Ebola: Do you support mandatory quarantine?

[ame]

I do, because they might be carrying it and not know it. Better safe than sorry.

I kind of have this urge to punch this selfish attention whore who wants a lawyer and to go about infecting the nation after she "selflessly" helped people. If she was so selfless, she wouldn't be batting an eye at a quarantine since she knows full well how infectious this disease is and being such a media whore. Suck it up, deal with it, make 100% sure you don't have the illness and make damn sure you don't spread it around.

 

[kenny]

I do, because they might be carrying it and not know it. Better safe than sorry.

I kind of have this urge to punch this selfish attention whore who wants a lawyer and to go about infecting the nation after she "selflessly" helped people. If she was so selfless, she wouldn't be batting an eye at a quarantine since she knows full well how infectious this disease is and being such a media whore. Suck it up, deal with it, make 100% sure you don't have the illness and make damn sure you don't spread it around.

+1

I am so disgusted with that nurse.
Shame on her.

And about testing negative being any argument for being allowed to wander free during your 3-week incubation period ...
Perhaps you test negative until you test positive, just like you don't have symptoms till you do.

 

[ame]

I do, because they might be carrying it and not know it. Better safe than sorry.

I kind of have this urge to punch this selfish attention whore who wants a lawyer and to go about infecting the nation after she "selflessly" helped people. If she was so selfless, she wouldn't be batting an eye at a quarantine since she knows full well how infectious this disease is and being such a media whore. Suck it up, deal with it, make 100% sure you don't have the illness and make damn sure you don't spread it around.

+1

I am so disgusted with that nurse.
Shame on her.

And about testing negative being any argument for being allowed to wander free during your 3-week incubation period ...
Perhaps you test negative until you test positive, just like you don't have symptoms till you do.

That's exactly it. Everyone else thus far didn't immediately test positive, and didn't immediately have symptoms. It takes time. Why in the hell would you risk it? When I heard about the lab tech that got on a cruise ship, I lost my sh!t. You knowingly were exposing other people to this disease in the first place, but in a confined area?! WHY?! Because you might lose your deposit? What about all the other people who paid the money to go on this trip who didn't deserve that exposure who also paid, and who also lost out on several ports that refused the ship after finding out your selfish a$$ was on board? What is wrong with people?! YOU ARE NOT A HERO just because you tried to help someone with this disease if you go out and risk spreading it around.

 

[kenny]

BTW fear, like judging, is wise.

 

[Calliecake]

I think - and this is while supporting the mandatory quarantine, mind (though, like TGal, I note that there is a need for some infrastructure before it's a firm policy - that the objection is partially financial. If you're quarantined, you can't work, and a 3-week hiatus can cause quite a gap in people's budgets. At that point, you're less volunteering your time and more experiencing a penalty for it (a nice illustration of the adage that no good deed goes unpunished). The question then becomes who's responsible for picking up the tab on that ... the state? The organization spearheading the philanthropic effort? The individual's insurance? If ever anything could be considered an act of God, historically one would assume it would be plague, but ....

Again, though, if you have the ability to budget both time and financial resources for volunteering in the first place, then why not budget in the total time (including the time for quarantine)?
Don't get me wrong, I think that it's awesome that people are willing to volunteer their time for the cause, but complaining about quarantine when you've literally put your life on the line with this sort of work, seems pretty silly - don't you think? Why would you even want to risk exposing others (upon returning home), especially when you've worked so hard to help those already affected? None of that makes any sense to me...

I don't understand the objection to being quarantined. If you have been there and seen first hand how awful this disease is wouldn't you want to do everything possible to keep your own family and friends safe from the same disease.

 

[ame]

Seriously! I don't really get her argument, it's hollow, considering she's got first hand experience AND is a nurse. Why should should get somehow different treatment? All I keep thinking is that she didn't go to really help people, she went to say she helped people because she knew it would get her tons of attention.

 

[zoebartlett]

Seriously! I don't really get her argument, it's hollow, considering she's got first hand experience AND is a nurse. Why should should get somehow different treatment? All I keep thinking is that she didn't go to really help people, she went to say she helped people because she knew it would get her tons of attention.

Ame, come on, really? Kaci Hickox has first hand experience, as you said. She's treated people with Ebola, and she understands the disease.

 

[lyra]

Seriously! I don't really get her argument, it's hollow, considering she's got first hand experience AND is a nurse. Why should should get somehow different treatment? All I keep thinking is that she didn't go to really help people, she went to say she helped people because she knew it would get her tons of attention.

Her argument is the inhumane way in which she was treated. I don't know WHY, but I somehow envisioned that mandatory quarantine would either be in your own home with armed guards maybe, or in a hospital isolation ward. I certainly never thought what it would ACTUALLY amount to was being placed in a tent outside the hospital, with a chemical toilet and bottled water. How is that supposed to in any way be adequate care? How is that an atmosphere in which one could even remain hygienic over a 21 day period? Can you bleach a tent daily?

Quarantine could be done in the home. It's more likely to work that way, and be accepted by people. Twice daily medical checks would pick up anything before it could actually affect anyone else. At least it's humane.

 

[Calliecake]

The nurse that has been ordered to home quarantine is saying she may defy the order and leave her home. I think examples like this are reason mandatory quarantines are even being discussed. It's too much for this nurse to stay in her home for 21 days. This woman seems so arrogant to me.

 

[ame]

The nurse that has been ordered to home quarantine is saying she may defy the order and leave her home. I think examples like this are reason mandatory quarantines are even being discussed. It's too much for this nurse to stay in her home for 21 days. This woman seems so arrogant to me.

THIS. Yes I do think a tent OUTSIDE a hospital is the wrong path. She should've been in her home or in an isolation ward IN the hospital. But defying any quarantine at all is the problem I have with her, not the "inhumanity of her treatment." I get the sense from how she speaks that she'd be this big of a nightmare regardless. She has been there, and she knows how infectious it is which is why she should be willing to be in quarantine, in her home or in a facility (I agree not a tent) and not putting up such a ridiculous fight that instead looks like an attention grab, "oh poor me, I went to help these people and now I have to decontaminate"! She is coming across as incredibly arrogant, and seems to think she's somehow above it all and that somehow our medical teams and every single facility is prepared to deal with it, and they're not. She (and that idiot NBC doctor) is precisely the reason that a mandatory quarantine should exist.

 

[lyra]

The nurse that has been ordered to home quarantine is saying she may defy the order and leave her home. I think examples like this are reason mandatory quarantines are even being discussed. It's too much for this nurse to stay in her home for 21 days. This woman seems so arrogant to me.

THIS. Yes I do think a tent OUTSIDE a hospital is the wrong path. She should've been in her home or in an isolation ward IN the hospital. But defying any quarantine at all is the problem I have with her, not the "inhumanity of her treatment." I get the sense from how she speaks that she'd be this big of a nightmare regardless. She has been there, and she knows how infectious it is which is why she should be willing to be in quarantine, in her home or in a facility (I agree not a tent) and not putting up such a ridiculous fight that instead looks like an attention grab, "oh poor me, I went to help these people and now I have to decontaminate"! She is coming across as incredibly arrogant, and seems to think she's somehow above it all and that somehow our medical teams and every single facility is prepared to deal with it, and they're not. She (and that idiot NBC doctor) is precisely the reason that a mandatory quarantine should exist.

I agree Ame. Sorry if my quoting you may have given you the impression that I was singling you out. Nope. Not at all. I appreciate everyone's opinions.

I'm wary of not having the actual details of what's going on with Kaci. I'd rather watch her in an interview or something, because no, I really don't understand why she's making a scene out of this. Well, I suppose it could be money and fame, right? Otherwise, she could have served out her quarantine at home and gone on to be applauded perhaps, or at the least, just forgotten about and able to carry on her life in peace.

I believe she has only 10 days left out of 21. I have no idea what it's like psychologically, to be quarantined, or under pressure from the media and lawyers and the world at the same time. Losing one's personal liberties must be pretty tough to handle when you're a law abiding citizen on your native soil.

 

[zoebartlett]

So anyone returning from west Africa after treating patients with Ebola should be quarantined? How do you explain the health care workers who were just at the White House (within the 21 day quarantine period), receiving praise from President Obama? How are they different from Kaci Hickox, who again, was not and is not symptomatic, yet was put in a tent and then sent home and told to stay there?

She's told that she'll be arrested if she leaves home. She'll become part of the court system at that point. How is that beneficial to anyone? She hasn't done anything wrong but she's made to feel that way. For those questioning why she's making a big deal out of this, it's because she's a free person, but not really, right? If you were Kaci Hickox, how would you feel about the way you had been treated?

How would quarantining health care workers work financially and logistically? All of these people miss 3 weeks of work when they get home and someone mentioned earlier, who pays for that? Of COURSE this affects the number of people volunteering to travel to west Africa.

 

[ksinger]

So anyone returning from west Africa after treating patients with Ebola should be quarantined? How do you explain the health care workers who were just at the White House (within the 21 day quarantine period), receiving praise from President Obama? How are they different from Kaci Hickox, who again, was not and is not symptomatic, yet was put in a tent and then sent home and told to stay there?

She's told that she'll be arrested if she leaves home. She'll become part of the court system at that point. How is that beneficial to anyone? She hasn't done anything wrong but she's made to feel that way. For those questioning why she's making a big deal out of this, it's because she's a free person, but not really, right? If you were Kaci Hickox, how would you feel about the way you had been treated?

How would quarantining health care workers work financially and logistically? All of these people miss 3 weeks of work when they get home and someone mentioned earlier, who pays for that? Of COURSE this affects the number of people volunteering to travel to west Africa.

Yeah. I've been thinking about that a bit myself. The only people here who could nonchalantly say "Well, she should just cool her jets for3 weeks because what's the big deal", are clearly those who don't have to worry about those pesky things called bills or paychecks.

I think it will affect the ranks of the willing for certain. Last year the government had furloughs for a month. I'm sure those who were not involved thought it was inconsequential and were disdainful that federal employees DID get back pay for that time. One thing that those same people probably do not know however, is that along with the federal employees, an even larger number of federal contractors were also furloughed (in some cases simply outright fired) and when they did come back, they did NOT get back pay of any kind. And what resulted? In a manner of a few months there was a quiet mass exodus of people who were fed up with being treated like crap and worrying about a steady paycheck. The fed has not recovered yet from that blow.

So yeah, human nature being what it is, I see treating returning health care workers like pariahs as a self-defeating strategy.

 

[momhappy]

^If you're already volunteering your time - then you've already budgeted to for the the lack of pay. If quarantine is mandated as part of service, then budget for the whole darn time (and lack of pay) or don't dedicate yourself to the cause in the first place.
Are you suggesting then that those who've returned from that line of service should just go right back to their jobs? Would you seriously want her to have the ability to go back to nursing immediately upon her return
After seeing her on the news multiple times, I am convinced that this is about attention. She seems to think that she's so darn special...

 

[missy]

^If you're already volunteering your time - then you've already budgeted to for the the lack of pay. If quarantine is mandated as part of service, then budget for the whole darn time (and lack of pay) or don't dedicate yourself to the cause in the first place.
Are you suggesting then that those who've returned from that line of service should just go right back to their jobs? Would you seriously want her to have the ability to go back to nursing immediately upon her return
After seeing her on the news multiple times, I am convinced that this is about attention. She seems to think that she's so darn special...

I have to agree. She doesn't seem very altruistic at all and one wonders why she even went to West Africa in the first place. She seems pretty darned selfish IMO and yes arrogant as others have written. Yeah a tent outside the hospital is foolish but at the time health and government officials are just doing the best they can and learning as they go. Her over reaction is extreme and unwarranted and not behavior complimentary to someone who supposedly cares about the welfare of others.

 

[momhappy]

^Yes, that's how I felt about the tent too. It's not like every hospital has a protocol for this exact scenario - like you said, we are learning as we go. The tent was not ideal, and I'm sure that it sucked for her, but they probably did the best they could and they are probably working to improve the system.

 

[tyty333]

^If you're already volunteering your time - then you've already budgeted to for the the lack of pay. If quarantine is mandated as part of service, then budget for the whole darn time (and lack of pay) or don't dedicate yourself to the cause in the first place.
Are you suggesting then that those who've returned from that line of service should just go right back to their jobs? Would you seriously want her to have the ability to go back to nursing immediately upon her return
After seeing her on the news multiple times, I am convinced that this is about attention. She seems to think that she's so darn special...

+1

I would in no way want her working on me or a member of my family until we were absolutely sure that she was Ebola free
(21 days).

I think the tent thing really stinks and wish they had a better facility to quarantine her in but I don't think she would have been
happy in a 5 star hotel.

 

[Calliecake]

^If you're already volunteering your time - then you've already budgeted to for the the lack of pay. If quarantine is mandated as part of service, then budget for the whole darn time (and lack of pay) or don't dedicate yourself to the cause in the first place.
Are you suggesting then that those who've returned from that line of service should just go right back to their jobs? Would you seriously want her to have the ability to go back to nursing immediately upon her return
After seeing her on the news multiple times, I am convinced that this is about attention. She seems to think that she's so darn special...

+1

I would in no way want her working on me or a member of my family until we were absolutely sure that she was Ebola free
(21 days).

I think the tent thing really stinks and wish they had a better facility to quarantine her in but I don't think she would have been
happy in a 5 star hotel.

I totally agree with you. I don't think anything would make this woman happy. She is at home now and threatening to break quaratine. I'm starting to think she's just a fame whore (I know, I also hate the word). I don't understand how she could have so little regard for anyone but herself. The doctor who was hospitalized showed everyone that even if this risk is small, there is still a risk. How can she be so arrogant have so little regards for others. In all honestly if there were only a 1 percent chance that I could possibly be infected and pass this disease on to someone I would gladly sit in my home for 21 days. I think it's a small price to pay for the safety of others. I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for my comment. I'm sincerely sorry if I've offended anyone. I do realized she did a wonderful thing helping in Africa but it doesn't change my opinion that she is being a jerk now. I also can't imagine a hospital would want her seeing patients until the possibility of her infecting others is completely gone.

 

[TC1987]

I can understand why Kaci would be feeling a little slighted that a doctor gets sent to Bellevue but a nurse gets a tent on a lawn in Newark. That even makes me livid. But Dang, Kaci, just be gracious and cool your jets at home in Maine and stop making a spectacle of yourself. There is much that we don't know about ebola. Pets are quarantined when they move from country to country. Livestock are quarantined in some cases, jut to move from auction or farm to another farm. Quarantines of people were implemented, strictly enforced, and cooperated with during the polio epidemics of the '40s and '50s. So what is so d--mned difficult about staying home for 21 days. It's not a soul-crushing defeat or anything! There are just too many people nowadays that think that rules don't ever apply to them.

 

[Calliecake]

Kaci Hickox is now out riding her bike and has defied the home quarantine. And people wonder why mandatory quarantine is being discussed?

 

[packrat]

We are an entitled, selfish lot, and we allow ourselves to be this way. If you go somewhere, do something, that comes w/risks, then you need to suck it up and deal w/what happens b/c of YOUR choices. But, when we allow someone to thumb his/her nose at us as far as safety for the numbers at large are concerned, well...

 

[lyra]

Well yes, she does have an entitled attitude at this point. It's probably, likely, all without merit anyway. I don't think she has ebola. She is definitely not symptomatic at this point, which means she's not contagious, which means she's not currently endangering anyone. However, her actions are only making people want mandatory quarantine even more. Why not show that she isn't/wasn't a threat at all? As in, okay, I will do the silly at home quarantine quietly, and others will see it was pointless anyway. The way she's acting makes her look unprofessional at the least. Shaking my head at this one.

If it were me, I would have voluntarily just quietly stayed at home, no fuss. Her initial treatment at the hospital was very wrong.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

An infectious disease conference is going to be held in Louisiana. Ebola was on the agenda to be discussed by Dr.s who had first hand knowledge of working with the disease. These Dr.s, have been dis-invited to the conference. They must be past the 21 day incubation period to be allowed to come. The Louisiana Health Dept issued this to the conference and they complied without complaint.

It is hard for some people to make it on their paychecks. I think the Docs will survive the 3 weeks not earning, and nurses, in this country have come a long way, un-like teachers. If you can go away for 3-6 months I think you have prepared your finances before you leave. Do you think our volunteers have never thought that may contract the disease?. There are Drs over in Africa who have contracted it. Why does this woman think she is immune?

It is a shame to take the conversation away from the need for a vaccine to this womans so called "right" to go freely on her way. Where do people get these ideas about their rights? Someone of course will answer the "Constitution you idiot." You have the freedom to and the Freedom from, of course with their differing meanings. It is not a one way street, and lawyers that i heard last evening say that usually judges will rule for the Public Health Dept, over any indivual rights. As it should be.

Maybe the Science will become clearer, and we will all relax. Until then I suggest we stay on the vigil.
Lets get that vaccine. It makes me feel better to write it.

Annette

 

[kenny]

Kaci Hickox is now out riding her bike and has defied the home quarantine. And people wonder why mandatory quarantine is being discussed?

Unbelievable!

 

[movie zombie]

she certainly makes it hard to convince Africans they need to be quarantined when she herself refuses to comply.
a good example she is NOT.

 

[zoebartlett]

^If you're already volunteering your time - then you've already budgeted to for the the lack of pay. If quarantine is mandated as part of service, then budget for the whole darn time (and lack of pay) or don't dedicate yourself to the cause in the first place.
Are you suggesting then that those who've returned from that line of service should just go right back to their jobs? Would you seriously want her to have the ability to go back to nursing immediately upon her return
After seeing her on the news multiple times, I am convinced that this is about attention. She seems to think that she's so darn special...

I have to agree. She doesn't seem very altruistic at all and one wonders why she even went to West Africa in the first place. She seems pretty darned selfish IMO and yes arrogant as others have written. Yeah a tent outside the hospital is foolish but at the time health and government officials are just doing the best they can and learning as they go. Her over reaction is extreme and unwarranted and not behavior complimentary to someone who supposedly cares about the welfare of others.

I don't know why but I'm so surprised we can watch the same interviews and see the same thing, but we get completely different impressions. I don't see Kaci Hickox as arrogant at all. I see her as one really pissed off person for the way she was treated, and I don't blame her at all for feeling that way.

As for returning to work immediately afterwards, I have no idea how that's handled. When I travel, I like to have a day or two when I get home to decompress and get caught up with my family and everyday life again before returning to work. I've never gone on missions before like health care workers traveling overseas though. I would imagine they'd have built in a few days for that, but who knows. I'd follow my organization's policy, if there is one, for returning to my job after doing such work. Again, I don't know what the standard routine is, but I'm interested to find out.

 

[kenny]

I don't know why but I'm so surprised we can watch the same interviews and see the same thing, but we get completely different impressions.

You just said a mouthful and summed up the reason for Kenny's People Vary campaign.

It is perfectly okay to have a different opinion, even if it is different from 99.99999999% of other's.

I reject the idea that there is one right way that everyone must arrive at, fight for, impose upon others, unless we are talking about things like what 2+2 equals.

It is also a reason I sometimes just drop out of threads.
At some point there's just no point in arguing back and forth any more.

 

[kenny]

Our nurse says she tested negative twice so she doesn't have Ebola and shouldn't be in quarantine.

Someone needs to tell her that if she IS carrying Ebola the blood test can't even find it this early in her 21-day incubation period.
If she is carrying the virus her blood test results will change from negative to positive when symptoms appear.

SNIP:
In an ideal world, health care workers returning from West Africa would get a quick blood test to prove they aren't carrying the Ebola virus.
A test like that would likely put to rest some of the anxiety surrounding these doctors, nurses and scientists.

Unfortunately, even the best blood test in the world can't do that.
The test uses a technology called PCR, for polymerase chain reaction.
It can detect extraordinarily small traces of genetic material from the Ebola virus.

But the catch is, the test is usually used on blood samples.
And in the beginning, that's not where the Ebola virus hides.
"The initial sites of replication actually are not in the blood itself — they're mostly in tissues like spleen or liver," says Thomas Geisbert, a microbiologist at the University of Texas Medical Branch in Galveston.
It's not practical to sample these organs to look for Ebola.

But the virus doesn't stay there forever, Geisbert explains.
As the infection grows, virus particles are gradually released into the blood, as well.
And as soon as a small amount of virus ends up in the blood, PCR will detect it.
It can find one or two virus particles in a drop of blood.
That concentration is so low, Geisbert says, that an infected person's body fluids pose a minuscule risk to others at that stage.

The problem is, that can change pretty quickly.
"As the disease progresses, and people start to get sick," he says, "in that same small drop of blood [there can be] 100 particles — or a thousand particles."
That's the point when body fluids do pose a risk.
It's also the moment when the infected person starts to feel sick.
"You're going to start to detect the virus at about the same time you're going to have clinical signs of disease," Geisbert says.

So — sensitive as the PCR test is — it doesn't reliably give you much advance warning that a person is infected.
On the plus side, this pattern of infection also explains why people infected with Ebola aren't a risk to others until they actually fall ill with symptoms.

Source: http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2014/10/28/359567808/blood-test-for-ebola-doesnt-catch-infection-early

 

[packrat]

If I were treated like shit, and I don't know what the deal is, she was in a tent or something? So, ok, a Dr gets million dollar treatment and she gets to live in a tent, yep, I agree, that's not fair. It's also not fair for homeless military veterans to live under bridges, and I guess were I in her shoes, and after having waged war on disease and strife for my fellow man in a poor country as tho I were a selfless person of great compassion and empathy, I'd continue to exhibit that great compassion and empathy for my fellow man when I came back to my country. That's just me tho. I could possibly go the other direction and fling myself about the general population with no regard to anyone else but myself too. I'm sure parents would like it if I came back from country where I could possibly have contracted a disease and couldn't deign myself to make sure I wasn't infected, just go on about my preschool beeswax, taking care of the ole young'uns and such, cuz eh who cares, I have RIGHTS.

I'm about half disgusted and sick to death w/our whine baby pee pants woe is me gawd it's so hard to be meeeeee mentality we have going on nowadays. It gets old real fast.

 

[kenny]

I wonder if they'll do a SNL skit on her?

There's so much potential for comedic material in how 'Nurse Wretched' has behaved.