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Am I crazy to do it all online?

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magicspot

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
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Im looking for at a 25k +/- budget with out the setting

Ive been reading all day. Ive come up with the following critera:

2.5-2.6 carats
H/I clarity
S2 or better (clean to naked eye)
excellent - ideal cut

Im tempted to do all my shopping online and even pull the trigger without entering a store. I have a novice's eye. I wont be able to really discern too much when it gets close. Online I know what Im getting I can look at the certs and i can post the details of the stones here for the pros to look at.

Its important to me that I get good value. That i get the best stone within my budget. I understand I wont be able to immediately sell it and scratch my purchase but value is huge.

I have a bunch of people who know "guys" but what would I gain from meeting or purchasing from one of these connections? the price may even be worse.

It seems like id get an education but in the end not purchase from them. I suppose I should give them a chance to match a price I find from an online retailer.

so far ive come up with:

http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=597983&ref=pricescope

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1423212.asp

basically its either H S2 vs J S1

the virtual loupe is scary on james allen! looking at the AGS report for the second stone i see a lot of wisps.

other contenders:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1328388.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/I-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1402611.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/I-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1376636.asp

http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=599023&ref=pricescope

im beginning to get to the point where my head is spinning. i have a lot of stones that all seem very similar.

thanks so much.
 
I did all my shopping online, and am completely happy with my ring.

I found there was more information available on the online stones than available about the diamonds at actual stores. The stores I visited didn't have highly magnified pictures or IS/ASET images, and carried uncertified and fairly poor quality stones.

I found that when I did go into stores the salespeople were pushy and fairly clueless and unhelpful when it came to the finer points about diamonds.

The onlne retailers I have dealt with have always gone out of their way to provide me with the information I request without being pushy.

Shop however you feel comfortable.

Re your Diamonds:
All the James Allen stones you have posted don't look eyeclean, and I can't really tell about the ones from Eternity diamonds. I'd sugest going for a smaller, but cleaner stone - Are you willing to go to an SI1 stone? If you must stay at SI2, try to find a stone with a few larger inclusions near the edge that could be covered by the setting's prongs.

Keep looking ::)
 
i appreciate your response. it echoes my thoughts.

it just seems like i get more information online.

these stones seem to be a commoditized product it makes sense to me to just do it all online.

my only thought tho is maybe visiting a family friend in the business. id probably be up front with them and say that ive been doing a lot of online work.
 
If you can stretch your budget this one's nice:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2696793.htm

or this one

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamondR...n=2&ctMax=3&color=56&resultsColumns=268435471

This one is smaller, but well within budget:
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2119081.htm

For stones you can't see I'd stick to VS2 or higher on clarity to be sure:
http://www.eternitydiamonds.com/diamond_detail.php?id=581463&ref=pricescope

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/2.300-i-vs2-round-diamond-gia-33537364

I'm sure there are others out there as well, these are just a few

Don't forget about the future! Different vendors have very different upgrade policies! Saving a little money now isn't worth it if your vendor won't let you trade in the stone for an upgrade later.
 
i thought the S1 and S2 clarity levels were my sweetspot, i trust most of these dealers would let me know about specific stones and if they were "eye clean"

they all seem to be very liberal with return policies so if it wasnt eye clean i could return it.

the first one you linked from whiteflash looks pretty nice! albeit more than i wanted to spend.

the upgrade option seems interesting but im not sure how she would feel about trading in the engagement ring.
 
magicspot|1321840909|3065851 said:
i thought the S1 and S2 clarity levels were my sweetspot, i trust most of these dealers would let me know about specific stones and if they were "eye clean"

they all seem to be very liberal with return policies so if it wasnt eye clean i could return it.

the first one you linked from whiteflash looks pretty nice! albeit more than i wanted to spend.

the upgrade option seems interesting but im not sure how she would feel about trading in the engagement ring.
Click to expand...

For a larger stone like a 2-2.5 ct, I would avoid SI2. Actually for any engagement ring I would likely avoid an SI2, but the larger the stone, the more likely you are to see inclusions. You have a great budget, so I would at least go up to SI1. That's just my opinion of course.
 
sonnyjane|1321842516|3065870 said:
magicspot|1321840909|3065851 said:
i thought the S1 and S2 clarity levels were my sweetspot, i trust most of these dealers would let me know about specific stones and if they were "eye clean"

they all seem to be very liberal with return policies so if it wasnt eye clean i could return it.

the first one you linked from whiteflash looks pretty nice! albeit more than i wanted to spend.

the upgrade option seems interesting but im not sure how she would feel about trading in the engagement ring.
Click to expand...

For a larger stone like a 2-2.5 ct, I would avoid SI2. Actually for any engagement ring I would likely avoid an SI2, but the larger the stone, the more likely you are to see inclusions. You have a great budget, so I would at least go up to SI1. That's just my opinion of course.
Click to expand...

I agree. I'd much rather have a slightly smaller stone that is better clarity.

You really need to focus on in-house stones that can be examined by the vendor for cut quality and inclusions.

Here are some that I would rather have:

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/2.010-i-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104054186011

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8079/

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2649048.htm
 
In the case of Brian Gavin, if they called in that stone for you, they would reliably tell you whether the stone was eyeclean. That inclusion plot looks a little scary to me, but if most of them are twining wisps and not feathers, then it might turn out okay. I just can't tell from that picture which marks are which. There is a huge difference in using someone like Brian Gavin, WhiteFlash, and Good Old Gold to evaluate stones versus a drop shipper. So by all means try Brian if you are interested in that stone. Then come back and let us know what he says because I would be curious.

(Some vendors may charge you for shipping multiple stones for them to examine for you. So be sure to ask if there is any charge for this before you proceed.)
 
ok i asked them for more information regarding the stone.

ill keep you guys posted.

it would be worth some small fee to have them inspect a stone before it got to me.

thanks that was a good suggestion
 
are there any other stones online that i seem to be missing?

i saw a few others but like i said before im having issues discerning differences between all these similar stones.

thanks.
 
Wouldn’t it be great if there were an industry of jewelry professionals who could evaluate your deals from the online merchants and/or your ‘guys’ and give you unbiased advice on how to proceed?
 
if my post was offensive it was never my intention.

i was just seeking advice from those more experienced.
 
No offense. I'm just treading on thin ice to even mention that there is such an industry because of the PS rules so I have to be careful what I say. I may get slapped for even that obscure a reference.
 
magicspot|1321891037|3066139 said:
if my post was offensive it was never my intention.

i was just seeking advice from those more experienced.
Click to expand...

you definitely /can/ find a good eye-clean SI2 by checking with the numbers and having vendors call in stones for review, but as DS said, there may be shipping fees associated and it may take longer to find a good candidate than it would if you were to choose from in-house stones. that being said, the in-house stones have a markup, so you may be able to save.

Phoenix had a BGD SI2 for sale on the preloved forum...if it is available I would check into that? I can't seem to find the link
 
i tried to look for the BGD you mentioned, all i can find is a sold eternity band.

thanks for the suggestion tho
 
ok filled out the quote request forms. that was a good idea.

i dont understand some of the price differences on what appear to be very similar stones.

for instance:

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/2.500-i-si1-round-diamond-gia-29054845

and

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/2.530-i-si1-round-diamond-gia-33609495

are both I and SI1, both have 1.4 HCA score, the second one is EX/EX/EX the first is EX/EX/VG

the second one is bigger and cheaper.

am i missing something?

thanks!
 
The differences in the stones could be how they look in real life, or because they are virtual stones
They're probably held by two different wholesalers that price differently.

The inclusion plot will tell you where the inclusions are, but it won't tell you how well they "blend in" to the stone - some inclusions are white and some are black, some blend in with the areas of obstuction, and some are unavoidably in the middle of bright facets.

I think what DenverApraiser may have been trying very hard not to say is that you can always have stones shipped out to an independant appraiser for evaluation/comparison - an expert eye that is unbiased by the outcome of a sale and who can give an honest opinion of the stones. On this board Trade members wil be bannished if they self-promote or advertise outside of the paid ad boxes.

Getting good pictures of the stones themselves, or videos will make choosing a good stone much easier.

I can't wait to see what the vendor quote form brings back to you!
 
again i appreciate all the help.

ill let you guys know what i find out from the multiple dealer quotes.

also the second stone referenced above has been verified as eye clean. i think i will have it shipped to a vendor for pictures, sarin, ideal scope and ASET.

from my research it seems to be an excellent option.

ive been told it probably falls outside of AGS0 standards..... as a downside.

thanks.
 
so i looked at a few stones today, and i will look at a few more on friday.

i saw some AGS0 stones..... wow they sparkle.

i may lower the carats and look for an AGS0 stone.

is it safe to say that most GIA EX stones wont be AGS0s?

because if they could be AGS0 theyd be sent there?

and the best option i can find right now is 30k.... a bit more than i want to spend. it was suggested by hopedream earlier in the thread.

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2696793.htm
 
It looks very nice.
 
I didn't look at every diamond posted or read every word, but with that budget I'd get an AGS0. No way would I settle for less. I'd get an WF ACG, a BGD signature or something from GOG. And yes you can do it all online. You'll never regret that part.
 
im making progress with my search and have narrowed it down to a few different stones.

first choice:

http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-2-carat-ideal-cut-i-color-si1-clarity_LD02207543

downside is HCA 2.6, but AGS000, i wont get more info than the AGSL cert, theyll take a few pictures and verify that its eye clean.

AGSL light performance looks great tho. and that should trump HCA i believe.

26.5k

second choice:

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/2.530-i-si1-round-diamond-gia-33609495

larger stone, probably wouldnt be an AGS 000, i can get the full battery done on this, sarin, aset, etc. also eye clean, better HCA, inclusions look more scary

its a virtual stone, i would have to have BGD order it for me and id have to pay them to run the tests.

if the first stone looks much better, which i think it does.... it makes little sense for me to order this stone.

they are willing to work with me on price. so its a tad cheaper than whats posted.

and finally:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2696793.htm

this is more than i want to spend. im thinking choice 1 would be similar, just slightly smaller, under that 2.5 carat price bump and overall a better value.

the price for stone 1 seems good, even tho most of the other stuff i looked at on blue nile seemed high.

is my assessment on par?

thanks! and happy thanksgiving
 
Hi Magick spot, 4 thoughts:

1)
Whiteflash's definition of eyeclean:

Inclusions in this diamond are not visible to the naked eye with the diamond viewed in the face-up position in normal overhead lighting from a distance of 10 inches by a person with 20/20 vision.
*This viewing distance is based upon the “distance of most distinct vision” (25 cm) in the field of optometry, and is also the viewing distance upon which the AGS Light Performance Grading System is based."

This means if you view the diamond at 6-8 inches, you (and your fiancee) are likely to see something. Is this mind-clean for you? or will it bug you?

2)
HCA is a rejection tool, but it's not perfect, so there are 1 or 2 good stones that may fall through the cracks - but this is the exception rather than the rule.

3)
You don't have to exclude GIA excellent stones.

Dreamer D said it best in a different thread:
"GIA is the more common report to see, and some B&M vendors will not actually know much about AGS because it is relatively smaller. Some have argued GIA is stricter in color grading than AGS (but not hugely, maybe a grade, sometimes). Others argue that GIA is less strict in cut quality grading, with a wider range of stones getting their EX cut grade than AGS's equivalent top grade for cut, AGS0. Cut nuts tend to favour AGS stones because of the strictness of their cut rating, and the methods they use. Most/all of the branded H&A stones (top .1% for cut quality) come with AGS reports. Both labs are totally trustworthy and carry a premium on the market because of their reliability. "

4)
Regarding cut precision:

There's actualy a lot of variety even within a single cut grade like AGS0 or GIA EX : https://www.pricescope.com/journal/laboratory_cut_grades_what_report_doesn’t_show/
It shows the visual differences between hearts and arrows and non hearts and arrows stones

Just because a diamond is cut to ideal proportions with an AGS0 does not mean that it will exhibit a crisp and true hearts and arrows pattern. In addition to being ideal, the diamond has to have super symmetry - where all the angles and facets have to be perfect.
 
hopedream, thanks for the response.

im about to read the link you posted on the cut grades.

what is your opinion of the stones i posted?

is the symmetry something i can tell from the AGS grading or the posted report?

from looking at the AGSL light performance for both the stone from blue nile and the 2.51 from whiteflash they look very similar.

so im thinking that perhaps the blue nile stone has some H&A symmetry but may not be perfect.

again, appreciate the feedback.
 
BN Diamond- Not a lot going for it,
BGD virtual stone- also not that great, but better HCA than the BN stone
Neither are likely to be eye-clean or show hearts and arrows, both are in your size range and budget. I would pass unless the BGD stone is definately eyeclean. If you don't care too much about H&A, and it's eyeclean it, could be an ok choice.

Whiteflash stone: Basically everything you're looking for except that it's 5k over budget, and it's upgradeable.

where I'm coming from:
I like very clean, colorles stones with high optical symmetry, and would sacrifice size if there's a good upgrade policy.
In your shoes I'd get a smaller, cleaner stone, and then upgrade on my first or 5th wedding anniversary.

All of these looks nice and clean and are on or under budget, just smaller than you'd like, but upgradeable. If you get a halo setting it it will have ample visual impact.

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ls/2.010-i-si1-round-diamond-ags-104044686001

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8079/

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2649040.htm

I guess what you have to decide is whether the extra 0.5ct (.65 of a millimeter) is worth 5k to you.

Have you seen the relative finger size chart? https://www.pricescope.com/communit...izes-and-percentage-of-finger-coverage.64644/ It might help you decide how a stone will look on her finger.
 
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