adoption by gay couples?

[Arkteia]

It is perfectly fine legally, but I suspect there may be still many roadblocks for gay couples who want to adopt. I know there were in 2003 when a lesbian couple I knew were foster parents for a girl. They were excellent parents for her, did everything by the book...Yet when it came to adoption, the girl was given to a straight couple. Imagine the devastation of two women who got so bonded with the girl, and the girl bonded with them!

A couple of years ago I was on a plane flying from the East Coast to my area. There were two gay men with a couple of twin girls, recent adoptees. These guys were so good about the girls, fussing around them, feeding them...so happy. I wonder what they had to go through to adopt these girls.

Just wanted to know other people's opinions. I do not have many gay friends who choose to adopt but maybe other people do?

 

[Sizzle]

I am only 35, and my opinion about many things has changed during the past 10 years or so, as I have lived life, met people and seen more of the world. At this point in my life, I think any time someone wants to love someone and give them the care that they need, that no one else should stand in their way, period. I think this is especially true when the person who is "against" someone else, is not putting themselves in the position to be the loving person to those who just want to be loved-something I believe is one of the essential needs for human beings. I dont think anyone should define who a family is for someone else.

 

[megumic]

Actually, some states do not allow gay couples to legally adopt. Typically one partner will be a biological parent and the other parent is just a non-legal parent, i.e. if the bio parent dies the non-legal parent has no standing to have custody. Yeah, it''s a problem.

 

[Trekkie]

A very good friend of mine adopted a little boy two years ago.

Very few people cared about her being gay. More eyebrows were raised by the fact that she is white and her son is black...

Personally, I care more about the fact that they''re a happy family.

 

[lulu]

I think it has more to do with whether people are in a stable committed relationship rather than their sexual preferences. I just don''t understand the opposition to any sort of gay rights. People don''t choose their sexual preference; it just is.

 

[Prana]

I think that ANYBODY who can provide a better life for a child through adoption should be allowed. Think of the good it does for all parties involved!

 

[atroop711]

It annoys me beyond belief when some ppl have the nerve to tell same sex partners that they can''t marry or adopt. It''s their lives and no one should have a say. There are so many children in foster care that need homes. Why exclude a family who wants to share their love with these children because of their sexuality. Living in NYC I know many same sex families and they are wonderful parents. I just hope ppl stop assuming, judging and open their
eyes a little wider.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Some of the most stable, secure and committed couples I know are same sex couples (married or otherwise). Personally I think they would make better parents to a child than some of the hetero married couples I know. I think it''s a shame that something like sexual preference or the title of Married would prevent a couple from making a loving and secure home for a child.

I think same sex adoption is much more widely accepted today than 5-10 years ago. Sure there are some areas of the country/world where it''s still hard or not possible, but for the most part I think it''s generally accepted. I think the source agency also has a lot to do with it. A Christian or Catholic adoption agency might have an issue accepting an application from a gay couple vs a non-denominationally affiliated or state agency.

 

[zoebartlett]

Date: 6/28/2010 9:48:01 AM
Author: girlface
I think that ANYBODY who can provide a better life for a child through adoption should be allowed. Think of the good it does for all parties involved!

I agree! I don''t understand why anyone would have a problem with it.

 

[RaiKai]

My brother and his (male) fiance will make wonderful and loving parents one day should they choose. They have discussed either adoption or surrogacy though are still a bit ways off. They do live in an area/place that is quite accepting of gay families/parenting, and their families, peers, and coworkers are also very accepting of them as a family however they choose that family to be (i.e. just them, with children, and so on).

I do think it is generally more accepted now than it was a few years ago, but that does not mean everyone is accepting.

I can see how there are places where it is still not as openly accepted (nor is gay marriage), however, and there are indeed places where gay couples are not permitted legally as a couple to adopt. I saw a recent show on CNN where two men showed their journey through surrogacy and adoption (the child was biologically one of theirs, and the other had to adopt the child so that both were legally parents). Adoption agencies may have their own policies in some places too.

I personally think that if someone would make a wonderful parent(s), they should be allowed to adopt whether they are straight, gay, single, coupled, and so forth. I think discriminating against a couple as they are gay is just nonsense, personally. There are plenty of straight couples who can conceive who probably should undergo just as rigorous a screeing process as the couples who need to adopt do!

 

[dragonfly411]

I wanted to offer a different take on this and ask how many have had experiences with it? I have found many gay couples that I know to be completely uninterested in being parents. One couple has a dog that they treat almost as a child... but otherwise several just have no interest. Is this something that is common? Or do you think it is because they think it wouldn''t be accepted?

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

I know many older gay couples (like 35+ -not that 35+ is old, but they're not 20) and they're definitely on board with being parents and adopting. Also remember that we're talking about couples in long-term committed relationships, either married or in civil unions, not young people having fun or in new relationships. I think you see a lot of child rearing hesitation in young people regardless of being gay or not.

 

[RaiKai]

Date: 6/28/2010 11:08:34 AM
Author: Hudson_Hawk
I know many older gay couples (like 35+ -not that 35+ is old, but they''re not 20) and they''re definitely on board with being parents and adopting. Also remember that we''re talking about couples in long-term committed relationships, either married or in civil unions, not young people having fun or in new relationships. I think you see a lot of child rearing hesitation in young people regardless of being gay or not.

Yes, I agree with this.

I have personal experience with this both through my brother and his long-term partner (now fiance), a few of his friends, and a few of my own friends. I know some who want to be parents, and others who don''t. Which I find no different than my straight siblings and peers!

I find that those gay couples I know who are in long-term committed relationships (i.e. have a life commitment whether by marriage, or commitment ceremonies, or by common-law or just by agreement) tend to more on board with being parents, either by adoption or surrogacy. My brother has always expressed a desire to be a parent, as has his partner. For now, they just have a massive Great Dane, but they certainly are also still fairly young (mid 20''s) and still early in developing their respective careers to want to have children just yet. They still have more responsibility (i.e. a dog) than my own husband and I do right now, ha!

 

[Cehrabehra]

I personally don''t know any gay couples who have adopted children. I do know a couple of women who had children in previous marriages who then went on to same sex marriages and they share parenting. I know a male couple who wants children but they haven''t pursued it at all. My two gay cousins (one male, one female) don''t want children.

Honestly, I don''t know that many gay people anymore. I actually was in a circle of gay friends before I got married, hmm... then I was a military wife and then a minivan driving school mom...

My opinion of it is the same as gay marriage - as long as relationships are healthy and loving, gender is irrelevant, even if redundant haha

 

[RaiKai]

What timing, apparently, per my previous post, my brother and his partner are in the process of getting on adoption lists now (whatever that takes). I only found this out this morning...yeah!

Then once they are on I guess the wait begins...hopefully not much longer than they want to.

 

[kenny]

I see three issues:
1. The parents rights and experience
2. The kids rights and experience
3. Society today being how it IS vs. how is SHOULD be

Gays adopting kids may be groovy for the parents but not for the kids.
I'm not saying gays cannot be good parents.
In fact, the gays that DO eventually qualify to adopt kids may self-select to actually be SUPER excellent parents because of all the opposition and scrutiny they must endure.
Most of all they have to really want the kids.

I'm just saying society is not ready yet.
There is still too much hate against gays for kids to not feel some negative effect of it - even if they live in the gay Castro district of San Francisco.

I think it will be a few hundred years before the stigma of being gay completely goes away.
Slavery was outlawed 148 years ago and blacks and whites are still not equal.
Stigma sticks.

Again the problem is society not the parents.
Also, FWIW and for those readers who didn't recall, I'm gay.
That does not give my opinion any more weight on this topic, it may be relevant so I mention it.

I realize progress depends on trailblazers, and my hat is off to the gay parents who are leading the way today.
It is just that a little baby has no say about being put in the front lines of this battle.

 

[Haven]

Date: 6/28/2010 2:11:12 PM
Author: RaiKai
What timing, apparently, per my previous post, my brother and his partner are in the process of getting on adoption lists now (whatever that takes). I only found this out this morning...yeah!

Then once they are on I guess the wait begins...hopefully not much longer than they want to.

I know two lesbian couples who have adopted children. I know for sure that one couple had to adopt the child in only one partner''s name, and I''m pretty sure it was the same situation for the second couple.

I don''t believe that sexual orientation has anything to do with someone''s ability to raise a child, and I''m all for anyone who is committed to raising a child being able to adopt.

This is just anecdotal, but I know many families with adopted children and they are ALL extremely devoted to their kids. Excellent families all around, in my experience, gay or straight, old or young.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Kenny, I definitely see what you''re saying about society and I respect your viewpoint on the subject. Maybe it''s due to my geographic locale (Massachusetts) and where I was raised (one of the most liberal towns in NH with a big name college in it), but it doesn''t seem like discrimination against these kids is common. Most kids today are raised with all sorts of families being considered "normal." There''s only one recent instance of blatant discrimination that I can think of involving discrimination against a child of a same sex couples and that was due to the couple wanting to send their child to a parochial school. The school admitted the 3rd grader and then later retracted the admission due to discovering that the parents were lesbians. The Archdiocese of Boston went public stating that they had no policies against children of same sex couples attending Catholic schools and didn''t agree with the view of the school itself. It was discrimination at the parish level. Maybe I''m naive, but I don''t think acceptance of children of gay parents is as big of an issue as it was in the past.

 

[MissMina]

Kenny
Your point is well taken.
I have often wondered if the battle is any easier for an older child
(rather than an infant) who knows what he is getting into.
I live in the South where the wheels of change move slowly.

 

[kenny]

Lots of stuff can affect a child which never makes the cut at CNN.
Stuff on the playground, not being invited to a birthday party, etc.

Childhood is hard enough.
Why make it harder?

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

I understand what your saying Kenny. I'm just saying that not all of "society" is the same throughout the country. Unfortunately we have different tolerance levels in different regions and somethings are more widely accepted. I went to elementary school and HS with kids from same sex couples and they were all well adjusted and reasonably happy individuals (using the term reasonably to accentuate the fact that NO ONE has a perfect childhood and very few escape their school years unscathed emotionally). I don't think they were picked on any more than I was. Similarly, my stepfather's nephew has two moms and is a totally normal, well adjusted kid. I don't think this should prevent a couple from adopting a child and giving the child the best life they can.

ETA: And I truly believe that at a certain point in your life you have to learn to be responsible for your own happiness. Your parents can set you up for success in this area by providing a loving and stable home for you, but you as an individual have to develop the skills to be an emotionally and physically healthy person. A lot of times, the people who face the most adversity are the ones who come out the strongest. So again, I don't see being raised by a same sex couple to be a detriment to a child.

 

[Haven]

Date: 6/28/2010 3:34:32 PM
Author: kenny
Lots of stuff can affect a child which never makes the cut at CNN.
Stuff on the playground, not being invited to a birthday party, etc.

Childhood is hard enough.
Why make it harder?

I agree that childhood can be hard, Kenny. However, isn't it harder for a child to be raised without a stable environment or family (in foster care, for example) than to be raised by loving parents who very much want to provide for him?

My parents raised me in a faceless suburb where everyone wanted to look the same, think the same, and basically be the same. We were the weird family in town. I slept on a futon, we were vegetarians long before it was cool, and my mom picked me up from school wearing what she called "shmatas" (long, flowy, shapeless pieces of fabric draped over her shoulders) with her long hair trailing behind her as she walked. I could *feel* the stares, I really could. It was hard when I went through that middle school phase of wanting to be like everyone else, but I think it helped me, too, to have such a different family. We didn't fit in, and yes, I still vividly remember that a group of girls made fun of me in the 5th grade because I wore these organic fake Keds gym shoes and only the REAL Keds gym shoes were cool. But over time I learned to really appreciate my family for not being the same as everyone else's.

 

[kenny]

Making the best of it when things are not optimum is not the same as things being optimum.

Optimum is better than not optimum.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Points well made Kenny,

But in terms of the children suffering backlash, I sometimes wonder how much of a worry that is growing up in suburbia. I feel like having gay parents would illicit teasing and mockery, sure, but kids will make fun of each other and harass each other for a million different reasons and I don''t know if "gay parents" is much worse than any of those reasons. Or that being teased about gay parents would be worse than missing out on an otherwise wonderful family life.

Of course, I don''t know any children of gay parents, so it''s just conjecture on my part. But I remember in school, if you were popular then you were popular. And if the other kids wanted to pick on you, they could find a reason, any reason really, to pick on you.

And I think almost all parents do things to their kids to get them embarrassed or teased at school (i.e. forcing an outfit, bad haircut, calling you by pet names, sharing awkward stories etc), but it''s because they love you.

 

[Karl_K]

First I want to say I''m a live and let live person, I don''t care if someone is gay it is none of my business and if they are happy more power to them.
but:
I don''t know I think I have to agree with Kenny because of something that happened to someone I know.
A lady had 3 kids they were around 4,6,8 when their dad died.
A couple years later their mom met a lady and fell in love and she moved in.
She was really great with the kids and very nice.
The middle daughter at age 12 left a note saying "im not gay" and killed herself.
Everyone was devastated.
So I honestly don''t know if it is a good idea.

 

[kenny]

That's a very sad story Karl.
It is impossible to know for sure what was going on in the mind of the girl who killed herself.

It IS possible that the orientation of the mom had nothing to do with the suicide but the girl knew that note would be an effective way to get revenge at mother, whom she hated for other reasons.

We just don't know.

 

[kenny]

True dat, kids tease other kids for everything.
But, why hand them another enormous social-hot-button reason?

I'm kind of repeating myself now, which gets redundant.
Of course I respect other opinions on this matter, and am not trying to convert anyone to my perspective, just adding it to the mix.

 

[Hudson_Hawk]

Date: 6/28/2010 4:00:58 PM
Author: kenny
Making the best of it when things are not optimum is not the same as things being optimum.


Optimum is better than not optimum.

Yes, however most parents (realistic ones anyway) will tell you that there''s never an ideal time, place or situation to have kids. If you wait for your life to be perfect and optimum you''ll be dead before you''re ready.

 

[kenny]

Date: 6/28/2010 4:11:28 PM
Author: Hudson_Hawk

Date: 6/28/2010 4:00:58 PM
Author: kenny
Making the best of it when things are not optimum is not the same as things being optimum.
Optimum is better than not optimum.

Yes, however most parents (realistic ones anyway) will tell you that there''s never an ideal time, place or situation to have kids. If you wait for your life to be perfect and optimum you''ll be dead before you''re ready.

Sure, it is all a matter of degrees.
Take a 19-yr old woman on welfare with no high school degree and 5 kids from different guys vs. the 27-year old married straight couple with grad degrees thinking having their first child.

Sure, both can have a kid, but which shouldn''t?

Equality is a wonderful thing but equality can also be sticking your head in the sand.

 

[Arkteia]

Funny that I totally forgot this story when I was asking this question. It was quite a long time ago.

I did know a lesbian couple who adopted a black boy. One of the women also had a boy of her own.

We all lived in an affluent and a very liberal town.

- the boy struggled with being adopted (not surprizing)

- he struggled with being the only black boy at school (even at our school where no one...)

- I do not know if he struggled with having two moms (I suspect that he had a very difficult pre-adoption life and struggled with that)

But his adoptive mom was a strong woman, he had great extended family and he got a lot of structure in his life

He is doing great now. I think he has a bright future ahead of him.

Love and structure - I think it made all the difference. Many biological parents can not provide it.

I do not remember anyone teasing him because he had two moms. Kids were insensitive and made many "off-color" jokes in his presence, though. It hurt but kids do not have much tact.

And I don''t think it will take one century before things change. Kenny, you may know better because you feel it and you may also be living in an area where things are different. I think that in Western Washington they have already changed. The people I see struggling with acceptance now are transgenders.