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akw94

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Well, I''m not feeling too good today. My bf and I have had a few emails back and forth lately and he mentioned that this relationship feels differently than others b/c of various things..one of which being he didn''t feel as rushed to make the decision. So I ask him what decision? To get married? To propose? When to propose? He says the decision to get married and to propose, b/c he sees both things as being the same decision.
So now I have gotten myself so upset. Maybe I''m reading too much into it but he still is making the decision to get married??? We''ve talked about rings and timelines and moving out of state in 2-3 years together, all premised on us getting married. We''re in the midst of buying a place together. So how has he not made that decision? I don''t understand. So I sent him a short email back saying that I really didn''t understand. That it feels like maybe we''re not thinking the same way and I don''t understand all the plans we''ve made/we''re making if he isn''t even sure about getting married yet. I also said I''d like to talk about it in person later this evening.
Now, I have an entire day at work and am already in tears. Not to mention I''ve been pretty emotional the last few days about various things so this has topped it off, I guess.
Does it sound like i''m over-reacting or have reason to worry?

And I''m actually supposed to work today???
 
Please, please, PLEASE do not discuss this sort of heavy relationship stuff over email. It needs a real conversation. You don''t know how he is actually feeling through just his writing. Maybe he doesn''t feel pressured since he knows you are the one and you have done such extensive planning already.

Talk to him. Face to face. Not over email or IM.
 
oh dixie, I feel for you. My bf is also feeling pressured from me, but from my vantage point, we''ve been together so long and basically playing "house", how can he move forward in those areas and get stuck on something so basic?

I would be concerned too if I were you and you are definitely in the right. How on earth can he make all those plans, especially buying a home together without coming to terms with the marriage issue?? It makes no sense! Of course you''re going to be pressuring him a bit, you''re investing a lot by building a life together, you want to know soon if it''s all for a long term commitment/marriage.
Today will be a short day (everyone leaves early for long wkend), so hang in there and try to hold back the tears. Makes sense to talk to him tonight. I just wanted to say that I can relate and stick up for yourself tonight but don''t attack (which I tend to do). Keep us posted and stay strong
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i agree that all serious discussions should be held in person. But i also think that email can serve some purpose to kick off discussions. I find I can express myself better in writing (less emotional, won''t turn into crying blubbering mess as easily). And my bf is not so good with communicating ..so writing is another form to take a stab at with.
 
it''s hard for us to conceive, but men have spent their entire lives thinking of marriage as a sort of inevitable prison. The End Of Fun. the ball and chain metaphor does not come from nowhere! women, on the other hand, are trained that their wedding day should be the most important day of their lives. after 28 years on this planet, i''ve reached the conclusion that it''s an insurmountable ideological gulf. the good part about this, is that men treat the proposal as tantamount to marriage - the ring is as desicive as the vow. women, on the other hand, tend to get wrapped up in wedding planning, rings, etc., and freak out later. the point here is that once a man buys that ring, he is done. stick a fork in him. he will not have second thoughts, he will not have moments of doubt, most likely.

at least, this is what i''m trying to convince myself - because i''m in the same position as many of you! i live with my bf, we''re in our late 20s, i get constant interrogations from friends and family. but i''m trying so hard to suppress my snide remarks. i love him, and i know we''re both in it for the long haul. we both have a potent fear of divorce. i too would love to plan a fall ''07 wedding, but i don''t want him to slide a ring on my finger because he wants to shut me up. i''m just trying to be zen about it!
 
Some interesting and eye-opening opinions here!

I'm a woman and I too feel that the decision to marry and propose are the same decision. I would have thought everyone felt this way. How are they two different decisions? I can't imagine proposing to someone, or accepting a proposal, if I hadn't decided I definitely wanted to marry the guy.

>>How on earth can he make all those plans, especially buying a home together without coming to terms with the marriage issue?? <<

I don't understand how this can be seen as the guy "making all those plans." You can't plan to buy a house with another person without that person being in total agreement, can you? I mean, how do you force someone to buy a house with you against her will? So shouldn't always.waiting's question be posed to dixie94, not her boyfriend?

"How on earth can SHE make all those plans, especially buying a home together without coming to terms with the marriage issue??"

Maybe he's OK with joint ownership with someone who isn't his spouse. There's nothing wrong with that if that's what they *both* want. Dixie, if it's not what you want, why on earth are you going along with it?
 
Date: 9/1/2006 11:55:54 AM
Author: AceP
, but i don't want him to slide a ring on my finger because he wants to shut me up. i'm just trying to be zen about it!
Click to expand...

AMEN!!! Ladies, I'm speaking from experience here. My bf and I dated for a few months. He started talking marriage. I got all excited, anxious, wondering when, let down, you guys know the whole routine. So I put some pressure on him to propose. He proposed to me after a fight. It stained the relationship until the very end. In fact, one of the last conversations we had before the divorce was about if he really wanted to marry me. His answer, no. It ultimately ended in divorce.

It's VERY easy to get caught up in the moment, in rings, and weddings, and wanting to built a life with someone. But BELIEVE ME, having been there, don't put so much pressure on them. After the excitement goes away, and married life begins, that will haunt you. You'll wonder if he WANTED to do it, or if he was so pressured he was forced. And you'll start to feel bad about it. I did so much, that I let my guy treat me poorly because I felt guilty that he married me. I let him walk all over me. NO ONE should have to feel that way.

I know it's tough waiting, but trust me, you don't want that burden on your relationship!! Been there, and now divorced, partly because of it.

I'm lucky enough to be getting a second chance with the man of my dreams. I have vowed to myself that I will not pressure him. In fact, he was the first to mention marriage. And how ever long it takes, I'm willing to wait. I want to know that he's ready.

Everyone feels differently and more passionately about things than others. I'm just trying to help you guys avoid the same terrible mistake that I made.

Oh, by the way, just wanted to say that I'm sorry for what you are going through Dixie. I hope it works out for the best. I hope it was a misunderstanding, and you guys can talk and work though it.
 
oh dixie sorry to hear that you are so upset....but i agree with AP...don't discuss this any further via email. tell him you want to talk about it tonite. and try not to freak out. maybe you two just need a good heart to heart communication session with everything out on the table. sometimes men cannot get their thoughts across coherently and especially not via email, i know sometimes they can be short with the communication. in any case, TRY to put it out of your mind today...and good luck tonite. i would say that for me the most important thing about what he said was that the relationship feels different. that's more interesting to me than the fact he is questioning things. because it sounds like he may be Q'ing things because things feel different, and maybe that is the root, so i'd explore that more for sure. in any case....good luck!! and try not to worry.
 
Thanks everyone! I am trying to remain calm and not obsess too much but it really is tough!
Amanda, I agree about the email thing. All too often I discuss how I feel over email and I know it''s not the best way. I did just write something short to him so he''ll have know what I want to talk about and said that I really would like to talk in person.
Always and Maria, thank you! I shortened my email to him a lot just so that he wouldn''t feel like I was trying to attack him. I''m not trying to pressure him or make him feel pushed into an engagement, but I do need to understand his thoughts. I need to know that we are on the same page, and I truly thought we were until now.
I agree that it''s not him making all the decisions. We have made all the past/present decisions together. That''s why I''m so shaken by what he said. And we''ve both said that all of our plans are predicate on marriage. Living together w/the plan of marriage, moving together in a couple years only if we''re already married... So to hear him now say he hasn''t decided to get married, I just don''t understand. Then what have all of our conversations been about? I don''t feel like I''m going along w/something I don''t want b/c it was always my understanding that we would get married in the next couple of years. That''s my concern. All of a sudden I feel like something has changed and I was never told.
Ace, I think you''re right. All of this is sort of one big thing to him. He would be fine w/getting engaged, getting married and moving w/in the same few months. I want the time in between each step. And I also agree that I really don''t want him to propose just b/c of any statements that I make. He knows that I wouldn''t want him to do it until he''s ready. I don''t expect a proposal right now. But I don''t understand him not having made a decision to get married given all of our prior talks.
cRaSh, thank you for the advice! I appreciate it and work hard at not getting too caught up in the proposal aspects. I am trying to be patient, and I feel that I rarely bring it up. I would never want him to feel forced. But I do need to know that our thoughts are similar. That I''m not the only one wanting marriage w/in this period of time. We have made a lot of plans and I just can''t keep making those plans or expecting them to happen if he really isn''t ready for that. And quite honestly, I''m not sure I can get a place w/him if he doesn''t know that he wants to be married.

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Mara, thanks for the thoughts! Actually, I started the whole feeling different thing by mentioning to him that our relationship felt different from ones in the past, in a very good way, having thoughts of marriage, etc... I asked him if it felt different to him (b/c he''s already been married and likely had similar thoughts) and then he replied that it did also. He also said that regarding marriage, when he made the decision it wouldn''t feel as rushed. So that part was good. It was when he specified making the decision to get married that upset me so much. I just can''t imagine that we are where we are in our relationship if that decision was not already made.
Hopefully we will get to talk tonight.
 
dixie, don't forget...BOYS do not think like girls. he may just have mentioned the 'decision to get married' just as a phrase or something that popped into his head, it does not mean he is questioning it!! i know it's a girl's tendency to read volumes into one line, we all do it....but the poor guy just probably wrote down something, maybe mindlessly, maybe he was doing something else at work too (multi-tasking for boys, always a no no!!!!) and it came out wrong ...whatever. in any case, i wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be a big fat nothing when you talk about it tonite. but yes, don't be defensive, don't be accusatory...he may be totally clueless!!
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Good point Mara! Now, I just have to figure out how to talk to him and what to say so that I don''t over-react. I really just want to know what his thoughts are, what he wants, w/o pushing him to give specific dates. To know that we''re feeling the same way and that our plans are OUR plans, not his or mine separately.
What a day!
 
Aww Dixie, I feel for you. I think he said "decision to get married" as in "decision to get married NOW!" I think a lot of people know about things they want to do (and who they want to do it with) but the actual moment to take the leap is still a big decision. Not so much as the intention to do it, but to decide if all the factors and timing are lined up so he can propose. Hang in there! And stay away from any more email decisions. It''s so easy to interpret feelings/emotions on IM or email!
 
Date: 9/1/2006 11:26:58 AM
Author: always.waiting
oh dixie, I feel for you. My bf is also feeling pressured from me, but from my vantage point, we've been together so long and basically playing 'house', how can he move forward in those areas and get stuck on something so basic?
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Click to expand...

I definitely understand that, my bf and I have been living together for a year and he said to me the other day he doesn't even think of the word wedding because it's so far off in the future! He doesn't want to marry me, but he does want me to play wife and cook for him, clean for him, and basically be married to him without the commitment. I just need to think about how long I'm willing to wait in this situation. It feels a bit unfair to me, because he's been married before, he married his first wife after only a couple of months together. It ended badly, and I know that's part of the reason why he has reservations about marriage. But I can't help but feel this way, because a big part of me thinks that he might never be ready for marriage again and he just wants me to go along with that and be happy just living together. This is the man of my dreams and I want nothing more than to be with him, but I do want to get married. I want that commitment. We talked about marriage early on in the relationship and now as we've been together longer and things got very serious and stable, it's like he realized it was imminent. I don't know, I'm rambling.
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Sometimes I really don't understand men. They want everything a relationship has to offer and make plans for everything but don't even think to think about marriage. My boyfriend is the same way, he's very impulsive and makes plans for us years into the future, and then tells me something like that!

I'm sorry, but I really needed to vent, his comment has been on my mind since he said it a few weeks ago.

I agree that you should definitely talk in person, emails aren't a great way to have a serious conversation. Hang in there for the rest of the workday and try to be as calm as possible tonight when you guys are talking. I really hope everything goes well tonight.

Sorry for the long post
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i have to agree with mara here - he may be STUNNED at how much you read into his email statement. it could have been intended completely differently than how you interpreted it, e.g., he really respects you because you haven''t been laying the pressure on, etc. - that he''s happy you haven''t made him feel rushed. so take a deep breath, remember that men do not analyze before they speak, and keep us updated!
 
Ally, what you said makes sense. I guess it seems odd to me that there''s some moment that he''s waiting for, if that''s the case. Does one just all of a sudden realize they want/are ready to be married? I do think that once he feels ready, he''ll take action quickly after but it does worry me that he could be waiting for some big lightbulb moment, rather than relying on his feelings or the plans that we''ve made.

LyBug, sorry your bf made that comment to you. I would be hurt by that too. Sometimes they just don''t think of our feelings before speaking. That is aggravating and can be painful. My bf was married before too, so although I''m glad he feels good about our relationship, he''s already said that in the past, he likely would''ve proposed by now. Great.
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I have been somewhat ok w/everything until this recent statement b/c I thought we had a general agreeement. Now, just not so sure. Don''t worry, long posts are always ok!!

AceP, you''re probably right too. He usually is a bit shocked at my interpretations of his statements. I guess that is the problem w/email. He''s doing virtually no analysis and I can''t stop analyzing!

Well, now I''m a little worried about his take on my email. It''s such an emotional topic for me. I wish sometimes that I could not take everything so seriously, but I haven''t yet figured out how to do that.
I do think that a part of me is feeling very vulnerable right now, the more serious we do get so it''s pretty scary to feel so shaken at this point in our relationship.
 
Dixie: Well I''m talking from personal experience because I''ve REALLY struggled with this whole marriage thing. I''ve been with my boyfriend for 10 YEARS! Since I was 16 years old, and I knew from the time I was 20 that I would marry him *one day* and the years passed. I was in school, he was in school, we both knew we would ONE DAY get engaged. Then I turned 24 and dsicovered that my boyfriend had made steps to buy a ring, and was planning to propose on our anniversary. I FREAKED out completely! Crying, nightmares etc., because, while it''s something that I always *knew* would happen, the actual reality is this really big, grown up moment. And I REALLY wasn''t ready because at that time my life wasn''t in the right place and I wasn''t expecting it. Lots of hurt feelings on his part, we almost break up. Proposal postphoned. And a year later, I have time to get used to the idea of being a grown up, analyze it etc. And then I''m ready. We pick out a ring together, and get engaged.....now actual wedding...there''s a similar process going on right now. What can I say...I''m not a creature that likes change
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So what I''m saying is that he might need time to adjust to the moment, because it''s big and at least you KNOW it''s something he takes seriously. And at this moment you are buying a house together (BIG PURCHASE) and maybe he just needs a little time to adjust to that change before jumping into another one. It sounds to me that without a doubt you two are building a life together, and that''s the foundation of marriage. As long as your clear about your expectations and he''s clear about his intentions, he''ll come through.

And I don''t think people have a very clear lightbulb moment. Aha! I want to be married. I think with most couples, it''s a process that involves timing, discussion etc. I feel that it''s very similar to maturing. No one wakes up one morning and they are suddenly an adult. And I think rarely do guys have this fantastic revelation that they want to be married. They might need a kick in the butt once their decision is made up to go through with it. But I honestly think most guys that are in relationships know if they are going to marry (or are in potentailly marriageable relationships) I have lots of guys friends. I ask. And they tell me. Sometimes it''s "No", sometimes it''s "yes" But I can tell you that rarely will a guy buy a house with a girl when he has absolutely NO INTENTION of marrying her (unless he''s one of those guys that doesn''t believe in marriage and has so stated)

Sorry for the ramble. Hugs! Feel better and keep us updated!
 
Ally,
Thank you! I appreciated your words and I think sometimes I just get nervous and impatient and definitely read way more into what he says than he intended. It can be hard not to though.
Anyway, we did talk that Friday evening. He was upset b/c he said I didn''t really read what he said and took it in a way that he didn''t mean. For me, I guess I didn''t really understand what he was saying b/c it was a very different perspective than my own so I then misunderstood his intention.
What he did explain is that he does want all the things we''ve talked about but doesn''t ever feel comfortable putting a guarantee on something. So he won''t say to me that positively we will get married b/c things do happen and he doesn''t want to take the relationship for granted. He said that he does want the same things and sees them in our future, but until he proposes, the actually decision to marry is not made. They are one in the same for him. I guess we just see things a little differently but have the same overall view. I think he was also hurt that I doubted that his intentions were serious and that I said I felt he was unsure. He said he is NOT unsure and wouldn''t be talking/making the plans that we''re making if he was.
So, I guess it''s one of those guy vs. girl perspective things. They can be awfully tough to understand sometimes. The one big lesson for me was to stop emailing this sort of stuff. I really have to just get up the courage and talk about it.
Thank you so much! I really feel better.
 
dixie i wondered about you this weekend and how the talk went!!! i'm glad you both seem to be on the same page...
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as long as you feel okay with it...GOOD!!
 
Mara,
Thanks! As soon as we actually talked, I did feel better. Then we spent the weekend together and it was a good one, as always. Now, I even feel calmer and less worried about when the actual proposal will happen. I do trust him and have to remember that. And I am ok w/waiting until after we''ve moved and settled in.
Thanks for your thoughts.
 
i really hope you are paying attention to the red flags and not buying real estate or moving in with him. take good care of yourself.
 
Ladykemma,
Thanks for the advice. Honestly, I don''t see any red flags. I do truly believe that we have different ways of expressing our sentiments but that our feelings are the same. I think he is very honest and straightforward with me, and I believe what he says. If he said he wasn''t sure or said that he doesn''t want what we''ve already discussed, I would take a different course of action. He''s said he is sure and does want what we''ve discussed and that he wouldn''t be moving forward if he felt differently. At the very least, he''s said he would always tell me if he did feel differently. I do trust him and believe that so I''m not worried.
We are still planning to buy a place together. I am not someone who feels an engagement must come before living together. As long as I feel confident that we both want the same things, w/in a general timeframe, I am ok w/it, as is he.
Maybe I am missing something but I honestly don''t think so.
 
dixie--I''m all for you going with your instinct and you have the best handle on the inner workings of your relatiionship than anyone. Sounds like you are happy with how things are and understand that while your bf communicates differently, he still feels the same way and shows it in various ways.

but, i too would caution on buying a place together. it''s ok to live together, discuss buying, but i just think buying together gets dangerous because there is no legal binding relationship between you two. It could get very messy and i''m just guessing, that you both probably couldn''t afford it individually. I have nothing to go on and i hate when people dish and can''t take it (me..hehe), but i''ve just heard too many scenarios where people do this and later regret it on many levels. my bf bought 2 places while we were together and i feel like i was part of the process, but i will not invest at all. we''ve discussed buying but i won''t do this until after marriage. just too complicated and my life''s complicated enough!i hope it works out though~
 
Always,
Thank you for your concern. I do understand the concern and the issues brought up. I wouldn''t want anyone to think I am totally naive or haven''t considered all the possibilities. I guess that I just trust who he and I are. Even if it didn''t work out between us, neither of us (imo) are the type to cause a problem about it. Of course, I say this now and I realize that I don''t know what would/could happen, but I do feel that I can only worry about how I feel presently, as long as I''ve thought through all the possible outcomes. It''s the same reason I don''t believe in pre-nups.
Don''t get me wrong, I am a lawyer and I know the law. I don''t feel I''m overlooking any issues, but I understand how others could feel that way. If I had doubts in him as a person, I wouldn''t go forward. I just think we are both sensible people who would handle a breakup sensibly if it were to happen....but hopefully it will not!
 
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