Dana Bash quote

[Begonia]

"What consequence should China face for its role in the global pandemic"?

 

[Matata]

I hope China has learned a lesson from the toll the pandemic has had on its economy to the point that Jinping will take measures to ensure a debacle doesn't happen again or at least to the extent it did this time. I doubt he cares too much about his citizens but I'm darn sure he cares about staying a world economic power. I doubt that any other consequence other than the self-inflicted toll on the economy would have much impact. At this point, I think a game of consequences would be detrimental to all of us.

 

[Begonia]

I doubt (she?) meant retaliatory, more accountability. Fiscal and otherwise.

I agree with this. I'm told this pandemic is costing trillions, and we are going to have to pay in taxes when this is all over. When. If.

The first cases go back as early as November. November.

 

[Matata]

I doubt (she?) meant retaliatory, more accountability. Fiscal and otherwise.

When I referred to a game of consequences, I was thinking about our incompetent president who is now trying to lay complete blame on China for the pandemic in the US. He's a loose canon and I shudder to think what he'd attempt to do to China -- embargo, raise tariffs again, bigger trade wars, further erosion of our diplomatic relationship with China to the detriment of the US.

 

[Begonia]

Fair enough Matata, I understand your concern.

I'm Canadian, and I believe Canada, the rest of G7 and the global community as a whole must consider how to approach this. There should be discussion.

The transparency wasn't there with SARS, and it's happened again. We'll be 'paying' the consequences of this for generations.

In a perfect world, China will assume (some?) responsibility, but they have already been deflecting blame.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Th CCP is terrible. Let me just get that out of the way. They should absolutely be held responsible for lack of transparency. And other governments should be held responsible for their inactions and lack of preparation as well.

That being said, imagine if the virus started here under current leadership. With no other countries to serve as warnings I wonder how out of control things would have gotten before the US locked down. We STILL have states with no shelter in place orders...

So yeah, even if China had 100% transparency I’m not convinced this would have spared the US seeing how we are still lacking in centralized cohesive response. We didn’t take advantage of the time and warning we did get. Don’t know why an extra 2 months of inaction would have made a difference.

 

[Begonia]

Th CCP is terrible. Let me just get that out of the way. They should absolutely be held responsible for lack of transparency. And other governments should be held responsible for their inactions and lack of preparation as well.

That being said, imagine if the virus started here under current leadership. With no other countries to serve as warnings I wonder how out of control things would have gotten before the US locked down. We STILL have states with no shelter in place orders...

So yeah, even if China had 100% transparency I’m not convinced this would have spared the US seeing how we are still lacking in centralized cohesive response.

Govts might have acted sooner had accurate data been made available? We'll never know, because the barn door has been open since November (or earlier?), and the horse is long gone.

I can't speak for the US, but there are no restrictions on freedom of speech and reporting in Canada for health issues. It would most certainly would not have been a cover up. Sigh, but we also don't have Trump as a leader.

I choose to believe that 2 months (more?) notice in many countries may have saved thousands of lives.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Govts might have acted sooner had accurate data been made available? We'll never know, because the barn door has been open since November (or earlier?), and the horse is long gone.

I can't speak for the US, but there are no restrictions on freedom of speech and reporting in Canada for health issues. It would most certainly would not have been a cover up. Sigh, but we also don't have Trump as a leader.

I choose to believe that 2 months (more?) notice in many countries may have saved thousands of lives.

Yeah I can only speak to the response in the US. Florida literally only Yesterday passed a shelter at home order despite thousands of cases. So hopefully you can understand my cynicism that “if China had told us in November” the US would be in a better place or saved more lives considering that in the current timeline the government is still making decisions that cost lives even when the virus is literally more here than anywhere else.

You could argue that had China acted faster and more aggressively they may have contained it in China. But again, that’s a big maybe and I don’t know that any other country would have been able to (seeing how most countries were largely unable to limit spread in their own countries even with warnings and head starts) so holding them to that standard seems hypocritical.

I think wet markets need to be made illegal and there are so many human rights violation issues with the CCP in general that I take major issues with. But holding the country responsible for all the damage caused by the pandemic is unrealistic and ignores the fact that China did a serious quarantine faster and more severely than any other country to date to try to limit spread and scientists there shared (and continue to share) sequencing and other information as best they can. I can tell you that many people in China are currently in shock and deeply saddened at how poorly the US is handling the virus considering all the head starts and warnings. They are not the government and suffer more from the CCP than anyone.

This is the time for global collaboration to find solutions in my opinion.

I also worry that asking how to punish China right now is just a way to scapegoat and distract (in the US anyways) from the issues with our own systems and response. I’m angry at the CCP (I’m Chinese American and have had family persecuted by the party so have personal grudges as well) but way more angry at my own American government right now.

 

[Begonia]

Punishing the country (whatever form that means) isn't going to be very productive, and potentially dangerous post-pandemic.
The WHO, or another post-pandemic organization needs to review all evidence and (what is available anyway) and see where/how China failed to alert its global neighbors at the earliest indication that a novel virus was infecting people. The results and recommendations of such an investigation should become a global how-to guide for all countries. The world needs a site safety committee and working protocol for unsafe practise, and the WHO failed badly here. A guideline for
reparation is necessary. 3rd world countries (with little infrastructure and healthcare) are facing complete societal devastation in the wake of covid-19, and will be looking to G7 and other counties for financial aid. As a global superpower and the richest country in the world, China must step up and begin
reparation financially to the global community.

Wet markets should be address globally, as China isn't the only country who has them. Yet yearly, our flu developers look to China (and those markets) in developing vaccines.

One could argue this post is discriminatory. I argue it's about accountability, and then moving forward using what has been learned about past fails. And in that I include all countries, although until the pandemic is over, we won't know who truly shone.

 

[GlitterInMyHair]

I think arguing what CCP should've done is a moot point.

Regardless, US is doing a p*ss poor job now compared to other affected countries, so I have very little reasons to believe US would've taken aggressive, preventive actions even with more advanced warning.

And I agree with @MakingTheGrade that expecting China to contain the virus was just not realistic. Look how fast it spread in Italy, Spain, US, months after the world watched what was happening in China.

 

[lyra]

There's nothing to stop another pandemic from happening, and they will continue to happen. Accountability? I doubt it when we need to continue trade with China. They won't even keep the live wildlife wet markets closed. This will continue to happen. Every decade now there will be a new pandemic, thereabouts.

 

[Begonia]

Pandemics are going to continue to happen, but more frequently unless we change the way we do business: all of us, globally. Even then, pandemics will happen. The goal is to recognize, assess, act quickly and with transparency.

All countries are now seeing how much work needs to be done on their individual Pandemic Response Plans, not to mention coordinated responses btwn countries.

I will insist within my country (as a member of G7), that we encourage discussion, and fiscal accountability for this pandemic. That we learn from this and our own national mistakes. I don't see it as a choice, moving forward.

 

[OboeGal]

There's nothing to stop another pandemic from happening, and they will continue to happen. Accountability? I doubt it when we need to continue trade with China. They won't even keep the live wildlife wet markets closed. This will continue to happen. Every decade now there will be a new pandemic, thereabouts.

I have to agree with this. I've been reading materials from the people who have spent their careers studying the pandemics that result from zoonotic diseases jumping species, and their conclusions are that unless ALL nations make major, fundamental changes in how they conduct their affairs, this will continue to happen, with more frequency and more severity, and originating from places all over the world. There are just too many people pushing too far - more and more all the time - into the habitats of wildlife and too many opportunities for novel pathogens to jump species.

I'm going to make a statement that is very, very harsh, but I think it needs to be said: human beings have become an irresponsible, invasive species that is at serious threat of wiping out themselves and multiple other plant and animal species - whether it's through pandemics, climate change, war, destruction of vital ecosystems.....or combinations thereof.

To stop this, we need to have a majority of people who recognize this, combat the human tendency to selfishness and short-term thinking, and are willing to deal in science rather than fantasy, and then apply it in their daily lives as well as demand it from their leadership. The LAST thing we need is the recent trends toward anti-science policies and isolationist nationalism. This pandemic should bring home that what happens in other countries DOES matter here, and everywhere else. Frankly, we wouldn't be in this position if, among other things, wealthier nations many years ago had not only discouraged the trend to have large families among their own citizens, but been willing to share their wealth and medical care with poorer nations to de-incentivize parents there from having large families because they needed many children to survive economically. We need fewer people, and we need governments that value preserving natural wildlife habitats and planetary resources to do so, and to act to put pressure on the governments that don't.

Honestly, though, I don't at this point have any realistic hope that this is going to happen. I think humans will continue to be ruled by selfishness, greed, short-sightedness, and cruelty, and to cling to fantasy rather than reality. This beautiful planet, and all the wonder of it's current state, will be lost to us, and we may very well be lost to it. The worst part, to me, is all the innocent animal life that will be lost, or will suffer horribly. They had no part in this. Perhaps humans will become extinct soon enough to save many of them - that may be the best thing to happen to this planet. I honestly feel that, as a species, we no longer deserve it's wonders.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Send the $2.2 trillion bill to China. As usual the far left will side with China instead of our own government. Kept on pointing the finger at Trump instead of Xi Jinping... . The liberal left will not sleep well till we call it "the Trump virus".

 

[Madam Bijoux]

There is lots of blame to go around, but placing blame & consequences will not cure this virus. Only scientific research can do it. Every country should put as much money as possible into research, and scientists from every country should be able to work together as a cohesive group.