Ellen''s Leon story has me thinking.....

[Harriet]

Deco,
We know you're not joshing.

May I add (timidly) that El's account is distinct from CrookedRock's? I'm not calling into question either's varacity, not do I want to re-open that *can* of worms. However, both ladies had different issues with Leon and it might help to keep that in mind.

 

[hairgirl95]

WOW! I missed all the great discussion about this this morning. All of you bring up really great points. Darn it for having to work this morning and missing out discussing this with you all!

I do want to clarify that its not just LM''s attitude that turned me off on him. It was the poor handling of Ellen''s stone as well as CrookedRock''s experience with him as well. I can handle someone who is pissy or full of themselves, and if they give me a great end result, their overall attitude is not a problem with me. BUT, when you do not fulfill the obligation of the job you were given, (ie the stone has some damage while in LM''s possession) COUPLED with a snarky and diva-esque attitude, for me, it spells trouble. I work with the public on a daily basis--I do hair and own a salon, and I deal with all types of crazy people! I know that when I have a customer that is highly demanding, it does me no good to be snarky and condescending with them. It only escalates a bad situation. I have high expectations of myself, and I have a full clientele of people. My clientele has high expectations of themselves AND me. I have to please both of us. I use this line of thought from my personal and professional life in regards to the LM situation. You can have all the attitude you want as long as the end result pleases both parties involved.


I think Madam Bijoux summed up my feelings perfectly in her post.

Risingsun--I hear ya too! I have gotten rid of clients, changed dentists and OB/GYN''s, even home improvement stores I patronize based on how I am treated. Heck, I am pretty tolerant to a point. I think one thing that needs to be mentioned is that noone is right for everyone. And LM is one of those situations. He does have beautiful jewelry, but he is not a good fit for everyone.

Tgal--I about spit iced tea all over my computer over the "suck" comment. That was hilarious! Guess Tguy is a "lucky" guy!!

Sorry for going there with that--just my ornery side coming out!!

Its been fun to see what everyones feelings and interpretations are in regards to this. I am glad it sparked a great dialogue!

 

[allycat0303]

Well here''s the way I see it. Everyone can have a bad day, so when someone has a bad experience I say to myself "well maybe this is an anomaly, maybe he was having a bad day, and this does not necessarily mean it will be my experience." However, it also depends on the situation. I DO NOT think that PSers lie. What I do think is that sometimes a craftsman can behave really badly, and sometimes the customer is too difficult. Usually though, the PSer will also provide pictures and facts. If I can''t see the problem, or it sounds as though it''s more a questions of "perfectionism" or "customer being difficult" or "customer changing their minds" then I give the vendor the benefit of the doubt.

And of course how much I want the product also factors into how much I am willing to tolerate. So I think Leon''s work is (or was) at a time, something that I didn''t think I could get anywhere else. I''d heard bad reviews, but I had also heard good reviews. I really wanted a Leon ring so I went with him despite the things I had heard.

 

[princesss]

Honestly, I would still go with him. In fact, I dream of a ring made by him. Those delicate prongs, the simple, smooth lines, the classic silhouettes.

To me, the end result is worth it. It''s worth the attitude and the headaches.

However, I do believe in getting everything in writing. Everything. So (on the off chance) something did get changed, I would have evidence to back me up. But I think his artistry is worth dealing with his attitude.

 

[Eva17]

Date: 7/25/2008 10:12:05 AM
Author: Irishgrrrl
There are many, many vendors here on PS who treat their customers like gold and provide an extremely high-quality product.

Really? A *better* product than Leon you think? Can't say as I've seen lovelier custom pieces done by ANY other PS vendor. Of course I'm basing my opinion on designs & craftsmanship viewed 99% through photos & other witness accounts.

And even the most reliable, customer-savvy, workhorse vendors have snafus and communication-problems & accidents & times that they aren't on their game.

From an aesthetic point of view -- I'd pick Leon each and every time.





Deco, i absolutely agree with your statement. I wanted to post this but figured i might have to do some "ducking".



Ellen, your post is eloquent as always. I am sorry you had to deal with this disappointment. Your post is honest and to the point. Without the mudslinging. Exactly what i would hope to find if i was doing a search on opinions of a vendor. Honest and truthful!

But again, i wish you didn't have to live with the end result....

 

[Skippy123]

Date: 7/26/2008 9:41:26 AM
Author: Eva17
Date: 7/25/2008 10:12:05 AM
Author: Irishgrrrl
There are many, many vendors here on PS who treat their customers like gold and provide an extremely high-quality product.

Really? A *better* product than Leon you think? Can't say as I've seen lovelier custom pieces done by ANY other PS vendor. Of course I'm basing my opinion on designs & craftsmanship viewed 99% through photos & other witness accounts.

And even the most reliable, customer-savvy, workhorse vendors have snafus and communication-problems & accidents & times that they aren't on their game.

From an aesthetic point of view -- I'd pick Leon each and every time.


Deco, i absolutely agree with your statement. I wanted to post this but figured i might have to do some 'ducking'.

Ellen, your post is eloquent as always. I am sorry you had to deal with this disappointment. Your post is honest and to the point. Without the mudslinging. Exactly what i would hope to find if i was doing a search on opinions of a vendor. Honest and truthful!

But again, i wish you didn't have to live with the end result....

Ellen, ditto, you are a classy lady; I appreciate your honesty.

 

[Eva17]

ok, i have been here a long time and i still don''t know how to insert the post i am trying to repond to with the blue box. or how do you hightlight the text in yellow?

 

[Skippy123]

Date: 7/26/2008 9:52:54 AM
Author: Eva17
ok, i have been here a long time and i still don't know how to insert the post i am trying to repond to with the blue box. or how do you hightlight the text in yellow?

Hi Eva, the post you want to respond to, hit reply button (the person you want to quote, specifically). Once you did that you have room to type but before you type, hit the Quote button. Then you have their quote there.

For highlighting, see the ab button up top (their is font, size, A, then ab) click on ab and you can highlight select a color if one isn't selected. I hope that helps.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 7/26/2008 9:52:54 AM
Author: Eva17
ok, i have been here a long time and i still don''t know how to insert the post i am trying to repond to with the blue box. or how do you hightlight the text in yellow?

Hi Eva!

Hit the reply box right above the post you want to quote/insert. Then hit the quote button. Voila, it should be there!


And thank you, and Skippy, for the very kinds words. They are truly appreciated.

 

[Ellen]

The Skippers is faster than me.

 

[CrookedRock]

Date: 7/25/2008 4:09:32 PM
Author: Harriet
Deco,

May I add (timidly) that El''s account is distinct from CrookedRock''s? I''m not calling into question either''s varacity, not do I want to re-open that *can* of worms. However, both ladies had different issues with Leon and it might help to keep that in mind.

I have to disagree. While we both had different experiences, the underlying issue is the same.

 

[CJ2008]

I wouldn''t use Leon. I don''t have the stomach/patience to deal with someone that I can''t feel comfortable saying "I''d like this a little wider". Part of it is that I don''t have thick skin - I admire those that do and can deal with pressure and confrontation and whatever else, knowing that in the end they''re going to get something they want. I would just go through so much anxiety, I couldn''t stomach it.

When I was looking to have my own ring designed, I contacted a jeweler often talked about on here - I found him to be too temperamental as well. He spent the whole time on the phone talking about what he wants in a client and how he doesn''t work with this type of person and that type of person. I think he knew instantly we weren''t an ideal match, even though we hardly said two words - by the end of the phone call I knew he was right.

I ended up finding someone local to me (through a recommendation) and we worked as a team to come up with the ring design I want. He''s very well known and is extremely talented, so I respected his opinions, but he respected mine too. I changed quite a few things based on his advice - and he modified a few things based on what I wanted. The ring came out beautiful, and we ended up having him design DH''s wedding band too.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 7/26/2008 1:16:40 PM
Author: claudinam
I wouldn''t use Leon. I don''t have the stomach/patience to deal with someone that I can''t feel comfortable saying ''I''d like this a little wider''. Part of it is that I don''t have thick skin - I admire those that do and can deal with pressure and confrontation and whatever else, knowing that in the end they''re going to get something they want. I would just go through so much anxiety, I couldn''t stomach it.

When I was looking to have my own ring designed, I contacted a jeweler often talked about on here - I found him to be too temperamental as well. He spent the whole time on the phone talking about what he wants in a client and how he doesn''t work with this type of person and that type of person. I think he knew instantly we weren''t an ideal match, even though we hardly said two words - by the end of the phone call I knew he was right.

I ended up finding someone local to me (through a recommendation) and we worked as a team to come up with the ring design I want. He''s very well known and is extremely talented, so I respected his opinions, but he respected mine too. I changed quite a few things based on his advice - and he modified a few things based on what I wanted. The ring came out beautiful, and we ended up having him design DH''s wedding band too.

I''d love to hear who that was. And I think others might too, as that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal.

And I''m glad you ended up with something/someone that made you happy!

 

[CJ2008]

I had my stone bought for a WHILE because I had been assuming all along I had found the jeweler I wanted to work with, based on craftsmanship. So when the phone call didn''t go well, I didn''t even know where to look for someone else. It really was great that it happened, though, as that''s the only reason I started asking around for a jeweler local to me - it took a while before settling on the right one, but we are just thrilled with him, and with the rings.

I should have given more thought to saying something about a jeweler and not disclosing who it is...but I think I''d rather keep it that way for now unless one day I choose to post my own experience in purchasing a stone (I used a vendor from PS), setting, etc. I hope that''s OK with you guys.

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 7/26/2008 1:36:00 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 7/26/2008 1:16:40 PM
Author: claudinam
. I think he knew instantly we weren''t an ideal match, even though we hardly said two words - by the end of the phone call I knew he was right.

I''d love to hear who that was. And I think others might too, as that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal.

I think every jeweler can decide what their OWN "main goal" is. For themselves. Just because someone has talent and chooses to offer their services to the public doesn''t mean they are automatically a slave to the whims of that public.

Some doctors want to care for patients individually ... others want to conduct research that challenges THEM intellectually. Some artists paint for their own pleasure, some paint children''s bedrooms for cash. The very best artists in all fields can pick & choose their clients to suit them. Funny how threatened some of you cash-holders are by this.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 7/26/2008 1:53:22 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 7/26/2008 1:36:00 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 7/26/2008 1:16:40 PM
Author: claudinam
. I think he knew instantly we weren''t an ideal match, even though we hardly said two words - by the end of the phone call I knew he was right.

I''d love to hear who that was. And I think others might too, as that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal.

I think every jeweler can decide what their OWN ''main goal'' is. For themselves. Just because someone has talent and chooses to offer their services to the public doesn''t mean they are automatically a slave to the whims of that public.

Some doctors want to care for patients individually ... others want to conduct research that challenges THEM intellectually. Some artists paint for their own pleasure, some paint children''s bedrooms for cash. The very best artists in all fields can pick & choose their clients to suit them. Funny how threatened some of you cash-holders are by this.

Of course they can. But I''d like to know in advance who they are, and what their goal is if I''m shopping around deco. And if their main goal seems to be what type of clients they prefer (as that post seemed to insinuate), I would imagine that''s not the right person for a lot of us. Even Leon, who is what he is, seems to want to turn out stunningly beautiful settings as his main goal.

We have a right as a customer to know who and what we''re dealing with. Why do you seem to have such a problem with that?

I know from reading a lot of your posts how you think, and why you might choose/do what you do, but I don''t comment/question you at every turn. In fact, I don''t comment at all. I just chalk it up to you being an individual with your own views, can you not do the same for us?

I''m not threatened deco, and I doubt anyone else is either. We want to be informed, and there''s absolutely nothing wrong with that. Please don''t read things into something when they''re not there.

 

[decodelighted]

te:[/b] 7/26/2008 2:14:10 PM
Author: Ellen
as that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal.

[/quote]
This speaks for itself. You didn''t say "I don''t want to use someone who''s main goal is picking their clients" ... or even "I want to KNOW if that''s their goal" ... you said that SHOULDN''T be a jeweler''s main goal. And I disagreed with that sentiment.

I have no complaint with full disclosure & knowing exactly who you''re working with beforehand. Seems like the mystery jeweler in question was VERY open about who he is and who he wants to work with.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 7/26/2008 2:28:25 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 7/26/2008 2:14:10 PM
Author: Ellen
as that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal.

This speaks for itself. You didn''t say ''I don''t want to use someone who''s main goal is picking their clients'' ... or even ''I want to KNOW if that''s their goal'' ... you said that SHOULDN''T be a jeweler''s main goal. And I disagreed with that sentiment.

I have no complaint with full disclosure & knowing exactly who you''re working with beforehand. Seems like the mystery jeweler in question was VERY open about who he is and who he wants to work with.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote is not working right, hence the line.


You''re right deco, I didn''t say any of that. I guess I thought my statement would be understood by most, even though I didn''t elaborate on it. I think most would agree that a jeweler with that as their main goal, doesn''t have the right goal in mind. I think most would say that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal, not that it can''t be.

And yeah, the mystery jeweler made things clear on what they want, but I''d like to know who they are. That still remains a mystery.

 

[Eva17]

Date: 7/26/2008 10:01:41 AM
Author: Ellen

Date: 7/26/2008 9:52:54 AM

Author: Eva17

ok, i have been here a long time and i still don''t know how to insert the post i am trying to repond to with the blue box. or how do you hightlight the text in yellow?

Hi Eva!


Hit the reply box right above the post you want to quote/insert. Then hit the quote button. Voila, it should be there!



And thank you, and Skippy, for the very kinds words. They are truly appreciated.

Thanks Skippy

 

[Eva17]

Date: 7/26/2008 10:03:03 AM
Author: Ellen
The Skippers is faster than me.

And thanks to you too Ellen!

 

[Skippy123]

Date: 7/26/2008 3:17:18 PM
Author: Eva17

Date: 7/26/2008 10:03:03 AM
Author: Ellen
The Skippers is faster than me.

And thanks to you too Ellen!

wooo hooo Eva, you did it!

 

[Ellen]

Date: 7/26/2008 3:17:18 PM
Author: Eva17

Date: 7/26/2008 10:03:03 AM
Author: Ellen
The Skippers is faster than me.

And thanks to you too Ellen!

You''re welcome!

 

[Eva17]

Yay, i know it worked....

i learned something new today!

 

[Harriet]

CrookedRock,

On the contrary, Ellen and you had the same experience, to wit, poor customer service. However, your underlying issues are distinct. Ellen''s is a possible breach of the warranty of merchantability, whilst yours is a putative contractual dispute. You yourself stated that the insert was not written in your final work order. Even though you had corresponded with Leon about it, your correspondence is likely inadmissible under the parol evidence rule.

I would not have written my post in legal terms had you not mentioned threatening Leon with legal action. In any case, this thread is about Ellen''s ring, not yours.

 

[Haven]

I''m sorry to read about Ellen''s experience with Mr. Mege, that is really unfortunate. And extremely disappointing.

I do have to say that I agree with Deco, and I would still consider commissioning a ring from Mr. Mege. My ultimate goal would be to have a beautiful piece of jewelry, which I know he is capable of creating. I''m also not scared to push back when someone treats me an an otherwise unfavorable manner.

So for me, it would be okay if we had a bit of friction during the creation process if I ultimately ended up with the piece I truly want.

 

[Ellen]

Date: 7/26/2008 9:48:39 PM
Author: Harriet
CrookedRock,

On the contrary, Ellen and you had the same experience, to wit, poor customer service. However, your underlying issues are distinct. Ellen''s is a possible breach of the warranty of merchantability, whilst yours is a putative contractual dispute. You yourself stated that the insert was not written in your final work order. Even though you had corresponded with Leon about it, your correspondence is likely inadmissible under the parol evidence rule.

I would not have written my post in legal terms had you not mentioned threatening Leon with legal action. In any case, this thread is about Ellen''s ring, not yours.

Actually, it''s about Leon, and whether he''s worth it.

Maybe we should all refrain from further commenting about CR''s experience until she posts about it.

 

[Skippy123]

Date: 7/26/2008 9:48:39 PM
Author: Harriet
CrookedRock,

On the contrary, Ellen and you had the same experience, to wit, poor customer service. However, your underlying issues are distinct. Ellen's is a possible breach of the warranty of merchantability, whilst yours is a putative contractual dispute. You yourself stated that the insert was not written in your final work order. Even though you had corresponded with Leon about it, your correspondence is likely inadmissible under the parol evidence rule.

I would not have written my post in legal terms had you not mentioned threatening Leon with legal action. In any case, this thread is about Ellen's ring, not yours.

*Anyone* can post about their experiences.

 

[Harriet]

Skippers,
Oopsydaisy! When I replied to CR, I mistook this thread for El's original one. Excuse me -- I was at the ILs.

El,
I agree with you on not further commenting on CR's experience with Leon until she has posted her complete account. That's why I asked in my first post (before I got confused) that we not conflate hers with your.

 

[LtlFirecracker]

Date: 7/26/2008 1:53:22 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 7/26/2008 1:36:00 PM
Author: Ellen

Date: 7/26/2008 1:16:40 PM
Author: claudinam
. I think he knew instantly we weren''t an ideal match, even though we hardly said two words - by the end of the phone call I knew he was right.

I''d love to hear who that was. And I think others might too, as that shouldn''t be a jewelers main goal.

I think every jeweler can decide what their OWN ''main goal'' is. For themselves. Just because someone has talent and chooses to offer their services to the public doesn''t mean they are automatically a slave to the whims of that public.

Some doctors want to care for patients individually ... others want to conduct research that challenges THEM intellectually. Some artists paint for their own pleasure, some paint children''s bedrooms for cash. The very best artists in all fields can pick & choose their clients to suit them. Funny how threatened some of you cash-holders are by this.

I have to agree with this. People have their strengths and weeknesses. Many individuals are good at the skill that allows them to make aliving, but have poor people skills. Should they not be allowed to practice what they do best just because they rub people the wrong way?

Different people have different opinions about how someone who does custom work should act. I myself am pretty upset about these stories. Many women here are getting the biggest piece of jewelry in their lives, and want the process to be a positive one. I myeself would be very upset if I received some of the comments you all received. I showed Leon''s site to my BF (who loves high end traditional stuff like antique furniture, mens clothes - has had some pieces custom made). He was very impressed by the quality of the pieces even though he knows nothing about jewelry. I than told him how rude this guy could be and he smiled and said "a true artist, he dosn''t let anyone get in the way of his work." He actually likes that about him????

I guess the point here is education. Know what you are getting into, deicide if you can deal upfront. But every professonal has the right to decide what is important to them. If they are albe to do well in their profession and make a positive contribution, than they are sucessful.

 

[CrookedRock]

Wow... I'm so over this. For some reason Harriet you seem to think it is your job to defend Leon when it comes to my case. Please Stop. I have been through quite enough when it comes to this.

Skippy~ Thank you very much for pointing that out.