lengths. I don''t know anything concrete about this but strmdr could probably give you more advice. I have read a number of threads where they discuss how different LGF and star lengths affect the disposition of a diamond toward sparkle, fire or brightness, and no doubt those three factors are affected in different ways by different lighting conditions. Thus if your diamond were leaning heavily toward one of those three dispositions then in a light condition that was not ideal for that particular light performance category it might have a much lesser performance than in most other lighting conditions.

I don''t know many facts, but these are some things to at least look in to! Nontheless it is an incredible ring, VERY much like the one I hope to get for my ff in the distant future (though the 5 year James Allen upgrade makes that a little more difficult!)

It seems to me much more logical to get a 3 stone over a single expensive stone, as It would maximize surface area, minimize depth, and with all of them being large enough to really create broad swaths of fire it would really create the most beautiful overall appearance I can imagine. I mean how wide are these three diamonds combined? something like 17mm of gorgeous sparkling firey diamond? How big would a diamond have to be to be 17mm? Yet at the same time who would want one giant 16mm broad flash of fire coming from their hand? but two 5mm and a 7 mm flash of fire! that would be amazing! (of course that is why a hundred tiny stones could never be as beautiful as one larger one, in my opinion).

finally,

If you compared it to an ideal cut diamond and you chose yours, be PROUD! its incredible!
 
Lighting- No diamond is going to look great in all lighting situations. I know its easy to think that everyone else''s diamond must be throwing fire everywhere even in the dark when you see posters on here talking about the incredible performance of their diamonds all the time! But as someone else said, many diamonds dont look good in sunlight, and its just a reality that some light sources don''t mix well with diamonds properties for whatever reason.

THe HCA- My diamond also falls outside of those boxes on the HCA, but I don''t care because its still a beautiful stone (as pretty as any stone that falls within those boxes are, in my opinion!) As the HCA creator himself will tell freely tell you, the HCA is not the be all and end all of determining what a "good" diamond is. The HCA is really designed for people who are ordering stones online and therefore CAN''T see the diamond before they have purchased it. It helps ensure you will at least get a nice stone. However, for those of us who are lucky enough to have the chance to see our diamond in person before buying, it really should be your eyes that make the decision. There are other crown/depth/angle combos other than the narrow one the HCA favors that produce beautiful stones. So, while the HCA perameters may help ensure that you don''t get a dead stone, that in no way means you can''t find some diamonds that perform just as well or even better that fall outside of the HCA ranges. Does that make sense?

I think your stone looks gorgeous in the photos, so I''d be inclined to keep it. Sounds like you got a really nice sized and beautiful diamond there! Enjoy it!
 
I think that your ring is beautiful!
 
Date: 6/18/2007 8:01:09 PM
Author: strmrdr
just a tad on the shallow/shallow side but the long lgf% helps min. any problems.
if you love it enjoy!
OK, you know you have become OCD on this when you spend the better part of last night reading up on shallow/shallow and long lgf%.

Strmdr- Ithank you so much for chiming in on my dilemma. I have a follow-up question or 2 for you. I understand that at 40.4 the pavillion angle is shallow, but why is the crown angle shallow at 34.5 degrees? What would it need to be to compensate for the shallow PA? Or, are you saying that the long lgf% is compensating for that?

Bottom line...I love the stone in certain lighting, not so much in others. I''ve never owned an excellent cut stone so I don''t know what to expect. I just want more fire from the stone. Maybe I am just spending too much time on a computer in a room where the lighting is such that any diamond I choose would look the same (or worse).

Aye carumba. I just wish it had a tad more fire and contrast. On the brightside, this is a nice problem to have, complaining about what I know to be a beautiful ring.

Thanks everyone for taking the time to comment! I think I need to go back to my jeweler and look at some more stones just to feel more comfortable with this one.
 
Kajamie, first, may I say that your ring looks terrific on your hand. And you say you love it so please, stop reading about numbers and just enjoy your lovely ring! Numbers are just that - numbers. Diamonds are about so much more than numbers on a piece of paper. IMO, you really have to see a diamond in person to see whether or not it''s a nice stone.

FWIW, I love my ering, but in bright, direct sunlight it looks very grey and bleh. It still has some fire and sparkle in direct sunlight but it grey''s out, but if I pull it into indirect or most other lighting, it''s magnificent. As others have said, no diamond looks amazing in ALL lighting situations so dont worry. Just enjoy it and when you''re in a lighting environment where it''s blazing, sit back and ENJOY!
28.gif
 
The numbers are fine and it looks gorgeous in the pictures. Enjoy your ring!!!
 
Hum, I have heard alot of people saying that htere diamonds don''t look good in direct sunlight but look fantastic in other scenarios. What is the reason for this? my last diamond was basically a perfect TIC cut as modern TIC go and it was glorious in direct sunlight and was bright and sparkly in other lighting--though it wasn''t nearly so incredible without the direct sunlight. Is this just because I am a big fan of fire? or what could be the reason for that?
 
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