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Brian Gavin signature J - anyone have one?

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Shellcm

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 10, 2015
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278
I am deciding between three stones. One is a J with medium fluorescence , one is a bit larger, same price J without fluorescence, and the third is an I with fluorescence that is 1K more than the others.

I asked them if the J without fluorescence will show tint and she gave me the 'our diamonds are cut to maximise light and will face up white' reply. I'm hesitant to pull the trigger as I am coming from a L and the tint definitely bothers me. I don't care so much about side tint, but tint from above - especially when next to G wedding band melee bothers me.

Does anyone have an AGS ideal J they can give their honest opinion on in terms of tint?

Returning isn't a viable option as I live in Australia.
 
@Shellcm, my wife has a Brian Gavin Blue K with medium fluor. It faces up plenty white (though not icy white like a D/E coloured stone), even when in lighting conditions where UV is not really present.
 
I have an AGS ideal I, but I suspect it is a 'low I'. I also considered an L during the same time and I could definitely tell the I was whiter face-up on my finger compared to the L. I would feel confident the J you are considering is an improvement whiteness wise and should blend in with G melee on a band. My stone is just shy of 2 carats for reference.
 
I have a BGB J with medium blue fluorescence, and it faces up pretty white. The tint from the side is visible, and I almost returned it for that reason. But once I had it set, the side tint was not as noticeable and face up is plenty white. I also think a J would be quite a bit whiter than an L.
 
If I go for a J - do I need fluorescence? The one without is larger - which would be nice!
 
I'm not sure I've ever seen a J without fluorescence, so I can't really answer that question. Can they give you side by side pictures and videos to compare the two stones to see if one looks whiter than the other? Did you ask them to compare the two diamonds and tell you if one looked whiter?
 
IMG_5517.jpg IMG_5518.jpg IMG_5519.jpg IMG_5520.jpg I have BGD signature AGS J and I. They're .646 J and .63 I. NO FLUORO.

I cannot tell which is which on my ears. I can tell when they're right next to each other by looking thru the body (side or bottom). I can tell face up, only cuz the J is a hair larger. They appear the same color face up.
 
Just did a chat with someone from BGD and they said it's a no brainer and to get the blue one. I have ordered it and feel relieved. My previous purchase took MONTHS of deciding and this one was so easy!
 
@Shellcm hi again! I have had he following stones bg BGD: a 0.7c H recut by BGD no flouro, a 1.5ct J no flouro cushion, a 1.1ct K with very strong flouro, a 1.8ct J with strong flouro and the latest is 2.1 I no flouro. In my opinion the fluorescence definitely helps the color, however, the J without flouro will also be much whiter compared to your current L and in the sie that you are considering, diamond's tint to me is less visible.

Here is a picture of the 1.1 K with very strong blue fouro next to the 1.8 J with strong blue:
IMG_1216.JPG

I think that you will be very happy with the J blue!
 
Shellcm said:
If I go for a J - do I need fluorescence? The one without is larger - which would be nice!
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Strong blue fluorescence can potentially mask some yellow in a lighting environment with an intense UV component such as in direct sunlight or observed very close to a fluorescent light. But in the vast majority of real world viewing conditions, even with a UV component present such as typical office lighting, the UV intensity at viewing distance is insufficient to stimulate the fluorescent effect. Therefore, except outside in the direct sun you are not likely to get any appreciable whitening from even strong fluorescence.
 
Texas Leaguer said:
Strong blue fluorescence can potentially mask some yellow in a lighting environment with an intense UV component such as in direct sunlight or observed very close to a fluorescent light. But in the vast majority of real world viewing conditions, even with a UV component present such as typical office lighting, the UV intensity at viewing distance is insufficient to stimulate the fluorescent effect. Therefore, except outside in the direct sun you are not likely to get any appreciable whitening from even strong fluorescence.
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@Texas Leaguer, I am sorry, but I object to that. Normal windows block all of UVB but allows UVA to come through. UVA (320 - 400nm) was what was being measured as UV in the Cowing Study and GIA published in 2008. The study stated: "indirect daylight through our windows has about as much UV radiation as the fluorescent light sources". Additionally, studies have found that CFLs (compact fluorescent lamps) which are frequently used in office environments, light leak UV. There is a whole other issue with that, but I am a firm believer that unless someone lives & works in a place with no windows and no fluorescent lights, they will absolutely observe differences in diamond's appearance when fluorescence is present. (I am mostly referring to Med, Strong, Very strong, I can't speak for faint really.) As a consumer, I have personally observed the differences. I had a J color super ideal diamond with strong blue flouro and attempted to pair it with two small J side stones (super ideal again). I spent over a month looking at the three stone is different lightning environments and I want to say that 90% of the time the center stone appeared to be a much lighter shade. It is why I decided not to set it as a three stone because the color difference was so very apparent. Later, I upgraded my stone to a a slightly larger I..the J with flouro still appeared whiter compared to the I color in many(most) lighting environments. The least flattering environment for a diamond's color/performance to be observed to me is in direct sunlight. Especially super-ideals tend to go dark and this is where the blue hue of strong/very strong florescence can really be observed. I don't necessarily find them to be "brighter" in direct sunlight, more so "lavenderish".
 
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Not the best quality photos, but here are two. One is in direct sunlight, notice the lavender-ish tone, the other one was taken on the same sunny day next to a window, no direct sunlight. Which diamond appears to be "whiter"?
IMG_5589.JPG
IMG_5561.JPG
 
SimoneDi,
I see the stone on the right to be whiter in the indirect light photo and the one on the left to have more yellow in the direct light, which I assume is in line with the point you are making. And I agree that direct sun is generally pretty unflattering light for diamonds, although you can get some really awesome fire sometimes. (It would be interesting to see them in an office light setting (fluoro tubes or cfl) to compare.)
I do agree that it has been demonstrated that sunlight coming through a window can activate fluorescence, but there are some important variables there as well - how close you are to the window, the kind of glass , whether it has a film on it, and if the sun is diffused by clouds.
My point is that most viewing environments are either devoid of UV or the UV is of insufficient intensity for the fluoro effect to be activated to the level necessary to provide color masking.
 
@Texas Leaguer alright, I think that we agree on many points, but I still think that actually most environments provide some (even though it may be minimal) UV to help diamond's color appearance. I will say that until I saw it, I did not believe it. I was actually very surprised to find out that florescence can help the diamond appear so much whiter! By all means, I do not consider that it completely masks diamond's color, but it most definitely "brightens" it. And here I should really mention that I have seen this mostly with strong and very strong flouro.

Office lighting. Again, not a great pic because I was mostly observing them with my eyes and only took a handful photos with my phone, but here is one.
IMG_4939.JPG
You may be able to notice how the side stones appear slightly more tinted than the center stone.
 
SimondeDi.

I have not done any side-by-side comparison under various lighting conditions, so I would like to ask you something. Beside diamonds with strong fluo appearing whiter face up, do you see other effects of strong fluo? I have noticed white light reflection characteristic of strong fluo diamonds to be somewhat pastel and "powdery". The contrast was not as deep and dark, as if light is being scattered inside the diamond. May be I was looking at bad and hazy diamonds. Yours seems a good one, so I would like to know a bit more.
 
If I were in your shoes I would have the stones sent to an independent appraiser to get their opinion if the diamonds are high or low I, J, K etc
 
@flyingpig , you are asking a interesting question. I will say that I definitely appreciate fluorescence, it is cool, it can help color, it is a positive especially for lower colored diamond etc. but I do think that the stronger the fluorescence, the more likely is for the diamond to take on "different" faces in different lightning conditions. Again, mostly related to strong and very strong, in direct sunlight, for example, I find them to become darker and definitely take on blueish/lavenderish color, not necessarily become less tinted. The color shift to me is from warm to cool, not from warm to colorless. For example, in the below photo you can see the AGS 1.8 J with SF flouro next to GIA 1.2 D no flouro.
IMG_5059.JPG
You can see how both stones go "dark", yet the D even appears "warmer" when compared to the J.
I have not observed the exact same with medium fluorescence, I find med to be much milder. And as I said before, I do think that the best way to set a stone with fluorescence will be in a solitaire, pavè, halo, etc. but not a three stone, unless maybe the sides are lighter, like H sides with J center, or unless the sides are also fluorescent. I found that stones with fluorescence are simply more sensitive to light and they change their hue more often than diamonds without fluorescence.
In regards to haziness/milkiness, many people will deny, but yes, diamonds can obsolutely have affected transparency due to fluorescence. I was trying to find a photo that I took a while ago, I will post when I find it to demonstrate. However, I am not sure how visible that is to the average consumer. I think that in most cases, the benefits of fluorescence outweigh the "negatives", unless absolutely visible, and I also think that each diamond with blue flouro needs to be inspected. I would not have any problem purchasing from the BGD Blue line as I really think that the diamonds with blue flouro that they select are phenomenal, but I would want a good return policy for all other in order to be able to inspect the diamond in various environments.
On a similar note, I have one stone with faint pink/orange flouro, that I find had no effect on the color of the diamond which is FIL, nonetheless, I am not sure how other fluorescent colors may affect diamonds' appearances.
 
Not to take the thread too far afield, but in the context of the discussion about relative intensities of UV in different lighting scenarios, I just took some readings with a UV meter in my office (uW/cm2).
The office has overhead fluoro tube lighting, a fluoro tube desk lamp, and two large north facing windows.
Notice that the reading one inch from the desk lamp tube is almost twice that at one inch from the window (bright sunshine). And two feet from the window the UV drops off to a little more than half. Moving the meter away from the desk tube about 6 inches, the intensity drops by a factor of ten. And turning desk lamp off, leaving just the overhead, the reading is essentially zero.

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To the OP's original question, I can generally see the tint in J color, so if you are trying to wear the diamond with a G wedding band, I think I color is your best bet.

There are differences in J color stones depending on whether they are high or low J. Even in higher colors, I always ask for the stones I am considering to be compared to be sure I am getting a stone higher in the color range rather than lower. That will make more of a difference than anything. Hopefully they can compare the stones you are considering to evaluate that.
 
diamondseeker2006 said:
To the OP's original question, I can generally see the tint in J color, so if you are trying to wear the diamond with a G wedding band, I think I color is your best bet.

There are differences in J color stones depending on whether they are high or low J. Even in higher colors, I always ask for the stones I am considering to be compared to be sure I am getting a stone higher in the color range rather than lower. That will make more of a difference than anything. Hopefully they can compare the stones you are considering to evaluate that.
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I've paid for the blue J so I'm just going to cross my fingers. Hopefully it's not a low one. I did ask about a comparison but they said the AGS grading is 'solid' and three different staff said the blue would appear whiter. And it's $600 cheaper, and considering I'm coming from a L and the wedding band only has .16 worth of diamonds (see pic)IMG_0571.PNG I'm just hoping it will be ok.
 
I think that your band will be absolutely fine next to your new stone. Please post pics when you receive it!
 
SimoneDi said:
I think that your band will be absolutely fine next to your new stone. Please post pics when you receive it!
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I hope so. I had gone from feeling confident about the blue J to doubtful and wondering if I have made the same mistake I did with the L (listening to the companies assurances and not the naysayers), but am trying to remind myself that it will be better than a L (lord I hope so!!) the girl who mainly spoke with me at BGD said she has a J BGD and that it is white. Worst case scenario I may need to upgrade again in a few years I guess!

I've also messaged ID jewellery asking if they can try to choose low G melee (possibly futile but it would be good if they can).
 
Oh yes, I would never worry about a band in that style (so pretty!) because the stones are tiny! A J is certainly whiter than L, so you will probably love it! (However, the vendors I have dealt with were kind enough to take color comparison pics which helped choosing the whitest stone.)

Okay, so is IDJ making this band for you? If so, ask for I-J melee. There's really no such thing as low G melee. You are talking about tiny little stones! They pretty much all will look sparkly and white if they are well cut and have good clarity, even the lower colors.
 
diamondseeker2006 said:
Oh yes, I would never worry about a band in that style (so pretty!) because the stones are tiny! A J is certainly whiter than L, so you will probably love it! (However, the vendors I have dealt with were kind enough to take color comparison pics which helped choosing the whitest stone.)

Okay, so is IDJ making this band for you? If so, ask for I-J melee. There's really no such thing as low G melee. You are talking about tiny little stones! They pretty much all will look sparkly and white if they are well cut and have good clarity, even the lower colors.
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Yes IDJ. I did ask awhile ago when I wanted it to go with the L and they said it would be $75 more. Not a huge amount but it's still $100AUD, so I thought with the new ering it wouldn't be necessary. Do you think it is?
 
diamondseeker2006 said:
Oh yes, I would never worry about a band in that style (so pretty!) because the stones are tiny! A J is certainly whiter than L, so you will probably love it! (However, the vendors I have dealt with were kind enough to take color comparison pics which helped choosing the whitest stone.)

Okay, so is IDJ making this band for you? If so, ask for I-J melee. There's really no such thing as low G melee. You are talking about tiny little stones! They pretty much all will look sparkly and white if they are well cut and have good clarity, even the lower colors.
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Is H colour melee a thing? In case I want to upgrade the solitaire in the future?
 
Shellcm said:
I hope so. I had gone from feeling confident about the blue J to doubtful and wondering if I have made the same mistake I did with the L (listening to the companies assurances and not the naysayers), but am trying to remind myself that it will be better than a L (lord I hope so!!) the girl who mainly spoke with me at BGD said she has a J BGD and that it is white. Worst case scenario I may need to upgrade again in a few years I guess!

I've also messaged ID jewellery asking if they can try to choose low G melee (possibly futile but it would be good if they can).
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I would not be concerned about the Blue J being next to a band with G colored meleè, especially in that size! Here is a pic of a J without flouro next to a Tiffany band, I believe they use F/G.

IMG_4746.JPG

If you ask them for a lower color meleè, I would stick with H/I, but honestly, in that size they will all look very similar.
 
SimoneDi said:
I would not be concerned about the Blue J being next to a band with G colored meleè, especially in that size! Here is a pic of a J without flouro next to a Tiffany band, I believe they use F/G.

IMG_4746.JPG

If you ask them for a lower color meleè, I would stick with H/I, but honestly, in that size they will all look very similar.
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Thanks, they have come back and said they can't do it (strange because they told me they could for a different ring), and also that they can't send it in my size and I'll have to get it resized locally which has thrown me off as I have read about resizing creating weak spots etc.
 
Shellcm said:
Thanks, they have come back and said they can't do it (strange because they told me they could for a different ring), and also that they can't send it in my size and I'll have to get it resized locally which has thrown me off as I have read about resizing creating weak spots etc.
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IDJ told you they can't size it for you? Are you sure??
 
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