Did he pay too much? Conflicted

[sofibebe]

I just got engaged about a month ago, (it was the perfect proposal!), and my ring is absolutely beautiful! It is perfectly what I wanted, down to the setting, and it sparkles like nobody's business! I loved it the minute I laid eyes on it.
However, because we were overseas, I have only gotten around to getting the appropriate appraisals for my ring for insurance purposes.

My F got the diamond and setting at a diamond exchange, I will post the diamond specs, but the setting is a custom made platinum setting with .30 ctw of VS2 colorless/near colorless (FGH) full cut rounds, 3 on either side of the center. Based on some internet research of similar settings, this runs about 1500$ as per online retailers (blue nile, brilliant earth). the diamond specs are as follows, and I've attached the diamond grading plot/proportions on my GIA.

1.02, E color, SI1
Very Good Cut, Excellent Polish, VG Symmetry, No Flourescence

Now, I know that appraisals from the actual seller tend to be greatly inflated so you think you got a "deal", but I went to an appraiser at another jewelry store (with many qualifications GG, CGA from AGS, ISA, NAJA). I am also still waiting to receive the appraisal from the seller himself, which I know will most likely be inflated at least 3 or 4k more.

Once he was finished he came over to discuss the approximate appraisal value with me- the setting being around 1500, but the diamond from between 7000 to 8000. The reason he discussed the final value with me was because my SI1 (GIA), E Color, Very Good Cut, diamond has two tiny naturals (cavities) on one of the lower edges of the table, plus an inclusion. The inclusion didn't seem to affect him as much as the two naturals, which he said would lower the price of the diamond closer to the 7000 side, but I've looked online for something comparable and it is rare to see any SI1s with cavities in the table. I found one with only one cavity, and I can't remember the exact price, but it was probably around 6500. Based on what I told him my F paid for it, he put it at 8000 for the stone to be on the safer side, so the total appraisal value was 9500$. Should I be ok with this kind of appraisal? I am considering taking it to an independent appraiser not related to ANY jewelry store, although this one seemed very qualified based on the above mentioned criteria.

So based on all of this information, a reasonable price for this ring, would have been anywhere from 8000-8500, NOT 9000, and assuming he paid around 1500 for the setting, for the 7500$ diamond price, he should have gotten an SI1 without any cavities on the table correct? Or is the 9000$ a reasonable price for something that was custom made, taking into consideration someone had to create/alter the setting?

What should I do? I'm not sure I want to exchange the stone because it is THE stone he proposed with, and he absolutely loved the way it looked and sparkled, and I love my ring, but I'm more upset that the salesperson a- should have given him a discount on the stone because of the cavities, b- charged him the price of an SI1 with no table inclusions/externals. It's been over a month since her purchased it... do I have any kind of an argument for at least him to refund him back some money? Or should I leave it be? Since even the lower initial value the appraiser discussed with me was only a few hundred from what he paid for it?

Thanks so much for your help!

 

[sofibebe]

 

[sofibebe]

 

[dragonfly411]

Sofibebe - If you love the ring, and he loves it and he is not feeling bad about the purchase I'd leave it be. It is GORGEOUS and you both love it. If the cavities that you are speaking about didn't bother you visually then I would not worry about them now just because of what an appraiser said about them. Wishing you joy with your ring and your engagement!

 

[heididdl]

Can we see the entire gIA certificate. I think the price is just fine. If you are not happy with the inclusions or feel that they were dishonest when he purchased it then exchange it . If you love it let it go the price is within range......

 

[bunnycat]

If it's an SI1 and the inclusions aren't bothering you. I'd leave it be. My only other concern is the 32.5 crown angle. Hopefully someone with more experience with crown angles can say whether you have to worry about protecting the edges of the stone because of the shallower crown angle. I forget at what angle that becomes an issue.

I think most people are going to tell you appraisals are to make the buyer feel better.

 

[sofibebe]

Hi Heidi!

I couldn't get a good picture of the whole certificate with my phone so I just shot the visuals at the bottom, the rest of the specs were as follows:

Round Brilliant
6.52 - 6.55 x 4.01mm
1.02
E color
SI1
Very Good Cut
Excellent Polish
VG Symmetry
No Flourescence

The cavities don't visually bother me at all, the appraiser just made it seem like he should have gotten the stone for 7000 or LESS because of them, but again, he may have downplayed because he has his own jewelry. I only noticed them because of course a girl stares endlessly at her diamond when she first gets it and when white flashed across the table facet i noticed two tiny "black" specs where the cavities are.
The actual crystal in the stone is noticeable from the side and from the top if you know where to look, but no one but me will ever look at it that closely, and it is so sparkly it doesn't matter anyway!
Should I go to the independent appraisal? Or just use his (since he did write it for 500$ more than what was paid for insurance purposes?
I don't think I should use the seller's appraisal (since it is most likely going to be inflated so it looks like my F got a "deal").

Dragonfly, thank you soooo much!!!

 

[bunnycat]

Hi Heidi!

he may have downplayed because he has his own jewelry.

I think you hit the nail on the head. The 32.5 crown would bother me more than a natural would. (But that's just me.)

I would get an independent appraisal rather than one from a person who also has a conflict of interest.'

FWIW I looked at VG cut E SI1s on James Allen and they seemed to be in the $6-7K range.

 

[bunnycat]

I'm also a little confused about the clarity grading. Perhaps someone on here who knows more about how the clarity grading works will see this and answer. I suppose I figured an SI1 was an SI1 once it's been graded. It merited that grading and once done, I do not know how an internal versus external inclusion affects the pricing, or if it does at all, or if they were just telling you that to spook you.

 

[sofibebe]

Hi Bastetcat,
Yes, I looked on there too, which is why I was worried he overpaid, especially given that appraisal.

 

[bunnycat]

Hi Bastetcat,
Yes, I looked on there too, which is why I was worried he overpaid, especially given that appraisal.

Well- the appraisal is much like any other. Probably slightly inflated. It's an appraisal and not the ticket of sale. If you really want to know how he fared for it, I think you may have to find out how much he actually paid, not how much the appraiser said.

 

[sofibebe]

I think sellers can charge more for SI1s without any visible inclusions, or more for inclusions that are around the edges of the diamond vs in those visible in the table, or those "naturals" such as cavities that would affect the reflection of light on that facet.

Is there a "shrugging" smiley?

I probably shouldn't even be worried about this, but I'm paranoid, so I had to vent to a forum that would understand.

 

[sofibebe]

Hi Bastetcat,
Yes, I looked on there too, which is why I was worried he overpaid, especially given that appraisal.

Well- the appraisal is much like any other. Probably slightly inflated. It's an appraisal and not the ticket of sale. If you really want to know how he fared for it, I think you may have to find out how much he actually paid, not how much the appraiser said.

I know he paid 9K for it. The initial value the appraiser wanted to give me was approx 8500$, but he increased it slightly to account for what he paid so I had accurate coverage.

I KNOW that when i get the actual seller's appraisal in the mail, that it will undoubtedly be inflated, probably as much as 3-4K.

My question was, since this appraiser also had his own jewelry store, and appraised it within hundreds of what he paid, should I go to an independent appraiser anyway?

 

[bunnycat]

I wish I could say. I hope someone with more experience in pricing and appraisals will see this and answer you.

 

[JulieN]

I think the cut grade on that drags the price down more than your inclusions do. I don't think of naturals as "bad" inclusions, since they are eye-clean and don't present a durability risk.

 

[sofibebe]

I was also concerned that the stuff in the table could pose any structural problems- the feathers mostly? But I doubt it since it is not an area that would receive much pressure from anything.

 

[sofibebe]

From looking at everything online, and comparing the different "flaws"/inclusions on the SI1s, the price really does range from 6000-7000 from an online retailer... I know brick and mortar do charge more, but it seems as though this rock, with the table naturals, would probably fall into the 6000s, which means he paid approximately 7500$ for this SI1.
:/

 

[diamond-enthusiast]

Return to the stone and get another. Cut is not good to begin with + all these issues with the inclusions you are worried about. A diamond is meant to be enjoyed. If you keep having 2nd thoughts, the best is to get another.

 

[sofibebe]

Since it has been past the 30 days since the purchase... do you think going in there with an independent appraisal woild help the cause?

I thought a very good cut rating was very good!

 

[ChrisES]

Very good is very good, but only excellent is acceptable! (With some exceptions, I myself gave my fiancee a VG and have no regrets, but I tell people I was one of the lucky ones. Ex is the way to go (or AGS 0).

The ring is for you and for you to be happy with, so you have to do what will make you happy. If it's the perfect setting and the perfect proposal and you have sentimental attachment to the ring because it's that ring, I do not think he overpaid by so much that it should sully those associations.

If, on the other hand, you know that you are going to be irritated by its minor imperfections and a slight overpayment, then by all means replace it. So you can be happy with it!

(Sorry I can't give any advice about appraisers and returns, I don't know anything on that front.)

 

[Dreamer_D]

Guys, she did not ask whether she should return the diamond, and the return window is over. I think we should he helpful. ETA: ok I see she mentioned it as a possibility. Still, it is not a likely possibility given geography and the time elapsed and the fact that IMO there is little/no grounds to argue she was misled.

The value is based on the information in the GIA report. I think the appraiser is splitting hairs by trying to say the particular grade-setting inclusions affect the price that much. Other gave you some online comps. You paid a price in a similar range. It is not a smoking deal, but it is likely fair all else considered.

You only need the appraisal to determine like kind and quality and to place a value. If you can replace your ring for the amount on the appraisal, then you are good to go. The GIA report sets the bar for like kind. So, it seems you can use the appraisal you have and stop worrying about these things.