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Am I being put together?

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ntlwhsle

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 16, 2007
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Hello..

I am new to the diamond world, so my good friend turned me on to this "wholesaler" who he speaks very highly of. My friend tells me that he spent around $12,000 on a ring that apprised for about $30,000 and would cost retail about $24,000. I go to see the Wholesaler and he is a very nice guy that only deals in high-line stuff. He actually has his own line of jewelry, and usually only sells to stores. I see a setting that i really like and the price tag (tags for the stores that sells his stuff) says $1600 and he tells me that my price will be $800. So now I am picking a diamond from him. here is what he is trying to sell me.

1.29 GVS
Ideal Cut
Hearts and Arrows
Price $9200 (just for the diamond) out the door.

Now when I look at it, the diamond is really nice. He says that this diamond would sell retail for $20,000 and would appraise for $30,000.

What do you think? am i just paying retail and getting a decent deal or am i being put together and paying way too much?

Help... and Thank you...
 
Get the specs so we can advise you if the price is right, and the diamond is really what he says it is.
 
Date: 6/16/2007 12:24:52 PM
Author:ntlwhsle
Hello..

I am new to the diamond world, so my good friend turned me on to this ''wholesaler'' who he speaks very highly of. My friend tells me that he spent around $12,000 on a ring that apprised for about $30,000 and would cost retail about $24,000. I go to see the Wholesaler and he is a very nice guy that only deals in high-line stuff. He actually has his own line of jewelry, and usually only sells to stores. I see a setting that i really like and the price tag (tags for the stores that sells his stuff) says $1600 and he tells me that my price will be $800. So now I am picking a diamond from him. here is what he is trying to sell me.

1.29 GVS
Ideal Cut
Hearts and Arrows
Price $9200 (just for the diamond) out the door.

Now when I look at it, the diamond is really nice. He says that this diamond would sell retail for $20,000 and would appraise for $30,000.

What do you think? am i just paying retail and getting a decent deal or am i being put together and paying way too much?

Help... and Thank you...
Click to expand...
Information to make a judgement on the stone is vague.....just like the deal.

Is the diamond graded by any grading company? AGS, GIA etc.
Have you seen these documents?

What is the color of the stone?
What is the clarity?

Does he provide any services after the sale?....what if something happens and you get it home and for whatever reason, you dont like it?.......Does he have a return policy?

Does he have an upgrade policy?

Idealscope scope images or aset images?

Pictures?

Let us know
MWG
 
Sounds to me like you're being taken for a ride in terms of the BS he's telling you about retail price. A 1.29 round G VS1 or 2 stone would sell for nowhere near $20,000 retail.

If it's certed by GIA/AGS, is a great cut (buy an idealscope or bring ALL the numbers from the certificate back here for us to look at, and it is what he says, it's not a bad price. But there's no way it would retail for $20,000. Crazy talk.
 
There is much malarkey here.

#1 ‘Wholesaler’. Back when I went to business school, selling things one at a time to the end consumer was called retailing. Last I checked, this definition hasn’t changed. This is a retailer who is calling himself a wholesaler. He MAY have some genuine wholesale accounts but I wouldn’t bet on it. Any retailer with any sense would drop a supplier like this in a heartbeat for exactly the transaction you are describing. Wouldn’t you if you were them? This means he’s willing to jeopardize his relationship with his supposed resellers of high-line goods in order to land an $800 sale to you. If true, this would be the height of stupidity so you’re left with two choices. He’s a liar or a fool. Perhaps both. Strike 1.

#2 ‘Retail’ value. A quick search of the retailers who advertise here produces dozens of more or less similar stones for approximately the same price or even slightly less and a few that are a little more. Any store can charge whatever they want for their goods so I suppose a retailer may very well be out there who would charge $20k for that stone but it sounds like you wouldn’t consider shopping at one of these so what use is a theoretical price that an unnamed store that is under no pressure to make actual sales might have the nerve to try to charge? I suppose these must be the stores that this ‘wholesaler’ is supplying and he needs to undermine them because business isn’t going so well with that plan. It’s a nice decorative touch to write big numbers on a price tag but I wouldn’t recommend you care. Price tags are cheap and retailers can get pretty imaginative about what they will write on them. Check out the prices of the retailers who advertise here with the utility at the top of the page titled ‘pricescope your diamond’. I see dozens of similarly described stones being offered AT RETAIL for comparable prices and unlike the theoretical store he's quoting, these guys are actually making sales and they're actually charging the prices listed. Pay attention to the deal at hand, not some fantasy that they tell you might have been. Strike 2.

#2.5 ‘Appraised’ value. Anyone who wants to can write a document titled appraisal and can put any number they want on it. Ink is cheap. In this case, we don’t even have an appraisal. It’s a theoretical and unnamed appraiser who is going to say it’s ‘worth’ $30k. On what planet? (I call this 2.5 because it’s really the same thing as #2 but it’s such an affront to the appraisal profession that I wanted to separate it out).

#3 ‘Hearts and Arrows’, ‘Ideal cut’, ‘GVS’. According to whom? These terms are used very differently by different sellers. Did he just make this stuff up or does he have something to base it on? I don’t know, maybe and maybe not. Ask him. You can bet he knows that stones are more valuable with lab grading and some labs are more reliable than others so if you’re getting a 2nd tier grader, an in-house opinion, or an off-the-wall definition of idealness, it’s no accident. If he can’t defend these claims, ask yourself why they were made in the first place. Oh yeah, he’s trying to part you from $10,000 and he knows that this is what you wanted to hear. We’ve already proven him a liar twice above, what does it take? Strike 3, you’re out.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 
I know it''s GIA Certified. I will get the measurements Monday for you guys. Thanks so much for helping me out.

The color is G
Clerity i will find out.

Also from what i know. GIA wont say that it is hearts and diamonds. so i am going by his word that it is. I will look a the stone to see the patterns.. i have learned what to look for in hearts and diamonds.

Do most places have a return policy that you can bring back the stone within a certain amount of time if you dont like it? Also i am thinking about getting a second apprasial to make sure that what is on the cert is actually that stone.


So monday for the specs on the stone. and thanks!

 
Hello All,

here are the specs for that stone EGL certified

Certificate 84155402D
Weight 1.29 ct.
Shape ROUND BRILLIANT
Color G
Clarity VS2
Measurements 6.97 - 6.93 x 4.31 mm
Depth 62.0
Table 57.0
Crown 14.7
Pavilion 43.0
Girdle THIN TO MEDIUM FACETED
Polish VERY GOOD
Symmetry VERY GOOD
Fluorescence NONE
Culet NONE
Cut Grade IDEAL PLUS
Lot 5202
Comments

UGS Appraisal Value $16020.00

the price out the door is $9200.00 . is this a good price? also a good stone?

thanks!
 
Does NOT look like a good deal to me, at all. EGL is known to be lax on their grading, so you could easily be looking at a stone that is really H SI. Even if it is G VS, The numbers you gave don''t sound great for the cut, either. I would turn and run from that stone. For that kind of money, you could get a 1.25 ACA diamond in the G-H VS range: http://www.whiteflash.com/diamonds/SearchResult.aspx?isStatic=false
 
Bottom line: you can get a much more beautiful diamond (better cut, more reliable color/clarity grading) for the same price elsewhere. WF has a return policy and upgrade policy as well.
 
Date: 6/16/2007 6:04:04 PM
Author: denverappraiser
There is much malarkey here.

#1 ‘Wholesaler’. Back when I went to business school, selling things one at a time to the end consumer was called retailing. Last I checked, this definition hasn’t changed. This is a retailer who is calling himself a wholesaler. He MAY have some genuine wholesale accounts but I wouldn’t bet on it. Any retailer with any sense would drop a supplier like this in a heartbeat for exactly the transaction you are describing. Wouldn’t you if you were them? This means he’s willing to jeopardize his relationship with his supposed resellers of high-line goods in order to land an $800 sale to you. If true, this would be the height of stupidity so you’re left with two choices. He’s a liar or a fool. Perhaps both. Strike 1.

#2 ‘Retail’ value. A quick search of the retailers who advertise here produces dozens of more or less similar stones for approximately the same price or even slightly less and a few that are a little more. Any store can charge whatever they want for their goods so I suppose a retailer may very well be out there who would charge $20k for that stone but it sounds like you wouldn’t consider shopping at one of these so what use is a theoretical price that an unnamed store that is under no pressure to make actual sales might have the nerve to try to charge? I suppose these must be the stores that this ‘wholesaler’ is supplying and he needs to undermine them because business isn’t going so well with that plan. It’s a nice decorative touch to write big numbers on a price tag but I wouldn’t recommend you care. Price tags are cheap and retailers can get pretty imaginative about what they will write on them. Check out the prices of the retailers who advertise here with the utility at the top of the page titled ‘pricescope your diamond’. I see dozens of similarly described stones being offered AT RETAIL for comparable prices and unlike the theoretical store he''s quoting, these guys are actually making sales and they''re actually charging the prices listed. Pay attention to the deal at hand, not some fantasy that they tell you might have been. Strike 2.

#2.5 ‘Appraised’ value. Anyone who wants to can write a document titled appraisal and can put any number they want on it. Ink is cheap. In this case, we don’t even have an appraisal. It’s a theoretical and unnamed appraiser who is going to say it’s ‘worth’ $30k. On what planet? (I call this 2.5 because it’s really the same thing as #2 but it’s such an affront to the appraisal profession that I wanted to separate it out).

#3 ‘Hearts and Arrows’, ‘Ideal cut’, ‘GVS’. According to whom? These terms are used very differently by different sellers. Did he just make this stuff up or does he have something to base it on? I don’t know, maybe and maybe not. Ask him. You can bet he knows that stones are more valuable with lab grading and some labs are more reliable than others so if you’re getting a 2nd tier grader, an in-house opinion, or an off-the-wall definition of idealness, it’s no accident. If he can’t defend these claims, ask yourself why they were made in the first place. Oh yeah, he’s trying to part you from $10,000 and he knows that this is what you wanted to hear. We’ve already proven him a liar twice above, what does it take? Strike 3, you’re out.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
Click to expand...
right, Neil....and there is no such thing as "wholesale to the public." An overworked, tired phrase that lures consumers into thinking that they are getting a "deal."

www.metrojewelryappraisers.com
 
Your Choice.....Buy this medicore stone for $9200 that is EGL certificated and will look decent until you see a real quality stone.

or buy a quality ACA from WhiteFlash for the same amount of money that sparkle and shine all day long......an Upgrade policy.....Return Policy. Oh.....the stone will be AGS or GIA certified. Oh.....did I mention NO TAX unless you are in Texas and free shipping!!!

It is a NO BRAINER!!!

MWG
 
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