I think I blew my interview.

[SarahLovesJS]

Aww Gypsy I am sorry hun!

((HUGS)) It sounds like these people are odd, I don''t think you would have wanted that job anyway! Definite personality issues. Sorry to hear that demon boss struck again!

Maybe HR will actually do something this time.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 5/19/2008 6:55:05 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 5/19/2008 6:40:29 PM
Author: Gypsy
While its good to be likeable and desirable, I think it''s also important to let them know that I am looking for certain things, and that my opinion of them and their company matters as much as their opinion of me.

I agree with you to a point ... but c''mon -- you said that girl was a) the most junior person you met b) nervous about her OWN review c) obviously insecure (with pompous manner & trying to compete with you on drafting skills) ... is THAT the person you need to play hard to get/chest-thump/take back your power in front of? She''s not the decision maker. It wasn''t going well. That''s why it *seems* more anger/ego-driven than strategic cool confidence. ACK == I do not mean to nitpick. Analyzing situations helps me a lot -- seriously mean to help - not 2nd guess you!

I agree Gypsy...I have always said that I am interviewing the company as much as they are interviewing me. However, when I say "said" I mean to myself not to them (not saying you did that). I do tell the company that they sound great (or some other compliment) and that I definitely want to make sure we are a mutual fit because when I accept an offer, I do so with long term in mind.

I also agree with Deco that it''s easy to be sophisticated in hindsight, so don''t beat yourself up too much. Hopefully you don''t think we are picking on you, but I do think sometimes objective analysis helps us all to improve and move on.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 5/19/2008 6:36:14 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 5/19/2008 6:24:38 PM
Author: TravelingGal
The challenge and growth comes from learning how to work with people from ALL walks of life and types of personalities. My cousin goes from job to job because she always finds someone at work she can''t stand. I''m not sure she understands yet that going to a new workplace does not fix the problem.

WEEEERD! I was just talking to a pal about this the other day. He was deciding whether or not to take an AWESOME job because he thought the people interviewing him, who would be his peers, were smug, Type A, a bit aggressive in their questioning & generally not ''chill''. Now he''d only spend a couple of hours with them -- and there was only one ringleader dude who was super um gruff. But!! He took the job. I was telling him that its so hard to find AWESOME jobs -- and EVERY JOB has difficult people. Wherever you go you have to learn to deal with a new type of AWFUL HUMAN. Its a learning curve NO ONE gets to avoid (or very, very few). These days the chances of finding an AWESOME JOB with all AWESOME PEOPLE -- ha!

And Gyp -- anyone (even me

) can be ''sophisticated'' in RETROSPECT. Now that we''ve seen the whole thing play out. Its much more difficult in the moment so don''t take it too hard. When people overshare it might be out of nervousness or something more sinister. Hard to tell.

I''ve been lucky to even have one job where EVERYONE was awesome and it was the best job ever. That lasted 5 years and 5 years after the company kind of fell apart, we all still keep in touch and have reunions. But you are right...it is tough. It is why I would not want to go back to an office environment again...working from home is wonderful!

 

[Gypsy]

Thing... If you're a hippie then I'm one too!! I agree, if it's meant to be, it will be-- if not. Well, something better will come along.

ahappygirl-- thank you for coming out of lurkdom for my post honey!! I really appreciate it. I also appreciate the support, and the advice. I think you are absolutely right, if they offer me the position, I am going to have to be clear about my reservations and see what they say. I was not at all happy with number 4 and number 3... well, you all could be right, she could have totally played me! I don't want to go from the frying pan and into the fryer. It would look terrible on my resume if I changed jobs again in under two years. I am going to deal with Demon Boss tomrrow. I'm going to formally complain to her boss, who won't do anything and will take her side as they are buddies. And I will tell him that if it's not addressed I will tell our VP (who would do something), and then take it to HR. I'll follow the chain of command, and if it means a formal complaint at HR. Well, so be it. She deserves it.

Kaleigh, I can see bot sides too. And you are always helpful, even if it's just offering support and friendship!

No Deco, you're right. I should have just let it go and gotten out of there. I agree. I wasn't thinking with my head.

Freke-- you can say that again!

Thank you Sarah! Yeah, Demon boss struck again. I'm not that pissed about it anymore though, cause I got PROOF in her own writing this time. It's not just heresay and he said she said. I've got it in BW. So, actually if it had to happen, I'm very happy she put it into writing.


Hey TG. No I don't think you are picking on me. You aren't attacking me personally or anything. You are just giving me objective feedback on a specific set of facts. There is a difference. And I do appreciate the feedback, because it IS very helpful.

On the plus side aside from my eyeliner (OY!) I think I looked very nice and professional, without looking like I was trying too hard. So my new suit was just right.

 

[TravelingGal]

So Gypsy, if you get the job, what would you say are your reservations?

 

[Gypsy]

Date: 5/19/2008 7:28:50 PM
Author: TravelingGal
So Gypsy, if you get the job, what would you say are your reservations?

Heh. I was just going to ask you all what I should say.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 5/19/2008 7:33:15 PM
Author: Gypsy

Date: 5/19/2008 7:28:50 PM
Author: TravelingGal
So Gypsy, if you get the job, what would you say are your reservations?

Heh. I was just going to ask you all what I should say.

That''s why I was asking...we can help if you want. I actually don''t know what your reservations are exactly...

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Gypsy, just don''t jump from the frying pan into the fire. There seem to be plenty of red flags about this situation that I''d be wary. I hope it all works out the best for you!!!

(And p.s., I finally found watches Saturday! I got two Longines and one is a Dolce Vita. The other is more antique looking and I love it. They are posted in Jewelry Pieces.)

 

[Gypsy]

Okay well. Just because I can be honest here and you guys will help me figure out what the boundaries of what I can say are... without overstepping them.

My current job is being disrupted because my boss thinks I''m after her job (she''s not an attorney). My contracts counsel thinks I''m after his (he is one, but well... I really could replace him if it weren''t for bandwidth). And no one seems to realize that there is enough work to go around and that I can just EXIST without being a threat to either of them.

My concern is that #3 and #4 aren''t attorney''s. Number 4 has already expressed her ... discomfort with the idea of an attorney in a role that is not specifically for an attorney. And that while the management, and the legal counsel, AND the Sister Department to the contracts department''s Manager all seemed enthusiastic and even eager to have an attorney in the position... I don''t think my co-workers feel that way. And I do not want to be put in the position again where when I''m hired on I''m automatically thought of as a threat to the exisiting employees, simply because I have a law degree and they don''t. It''s my understanding that they are having SERIOUS bandwidth issues. Enough to justify TWO new people, not just one. And I want any feelings of ''she''s being hired to take my job'' addressed, if possible. (which it may not be).

 

[Gypsy]

Date: 5/19/2008 7:37:20 PM
Author: diamondseeker2006
Gypsy, just don''t jump from the frying pan into the fire. There seem to be plenty of red flags about this situation that I''d be wary. I hope it all works out the best for you!!!

(And p.s., I finally found watches Saturday! I got two Longines and one is a Dolce Vita. The other is more antique looking and I love it. They are posted in Jewelry Pieces.)

Hi DS! I agree. I have to talk to John about it. I really do like the manager though.

Of course, it makes me wonder if he can control them.

YAY on the watches, I''m off to go and see!! I love the Dolce Vita and antique longines!!! YUM!

 

[pjean]

Date: 5/19/2008 6:12:10 PM
Author: omieluv
Okay, you know by now that asking about the review was probably not the best thing to do. However, red flags went up in my head the instant you mentioned she grilled you and then did not allow you to ask any questions. I know, she could have been running late, but that was not your problem. Given your experience with her, could you see working with her anyway?

Yep! Red flags here too!

 

[Mara]

honestly i'd keep looking. there are already issues with potential coworkers --that is not the way to go into a new job situation...esp from a bad one thus far.

i've had bad work envirornments previously, making a good work environ super precious to me. yes you can let them know that you are interviewing them as well, i was very up front about wanting a positive work environ, lots of teamwork and positive energy. i luckily found that here and i am happy.

if anyone i interviewed with here previously had acted the least bit shifty about answering questions or one of the gals i def felt like we could butt heads or she'd be jealous etc...i'd have kept looking. it's not worth jumping from a frying pan into a potential fire...sometimes the next situation is worse than the one you are trying to escape.

i am not sure how many opps there are for new gigs for you in your industry around the bay, but i am a firm believer in finding the right opportunity at right time....don't settle if you don't HAVE to...aka meaning you have a job even if it isn't fun and does pay the bills for now. keep looking...don't rationalize yourself into taking something you are not 1000000% jazzed about. we spent a lot of our time at work, it should be enjoyable...i totally believe that.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 5/19/2008 7:49:25 PM
Author: Mara
honestly i'd keep looking. there are already issues with potential coworkers --that is not the way to go into a new job situation...esp from a bad one thus far.

i've had bad work envirornments previously, making a good work environ super precious to me. yes you can let them know that you are interviewing them as well, i was very up front about wanting a positive work environ, lots of teamwork and positive energy. i luckily found that here and i am happy.

if anyone i interviewed with here previously had acted the least bit shifty about answering questions or one of the gals i def felt like we could butt heads or she'd be jealous etc...i'd have kept looking. it's not worth jumping from a frying pan into a potential fire...sometimes the next situation is worse than the one you are trying to escape.

i am not sure how many opps there are for new gigs for you in your industry around the bay, but i am a firm believer in finding the right opportunity at right time....don't settle if you don't HAVE to...aka meaning you have a job even if it isn't fun and does pay the bills for now. keep looking...don't rationalize yourself into taking something you are not 1000000% jazzed about. we spent a lot of our time at work, it should be enjoyable...i totally believe that.

Good Lord...here's a poster I haven't seen in awhile...is it because I'm not eating cupcakes while being on a treadmill?

I do agree with you Mara...but sometimes I wonder when people have lots of issues with people, is it the *people* or is it that PERSON? (Gypsy, not singling you out directly here). Some people have to learn how to grow thicker skins and work with different personalities. But yes...if possible, it's best to find something that isn't so blatantly iffy off the bat.

Gypsy, more later on your reservations...I have to check on the kid....

 

[Gypsy]

Thank you pjean.

Mara. You''ve posted a lot of helpful and thoughtful advice for me. But this post of yours really hit home, and in a long line of helpful posts, this might be your most helpful for me personally, yet. Positive work environment, teamwork and postive energy. That''s really what I felt was lacking with number 4. I felt good up until that point. I didn''t have any doubts about number 3, could tell she had boundaries and needed them to be respected, but she seemed pretty upfront. She''s the one that''s buried under a mountain of work though. I do need to think about things.

TG... Yeah, it''s the iffy off the bat thing. Demon Boss is even okay in interviews. Okay, so people don''t want to work FOR HER. But they usually don''t run out screaming they don''t want to work WITH her.

I''ve got to balance some stuff out in my head.

And I''ve got to lose the fantasy of telling Demon Boss to take her job and stuff it ASAP. I do have a job. My job security is okay. My boss is a nightmare... but I don''t want to end up in a worse situation. You all are right. So I need to think.

T-gal... give the little baby a kiss for me.

Can I say that I''m looking for a positive work environment with lots of teamwork and got the feeling that group was made up of individual contibuters instead of a true team, and that I''m concerned about the potential for negativity in that kind of work place? Okay, so maybe I can say it. But does it get at the point I''m trying to make or is it dancing WAY to far out from it to be clear?

 

[Fly Girl]

Can I say that I''m looking for a positive work environment with lots of teamwork and got the feeling that group was made up of individual contibuters instead of a true team, and that I''m concerned about the potential for negativity in that kind of work place? Okay, so maybe I can say it. But does it get at the point I''m trying to make or is it dancing WAY to far out from it to be clear?

I think that I would be clearer than that. I got the impression that your potential future co-workers are very threatened by your law degree, and that it might be difficult for you to overcome this in order to work well with them.

I have worked in a difficult environment, and consequently having good relationships with the boss and co-workers is very important to me. A good boss loves having smart, capable employees, because they know that you will make them look good. Similarly, good co-workers will love tapping into your expertise, instead of being rude to you. I''d ask the company how they would deal with this concern of yours. You have nothing to lose here. If it isn''t going to be a good work environment, I''d keep looking.

 

[Harleigh]

Hi Gypsy, Nice to "see" you again! I''m sorry your interview was so screwy, but I agree with the others that you may just be leaving one bad situation and jumping into another, which is NOT what you need right before your wedding. I think you should really weigh out the options and make the best choice for you and John. I hope it all works out for you! {HUGS}

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 5/19/2008 9:00:39 PM
Author: Fly Girl

Can I say that I''m looking for a positive work environment with lots of teamwork and got the feeling that group was made up of individual contibuters instead of a true team, and that I''m concerned about the potential for negativity in that kind of work place? Okay, so maybe I can say it. But does it get at the point I''m trying to make or is it dancing WAY to far out from it to be clear?

I think that I would be clearer than that. I got the impression that your potential future co-workers are very threatened by your law degree, and that it might be difficult for you to overcome this in order to work well with them.

I have worked in a difficult environment, and consequently having good relationships with the boss and co-workers is very important to me. A good boss loves having smart, capable employees, because they know that you will make them look good. Similarly, good co-workers will love tapping into your expertise, instead of being rude to you. I''d ask the company how they would deal with this concern of yours. You have nothing to lose here. If it isn''t going to be a good work environment, I''d keep looking.

If you really want to say that, I would ask: is the corporate environment more of a team driven one or more of an individual contribution driven one? Let THEM answer the question. If you want this job, I would be very careful about making judgments that may or may not be the case. As flygirl says, if you really have nothing to lose, be my guest. But you DO have something to lose if you really want to try out this job.

I also would not say to them that you are concerned about potential negativity...what are they going to say? "Oh yeah, it''s negative here...but we have faith that you''ll manage." If they want you, they are going to SELL this job and company to you and if they are smart they will not agree that the environment is negative...which puts you in the awkward position of having to explain why you think there is a potential of negativity.

You can''t control your colleagues personalities, and bordering on HR reprimandable actions, neither can they. Gypsy, would you to not take a good job just because you may be seen as a threat? Every new employee is checked out by their colleagues and more often than not, there is a feeling of job insecurity by them. This is pretty normal from what I have seen. It''s your job to be positive, a good worker and if possible, congenial to your colleagues so hopefully they like and trust you.

Like I said, if they want you, they will put a positive spin on anything. I don''t ask questions about potential colleagues...it''s not my concern. I ask more about where the company has been and where it''s headed...but even that is often answered in the best light with spin. I''m in sales, so I now just ask how growth has been over the last few years. I find people don''t really lie about that and I make my judgments based on the numbers.

Hope that helps some.

 

[Gemma12]

Date: 5/20/2008 12:48:07 AM
Author: TravelingGal


I also would not say to them that you are concerned about potential negativity...what are they going to say? ''Oh yeah, it''s negative here...but we have faith that you''ll manage.'' If they want you, they are going to SELL this job and company to you and if they are smart they will not agree that the environment is negative...which puts you in the awkward position of having to explain why you think there is a potential of negativity.

Hey Gypsy,
I''m sorry to hear about the problems you''re having with your current job and that this interview didn''t go well-good on you for seeking out advice in this thread!

I have to agree with TG here and wonder why they didn''t try and sell it to you a bit better in the interview! If it was just #4 being insecure/having an off day, whatever, that still doesn''t explain why #3 was indiscreet. Red flags, absolutely-and I would trust your gut on some of the other stuff that you have mentioned (ie #3 being manipulative).

That said, I agree with TG as well when she said no workplace is perfect. The interview is usually the place where both sides show off their best aspects and I would be concerned for you that they really didn''t do this.

Hope your meeting with HR re the DB (demon boss) goes well!

 

[Gypsy]

Thank you everyone who responded. I''m feeling a little overwhelmed right now, so while I want to respond to everyone, I''m going to hold off till after work tomorrow. Tonight, I have to figure out what I''m going to say to my bosses boss tomorrow. I have to unemotional and factual and firm and professional, when all I want to do is howl and rage and yell.

 

[bee*]

Sorry to hear that it didn''t go great. While I think that you did overstep the mark by asking the question, even though it wasn''t specifically about her review, I think I agree with Mara-I''d keep looking.I know that you really want to get away from demon boss, but there already seems to be issues with colleagues in this job. Maybe if they can answer your questions correctly on the phone I''d reconsider, but if they''re still wishy washy on the phone, I''d pass. There will be something out there for you.

 

[LegacyGirl]

I''m still praying for you Gypsy!

 

[iwannaprettyone]

At least you won''t be working for that strange person which could be viewed as a positive thing.