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Blue Nile - E-ring Solitaire ... help me out?

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danpz

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 24, 2014
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Hi all - Please provide any feedback possible. If I'm on the wrong path, tell me why. I know there are some differences of opinion on what the best ranges are for table/ depth, etc., and I'm not 100 percent certain I'm right in the sweet spot -- though I believe this is in line with Fred Cuellar's book, for whatever small amount that may be worth.

Blue Nile
GIA cert, round brilliant, 1.01 ct, VVSI, I color, cut grade excellent
Polish - excellent; symmetry - excellent; fluorescence - med blue
6.44-6.47x3.91mm

Table - 60.0%
Depth - 60.7%
Crown angle - 33.0%
Pavilion angle - 41.0%
Culet - none

HCA calculator shows a 1.5 (if that's not compromised by the 4.0% slightly thick/faceted girdle).
Price: between $5900 and $6000; I currently have it on hold.

Fire away, and thanks in advance!
DP
 
First things first, do you like 60/60 stones? The stone you had linked is a 60/60 stone:
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/60-60-proportioned-diamond

The issue with buying from Blue Nile is you have no idea what you're getting. It could be great or it could be a dud - they have no way of telling you.

I would suggest sticking with a vendor where you can be sure you're getting what you paid for.

Here is another option, where you know all of the light performance specifics, and it has been graded as AGS0:
.927ct, I, VS1
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3034520.htm

You would only be slightly dropping in size, maintaining a very high clarity, while ensuring you receive a stone that has the light performance you're after, all at the same price as the other stone.

Decision here would be easy for me.
 
Thanks for the feedback. I wasn't aware of the 60/60 stone issue, and I haven't looked at 60/60 stones per se.

From the link: "These two extreme examples have bad proportion combinations. Both are 60:60, both are ugly diamonds. The pavilion angles on these two stones are 36 degrees and 45 degrees. This range actually exists. Of all of the diamonds within this range of pavilion angles, only those between 40.2 and 41.2 degrees are likely to be worthy of consideration."

The BN pavilion angle is 41.0, so it's nothing like the 60/60 examples cited.

This might sound crazy to you, but buying with BN is going to get me to my Southwest Airlines companion pass before my annual deadline (free air travel with me for my significant other for a year) (2 points per $) ... thus, if feasible, BN is a preference. I realize there would be some due diligence with an independent gemologist recommended during the return period.
 
danpz|1409769593|3744166 said:
Thanks for the feedback. I wasn't aware of the 60/60 stone issue, and I haven't looked at 60/60 stones per se.

From the link: "These two extreme examples have bad proportion combinations. Both are 60:60, both are ugly diamonds. The pavilion angles on these two stones are 36 degrees and 45 degrees. This range actually exists. Of all of the diamonds within this range of pavilion angles, only those between 40.2 and 41.2 degrees are likely to be worthy of consideration."

The BN pavilion angle is 41.0, so it's nothing like the 60/60 examples cited.
Click to expand...

That's not necessarily true. The 41.0 is a rounded measure, due to the way GIA does their calculations. It could be over 41.2 on certain spots.

The statement also says 'worthy of consideration.' If it's under 41.2 degrees it may be worth considering, but that does not mean it's a good pick. In addition, the statement would imply stones with pavilion angles over 41.2 aren't even worth consideration, and the BN stone (with consideration for GIA rounding) is right on this borderline.

We simply don't have enough information to make an informed decision here. You can certainly order the stone and see it in person, but thorough remote assessment is not possible with the data BN provides.

60/60 is a different kind of stone than the more traditional Tolk cut. I would advise seeing one in person, prior to purchase, to ensure this is the type of stone you / the recipient likes. If the recipient is expecting a 'fire'ball, then a 60/60 stone may not be the best choice.

You may also want to try and find a BN Signature stone. Those have more light performance data, along with actual diamond images, which would allow for a much easier informed decision.

I definitely understand about the SW Companion Pass. I've had it for the past two years and certainly recommend it!
 
Thanks for the continued feedback. I'd rather be safe than sorry here ... hopefully I'll only be getting engaged once in my life ...

So ... extending out my budget just a bit ($7091), in looking at BN's signature ideal selection, here's one that caught my eye ... what do you think?

http://www.bluenile.com/certs/1179607430.pdf?params=cHJvZHVjdD1CTiZwaG9uZT04ODgtNTY1LTc2NDEmbGluaz1odHRwJTNBJTJGJTJGd3d3LmJsdWVuaWxlLmNvbSUyRl9MRDA0NjU3NDE5JnNrdT1MRDA0NjU3NDE5JmxhYj1naWEmY3VycmVuY3k9VVNEJg%3D%3D

http://www.bluenile.com/certs/241960047.pdf?params=cHJvZHVjdD1CTiZwaG9uZT04ODgtNTY1LTc2NDEmbGluaz1odHRwJTNBJTJGJTJGd3d3LmJsdWVuaWxlLmNvbSUyRl9MRDA0NjU3NDE5JnNrdT1MRDA0NjU3NDE5JmxhYj1nY2FsJmN1cnJlbmN5PVVTRCY%3D

(HCA 1.4)

Also ... what do you make of the "additional pinpoints" noted on the GIA report but not included in the sketch -- on a VS1 diamond?
 
danpz|1409774869|3744245 said:
Thanks for the continued feedback. I'd rather be safe than sorry here ... hopefully I'll only be getting engaged once in my life ...

So ... extending out my budget just a bit ($7091), in looking at BN's signature ideal selection, here's one that caught my eye ... what do you think?

http://www.bluenile.com/certs/1179607430.pdf?params=cHJvZHVjdD1CTiZwaG9uZT04ODgtNTY1LTc2NDEmbGluaz1odHRwJTNBJTJGJTJGd3d3LmJsdWVuaWxlLmNvbSUyRl9MRDA0NjU3NDE5JnNrdT1MRDA0NjU3NDE5JmxhYj1naWEmY3VycmVuY3k9VVNEJg%3D%3D

http://www.bluenile.com/certs/241960047.pdf?params=cHJvZHVjdD1CTiZwaG9uZT04ODgtNTY1LTc2NDEmbGluaz1odHRwJTNBJTJGJTJGd3d3LmJsdWVuaWxlLmNvbSUyRl9MRDA0NjU3NDE5JnNrdT1MRDA0NjU3NDE5JmxhYj1nY2FsJmN1cnJlbmN5PVVTRCY%3D

(HCA 1.4)

Also ... what do you make of the "additional pinpoints" noted on the GIA report but not included in the sketch -- on a VS1 diamond?
Click to expand...

Definitely more info on this one!

No need to worry about additional pinpoints. These are negligible, have no effect on the stone's performance. They are just included by GIA for sake of 'completeness' in their examination. Particularly at the VS1 clarity, this is a non-issue.

This one is much closer to the Tolk classic stone, when compared to a 60/60 stone.

I think you have a possible winner here - definitely worth ordering. If you don't like it, you can always return, but with the data you have here, it seems like it has a lot of potential!
 
Great. I put it on hold at BN. 48 hours to think it over. :)
 
Thanks Julie.

My theory, especially buying sight unseen from BN, is that I'd prioritize clarity somewhat over color. Some people are pretty adamant that with a round diamond, no one will be able to notice the difference between an H and an I. Who knows ... Wouldn't there be at least some chance of an SI1 having a visible inclusion?
 
All BN Signature stones are supposed to be eye-clean. You can always ask them to double check.
 
I have two 60/60 diamonds (that are ideally cut) and they are stunning!

Don't forget to use ebates if you go with Blue Nile! (I'm not affiliated, I just like saving money)
 
Julie - Really? I had never heard that bring "eye clean" was a definitive requirement of BN signature ideal diamonds. I didn't see that stated in BN's own sig ideal description page. Just checked, and there are over 170,000 SI1 (but apparently no SI2) signature ideal diamonds. Interesting.
 
HappyNewLife - thanks, I'll have to look into ebates. What do you think of the 60/60 I posted initially? Maybe you'd just have to see to tell .....
 
I wouldn't get it without an idealscope image. I suppose you can order it and see how you like it though. The two 60/60s that I have were inspected via idealscope and ASET before I pulled the trigger. Then again, I think the PS consensus is that HCA being under 2 is not enough, ALL diamonds should be looked at under an idealscope.

My 60/60 diamonds are both very white for Gs. I don't know if that's because of the light return since they are both ideally cut or because 60/60 diamonds tend to have whiter flashes (versus firey ones). I see fire in each of them. And, they were significantly cheaper than non-60/60 diamonds with the same specs (1.7 carat, G, eye-clean SI1, GIA XXX). Like, 2-3K cheaper!
 
So -- if anyone's following this post still - I have a general question re: the intersection of cut and clarity ...

In terms of getting good value, great sparkle, and an eye-clean stone -- what if any concern might you have about an SI1 diamond as an a) BN signature ideal, b) James Allen True Hearts, or c) Whiteflash A Cut Above diamond? Are the inclusion(s) likely to be a non-factor in your mind, or something you'd sweat?

Thanks for all the feedback ... it's helping me think through this stuff.
 
My criteria for the 4Cs are:

ideal cut
G color
eye-clean SI1 clarity

Then I go as big as my budget will allow, with the parameters above. If I can't see an inclusion with my naked eye, I don't care. I don't walk around with a loupe or microscope, and neither does anyone else. I'd rather be able to get something bigger and whiter with my budget (I'd never mess with cut-- that always has to be #1).

Just my $.02
 
danpz|1409784204|3744324 said:
So -- if anyone's following this post still - I have a general question re: the intersection of cut and clarity ...

In terms of getting good value, great sparkle, and an eye-clean stone -- what if any concern might you have about an SI1 diamond as an a) BN signature ideal, b) James Allen True Hearts, or c) Whiteflash A Cut Above diamond? Are the inclusion(s) likely to be a non-factor in your mind, or something you'd sweat?

Thanks for all the feedback ... it's helping me think through this stuff.
Click to expand...

I would have to evaluate it on a stone-by-stone basis. You can find Signature, True Hearts, or ACA stones that are not eye-clean, although a vast majority of these stones should be.

The other thing is that 'eye-clean' can mean different things to different people. Is it eye-clean at 16"? At 4"? When viewed from the side? When viewed through the pavilion? Some of these things matter, and others don't, but it's important to determine what eye-clean is to you, and what would be 'mind clean' in your case.

As long as I would be able to have a gemologist inspect the specific stone prior to it shipping to me (something all of these vendors should be able to do for you, with their in-house stones) and it meets your definition of eye-clean, I would feel good about an SI1.

If you can't have it inspected by someone at the vendor, I would not take a chance 'hoping' it's eye clean.
 
Rocky -- Thanks.
 
(bump bump) :naughty:

Haven't pulled the trigger yet. I was toying (if fleetingly) with the idea of something near the same price at a higher color. 3 Gs and and E color below ... would anyone be willing to provide any thoughts/feedback on these please?

All - GIA, round brilliant.

1.
1.01 ct, E, VS2, Very Good
6.26 - 6.29 x 4.00 mm
Depth 63.8%
Table 56%
Crown Angle 37.0°
Pavilion Angle 40.2°
Fl - med blue
Girdle - Medium to Thick, Faceted, 5.0%
Culet - none
Polish - exc
Symmetry - exc
HCA 1.8

2.
1.01 ct, G, VS1, Excellent
6.38 - 6.40 - 3.98 mm
Depth 62.3%
Table 57%
Crown Angle 36.0%
Pavilion Angle 40.6%
Fl - med blue
Girdle - Slightly thick, faceted, 4.0%
Culet - none
Polish - exc
Symmetry - exc
HCA 1.9

3.
1.00 ct, G, VS2, Excellent
6.35 - 6.42 x 3.95 mm
Depth 61.9 %
Table 57 %
Crown Angle 35.0%
Pavilion Angle 40.8%
Fl - None
Girdle - slightly thick, faceted, 4.0%
Culet - none
Polish - exc
Symmetry - very good
HCA 1.7

4.
1.0 ct, G, VS1, Excellent
6.36 - 6.37 x 3.98 mm
Depth 62.6%
Table 56%
Crown Angle 34.5%
Pavilion Angle 41.0%
Fl - med blue
Girdle - med to slightly thick, faceted 4.0%
Culet - none
Polish - exc
Symmetry - exc
HCA 1.9
 
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