Home Single-gender education - what do you think?

[Independent Gal]

Saw this fascinating article in the NYT magazine. I''m curious what the parents and teachers among you think about it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/magazine/02sex3-t.html?pagewanted=1&hp

 

[jas]

I had the honor of actually hearing Dr. Sax speak a few months ago. The man makes a lot of really interesting points. Boys and girls are wired differently...not only in the brain, but other parts as well, such as the make up of the eye! Boys and girls literally see things differently (girls, IIRC, see colors and shapes, boys see motion better) and this translates into how they learn.

People, I think, will be quick to worry about certain things such as "separate but equal" issues and of course "in the real world, men and women have to learn to work together."

IMHO, those arguments do not apply in this particular case. I think single-sex education, even if only in math and science (although it would, again IMHO, benefit boys in the humanities), gives kids this skills so that they can move on to work together.

It''s a really sticky issue, I understand, but I would strongly encourage everyone to read Dr. Sax''s books. I actually used some of his research in my own (co-ed) classroom teaching methods.

Forgive the rambling, I''m getting over the flu...maybe in a bit I can be more coherent.

 

[Independent Gal]

I think, if he were right about the claims he was making, that this would make a lot of sense. And girls and boys are wired differently, it''s just that the differences are often waaaaaaaay more tiny, like really minute, than people like Dr. Sax make out. Sure we''re different, but are we different ENOUGH?

The two things that worry me are:

1) apparently, he''s citing lots of bad research, or extrapolating from small claims to big ones, i.e., saying "girls hear better.... so teachers should speak more quietly!" when in fact the difference in hearing might be minute.

2) I found the ''sorting'' objection in the article quite interesting. As in, boys are taller than girls (in the same sense as girls hear better than boys, as in, on average). But if you sort by height, you''ll end up with 60% boys and 40% girls in the ''tall'' half of the class. If the differences between boys and girls in terms of learning are of this sort, then LOTS of girls and LOTS of boys are going to end up in an environment that is NOT conducive to them learning at all.

So, instead of sorting by gender, why not sort by learning style? Far more accurate, if more expensive. And if we take this to it''s logical conclusion, should kinetic learners be separated from verbal learners and they from aural learners, etc?

The gender thing does seem to hold lots of weight in terms of de-sexulazing classrooms, and giving boys and girls more gender-specific self-esteem. I''m all for that if it works. I''m definitely not against single-sex education if data shows kids learn better that way. But I would want to see some solid research that suggested that the CAUSE of the better learning was the different lighting, hyperactive ball throwing, or quieter teacher voice, instead of social factors.

 

[KimberlyH]

I think it's a parents' responsibility to know their child and determine what environment is most conducive to their child being successful in school, rather than the school district determining that one size fits all and implementing that program alone. For some this means a public school education, for some this means magnet programs, for some this means single-sex education, etc. I think it's important that all types of educational options are available to students. Unfortunately, a system such as vouchers would still fail some students as their parents aren't interested in and aware of the importance of the education of their child/ren to take the time to figure out what is best for him/her/them. Education is a partnership between parents, teachers, and students and unless all three are vested in the success of the student, no matter the program/curriculum/setting, success is going to be a challenge at best.

 

[jas]

Well said, Kimberly!

 

[Independent Gal]

Yeah, thritto! That''s it in a nutshell.

 

[KimberlyH]

Thanks, jas and IG. I could go off on a tangent but I don't want to hjiack, so I'll be quiet now.

 

[ellaila]

i''m not even going to tell you what i thought this thread was about based on the subject.... (mind, get out of that gutter!!)

lol

 

[Independent Gal]

OMG! Look at those babies! I obviously haven''t been following the mommy threads. Congrats Ellaila! They are scrumptious.

 

[Independent Gal]

Actually, Kim, I''d love to hear your tangent. Go ahead and t''jack!

 

[ellaila]

Date: 2/29/2008 2:55:26 PM
Author: Independent Gal
OMG! Look at those babies! I obviously haven''t been following the mommy threads. Congrats Ellaila! They are scrumptious.

thanks IG! they''re sweet little things, my lovebugs

And thanks for the laugh I had at my own expense when I realized what this thread was actually about!

 

[brazen_irish_hussy]

I also have yet to see good evidence that seperate but equal is better.

Here are some other considerations. My best friend went to an all boy''s middle school for two years. He was obviously gay and was threatend and treated much worse and had no friends because of the lack of woman. The boys were afraid he would hit on them or something and wouldn''t give him any breaks, it was truely terrible for him.

It wouls also be hard on me. When I was tested as a youth, I learned more like males and my brother more like females. If we were put into single sex classroom we would have learned so little because they way it was taught was the opposite of what we needed.

I personally don''t believe a lot of the differences are the ways we learn but rather societal expectations. It was fine for a girl to be good at history in my high school but wierd and probematic if she was good at math since that was the societal idea. Same with boys in physics versus philosphy.
When I went to college though, these supposedly biological distinctions no longer held and the history and philosphy departments had equal men to women, same with physics and biology.

 

[Independent Gal]

Brazen, I definitely learn more stereotypically like a boy too (kinetic, hyper, etc.), and do better in ''boy-envirnoments'' socially, which is partly why I was interested in this.

 

[Independent Gal]

Oh, and Brazen, if you look at boy/girl ratios among FACULTY in philosophy and history departments... it''s telling. Of something anyway. And something not good.

 

[KimberlyH]

Date: 2/29/2008 2:55:48 PM
Author: Independent Gal
Actually, Kim, I''d love to hear your tangent. Go ahead and t''jack!

You asked for it....

One of the biggest trends in I see in education now is the theme of "College for All." I think this mentality is just another nail in the coffin of our education system. I go into 1st grade classrooms filled with students who are already concerned about what college they are going to attend. I am all for students having ambition and determination, but we are teaching students that there is something wrong with being anything other than a college graduate and I think it''s ridiculous. This mentality equates becoming something other than a college grad -- a construction worker, an automobile mechanic, a plumber -- a failure, when, in fact, these are all admirable career paths that are vital to our society.

I also see the effects of this mentality on adults. I am in an MEd program and am embarrassed that I will have to include the name of my school on a resume, or tell people what school I attend when asked, because of the calibur of students that attend class along side me. I am supposed to be among the cutting edge of college students, in a program geared toward adults who work while earning a master''s degree. Instead, I am attending school with people who can''t: write properly constructed sentences, edit, use APA formatting, work as a team, complete their work on time (for goodness sake!), and so on and so forth. I fault our education system for the issues I mentioned above, as these people are all products of said system. But my peers are on the wrong career path, because as adults they are unwilling to do anything to correct the academic issues they face and the cycle will only continue as they teach their students the incorrect way to speak, read, write, work cooperatively, etc.

I am so concerned for our future, and the hands that it lies in.

 

[Independent Gal]

I agree with much of what you say, Kim. I have a good friend who is a pastry chef. A very, very happy pastry chef. She comes from an upper middle class family that expected her to go to college, and it just wasn''t for her. PASTRY. Not medieaval history. She likes to do things with her hands, not with words or numbers. It''s tastier too! She finally got the courage to do what was right for her and now has a successful business... and no college degree.

That said, the more general education one has, the more one appreciates and understands the world in which we live, so from that perspective, I think it''s great for as many people as possible to get as much education as possible.

But if it''s just NOT for you, it''s just NOT for you. And people shouldn''t feel like it''s the only path to success.

 

[jas]

Dr. Sax did (in his speech) address the societal expectations...one thing that fascinated me was how, apparently, 100 years ago give or take, girls were expected to be better at the hard sciences and math, and boys were expected to excel at poetry and literature and such. This was due to the notion that the Humanities were "higher" order, closer to God, more cerebral, more intectual. The sciences were more earthly-bound (i.e. lower, not at close to Heavenly pursuits and Divine inspiration) and therefore, female. He showed us "girl" textbooks from the era (which were very very scientific) and "boy" textbooks (which were much more language/art oriented.) Then we looked at modern physics textbooks and, if you viewed them through a gender-bias lens, were very male.

I wish I could remember what caused the turn around...I have fluffy brain today.

Again, I am not a total convert to his principles, but Dr. Sax was very compelling in his presentation. Sadly, most education don''t research this kind of work in depth enough to say, "Hey...this part of your research is flawed..." or "Hmmm, that seems to be contradicted by this study..." Sometimes, things sound good and solid...the problem is when things go unquestioned and entire school systems adopt a program or a way of doing things without examining all sides and then scratch their heads 10 years later and say, "Well, that didn''t work."

I digress.

I personally have, for 12 years, seen a lot of gender differences and how schools really don''t do well on the whole for either sex...there are some real gaps. I never underestimate the power of hormones in teens and how that affects learning to certain extents. I became very aware of making certain girls got equal time to speak out in class (you''d be amazed how, even in an English class, boys tend to dominate discussions. Whether this is because girls self-censored or because boys are just more vocal is debatable.) However, I chose not to use sex as an anchor for my teaching. As one poster put it, I preferred to look at learning styles. Although these did often fall along gender lines, it was not 100%. I had more than my fair share of girls who excelled when I used more "male" activities (i.e. physical, active, fast-paced) and vice versa.

You''d also be surprised at how often traits (good and bad) were attributed to gender differences in staff meetings (I hope and pray this was isolated to the two schools I worked at -- I heard a lot of "Oh, he''s such a boy." ). Mostly schools reward "feminine" behaviors (in boys and girls) and discourage "masculine" behaviors (except in certain classes)...we (as a society) have developed a "sit down, shut up, raise your hand, don''t squirm" model that, to a certain extent, most girls can better adapt to than boys. It doesn''t mean that it''s good for either sex, mind you.

I''m not sure what my point is, other than that, be it nature or nurture, we are doing our girls a general disservice in the "hard" sciences (mostly physics and computer sciences), where the number of enrolled girls in these classes at the high school and college level has dropped in the last 25 years. We are doing a disservice to boys in the humanities.

Of course, this is only one lens through which to view modern education. I''m not sure this is how I would necessarily approach every lesson for the rest of my life, but I believe it is healthy and good to be aware of the research and the possible implications for the "typical" classroom. Your mileage may (AND SHOULD) vary in your own classroom/home/family/job.

Am I making sense or should I just go drown in some Thera-flu?

Ramblingly,
Jackie

 

[DivaDiamond007]

Date: 2/29/2008 3:32:36 PM
Author: KimberlyH

Date: 2/29/2008 2:55:48 PM
Author: Independent Gal
Actually, Kim, I''d love to hear your tangent. Go ahead and t''jack!

You asked for it....

One of the biggest trends in I see in education now is the theme of ''College for All.'' I think this mentality is just another nail in the coffin of our education system. I go into 1st grade classrooms filled with students who are already concerned about what college they are going to attend. I am all for students having ambition and determination, but we are teaching students that there is something wrong with being anything other than a college graduate and I think it''s ridiculous. This mentality equates becoming something other than a college grad -- a construction worker, an automobile mechanic, a plumber -- a failure, when, in fact, these are all admirable career paths that are vital to our society.

I also see the effects of this mentality on adults. I am in an MEd program and am embarrassed that I will have to include the name of my school on a resume, or tell people what school I attend when asked, because of the calibur of students that attend class along side me. I am supposed to be among the cutting edge of college students, in a program geared toward adults who work while earning a master''s degree. Instead, I am attending school with people who can''t: write properly constructed sentences, edit, use APA formatting, work as a team, complete their work on time (for goodness sake!), and so on and so forth. I fault our education system for the issues I mentioned above, as these people are all products of said system. But my peers are on the wrong career path, because as adults they are unwilling to do anything to correct the academic issues they face and the cycle will only continue as they teach their students the incorrect way to speak, read, write, work cooperatively, etc.

I am so concerned for our future, and the hands that it lies in.

I agree, Kimberly. Another thing that I have come across in my own life along these same lines is that just because you go to college does not mean you will graduate and have some wonderful high paying job. I personally know a few people that went to college with straight A''s, graduated college with straight A''s and are now working in retail making much less money than they should be considering their academic paths. It''s really sorta sad.

Jess

 

[jas]

Date: 2/29/2008 3:32:36 PM
Author: KimberlyH

You asked for it....

One of the biggest trends in I see in education now is the theme of ''College for All.'' I think this mentality is just another nail in the coffin of our education system. I go into 1st grade classrooms filled with students who are already concerned about what college they are going to attend. I am all for students having ambition and determination, but we are teaching students that there is something wrong with being anything other than a college graduate and I think it''s ridiculous. This mentality equates becoming something other than a college grad -- a construction worker, an automobile mechanic, a plumber -- a failure, when, in fact, these are all admirable career paths that are vital to our society.

I also see the effects of this mentality on adults. I am in an MEd program and am embarrassed that I will have to include the name of my school on a resume, or tell people what school I attend when asked, because of the calibur of students that attend class along side me. I am supposed to be among the cutting edge of college students, in a program geared toward adults who work while earning a master''s degree. Instead, I am attending school with people who can''t: write properly constructed sentences, edit, use APA formatting, work as a team, complete their work on time (for goodness sake!), and so on and so forth. I fault our education system for the issues I mentioned above, as these people are all products of said system. But my peers are on the wrong career path, because as adults they are unwilling to do anything to correct the academic issues they face and the cycle will only continue as they teach their students the incorrect way to speak, read, write, work cooperatively, etc.

I am so concerned for our future, and the hands that it lies in.

Kimberly -- not to thread-jack but have you read The Shopping Mall High School?

I had a similar experience with some teachers I "came up" with -- worse, they were indignant if anyone suggested that they work to improve their writing/communication/math/you name it skills. Apparently, they went into teaching because they did poorly in school and always wanted to be the kind of teacher they never had. These people tend to be a lot of fun in the class (i.e. very "popular" teachers), but the kids always suffer.

I am always so happy when you post about teaching because you are exactly what so many kids need. You''re bright, articulate, passionate, caring, up-to-date on research, and, most importantly, you have high standards that, even when tested, I am sure you stick to. I sure wish my little beans had you to look forward to as a classroom teacher!

 

[Independent Gal]

Re Dr. Sax, I think I also have an innate, bordering on paranoid suspicion of anyone with a popular, lucrative book out, who goes on speaking tours to promote it and is really charming and rhetorically compelling. I''m supicious of thinkers who are too ''compelling'' in terms of rhetoric too. So, for example, I always hated Nietzsche in college because the compelling-ness of his rhetorical style made the other students think less analytically about what he was actually arguing. I guess you could say, anyone who develops a following makes me suspicious. It doesn''t make me REJECT their ideas, just examine their arguments and evidence EXTRA closely.

And yes, I know that''s a bit crazy of me!

So part of what makes me go ''hmmmm, I would like to see and evaluate this reserach for myself'' with Dr. Sax is just that: that he''s apparently so compelling. I bet he has really straight, really white teeth too!

OK, I know. I am crazy. And SUCH a cynic.

 

[KimberlyH]

Date: 2/29/2008 3:42:41 PM
Author: Independent Gal

That said, the more general education one has, the more one appreciates and understands the world in which we live, so from that perspective, I think it''s great for as many people as possible to get as much education as possible.

IG, I absulutely agree that there''s no such thing as too much knowledge. If someone has an interest in a subject and wants to take classes to learn more I am all for it. I think it''s great that people have the option to audit college courses. I hope I didn''t imply that I don''t think everyone should persue knowledge and learning. I just think we all need to be aware of who we are and where our strengths lie and use those to our advantage rather than thinking there''s only one right path to follow.

My nephew is 2. His dad has already decided that he''s going to be an engineer, I mean he''s determined that''s what William is going to be. I say let the kid grow up, grow into himself, find what he loves and make a career out of it rather than determining he must go to college, must graduate, must be an engineer. How about thinking he must be fulfilled by whatever it may be that fulfills him, as long as it''s productive, instead.

 

[KimberlyH]

Date: 2/29/2008 3:51:04 PM
Author: DivaDiamond007

Date: 2/29/2008 3:32:36 PM
Author: KimberlyH

Date: 2/29/2008 2:55:48 PM
Author: Independent Gal
Actually, Kim, I''d love to hear your tangent. Go ahead and t''jack!

You asked for it....

One of the biggest trends in I see in education now is the theme of ''College for All.'' I think this mentality is just another nail in the coffin of our education system. I go into 1st grade classrooms filled with students who are already concerned about what college they are going to attend. I am all for students having ambition and determination, but we are teaching students that there is something wrong with being anything other than a college graduate and I think it''s ridiculous. This mentality equates becoming something other than a college grad -- a construction worker, an automobile mechanic, a plumber -- a failure, when, in fact, these are all admirable career paths that are vital to our society.

I also see the effects of this mentality on adults. I am in an MEd program and am embarrassed that I will have to include the name of my school on a resume, or tell people what school I attend when asked, because of the calibur of students that attend class along side me. I am supposed to be among the cutting edge of college students, in a program geared toward adults who work while earning a master''s degree. Instead, I am attending school with people who can''t: write properly constructed sentences, edit, use APA formatting, work as a team, complete their work on time (for goodness sake!), and so on and so forth. I fault our education system for the issues I mentioned above, as these people are all products of said system. But my peers are on the wrong career path, because as adults they are unwilling to do anything to correct the academic issues they face and the cycle will only continue as they teach their students the incorrect way to speak, read, write, work cooperatively, etc.

I am so concerned for our future, and the hands that it lies in.

I agree, Kimberly. Another thing that I have come across in my own life along these same lines is that just because you go to college does not mean you will graduate and have some wonderful high paying job. I personally know a few people that went to college with straight A''s, graduated college with straight A''s and are now working in retail making much less money than they should be considering their academic paths. It''s really sorta sad.

Jess

Tell me about it, Jess. I earned my B.A. in English. I became a secretary, then an "Executive Assistant to the Managing Director." That title always made me laugh. I wanted to say, "I am comfortable being a secretary, in fact I''m good at it! Just call me what I am!!!!"

 

[jas]

LOL Indy. I didn''t notice his teeth. I hope he flosses.

Like I said, I take all this sort of stuff, cherry pick what I feel works for my teaching style and (more importantly) my students and create a mishmosh of an approach.

I don''t begrudge him his following, but I don''t preach from the Book of Sax, either. I just like that he got me thinking about my own approach to education in terms of biases (of all sorts). Will I buy his book? No, I think I got the point of his book from the talk. Obviously, some of his claims stuck with me. I find them interesting and obviously worthy of discussion.

I think it''s great we''re talking about it here!

And I love cynics...who else can I roll my eyes at when humanity is at its best?

 

[KimberlyH]

Date: 2/29/2008 3:55:49 PM
Author: jas

Date: 2/29/2008 3:32:36 PM
Author: KimberlyH

You asked for it....

One of the biggest trends in I see in education now is the theme of 'College for All.' I think this mentality is just another nail in the coffin of our education system. I go into 1st grade classrooms filled with students who are already concerned about what college they are going to attend. I am all for students having ambition and determination, but we are teaching students that there is something wrong with being anything other than a college graduate and I think it's ridiculous. This mentality equates becoming something other than a college grad -- a construction worker, an automobile mechanic, a plumber -- a failure, when, in fact, these are all admirable career paths that are vital to our society.

I also see the effects of this mentality on adults. I am in an MEd program and am embarrassed that I will have to include the name of my school on a resume, or tell people what school I attend when asked, because of the calibur of students that attend class along side me. I am supposed to be among the cutting edge of college students, in a program geared toward adults who work while earning a master's degree. Instead, I am attending school with people who can't: write properly constructed sentences, edit, use APA formatting, work as a team, complete their work on time (for goodness sake!), and so on and so forth. I fault our education system for the issues I mentioned above, as these people are all products of said system. But my peers are on the wrong career path, because as adults they are unwilling to do anything to correct the academic issues they face and the cycle will only continue as they teach their students the incorrect way to speak, read, write, work cooperatively, etc.

I am so concerned for our future, and the hands that it lies in.

Kimberly -- not to thread-jack but have you read The Shopping Mall High School?

I had a similar experience with some teachers I 'came up' with -- worse, they were indignant if anyone suggested that they work to improve their writing/communication/math/you name it skills. Apparently, they went into teaching because they did poorly in school and always wanted to be the kind of teacher they never had. These people tend to be a lot of fun in the class (i.e. very 'popular' teachers), but the kids always suffer.

I am always so happy when you post about teaching because you are exactly what so many kids need. You're bright, articulate, passionate, caring, up-to-date on research, and, most importantly, you have high standards that, even when tested, I am sure you stick to. I sure wish my little beans had you to look forward to as a classroom teacher!

Jas, you are so sweet, and I am flattered. There are lots of great teachers, some mediocre, and some who are in it for the vacation and do the bare minimum in between. I hope to be very good at what I do. I have never been good at science and math, and will definitely be working towards improving those skills so my students are well prepared for high school and beyond. And I have a ton to learn (I start student teaching Monday and I'm beside myself with excitement!).

ETA: I haven't read it, I'll add it to my list.

 

[Independent Gal]

Jas ahaha! I''ll roll my eyes at my silly cynicism with you, OK? You ->

Me ->

All together now!

 

[jas]

Date: 2/29/2008 4:27:02 PM
Author: Independent Gal
Jas ahaha! I''ll roll my eyes at my silly cynicism with you, OK? You ->

Me ->

All together now!

Oh thank GOD! I''m working from home now and can only roll my eyes with the dog.

Thank you again for bringing up this topic...I love smart discussions like this.

 

[Fancy605]

Date: 2/29/2008 3:32:36 PM
Author: KimberlyH

Date: 2/29/2008 2:55:48 PM



One of the biggest trends in I see in education now is the theme of ''College for All.'' I think this mentality is just another nail in the coffin of our education system. I go into 1st grade classrooms filled with students who are already concerned about what college they are going to attend. I am all for students having ambition and determination, but we are teaching students that there is something wrong with being anything other than a college graduate and I think it''s ridiculous. This mentality equates becoming something other than a college grad -- a construction worker, an automobile mechanic, a plumber -- a failure, when, in fact, these are all admirable career paths that are vital to our society.

Wow, what area of the world is this? where I teach, my middle schoolers are very uneducated about college. A lot of them have no interest in continuing their education past high school (and some don''t even want that. We have a graduation rate of like 65% in the county where I work). A lot of them have the "I can work in the mill like mom" mentality. Of course, that isn''t always a bad thing. College isn''t for everyone. It just isn''t. I don''t understand the push for "college for everyone" because not everyone needs something like that to be satisfied. I wish my kids knew that they COULD have it if they wanted it with all the scholarship opportunities out there. A lot of mine say they want to go to college because they associate it with partying (and drinking) and sports, both of which are considered cool to our 8th graders, and neither of which are specifically good reasons for attending college. Of course all the boys think they will be playing football for UGA or GA Tech. But in reality a good many of them will end up satisfied to begin working full time straight out of high school and to skip the college thing all together. I just want them to know that the CAN find a college that will fit their lives and that they CAN find financial aid should they want it because a lot of them don''t go simply because they don''t see any way that they can go.

 

[diamondfan]

Did not read it yet.

I have three boys. I wanted them in co ed school. They go to camp that is all boys, so their school year experience I felt really needed to be co ed. I know that for girls, being with all girls at a young age can be really great, help them build confidence etc, but I hate the continued separation. Men and women are different, they learn differently and behave differently in class most of the time. I recall as a student teacher watching boys in a line up and girls in a line up. The girls tended to stand nicely and keep space in between one another, while the boys jostled and touched and poked. If you have a shy daughter who needs to be made comfortable and find her groove, maybe single sex is fine til middle school. I know girls and boys who went to single sex schools. My girl pals were mostly all admitting later they were boy crazy, as they did not have the exposure, and my guy pals admitted they felt very awkward around girls and really felt at a loss as to how best to interact. So, my opinion is that very generally I prefer co ed schools, so that boys and girls learn to interact well together, and the differences between them become less vast and more accepted. Of course this is just my opinion, and if I had a daughter as well I might feel a bit differently, and there can be very valid reasons for single sex schooling. In the early years, I feel generally the girls benefit from single sex but the boys needs the girls around, so it is a tough call!

 

[phoenixgirl]

There is an inexplicable disparity in academic achievement between the sexes at my high school. I am holding in my hands a list of the juniors who are eligible by GPA for the prestigious honor society at our school, and the list is 20% boys (this is basically a list of the top 15% of the class). The top ten students include two boys. And it's like this every year. The NY Times article mentioned a male student who sued (unsuccessfully) over this same issue of the top of the class/honor society being disproportionately female.

I'm the tenth grade honors English teacher, and again, I generally have 15 to 30% boys. Some would say, well, probably the math and science honors classes are 15 to 30% girls, but they're not. These girls are taking all honors classes, and the boys aren't. I think it's too simple to blame it all on gender differences, but I agree that a disparity exists.

I do think that it's important as an educator to seek to understand and respect all kinds of differences. Sometimes they're cultural (last year I had a handful of ESL students who had written their own papers all year refuse to write poetry or plagiarize their poems; obviously this went beyond motivation and I had to respect that I had asked them to do something much more difficult for them than to write a paper), sometimes they're gender-based, etc. I don't think it really matters if you call it personality type or learning style or gender differences as long as you try to vary your teaching styles as much as possible and note how they respond.

Before I was the honors teacher, I taught the middle level tenth grade classes, and I invariably had boys who should have been in honors--who would have outperformed many of my honors students--but who either did not want to take it or had never been told to take it. On the other hand, I have seen many average to slightly above average students forced to take all honors classes by their parents. Intellectually and cognitively, they are behind these lazy/unencouraged boys, but they are doing all the assignments, so they are doing ok, just not spectacularly. From my experience, white males are the least likely to fall into this "you must take all honors classes" (or at least as many as you can handle) group. I think part of it is peer pressure, that being smart is not cool in teenaged boydom.

Case in point: one of my honors classes (the one with the least number of A's and the lowest averages on everything) seems to have more than the usual share of popular kids who have friends outside of honors classes. At the beginning of this year, I had a "you must pick your head up off the desk or leave the room" show-down with this one football player. Much to my chagrin, he won the show-down as I was really not willing to call the office to remove an honors student over having his head on the desk. But then I read his letter of introduction to me, which revealed a dark but hilarious sense of humor and an eloquent writer. It said something like, "I know you seated me in the front of the room because you heard about me from [last year's teacher]." No, I seated them alphabetically. So I decided to proceed under the assumption that the head down incident was not some blatant show of disrespect but was really because he was feeling out of place and singled-out and was probably truly tired from having to start the school-year schedule again. So I gave him a second chance (making a special effort to act like I liked him) and now we have a great relationship . . . the kind where the student strikes up a conversation with you during down moments, etc. But if we had continued with an antagonistic relationship, I'm sure he would have made his protest known through not doing his work.

On the other hand, the teacher they'll have next year is, according to some of my students from two years ago, the reason why what few boys there were dropped out of honors English by 12th grade. There are three male students in AP English 12 this year. Three! And I sent at least 15 to 11th grade honors. She told one brilliant male student (perfect score on the state writing test) that he shouldn't take 11th grade honors English if he wasn't planning to major in English (WTF?), so he dropped out mid-year! This is one of those teachers JAS and Kimberly have been mentioning: the teachers who are in for what they get out of it emotionally. To be fair, I don't think it's that this teacher has it out for boys, but I think she rewards students who suck up to her (the AP teacher actually had to make a speech about how a poor grade doesn't mean she dislikes them because the 11th grade teacher had programmed that in their heads). And since only the top of the top boys were taking honors English to begin with, I think they were less likely to play that game for a grade. Very creative and advanced girls also dropped out of her class (so sad!). When I look at who is taking AP English next door, it is those girls I was describing earlier--the average to slightly above average students whose parents make them take all honors. All the truly great minds dropped out as an "F you!" to that teacher.

So perhaps another part of the problem is that so much depends upon the teachers you have along the way. Kimberly, you mentioned some of the morons getting an MEd . . . well, at my school, we hire teachers who aren't certified all the time. Imagine how many more morons are out there who aren't even getting into MEd programs but are still in front of the classroom! One-third of the teachers in my department were hired uncertified (they must get certified in three years). And twice that many have been hired uncertified over the last five years and have left the profession by now. One coworker, for example, always looks clueless when we discuss things at lunch that every English teacher should know: classic literature, rules of grammar and writing, etc. Her first year she was a cart teacher, and for some reason thought it would be appropriate and helpful to make a big poster with pictures of her friends and family (her in a bar with a beer in her hand, etc.) and mount it to the front of the cart she took from room to room. I think this was an example of something her students were supposed to do because as far as I can tell her class consists mainly of making posters and memory boxes. Anyway, as if this weren't bad enough, she labelled the poster in big letters, "WHAT [her first name] RELY'S ON"

And this was on her cart for MONTHS! Her first name, inappropriate pictures, and proof that she can't conjugate a verb! Finally I couldn't take it anymore, so I mentioned casually to a teacher with a big mouth, "Oh, I just noticed that 'relies' is spelled wrong on her cart. Do you think I should tell her?" The poster was gone by the end of the day.

I think it's great that schools are trying out different pedagogical philosophies because I see so many teachers who don't know the basics of their content area, let alone the different theories on learning styles and differences. So it can only be a good thing. I don't think any approach is "one size fits all," or even "one size fits all boys and another size fits all girls." But I'm glad that there are still people out there trying to evaluate and diagnose the ills of our system.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I did not read the article. But what I have always heard is that preference is given to high achieving boys over girls, so it is an advantage to girls to be educated in single sex schools because they have the opportunity to excel without boys dominating. That said, I went to an all girls college and loved it. We don''t even have the option here of single-sex education in schools below college, so it is a non-issue.