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diameter measurement variations

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gte937k

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 12, 2008
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Hi everyone. I have a bit of a problem. I bought an AGS stone and took it to an independent appraiser who is a master gemologist. Everything was fine (color, clarity, weight) until the appraiser measured the diameter. The appraiser measured it 0.02 mm smaller on the low end and 0.03 mm smaller on the upper end than what the cert claims. The appraiser did this with two different tools (digital and analog), which he says are correctly calibrated. We both (I really wanted to prove him wrong and not have to worry about all this) tried measuring and re-calibrating many times over. It also happens that the diamond came with an OGI report which showed the exact same measurements as the two tools used by the appraiser. The appraiser said that in his 35 years of experience, he hadn''t seen such a large discrepancy and advised me to talk to the seller.

I talked to the jeweler over the phone and explained the situation. I stopped by later in the day and he told me that he had called another master gemologist in the area and that he thought the discrepancy can be explained by variance in the tools. The jeweler also said that he called AGS and got the same response. Then he went on to insinuate that the first appraiser was not good at his work (which I found to be quite unprofessional of him, but that''s besides the point).

I am an engineer and I have a difficult time buying the "variance" argument. Yes it''s true that all instruments are slightly different and that environmental conditions affect readings, but it''s not terribly difficult to design a tool that varies by less than 0.01 mm in most environments. We reset the digital caliper several times and kept getting the exact same results. Also, three different measurement techniques came up with the same exact answer... that''s hard to discount.

The reason I''m posting here is that my appraiser feels very strongly about this and has even offered my money back to find someone else to appraise the stone. I left a message for a rep at AGS, but while I''m waiting to hear back, can any appraisers that visit this forum give me their experience with this? Do you see these kinds of variances often? Even so, should the stone be sent back to AGS (this affects the cut proportion after all: 62.1% instead of the stated 61.9%) or should I just find another appraiser to finish the job?
 
Give us all the info and we can model the stone and check the weight.
 
This is what the cert says:
weight: 0.902 ct
diameter: 6.13 - 6.19
depth: 3.82 mm (61.9%)
crown: 34.1 deg
pavil: 40.7 deg
table: 55.9%

The OGI report has the same numbers except that diameter is 6.11 - 6.16 mm and depth is 3.81 mm (62.1%). These exactly match the diameter measurements that the appraiser came up with.

Thanks for the help.
 

The AGS report can be 0.90ct


The smaller diameter can be 0.88ct if we assume the crown, table and pavilion angles and % are correct.

 
Are you questioning whether it’s the correct stone or simply curious about which set of measurements are more accurate? Assuming the latter, my bet is on the tool calibration issue as well and I would put my money that AGSL is more compulsive about keeping their equipment in calibration than the other two. Assuming the former, take it back to the dealer and let them work it out with AGSL.

A few more questions:
Does everyone agree on all of the other measurements and things like the exact weight?
Is there a girdle inscription?
Was the OGI scan done by the appraiser or someone else entirely?
Is the appraiser examining it loose or mounted?

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 
Does everyone agree on all of the other measurements?

Was the OGI scan done by the appraiser or someone else entirely?

Is the appraiser examining it loose or mounted?

The appraiser did not measure the angles, but the OGI report matches the AGSL cert on all except diameter. The appraiser verified that the weight matches the cert.

OGI was not done by the appraiser. It came with the diamond when I bought it.

The diamond was examined by the appraiser loose.



I guess I just have two questions:
1. How often are 0.03 mm differences in measurements (between your appraisals and AGSL certs) seen in the field?
2. Let's assume for a moment that there's a mistake in the cert. What am I risking? Is it worth sending it back? I am happy with the diamond, but I don't want incorrect credentials to haunt me later and if the diameter is off, could this mean other mistakes were made as well?
 
That’s definitely more than usual but 0.03mm is not outside the range of possibility. +/-0.02mm is the published accuracy for both OGI and Sarin equipment(AGSL uses Sarin equipment) so if both are at the limit in opposite directions you're within the range even if both are callibrated. In practice I find that they are usually better than that but even a 0.01 on each side gets you 2/3 of the way. Rounding can account for the rest. Assuming that everyone agrees that it’s the correct stone and you’re happy with the stone, as opposed to the paper, this is an academic question that has very little affect on you. Obviously it has no affect AT ALL on the beauty of the stone.

Of course everyone makes mistakes from time to time and AGSL is no exception but your question of whether other ‘mistakes’ are present on the report is one for your appraiser who has actually inspected the stone. This is part of what you hired them for.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 
That’s definitely more than usual but 0.03mm is not outside the range of possibility. +/-0.02mm is the published accuracy for both OGI and Sarin equipment(AGSL uses Sarin equipment) so if both are at the limit in opposite directions you''re within the range even if both are callibrated. In practice I find that they are usually better than that but even a 0.01 on each side gets you 2/3 of the way. Rounding can account for the rest. Assuming that everyone agrees that it’s the correct stone and you’re happy with the stone, as opposed to the paper, this is an academic question that has very little affect on you. Obviously it has no affect AT ALL on the beauty of the stone.

So, I think you''re saying that 6.11-6.16 mm (caliper-measured) vs. 6.13-6.19 mm (AGSL cert) is not a reason to ask AGS to re-certify.

Thanks again for the advice.
 
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