Men objectified as sex objects

[lucyandroger]

In our culture objectifying women as sex objects has been common for a long time.
The women's movement has illuminated this for us.
Struggle and adjustment has resulted.
The battle rages on.

I just thought it was refreshing to see some blatant and shameless objectification in the other direction.

Women blatantly and shamelessly objectify men even in our culture. Look at Chippendales, Thunder From Down Under, Firemen/Cop calendars etc. One just has to see past all the male pigs to find the sows digging up truffles too.

(By no means am I implying women are sows, it just happened to be what a female pig is called)

Yeah, but the objectification of women is much much much more common and mainstream. We're bombarded with advertisements with women in suggestive poses and outfits, Hugh Hefner is a household name, Miss USA is on primetime...etc. And it happens in ways that actually affect women on a daily basis, like in the workplace.

I believe Kenny was the one that posted the thread on Sarah Palin's possible boob job. Like I said in that thread, you just don't see that kind of stuff about male politicians. And the fact that there are male beauty pageants on a different continent or Chippendales clubs really doesn't change any of that.

 

[AGBF]

And I'm not the one who continually starts gender-related threads dearie.

ksinger-I think you are missing something when you call these simply, "gender related threads". These threads are not simply related to a discussion of differences between the sexes, they are often about which people are sexual objects. I started to notice this when I found myself angered at Kenny's threads about Hugh Hefner. There is an underlying desire to point out that very old men cavort with scantily clad women decades younger than they are and, conversely, that women are capable of sitting in an audience and watching a buff young man take off his clothes while lewdly whistling and sticking dollar bills in his G-string. There is a desire to show that people are base, that sex is base, that sex goes along with "Playboy" magazine and Chippendale dancers. I can't put my finger on exactly what it is, but there is a dynamic at work that goes way beyond a desire to deiscuss differences between the sexes.

Deb/AGBF


Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend

I would like to point out that I started reading between the lines of Cuso's threads and everyone got mad at me for it. I developed a grudge towards him because of my perception of his racism/elitism.

I'm just pointing out that what you're doing is very similar and not any nicer than what I did.

Just sayin . . .

iLander-Let me see if I have this straight. You thought you perceived something in someone else's writing (which may or may not have been present). You posted about it. Other people reacted negatively to what you wrote. So now you have come to believe that no one else should ever post any insights or write about any dynamics he perceives while on the internet.

That point of view will limit our intellectual horizons and stifle discussion, but you are, of course, entitled to your opinion.

Deb/AGBF


Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend

 

[kenny]

I didn't notice gender issues on PS's list of banned topics.

I think the anti-Kenny crowd has me pegged all wrong.
I'm pro-equality and love to point out sexist bigotry.

When I post about Hugh Hefner it's like posting about, say, Hitler.
Pointing out examples of garbage behavior does not mean I support it.
Quite the opposite.

You'd think this would go without saying, but I guess not.
If you look for bad in a person it will color your impression of everything they do.
You will find what your bias says is there, even if it is not there.

I may be male, but I on your team - if you are on the pro-equality team.
I also have a sense of humor about ALL groups.
Sheesh!

 

[AGBF]

I didn't notice gender issues on PS's list of banned topics.

I think the anti-Kenny crowd has me pegged all wrong.
I'm pro-equality and love to point out sexist bigotry.

When I post about Hugh Hefner it's like posting about, say, Hitler.
Pointing out examples of garbage behavior does not mean I support it.
Quite the opposite.

You'd think this would go without saying, but I guess not.
If you look for bad in a person it will color your impression of everything they do.
You will find what your bias says is there, even if it is not there.

I may be male, but I on your team - if you are on the pro-equality team.
I also have a sense of humor about ALL groups.
Sheesh!

I believe every word you posted, Kenny. The problem is that sometimes men who believe in equality think that giving women exactly what men have right now is creating equal conditions. That isn't the case. The current "world" was created so that men could be pre-eminent. Just as an example (a silly one): women don't need an equal number of strip clubs, pool rooms, and bars to achieve equality with men in a given neighborhood. We would prefer that you built us nail salons and hair dressers' salons. We actually are different, as came out in your (very good) thread on the military.

Deb


Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend

 

[kenny]

I believe every word you posted, Kenny. The problem is that sometimes men who believe in equality think that giving women exactly what men have right now is creating equal conditions. That isn't the case. The current "world" was created so that men could be pre-eminent. Just as an example (a silly one): women don't need an equal number of strip clubs, pool rooms, and bars to achieve equality with men in a given neighborhood. We actually are different, as came out in your (very good) thread on the military.

Deb

I love interesting, stimulating, vibrant conversation on all topics.
Often the most interesting subjects are those on the edge of polite society.
These touchy topics make us a little uncomfortable since they challenge our values.
Yes, I love to challenge my own values and learn from all of you in these threads.

I do not start threads to chisel away at anyone to convert them to my way of thinking.
Each person presents their perspective.
IMHO, one opinion does not conquer any other regardless of the number of posters who agree with that opinion, how well a person supports it, how many posts they make or how many pages a thread goes on.

To me, the goal is not winning an argument, or even agreement.
The phrase, "Let's just agree to disagree" annoys me because to me it's based on the assumption that disagreement is a bad thing and that people thinking similarly is superior to them thinking differently - a slippery slope.

I think respecting diversity is being at peace with not only differences from all the genetically-determined stuff like race, gender, etc. but also differences in people's minds.

Yes the genders are different, but deciding when and where they are to be treated as equals and when not is a healthy and fascinating conversation.

I feel compelled to apologize for being male here.
Please try to not hold being male against me.
The attitude that, "you're a man so you don't get it" is wrong.
Plenty of white people understood that slavery was wrong.
Also, blaming every man for the sins of some is wrong too.

 

[AGBF]

I'm a male.
Please try to not hold that against me.
The attitude that, "you're a man so you don't get it, you CAN"T get it" is wrong.
Plenty of white people understood that slavery was wrong.

I don't hold your being a male against you. I like men. There are some men, men who are interested, who can actually learn about what women experience on a deep societal level. You may be one of them. I don't really know you or know how open you are to learning. I only know the persona you portray here on Pricescope. I do know that men have to open their ears and listen to women, not just argue with them, if they really want to hear what it feels like to be a woman, though. Because men-and most women-don't think about it. We accept our roles. It is only the few women who examine a woman's role who can reflect on some of the bizarre things about it that role that they have come to realize.

Deb/AGBF


Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend

 

[kenny]

Thanks Deb.
Sorry, I didn't mean to single you out.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

I think you all are talking about cultural behaviors and not inate differences between the sexes.
I do not at all think men are more beautiful or showy than females. I think the female form is much more beautiful.
This is rather frivolous behaviors to me. Women on these threads get out of joint if a man at work says they're pretty. They wanted to sue, run to human resOURCES, or post on line because they are so upset. Over-reacting for sure.

I never minded passing a construction site and have guys whistle at me. I wish I looked like that now.

I'll tell you what opened my eyes wide. After the new law was enacted in Illinois that allowed women to get restaining orders against men who they said were a danger to them, almost a half a million dangerous men were restained from going near these women. That is a testament to men being abused by the system. All MY Opinion. Its tiring to always bash men,
And Debbie, you live in the past, however glorious it was. I was there. Things have surely changed.

Kenny, keep posting whatever you like.

Thanks,
Annette

 

[AGBF]

And Debbie, you live in the past, however glorious it was.

I assume I'm "Debbie", although I don't use, "Debbie" as a nickname. Forgive me if you weren't addressing me.

I live in real time with a real 18 year-old who has real 2011 problems. So I'm not sure what you're saying about me when you say I, "live in the past". What do you mean?

Deb (or Deborah)


Diamonds Are A Girl's Best Friend

 

[Arkteia]

I think it'a odd that in the animal kingdom, the male is usually the embellished one, but in humans, it's the opposite.

Why is that?

I always found that odd too iLander. I think it's because a male can impregnate many females while (in most animals) a female can only be impregnated by one male. The male has a greater chance of passing along its own genetics with the more females it can attract and successfully copulate.

I think the male is the embellished one only in species where two males have to compete for a female's love. In the same species, males also fight for the female.