Can anyone help with spessartite pricing?

[kelpie]

Hi, I did my first bit of gem shopping since I moved to Tanzania today. I have my sights set on finding the perfect "fanta orange" spess. I'm looking for something 2.5+cts and prefer a cushion. I found almost what I was looking for: 4.04ct un-windowed locally cut oval and eyeclean with minimal sugaring. The cut was nice...not wonky or asymmetrical. They wanted $200/ct ($800) which I think seems high. I know I can get a 20% discount. What would you pay for something like that from a local store? I really wanted to pay like $400-500 for the stone but left without doing hardline negotiation so I could do my research. I have several more places to scope out in my quest yet. This is not the stone but the color was similar to this:

 

[faegrace]

Hi, Kelpie ~

I wish I could help you. I don't know a lot about spess pricing and am looking for one myself. I do believe you're in a unique position to negotiate with the locals. (We live in CA and a jeweler tried to sell my mom a 2ct. Nigerian red-orange spessartite for several thousand dollars. Argh!) Anyway, best of luck. I hope you do indeed find what you're looking for.

~ faegrace

 

[cellentani]

How is the saturation level and tone? For a true Fanta-colored spess with good saturation and medium tone, $200/ct for an over 4ct stone isn't too out of line, especially after the 20% discount.

 

[minousbijoux]

So basically, with a 20% discount, you'd be getting the stone for $160/ct - that sounds pretty good to me, for a high clarity, true fanta color stone of large carat size. I think my best prices have been in the $140 - $160 range per carat for 3 - 5 carat stones. I bought one recently for considerably more than that per carat - sold as "true fanta" and I ended up returning it because it seemed to me to have a slight black modifier to it and was too light to be considered fanta color. I always *think* I don't have enough spessartites and have to remind myself to look in my gem box before spending even more money

I hope that helps!

PS - Kelpie, are you living there now, or just visiting? How cool to be there! Think of all of us when you're on the gem hunt!

 

[Arcadian]

Well, I can only tell you what I've found while I've been looking. 200/ct is not unheard of for what you're asking. the cleaner the stone, the more you'll pay,especially true in ideal color. With the discount you're getting a nicely priced stone. If you look around a bit more you MAY be able to find it cheaper but not by much.



-A

 

[kelpie]

Thanks guys. I guess I was just expecting it would be less closer to the source though $160/carat isn't bad since it was clean...just more than I want to pay. I am really bad at saturation and tone, I confess I don't fully understand the concept of tone even after reading the GIA intro to colored stones course. It wasn't neon like the very best spess but it lacked brown/amber coloring which is good.

Since everyone goes in looking to buy tanzanites I thought the demand might be softer for spessartites and I could get a good deal. It was a nice stone but it will probably still be there next time I go...no rush since I'll be living here for a couple years. I'm going to check out the stock of all the jewelers in town. It's weird but Swala's website does not work here even through VPN. I wish I could pick stones of interest online and then go view them in person. I'll probably go there next...I go past it all the time but they are only open by appointment.

 

[kelpie]

I finally got into Swala's website through a VPN...their color is great but their prices are WAY more than $200/ct. I guess I was way out of line. Is it just me or have prices gone up a ton? I'll still check out their store. Went to two other places today...first one had several large but included gems for $150/ct which I got the impression was negotiable. The second place had a 2.78 trillion in a necklace that was the perfect neon color and clarity but I'm not into that shape and I want it loose. He said if he could get a cushion or emerald loose for me of that quality from his Nairobi branch it will be $300/carat which is starting to sound not bad especially since in Tanzania it is customary to be able to negotiate 40% off of the first quoted price...but that is far less likely to happen at the shops with high end clientele.

 

[minousbijoux]

Kelpie - what happened to the first one you saw where you were quoted $200/ct and thought you could negotiate it down? Is that still of interest to you, or have you moved on from there? Just as a comparison, I might watch some ebay listings - the usual standbys - to get a sense of prices/ct there.

 

[minousbijoux]

Oh and Kelpie? Can you tell us a little about Tanzania? What is it like? The aplomb with which you talk about it makes me think you've been there to live before...

 

[kelpie]

Hi, Minousbijoux! The first one is a contender still but the trillion I saw today made me realize the 4ct oval is not as vibrant of a color. Just exploring all my options...you would not believe how many colored stone dealers there are...like 3 in every shopping center mostly specializing in tanzanite and tsavorite of course. I've only lived in Tanzania for 9 weeks but I'm jumping right in. We came here for my husband's job and my interest gems sealed the deal. We just love it. We are walking distance to the indian ocean with water the color of Atwater's new tourmaline and white sand beaches. The tide goes out so far you think it might not come back. The Tanzanians are very friendly and there is a large community of expats as well. Sometimes it is frustrating because the infrastructure is poor and Africa time is truly at a different pace...but at the same time the break can be nice.

 

[kelpie]

So what I am learning is the pricing is all over the place...

Today I saw another trillion which was loose and eyeclean with perfect fanta color with size comparable to yesterdays (>2 and <3ct). The cut did not seem as brilliant as yesterday's but they also didn't have any tricksy lighting. The list price for the whole stone...$178! I asked them to see if they can find a cushion or emerald but really I may get that stone for a necklace as well because the price was excellent.

 

[T L]

So what I am learning is the pricing is all over the place...

Yup, spessartites are the one gem I think it's best to shop around for because

1) They are not treated (at least not that I know of)
2) They come in a wide variety of price points, clarity, and colors, and none of them correlate really from what I've seen.
3) The only simulant i know of is citrine, and it's easy to tell a citrine (very low RI) from a spessartite
4) Natural spessartite have tell tale inclusions so you don't have to worry as much.
5) They are not synthesized as far as I know.

You can find some really good buys on spessartites if you know where to look. Now I will mention ebay for spessartites because it is the one place I have found the best pricing on them, but you should go with trustworthy sellers. A memo is not really necessary if you know what inclusions to look for, as most of them have some inclusions. A flawless spessartite is pretty rare.

 

[kelpie]

Very helpful TL, thank you. Even the eyeclean stones I see have the minute sugaring which seems to me to have the same effect as silk in a kashmir sapphire...they catch the light and sort of make it glow.

 

[T L]

Oh yes,forgot to mention, and this includes ebay and even non ebay vendors. Spessartite is one of the most photoshopped gems, and you will hear everyone calling even root beer colored stones, "Fanta" or "mandarin." Be very careful of that, as many are more brown IRL than in photos. It is harder to find true mandarin or fanta color, but I have found some on ebay for really good pricing, and with a little luck and fortitude, you can too.

 

[kelpie]

Oh for sure. I am watching some on ebay but plan to buy locally. The whole logistical process of buying on ebay would be ridiculous: Leaves the mine in Tanzania ---> Thailand for cutting and sale ----> Long trip to my address in USA ----> Long trip forwarding parcel BACK to Tanzania where I live.

That just seems silly, doesn't it?

 

[T L]

Oh for sure. I am watching some on ebay but plan to buy locally. The whole logistical process of buying on ebay would be ridiculous: Leaves the mine in Tanzania ---> Thailand for cutting and sale ----> Long trip to my address in USA ----> Long trip forwarding parcel BACK to Tanzania where I live.

That just seems silly, doesn't it?

If it were irradiated, it would go for a pit stop in Brazil, and then to Thailand. Amazing how much some of this material travels.

 

[minousbijoux]

I'm not into the irradiation part, but the travel part sounds pretty good to me