2.08 ct! Asets/Ideal images. Inclusions ? Help pls!

[Scopey]

Hi All,

I have been diamond researching and searching for the past several months for that perfect stone and have finally seem to come to a great option. I would love to see what you all think as I am thinking of pulling the trigger on this if all goes well !

Been dealing with BG all along and they have been lovely to deal thus far.

This diamond scored a 2.4 HCA and I decided to bring it in for further inspection.

Im excited about the results of the diamond thus far but have a few concerns and hope I haven't missed anything else, which you guys may pick up on! I am also unable to do a physical inspection so would love as many opinions or advice I can get! It is a big purchase so I want to be fully informed or 100% confident what to expect ! Appreciate your help in advance !

So the specs are below:

Measurements
8.11 - 8.19 x 5.08 mm

Carat Weight
2.08 carat

Color Grade
G

Clarity Grade
VS2

Cut Grade
Excellent

Depth
62.3 %

Table
57 %

Crown Angle
35.0°

Crown Height
15.0%

Pavilion Angle
41.0°

Pavilion Depth
43.5%

Star Length
50%

Lower Half
80%

Girdle
Medium to Slightly Thick, Faceted, 4.0%

Culet
None

Polish
Excellent

Symmetry
Excellent

Fluorescence
Medium Blue

My view on the images provided.

ASET- seems to have good symmetry and minimal greens and even blues.
IDEAL - Good dark reds, even blacks and minimal whites.

My concern is the inclusions. Been advised by BG and supplier that it is eye clean. Would you expect to see that large crystal inclusion on the table with the naked eye even at close proximity like say 2-4 inches? Is the magnified photo a true indication of the eye cleanliness of the stone, as it seems like there are no visible inclusions. But would just be the lighting of that photo. Can it be visible at different angles?

Also the measurements being 8.11x8.19 round brilliant. Its not ideal and I have noticed many are within 0.02 - 0.05 if they are considered perfectly round? Should I be concerned about the difference in length and width of 0.07 ? Would this be noticeable to the naked eye?

Should I request for any further imaging or photos taken for peace of mind ? Have I missed anything ?

Any others suggestions and advice would be appreciated. Feel free to critic any aspect of the diamond.

Would love to hear from you all !

Thanks again !!

 

[Gypsy]

The IS shows leakage. I would not personally buy it. Forget about the inclusions. You want NO white. Not minimal white. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope

It's on the steep deep scale with the 35/41 angle combo. I'd keep looking. BGD can find you a great stone. Just ask them to look for another. They are great vendor.

 

[Scopey]

Thanks Gypsy. How bad do you rate the light leakage ?

 

[Gypsy]

Visible range. So, like I said, deal breaker. You have the budget to get better. So get better.

 

[Gypsy]

This is what you want to see:


Drop to eyeclean SI1 if you have to. It won't affect the visual brilliance.

 

[Scopey]

Thanks Gypsy. That's a great comparison and I can see what you mean.

Apart from the light leakage, is there anything else I should be mindful of.

Steep deep scale 35/41 . What should they be? Low 34s and around 40.8 ?

 

[Scopey]

Apart from the negatives, Is there anything else particularly great about this diamond ?

 

[Gypsy]

It's how all the angles work together. The HCA is your friend. 2 and under has the most potential for a bright red idealscope. 2.1-2.5 it's less likely, but still possible. 2.6 and over it's unlikely.

 

[Gypsy]

Apart from the negatives, Is there anything else particularly great about this diamond ?

It's a G VS2? But that's not enough.

 

[luvdajules]

Hi Scopey, I have a different take as this stone has many qualities of the stone I just purchased, so I know exactly how you feel as many PSer's (although not all, yeah) would likely agree with Gypsy. I understand this, of course, as typically very safe and cautious selections are given (understandably). However, I wanted a big stone that maxed my budget. I don't know what your budget is so not sure if yours is a real deal or if you can find other options easily. That would weigh into the mix a lot.

fwiw, during inspection period I had it appraised with Neil Beaty to reassure me of the veracity of the stats (color, cut, clarity, etc). As you can see the aset isn't perfect, it's hca is 2.1, the measurements are 8.17-8.28mm, little things like that. Mine also is slightly steep/deep and hca is very harsh on those, even though these stones can be more firey in the right lighting, something I LOVE about my stone. Although, there's a limit, cant be too steep/deep, causing other problems. My stone is also very contrasty, which again, I adore. Neil assured me it's a top cut and great performer with "not significant" leakage (not enough to pass on the stone). He did not know the price so was not swayed by that. And I have found that it is a great performer too. In fact, I have not seen any as good as mine, especially in this size! It's very white too. 2 jewelers thought it was an I, not a J (and both viewed without benefit of day light). It's blindingly sparkly in direct light, so if there's leakage I cant imagine!

Just know, I feel your pain and panic...I just went through this myself with a very similar stone. Just want to give you my opinion, but the balancing of the 5 C's (including cost) is very personal. So, this is my perfect stone, but yours? Only you can say.

If you are interested and have a little time to decide to pull the trigger or not, please find my post below.
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/advice-on-this-2-07-ct-j-si2-on-the-fence.204119/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/advice-on-this-2-07-ct-j-si2-on-the-fence.204119/[/URL]

eta for typos

 

[Scopey]

Bump!
Thanks for your comments. Do we have any other views.

This diamons is approx $25k. Is that a good deal for the compromise?

Im thinking of possibly going below the 2ct mark and avoid the premium price point. Is that correct ?

 

[luvdajules]

wow, for that budget you could get the 3 ct j/si1 in pre-loved (for $26k). Also, Phoenix has/had a stone for sale in pre-loved that's 2.5+ ct H/Si2 eye clean lowered to $28k, it's huge at 8.8 mm. Is it a Brian Gavin Signature cut, or one they a sourcing for you but not within their signature brand? The price is right for a G color eye clean stone (VS clarity). Mine, that I linked was much less! If I wanted to spend that kind of budget, I'd consider the 2 I mentioned from pre-loved. I don't think you need to go smaller. Did you ask the Brian Gavin rep about the leakage we can see in the IS? Is it visible? If so, is it significant? They see a ton of stones so should be able to tell you.

Let's back up...what's your comfortable budget for just the stone? What specs are you hoping to get? What range of specs are ok, for instance, just eye clean or do you really need VS1 for mind clean? Have you seen a lot of stones so you know what color and clarities and sizes look like?

 

[Scopey]

This is not a Bg signature cut and was one sourced elsewhere. To be honest I have not seen a ton of stones but some to get idea.I should probably go see more. Ive seen enough on size. Ok idea on colour. Maybe not so.much clarity but every stone can b different in the same grade. I did indeed ask about the leakage and the steep table but all they said was this is an Gia certified excellent stone and within all within ideal parameters. If I wanted better cut I should go lesser ct, lower colour or clarity. Slightly disppointin response and avoided the leakage issue or what her personal opinion was on the light return.

Hence, I am just extremely wary and cautious to not be let down or disappointed by the vendor if I end up choosin a SI1 or SI2 and any colour beyond G despite they may say it may be eye clean or facing up white. I feel nervous goin beyond these parameters. Because this over the net purchase to minimise cost and without any physical inspection I heavily rely on the vendors opinion and somewhat my gut based on my research to date (a lot to learn admittedtly).

I would be comfortable spending 22-23k ideally on the stone and 1-2k on setting. So that stone above was slightly pushin my limits and only would proceed if it was perfect. But noe concerned bout the leakage you all mention.

My requirements was preferably 2ct, cut must be trip excellent or AGS000, must be eye clean from very close proximity to.naked eye especially on the table (so I chose vs2 or si1 cos im nervous on anyThing beyond), colour to be not beyond G so yellowness cannot be evident, not.milky or haziness,.

Whats your view on my selection. Any advice would help! Thnx lots

 

[luvdajules]

found this one on B2C Jewels, ask if eye clean. No fluoro. wire price just under $24k. Ask for IS or aset if you like the paper.
http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-5178749-2.01-carat-Round-diamond-G-color-SI1-clarity.aspx

How do you feel about fluoro? or 60/60 stones? I saw several that were in the $20-23k range that were either 60/60 and/or med to strong fluoro.

Assuming top cut and light performance, You could probably drop to H color for sure, many people would say I color is fine too. But you may need to see more stones to gauge comfort level.

 

[Scopey]

My first impression for that b2c stone is that the inclusions on the table are quite substantial and to me unlikely to be eye clean or could be seen from close proximity. Would that the wrong assumption to make? . Seeing the cert with such abundance of inclusions is rather nerve racking since I cant see these stones personally and not sure if the suppliers or vendors advice would be at my expectation of eye clean as I don't wish to be let down if I do happen to see inclusions myself after making such a large online purchase.

60/60 stones. Im not familiar with that. Is that the Table and depth %? if so what is the effect of such proportions ? Good or Bad ?

I think I can deal with med or strong fluorescence as long as its not milky, cloudy or hazy. My understanding is that it may make a diamond less white and more blue, is that right? What is your experience with different fluorescence levels.

You are right I think I need to see more diamonds... so I can be more certain on what criteria I can compromise..

 

[luvdajules]

Call b2c and ask about eye clean of that linked stone. If it's clean to your definition, put on hold right away while they get IS or aset for you. My guess, it could very well be eye clean, but ask what eye clean means to them. Is it the same as yours? My Si2 is eye clean, unless you have 20/10 vision from 8". The crystals could be white crystals or small black ones, if small enough, could be only noticeable with a loupe. Many people need high clarity due to mind clean, that's another story.

Yes, 60/60 stones refer to table/depth of 60% each. They can be really great cuts with complimentary angles (check HCA). They tend toward brilliance (white light) than fire (colored light) than a true Tolk cut balance of the two. They tend to face up big for their weight, spready (which is nice). So you can target a slightly smaller stone and get the same face up size, a 1.8 ct 60/60 stone will face up like a 2.0 ct. You don't have to size down tho, you can get a 2 ct. and it will be that much bigger, like 8.2 or 8.3 mm.

I like fluoro in my J diamond. If faces up more like an I (it's borderline I/J anyway). Fluoro helps the color a bit when UV is present (from the side view mostly). Face up, it's hard to tell color, especially once set. Your target color of G will look like an F, with fluoro. medium to strong is pretty safe. Just ask to make sure not overblue (hazy, cloudy, negative effect of fluoro.)

We made a video that I linked to another post but wanted to make sure you saw it, so I'll post it here too. Sorry, if you've seen it and it's overkill. I don't know why the dispersion (fire or colored flashes) came out only white and blue! The size of the facets and the ideal cut really help the whole thing (that's why I'm in favor of not going down in size unless you have to). My budget was no where near yours.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56romlzdNRw&feature=youtu.be