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szdonnie

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
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15
Hi all,

Thanks to those who gave me a lot of advices last night. I have been told that I post the descriptions of the stones to get some comments.

There are two stones I am thinking about at the moment:

Both GIA certified, Round Brilliant, D-IF, with Excellent in Cut, Polish and Symmetry, no fluorescence.


Stone A:
Carat: 1.21
Measurement: 6.89 - 6.93 x 4.19
Depth: 60.6%
Table: 57%
Crown: 32.0
Pavillion: 41.2
Girdle: thin - slightly thick (faceted)
Additional inscription: minor details of polish are not shown. H&A (i guess this does not mean anything)

Stone B:
Carat: 1.17
Measurement: 6.71 - 6.75 x 4.18
Depth: 62.1%
Table: 59%
Crown: 35.5
Pavillion: 41.2
Girdle: medium - slightly thick (faceted)
Additional inscription: minor details of polish are not shown.


Please tell me your view about them, and how can I guarantee a true H&A without actually see the stones using Ideal Scope (IS?)


In fact. can I actually buy an Ideal Scope in London? Or does anyone have one that I can borrow?
(what is the difference between it and an ASET Scope?)


Cheers
D
 
A is a Brilliant ideal cut, BIC, cut for brilliance and spread, but scarifice fire for it.

B is cut too steep in the pavilion angle for that.

H&A and IS scope are 2 different thing. H&A scope is to look at H&A images, that only shows if a stone has good optical symm or not, not the light return of the stone. IS shows the light return performance of the stone, not the optical symm. A stone can have good light return and still not be H&A and vice versa. Idealscope, ASET scope are shipped internationally.

Difference between IS and ASET scope is how many level the light return is divided, serves the same purpose, ASET is not necessary for round brilliant.
 
Date: 11/13/2009 10:18:21 AM
Author:szdonnie
Hi all,

Thanks to those who gave me a lot of advices last night. I have been told that I post the descriptions of the stones to get some comments.

There are two stones I am thinking about at the moment:

Both GIA certified, Round Brilliant, D-IF, with Excellent in Cut, Polish and Symmetry, no fluorescence.


Stone A:
Carat: 1.21
Measurement: 6.89 - 6.93 x 4.19
Depth: 60.6%
Table: 57%
Crown: 32.0
Pavillion: 41.2
Girdle: thin - slightly thick (faceted)
Additional inscription: minor details of polish are not shown. H&A (i guess this does not mean anything)

Stone B:
Carat: 1.17
Measurement: 6.71 - 6.75 x 4.18
Depth: 62.1%
Table: 59%
Crown: 35.5
Pavillion: 41.2
Girdle: medium - slightly thick (faceted)
Additional inscription: minor details of polish are not shown.


Please tell me your view about them, and how can I guarantee a true H&A without actually see the stones using Ideal Scope (IS?)


In fact. can I actually buy an Ideal Scope in London? Or does anyone have one that I can borrow?
(what is the difference between it and an ASET Scope?)


Cheers
D
Click to expand...
The first has potential, the second is a steep deep angled diamond, light leakage is a possibility. No way you can guarantee h&a without images, really in order to evaluate a diamond for crisp h&a patterning you need a h&a viewer more than Idealscope, Idealscope is basically used to show light leakage or lack of. It is debatable whether either diamond will show what we call " true" hearts and arrows, I would suggest if a branded h&a is your goal, try -

www.bestdiamonds.co.uk as they sell Infinity h&a.
 
Do I always need to sacrifice the fire (or briliance) for each other? Is there any kind of balance?

If the scopes are not used to look for the H&A, how can I actually check the H&A on the stone?


The first sone I am looking at £17k, is this a good price?

Thanks
D
 
Date: 11/13/2009 10:32:25 AM
Author: szdonnie
Do I always need to sacrifice the fire (or briliance) for each other? Is there any kind of balance?

If the scopes are not used to look for the H&A, how can I actually check the H&A on the stone?


The first sone I am looking at £17k, is this a good price?

Thanks
D
Click to expand...
Yes absolutely, if you find a branded h&a these normally have great attention paid not only to the h&a patterning but visual balance too such as fire, brilliance, scintillation and so on. If a well balanced diamond is what you want, personally I would keep looking. The first will show more brilliance than fire, the second might show leakage.

As to checking the h&a pattern without scopes, you can't without a h&a viewer. This is needed in order to judge the optical symmetry of the arrows face up and the hearts face down. Also if you stick to D IF then that will be limiting in order to find a well cut or h&a stone as D IF will often sell not only on the rare colour and clarity, but also on carat weight. Would you consider lowering both colour and clarity a bit to broaden the options? You don't have to of course but it is just a suggestion, for example you could consider F or G colour and VVS or VS clarity, if the cut is great there will be no visual sacrifice and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between D IF or those grades.
 
You will need a H&A scope to check the H&A.

The balance between fire and brilliance is what we described as the Tolkowsky ideal cut, TIC, or near tolk. BestDiamonds carries CraftedbyInifinty which are H&A TIC stones. They will have ASET and a H&A viewer available for you to verify the stone's performance personally.
 
Just went to its website and left a message to make an appointment.

It''s office is in Royal Exchange - what an expensive location - I guess they may charge quite a high margin in selling stones..
 
Can I assume that using https://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp I will be able to tell the balance between fire and brilliance?

H&A Viewer, Idealscope - what is the quickest way to get myself equipped?


Thanks for those advice!
D
 
Date: 11/13/2009 12:09:19 PM
Author: szdonnie
Just went to its website and left a message to make an appointment.

It's office is in Royal Exchange - what an expensive location - I guess they may charge quite a high margin in selling stones..
Click to expand...
You might be pleasantly surprised for price actually especially with the Infinity brand. See what Indira can suggest for you.
 
Date: 11/13/2009 12:14:55 PM
Author: szdonnie
Can I assume that using https://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp I will be able to tell the balance between fire and brilliance?

H&A Viewer, Idealscope - what is the quickest way to get myself equipped?


Thanks for those advice!
D
Click to expand...
The HCA cannot physically see the diamond so it can't really predict any performance nuance with any real accuracy. Also the HCA is used for rejection, not selection. Images and an expert vendor's eye, then ultimately your own eyes are the best way to evaluate.

Indira will have everything you need such as a h&a viewer, ASET and Idealscope for your appointment with BestDiamonds, if you want to purchase a h&a viewer and IS for use yourself, ordering from the States might be your best bet,
 
Lorelei, I have booked an appointment with Indira, thanks!

My biggest concern at the moment is still the price, she promised to show me three stones, all quoted at £22+.

Despite the fact that I have not seen the stones yet, do you agree that these prices are way too high?


Cheers
D
 
Date: 11/17/2009 9:57:22 AM
Author: szdonnie
Lorelei, I have booked an appointment with Indira, thanks!

My biggest concern at the moment is still the price, she promised to show me three stones, all quoted at £22+.

Despite the fact that I have not seen the stones yet, do you agree that these prices are way too high?


Cheers
D
Click to expand...
Hi szdonnie

Are the diamonds Infinity brand of D IF colour and clarity?
 
What are the specs you ask Indira to look for?

As far as I know, CraftedbyInfinity do not have a D/IF stone in stock.
 
I said specifically D-IF, triple Excellent, 1.20+, and she said these are very rare and there are three she can show to me next week.


I have also called up Ideal Scope to see if I can purchse the Expert Scope Kit, but it will take 6-8 days.
Do you have any information that whether I can find the Kit in the UK? (The desinated retailer mentioned in the IS website is no longer valid)

Cheers
D
 
With regards to the idealscope, maybe send Garry an email to ask about it?
 
Date: 11/17/2009 10:35:54 AM
Author: szdonnie
I said specifically D-IF, triple Excellent, 1.20+, and she said these are very rare and there are three she can show to me next week.


I have also called up Ideal Scope to see if I can purchse the Expert Scope Kit, but it will take 6-8 days.
Do you have any information that whether I can find the Kit in the UK? (The desinated retailer mentioned in the IS website is no longer valid)

Cheers
D
Click to expand...

All you can do is compare cut quality etc and prices from various dealer/ vendors to see which is best for you. D IF triple ex are indeed rare and will be costly, many are just cut for weight so finding well cut stones of this quality can be more of a challenge.

As to the IS maybe you could get it reasonably quickly from the US if you contact the link here.

Contact info -

All queries: [email protected] or fill in the form below
US queries: [email protected] or fill in the form below,
or call Dave Atlas on 215-922-1926 (Philadelphia - business hours)
Fax: + 61-3-9836-3802
Melbourne, Australia
Att : Ideal-Scope

 
Sorry, what is Garry''s email?

Thanks
D
 
Thanks Lorelei, I have called exactly the same number you provided, and the lady over the other side of the ocean explained to me that shipping may take 6-8 working days.
She does not even know they''ve got a retailer in the UK.

The lady also gave me another number to contact Dave, but no one is answering the phone.
 
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