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Advise on a diamond - please

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bz1010

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 1, 2008
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Hello, I would appreciate your thoughts on the following diamond

Its a EGL USA Rated -

Stone 49616801D
Weight 2.03 CT
Shape ROUND BRILLIANT
Color G
Clarity VS2
Measurements 8.07 x 7.95 x 5.09 mm
Depth 63.3%
Table 54%
Crown 16.5%
Pavilion 43%
Crown Angle 35.9°
Pavilion Angle 40.8°
Girdle THIN TO SL. THICK FACETED
Polish VERY GOOD
Symmetry EXCELLENT
Fluorescence FAINT
Culet NONE
Cut Grade IDEAL

I can get it for around 27K - and am ok with the jewler making some money, as he has spent a lot of time with me so far on settings and diamonds. Just want to make sure I am getting a fair deal.

thanks in advance for any input
 
Date: 10/14/2008 2:36:03 PM
Author:bz1010
Hello, I would appreciate your thoughts on the following diamond

Its a EGL USA Rated -

Stone 49616801D
Weight 2.03 CT
Shape ROUND BRILLIANT
Color G
Clarity VS2
Measurements 8.07 x 7.95 x 5.09 mm
Depth 63.3%
Table 54%
Crown 16.5%
Pavilion 43%
Crown Angle 35.9°
Pavilion Angle 40.8°
Girdle THIN TO SL. THICK FACETED
Polish VERY GOOD
Symmetry EXCELLENT
Fluorescence FAINT
Culet NONE
Cut Grade IDEAL

I can get it for around 27K - and am ok with the jewler making some money, as he has spent a lot of time with me so far on settings and diamonds. Just want to make sure I am getting a fair deal.

thanks in advance for any input
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Welcome to Pricescope,

If you have seen the diamond and love it then that is the main thing but honestly you could find one better cut. It is a bit deep and the crown and pavilion angles aren't the best combo. Does the jeweller have any others he can show you? Also have you looked at any GIA or AGS0 graded diamonds? You have a great budget, you could get a wonderful diamond for that, the price of this diamond is high, does it include a setting?
 
Thanks for the reply, I have seen the diamond in person and he did show me a few others. This was the one that I chose as the finalist based on what looked good to me from a color and shine perspective. It also looked to be fairly clean of inclusions that I could see, except for one small one on the outer edge.


This price does not include the setting.

I did some searching on Blue Nile for diamonds of similar specs

2.03 CT, G Color, Ideal Cut

and found the results to show an average in the 25-26k range for this level of diamond. If this diamond is close to this range in value, I am ok paying this because he has spent a good deal of time with me thus far on both the setting and the diamonds.

please let me know what you think?

thanks again for you help
 
bz1010...

you did come on here for advice, and now you're getting some.

Despite what seems to be lower grades for color & clarity, I'd prefer the ones upgradeable notes, too.

I understand your point...



Date: 10/14/2008 2:36:03 PM
Author:bz1010

I can get it for around 27K - and am ok with the jewler making some money, as he has spent a lot of time with me so far on settings and diamonds....
Click to expand...
...but unless you're getting some other kind of action from your jewler...

make sure you have compared to the sort of options that are reviewed here daily. Like Upgradeable, or this one...

or even this one...which your own jeweler might also be able to get (it would take some more research to determine if this one has the valued AGS0...to see further how desirable it is...and note...you can also do the one two punch with plan B noted under my signature in the case of using WF).

Read about the HCA
Read about the pattern for EGL (less applicable for USA)
Make sure you've seen a very well cut diamond...

You don't have to make a career out of looking for this like some of us have...but many of us think you should continue the same due diligence you began when you came here.
 
thanks for all the replies. Here is a new diamond that my jewler got in

advise on this would also be appreciated

AGS#: 5934808
Report Type: Diamond Quality™ Document
Shape and Style: Round Brilliant
Measurements: 8.11 - 8.15 x 5.04 mm
Cut Grade: AGS Excellent 1
Polish: Ideal
Symmetry: Ideal
Proportions: Excellent
Color Grade: AGS 2.0 (H)
Clarity Grade: AGS 3 (VS1)
Carat Weight: 2.012
Fluorescence: Negligible

Table: 57.0%
Crown Angle: 34.0
Crown Height: 14.5%
Girdle: Faceted, 0.7% to 2.1%
Pavilion Angle: 41.5
Pavilion Depth: 44.2%
Total Depth: 62.0%
Culet: Pointed

thanks again.
 
WOW!?? That only net a HCA 5.4. That is really a bad performer by the numbers. Still makes me wonder, how large a range is AGS1?
 
Yes, I just ran the cut advisor myself and was dissappointed to see the 5.4 score as well.


Seems like all the numbers were within this guideline except for the pavilion angle

depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
table - 54- 57%
crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
polish and symmetry - very good and above

Not sure how an AGS diamond gets an AGS Excellend 1 CUt grade with excellent proportions but gets a bad grade on the Cut Tool.

Should I just discard any of these diamonds that don''t score under a 2 ?

thanks again
 
Date: 10/16/2008 3:21:03 PM
Author: bz1010
Yes, I just ran the cut advisor myself and was dissappointed to see the 5.4 score as well.



Seems like all the numbers were within this guideline except for the pavilion angle


depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%

table - 54- 57%

crown angle - 34- 35 degrees

pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees

girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc

polish and symmetry - very good and above


Not sure how an AGS diamond gets an AGS Excellend 1 CUt grade with excellent proportions but gets a bad grade on the Cut Tool.


Should I just discard any of these diamonds that don''t score under a 2 ?


thanks again
Click to expand...


Yes, reject them.
 
It is the pavilion angle which is accounting for the score of this diamond, the HCA penalizes a diamond for this. How does it look in person? What you could do is to order a beginner Idealscope and you can use that to check the diamonds out yourself, the delivery could be quite fast. You could insist that all your diamonds score under 2 on the HCA, but if you see one that doesn't that you like, you can give it the benefit of the doubt with the IS and your own eyes by checking it out carefully in different lighting, not all diamonds which score over 2 are going to be bad performers. You could make this easier by asking the jeweller to source you some AGS0 and GIA Excellent and go from there.


http://www.ideal-scope.com/cart_zoom_item.asp?Id=2&ShowAdd=Y
 
No, I have not seen this diamond in person. Just received the specs today and figued I would run the HCA test and get some input from the forum.

As far as an ideal scope goes, not sure I am confident enough with my eyes looking through a scope. That is why I was focused on teh HCA test, becuse this was easy for me to do.

The second diamond scores worse than the first one on the HCA. I was initially excited to run the test seeing the specs on the sheet, especially since it was an AGS rated diamond. All the previous stones that I looked at were EGL USA.

AGS Excellent 1 CUT as well as Excellent Symmetry, figured it would do better than it does.


Which do you like between the two I have listed here?

If the 4 C''s arent'' enough, I think I maybe getting in over my head here.

thanks again for your time
 
Date: 10/16/2008 4:03:21 PM
Author: bz1010
No, I have not seen this diamond in person. Just received the specs today and figued I would run the HCA test and get some input from the forum.

As far as an ideal scope goes, not sure I am confident enough with my eyes looking through a scope. That is why I was focused on teh HCA test, becuse this was easy for me to do.

The second diamond scores worse than the first one on the HCA. I was initially excited to run the test seeing the specs on the sheet, especially since it was an AGS rated diamond. All the previous stones that I looked at were EGL USA.

AGS Excellent 1 CUT as well as Excellent Symmetry, figured it would do better than it does.


Which do you like between the two I have listed here?

If the 4 C's arent' enough, I think I maybe getting in over my head here.

thanks again for your time
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The HCA can't physically see the diamond, it is used for elimination not selection - generally the aim is to find a diamond which scores 2 or below, then evaluate using Idealscope, trusted vendor/ appraiser input and your own eyes. Furthermore, some diamonds which score over 2 can be also attractive diamonds if they have top symmetry. The second diamond scores worse than the first one because of the steeper pavilion angle, as I said before the HCA penalizes a diamond for this.

What I would do to make this easier, is to ask your jeweller to show you some AGS0 cut grade or some diamonds with proportions which match the numbers you listed above. Some GIA Excellent can also be good diamonds, use the numbers listed to find the best ones.

As to the Idealscope, it is actually very simple to use and an asset to those shopping for diamonds in person. I will link a chart so you can take a look at how it works. https://www.pricescope.com/idealscope_indx.asp

Of course it is up to you, but there are various methods you can use to approach this.

You can buy an Idealscope and use it alone or along with the HCA, use these to find the better cut stones out of the ones your jeweller has to show you. Use the numbers above as your guideline also to find the better cut stones. You could even take a laptop or use the jeweller's computer if he will let you to run the HCA while you look.

You can ask your jeweller to source you some AGS0 and GIA Excellent and use the either the HCA/ IS or both.

You can arrange for an independant appraiser to evaluate a diamond you are seriously considering if your jeweller is agreeable, if you like the diamond but are not sure of the cut quality and want an impartial expert opinion. This would be very prudent anyway with the amount of money you might spend, make the sale final on a favourable report from the appraiser.

Or you can change your tactics and buy online from one of the vendors here with in house diamonds.

Above all take your time, you have a great budget and you want to spend it well on a beautifully cut diamond which you can be proud of. I know it is confusing and more complicated than you thought, but many major purchases require a good deal of research and especially with your budget it is time well spent learning about what to buy. We are here to help you through it as you need us.

One thing that might help you, if you have a Jareds in your area, apparently they are now selling AGS0 cut grade diamonds, if you can check some out so you can look at some diamonds of known cut quality in person, this will give you a good baseline comparison of what to look for when purchasing.
 
Lorelei, thanks for all your input.

He just sent me the specs on another diamond that scores 1.1 on the HCA.

let me know what you think of this

Report Type: GIA Diamond Grading Report
Date of Issue: May 31, 2005
Round Brilliant
Measurements: 8.04 - 8.12 x 4.98 mm
Carat Weight: 2.02
Color Grade: H
Clarity Grade: VS1
Proportions:
Depth: 61.6 %
Table: 57 %
Girdle: Thin to Slightly Thick, Faceted
Culet: None
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Excellent
Fluorescence: None


Additional Information
Crown Angle: 33.5°
Crown Height: 14.5 %
Pavilion Angle: 41°
Pavilion Depth: 43.5 %
Star length: 55 %
Lower Half: 85 %
Cut Grade: Excellent

thanks
 
Looks like the one for you.. :)

Good Luck.
 
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