BeaudryBabe
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Barbaro odds are now poor
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Scintillating
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diamondfan
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BeaudryBabe
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You know, I am guilty of watching the Derby every year, but the more I read about horse racing the more I think that it''s completely cruel. I recently read an article that stated how many horses have to be put down each year as a result of injury and the number is just staggering.
Too sad, I hope he pulls through. Hope he is not suffering throughout this process. Maybe he should have been put down the day of the accident after the magnitude of the injury was realized.
Too sad, I hope he pulls through. Hope he is not suffering throughout this process. Maybe he should have been put down the day of the accident after the magnitude of the injury was realized.
aussiegirl23
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I''m not so sure putting him down on the day of the incident would have been the best course of action.
Vets have developed a multitude of procedures and techniques that make it possible for an injured race horse to be healed and given the oppurtunity for a full and long life. Maybe not as a race horse, but as a horse who has great potential to pass on his gift - by going up as stud, or simply living out his life as a "normal," yet well-loved animal.
He may be suffering because of the infection now, but his owners, trainers, jockies, vets, etc. will make sure that is as minimal as possible.
Don''t you think it''s best to try and heal a horse than simply give up on him? Either way, Barbaro is in my thoughts.
Aussiegirl
Vets have developed a multitude of procedures and techniques that make it possible for an injured race horse to be healed and given the oppurtunity for a full and long life. Maybe not as a race horse, but as a horse who has great potential to pass on his gift - by going up as stud, or simply living out his life as a "normal," yet well-loved animal.
He may be suffering because of the infection now, but his owners, trainers, jockies, vets, etc. will make sure that is as minimal as possible.
Don''t you think it''s best to try and heal a horse than simply give up on him? Either way, Barbaro is in my thoughts.
Aussiegirl
diamondfan
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BeaudryBabe
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I am not sure either, however, the vets gave him difficult odds to begin with citing the very reason he is currently suffering, the infections. I just feel that in a situation like this, the animals well being should come first, not the thought of the lost revenue, ie...no stud fees.
Of course I think it''s best to try and heal a horse, however, in this situation, the one break was devastating and the vets said early on that it would be incredibly difficult to overcome and heal that particular break.
My thoughts are only what is/was best for the horse.
Kaleigh
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BeaudryBabe
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So sad...
I enjoy watching the Kentuck Derby too. But I too have serious concerns about this sport..
Maybe Equestrienne or someone else knowledgeable can speak more authoritively, but I think these accidents might be the result of these horses being started SO YOUNG.
I remember in other sports, horses aren''t even broken until they''re three years old, and certainly don''t get into demanding work (jumping, dressage, etc) until they''re four and five and up!
I''m amazed that some of these "two-year-old" thoroughbreds are even fully grown!
I suspect there would be fewer breakdowns/injuries if they gave these animals at least one extra year to mature before the put them on the track...
This story hasn''t been getting too much attention in California (or at least I haven''t noticed) Have there been any "animal rights" organizations speaking up?
widget
I enjoy watching the Kentuck Derby too. But I too have serious concerns about this sport..
Maybe Equestrienne or someone else knowledgeable can speak more authoritively, but I think these accidents might be the result of these horses being started SO YOUNG.
I remember in other sports, horses aren''t even broken until they''re three years old, and certainly don''t get into demanding work (jumping, dressage, etc) until they''re four and five and up!
I''m amazed that some of these "two-year-old" thoroughbreds are even fully grown!
I suspect there would be fewer breakdowns/injuries if they gave these animals at least one extra year to mature before the put them on the track...
This story hasn''t been getting too much attention in California (or at least I haven''t noticed) Have there been any "animal rights" organizations speaking up?
widget
BeaudryBabe
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rainbowtrout
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I have some issues with horse racing too..they race 2 and three year olds, basically horse "teenagers" (they are mature at 5 ys old) and my understanding is that this causes lots of problems for them. Also the way they are bred, with those uber thin long legs might contribute. I did read that they also have enlarged hearts, but it doesn't seem to bother them. Secretariat had a HUGE heart for a horse, literally speaking.
I think they race them so young *because* their bodies havent gained their full muscle weight yet so they can be faster, carry less extra weight sort of like a rail thin teen who runs track can.
OTOH, they work for two or three years and then get put out to stud. Good life.
I think they race them so young *because* their bodies havent gained their full muscle weight yet so they can be faster, carry less extra weight sort of like a rail thin teen who runs track can.
OTOH, they work for two or three years and then get put out to stud. Good life.
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I just wanted to say hang in there buddy - I am praying for you.
One thing I will say regarding racing, is that the amount of " wastage" in the racing industry is horrendous. Many horses are considered surplus to requirements and are discarded accordingly, not many of them are lucky enough to live out their lives or find caring owners after their racing days are over to retrain them as riding horses or care for them.
And Widget, you are correct in your assumptions that these horses are raced far too early, are bred for speed rather than conformation and not allowed to mature properly before their hard work begins. This of course leads to many tendon, joint and bone injuries, also Thoroughbreds have notoriously poor feet which are often a great source of trouble and pain for them.
One thing I will say regarding racing, is that the amount of " wastage" in the racing industry is horrendous. Many horses are considered surplus to requirements and are discarded accordingly, not many of them are lucky enough to live out their lives or find caring owners after their racing days are over to retrain them as riding horses or care for them.
And Widget, you are correct in your assumptions that these horses are raced far too early, are bred for speed rather than conformation and not allowed to mature properly before their hard work begins. This of course leads to many tendon, joint and bone injuries, also Thoroughbreds have notoriously poor feet which are often a great source of trouble and pain for them.
rainbowtrout
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RT - you would be surprised - in how a hoof can regrow. I have known of horses who have survived severe founder attacks ( inflammation of the feet) where the hooves have started to shed. In some cases these poor horses can be saved if this is caught in time, properly and expertly treated, plus the best medicine of all- time to heal.
I just wanted to add also, that with a fracture of a horses' leg, the vets treating Barbaro must have thought they had a reasonable chance of success with trying to save him. Not all fractures in horses can be treated unfortunately, mainly because of the weight of the rest of the horse being too much for many breaks, also because of the nature of the horse needing constant movement etc. I don't know the specifics of Barbaro's injury, but I think we can rest assured that the professionals would have weighed up the type of fracture and chance of success, also Barbaro's temperament and how well he would cope with restricted movement etc for a long period of time, plus how he would cope with complications such as this infection. If they hadn't thought that there was a good chance of saving him, no matter how much Barbaro is worth monetarily, also the value of any of his future offspring, they wouldn't have attempted it and put him out of his pain immediately.
I just wanted to add also, that with a fracture of a horses' leg, the vets treating Barbaro must have thought they had a reasonable chance of success with trying to save him. Not all fractures in horses can be treated unfortunately, mainly because of the weight of the rest of the horse being too much for many breaks, also because of the nature of the horse needing constant movement etc. I don't know the specifics of Barbaro's injury, but I think we can rest assured that the professionals would have weighed up the type of fracture and chance of success, also Barbaro's temperament and how well he would cope with restricted movement etc for a long period of time, plus how he would cope with complications such as this infection. If they hadn't thought that there was a good chance of saving him, no matter how much Barbaro is worth monetarily, also the value of any of his future offspring, they wouldn't have attempted it and put him out of his pain immediately.
FireGoddess
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Ok , I just had a look to see what had happened and according to the report I read, Barbaro has had a huge attack of laminitis or founder as I previously mentioned. What has happened is that the other hind leg which has been having to take more weight due to the fracture in the other leg, has foundered. This basically means that the pedal bone inside the hoof has rotated and probably sunk downwards - sinking is life threatening and this is probably what has happened. Laminitis is a disease I have had much experience with unfortunately and has many causes. In Barbaro's case it was probably caused by the extra work the other leg had to do, plus the stress of all he has been through. The vets have obviously prepared the good leg to help avoid this happening as it is a common and most unwanted side effect, but weren't successful.
In basic terms, laminitis is the inflammation of the sensitive laminae inside the foot, which hold the pedal bone in position inside the hoof. When laminitis happens, which can be caused by many things, the blood supply to the foot gets disrupted and the laminae begin to die. Once this happens and depending on the severity and cause of the attack, how swiftly it is treated etc, in Barbaro's case the laminae have probably almost broken down entirely, this causes the pedal bone to sink downwards as there isn't enough - if any tissue left to anchor it, and it can protrude through the bottom of the foot which is very often fatal. In milder cases, if some of the laminae are intact, the bone can just tilt downwards and not sink, or you can rotate and sink, or sink at a later date.
Now they will be trying to stop the bone protruding through the foot and halt the progress of the laminitis, but it is going to be very very hard to do this with the poor guy's fracture.
Laminitis cases can be saved in some instances, but it depends on the severity of the attack, the cause, Xrays to see how much damage there is regarding the movement of the pedal bone, the commitment of the owner, the temperament of the horse and it's will to keep fighting, money, skill of the vets and farrier working with the horse and patience of all concerned.
Laminitis is about the most horrible disease to strike any horse and it's owner and the worst part of it is the pain the horses have to endure while suffering from it. In many cases it is preventable, but in Barbaro's case, not surprising that it happened unfortunately.
Barbaro will need all our strongest prayers now.
In basic terms, laminitis is the inflammation of the sensitive laminae inside the foot, which hold the pedal bone in position inside the hoof. When laminitis happens, which can be caused by many things, the blood supply to the foot gets disrupted and the laminae begin to die. Once this happens and depending on the severity and cause of the attack, how swiftly it is treated etc, in Barbaro's case the laminae have probably almost broken down entirely, this causes the pedal bone to sink downwards as there isn't enough - if any tissue left to anchor it, and it can protrude through the bottom of the foot which is very often fatal. In milder cases, if some of the laminae are intact, the bone can just tilt downwards and not sink, or you can rotate and sink, or sink at a later date.
Now they will be trying to stop the bone protruding through the foot and halt the progress of the laminitis, but it is going to be very very hard to do this with the poor guy's fracture.
Laminitis cases can be saved in some instances, but it depends on the severity of the attack, the cause, Xrays to see how much damage there is regarding the movement of the pedal bone, the commitment of the owner, the temperament of the horse and it's will to keep fighting, money, skill of the vets and farrier working with the horse and patience of all concerned.
Laminitis is about the most horrible disease to strike any horse and it's owner and the worst part of it is the pain the horses have to endure while suffering from it. In many cases it is preventable, but in Barbaro's case, not surprising that it happened unfortunately.
Barbaro will need all our strongest prayers now.
FireGoddess
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I don''t think they EVER thought they had a very good chance of success...that almost any other horse in the world would have been humanely put down. It''s all about $$$
This may be gross and cynical, but I bet if there were a way to do it, they''d be collecting as much sperm as they coould from the poor animal, and keep him alive as long as they could regardless of his prognosis or level of pain.
Grrrrr.
widget
This may be gross and cynical, but I bet if there were a way to do it, they''d be collecting as much sperm as they coould from the poor animal, and keep him alive as long as they could regardless of his prognosis or level of pain.
Grrrrr.
widget
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From what I've read, the owners appear to be genuinely concerned about his comfort, but I'm just taking what they've said at face value. Only they know their true feelings and motives. The rules for breedingThoroughbreds don't allow artificial insemination. They've said that If he survives this and still can't "cover" a mare, it would be fine with them.
Racing horses and dogs is a dirty, cruel, lousy game and ought to be outlawed.
Racing horses and dogs is a dirty, cruel, lousy game and ought to be outlawed.
Living in the middle of horse country (our driveway has a grandfathered easement for a bridal path), I hear mixed things about the whole racing thing. Running is in their blood - it's what they do. And, Barbaro's trainer is a world class (olypmic winning) esquer. They seem to have a true bond. Keep in mind - the jockey risked his life to hold back Barbaro. What he did wasn't protocol. I still don't want to be reduced to a cynic - I feel he did what was in his heart.
I was chatting w/ a women who is seriously into greyhound rescue. The problem with the "sport" isn't the running of the dogs -it's in the throw away nature that reduceds the animals to "income producing property". She said that Greyhounds make up is different than most dogs. They are incredibly aero-dynamiclly suited for running - even their veins are bigger to hold more oxygen for a fast, long run. And, they have the drive to do just that.
Like any "sport", athletes take a beating - what's a running backs life span? Yes, we are able to be conscious to make that choice - but it may be someone's best shot at having a career.
That said, I hope Barbaro makes it through. That's one horse who had fire in his eyes and belly with incredible heart to come along in a LONG time.
I was chatting w/ a women who is seriously into greyhound rescue. The problem with the "sport" isn't the running of the dogs -it's in the throw away nature that reduceds the animals to "income producing property". She said that Greyhounds make up is different than most dogs. They are incredibly aero-dynamiclly suited for running - even their veins are bigger to hold more oxygen for a fast, long run. And, they have the drive to do just that.
Like any "sport", athletes take a beating - what's a running backs life span? Yes, we are able to be conscious to make that choice - but it may be someone's best shot at having a career.
That said, I hope Barbaro makes it through. That's one horse who had fire in his eyes and belly with incredible heart to come along in a LONG time.
AndyRosse
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Poor boy
I''ve been checking updates on him daily and was very upset to read yesterday''s update. The tone of yesterday''s update definitely changed, so today''s announcement was no surprise.
As for him being kept alive only for $$$, I truely don''t believe that is true. The Jacksons have from the very beginning said that they just want their horse to get a fair shot at living a long, happy life, even if that is only in a pasture with no breeding possible.
Thankfully right now Barbaro seems quite comfortable. He is eating well, greeting visitors, and acts as if nothing is the matter. I pray that he can overcome this....
I''ve been checking updates on him daily and was very upset to read yesterday''s update. The tone of yesterday''s update definitely changed, so today''s announcement was no surprise.
As for him being kept alive only for $$$, I truely don''t believe that is true. The Jacksons have from the very beginning said that they just want their horse to get a fair shot at living a long, happy life, even if that is only in a pasture with no breeding possible.
Thankfully right now Barbaro seems quite comfortable. He is eating well, greeting visitors, and acts as if nothing is the matter. I pray that he can overcome this....
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He had a fairly good night last night. Here''s a link for updates on his condition:
http://www.vet.upenn.edu/newsandevents/news/Barbaro_Updates.htm
http://www.vet.upenn.edu/newsandevents/news/Barbaro_Updates.htm
BeaudryBabe
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Mannequin
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I don''t know how I missed this thread before, but thank you Lorelei for jumping in there with your expertise. I''ve been following the story here and there, and knowing a few horses that have had similar foot issues, I am not very optimistic for the poor guy. I hate to be all "doom and gloom" in my thoughts on him, but the horse needs so much to go right from here on in to have a chance. Even if he pulls through this particular episode of founder/laminitis, which is said to be as bad a case of it as a horse can have by his vet, he may be more susceptable to future problems with those feet later due to the damage that these current health problems are causing. Remember, they''ve taken off most of his outer hoof on that foundered leg. That all has to grow back soundly and without infection and can take many months, and if something happens they cut everything off and start over.
As a horse who is famous and is also trained by a very public figure (Olympian Michael Matz), he is guaranteed to get the very best in care and treatment at any cost. Some of these services may even be donated because later this facility and these people can say that they have treated an equine celebrity. A wave of donations has poured in to help support the horse''s treatment and bolster the facility''s ability to deal with animals with similar situations in the future. What makes me sad is that for every Barbaro saved by an onslaught of the very best medical care, there are so many other horses with the same afflictions who will be put down by their caretakers due to lack of funding, time, and value. Laminitis treatment itself takes a long time, and then the maintenance to prevent further problems is lifelong and can require serious investment and commitment on the part of the caretakers. And any kind of equine surgery? INCREDIBLY expensive.
Also, any positive progress updates that we hear are uplifting, but we should remember that we are dealing with an animal here, not a person who can be told to just lay still on bed rest. Barbaro has been very active in his stall when he''s not in his sling, which has lead to needing to reopen surgical sites and rework his break site hardware. To keep an injured horse to a stall when they are active and social creatures is like being in prison in solitary, and the situation is not made better by the fact that the poor guy is a finely tuned athlete who is used to being exercised regularly and allowed to go outside and run around as much as possible. I only hope that they have Barbaro''s very best interests in mind as they continue the treatments at new Bolton. My heart really goes out to the horse and the people helping him out, as it must be wrenching to have the horse take such a grave turn after recovering remarkably well for so long.
Some good links I''ve been watching:
http://hoofcare.blogspot.com/ - Site that gives more information on Barbaro''s hoof conditions as well as regular updates
http://www.vet.upenn.edu/newsandevents/news/Barbaro.htm - News from the New Bolton Center
Barbaro''s saga brings to mind Ruffian: Burning from the Start, a book I read last summer about the great racing filly Ruffian. She also was undefeated and won the filly Triple Crown before breaking a leg in her last race. Unfortunately, she lived in a time before such aggressive and diverse medical treatment was available and she was euthanized. This book was fabulous and truly touching. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345450000/002-9802396-1627242?v=glance&n=283155
As a horse who is famous and is also trained by a very public figure (Olympian Michael Matz), he is guaranteed to get the very best in care and treatment at any cost. Some of these services may even be donated because later this facility and these people can say that they have treated an equine celebrity. A wave of donations has poured in to help support the horse''s treatment and bolster the facility''s ability to deal with animals with similar situations in the future. What makes me sad is that for every Barbaro saved by an onslaught of the very best medical care, there are so many other horses with the same afflictions who will be put down by their caretakers due to lack of funding, time, and value. Laminitis treatment itself takes a long time, and then the maintenance to prevent further problems is lifelong and can require serious investment and commitment on the part of the caretakers. And any kind of equine surgery? INCREDIBLY expensive.
Also, any positive progress updates that we hear are uplifting, but we should remember that we are dealing with an animal here, not a person who can be told to just lay still on bed rest. Barbaro has been very active in his stall when he''s not in his sling, which has lead to needing to reopen surgical sites and rework his break site hardware. To keep an injured horse to a stall when they are active and social creatures is like being in prison in solitary, and the situation is not made better by the fact that the poor guy is a finely tuned athlete who is used to being exercised regularly and allowed to go outside and run around as much as possible. I only hope that they have Barbaro''s very best interests in mind as they continue the treatments at new Bolton. My heart really goes out to the horse and the people helping him out, as it must be wrenching to have the horse take such a grave turn after recovering remarkably well for so long.
Some good links I''ve been watching:
http://hoofcare.blogspot.com/ - Site that gives more information on Barbaro''s hoof conditions as well as regular updates
http://www.vet.upenn.edu/newsandevents/news/Barbaro.htm - News from the New Bolton Center
Barbaro''s saga brings to mind Ruffian: Burning from the Start, a book I read last summer about the great racing filly Ruffian. She also was undefeated and won the filly Triple Crown before breaking a leg in her last race. Unfortunately, she lived in a time before such aggressive and diverse medical treatment was available and she was euthanized. This book was fabulous and truly touching. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345450000/002-9802396-1627242?v=glance&n=283155
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