Cali. should take lessons from Wisconsin...

[Dancing Fire]

don't spent more $$$ than we take in.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/13/us/huge-new-shortfall-predicted-in-california-budget.html

btw; my wife said the state will cut her salary by about 5%.

 

[Imdanny]

don't spent more $$$ than we take in.

Wisconsin had a SURPLUS when Walker took over. Wisconsin's "fiscal crisis" is a BIG LIE. The way you get to a small deficit is through tax cuts WALKER gave. I'm sorry the media don't report what I just said very often but THEY HAVE.

The lesson we should learn is that Citizens United was a very bad decision.

 

[movie zombie]

Danny is completely right.

those that work for the state or have loved ones that do and then complain about how the state over spends confound me.
why isn't she working in the private sector?
you/she should be happy she didn't get laid off because the state woul save more by eliminating her job and the jobs of other state workers.

 

[ForteKitty]

As someone who works for a govt. agency, I can say that a LOT of funds are misused, and totally unnecessary. It happens in every agency, on every level. It happens in private industries as well.

I gladly offered to take less pay for furlough days, but since my agency is doing very well, they laughed at that suggestion.

 

[Lula]

don't spent more $$$ than we take in.

Wisconsin had a SURPLUS when Walker took over. Wisconsin's "fiscal crisis" is a BIG LIE. The way you get to a small deficit is through tax cuts WALKER gave. I'm sorry the media don't report what I just said very often but THEY HAVE.

The lesson we should learn is that Citizens United was a very bad decision.

I live in Wisconsin. Danny is absolutely correct. DF, I really wish you'd take a course in public finance before you post these nonsense threads equating government budgets to household budgets.

ETA: The "cuts" Walker imposed sucked money out of communities, and have forced many small businesses -- who did not benefit at all from Waker's corporate largesse -- to close or cut staff. The press has not covered this aspect of the cuts at all. The farmers -- some of the biggest beneficiaries of government subsidies -- are largely Walker supporters. Talk about voting against your own interests.

 

[Dancing Fire]

don't spent more $$$ than we take in.

Wisconsin had a SURPLUS when Walker took over. Wisconsin's "fiscal crisis" is a BIG LIE. The way you get to a small deficit is through tax cuts WALKER gave. I'm sorry the media don't report what I just said very often but THEY HAVE.

The lesson we should learn is that Citizens United was a very bad decision.

Danny, it is funny how you and MZ never give credit to a conservatives when they are doing right thing by cutting government spending,so do you believe that governor Brown is LYING about Cali's $16 billion deficit?

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

I'm sorry but I thought the Walker recall election had to do with unfunded pensions. He took away collective bargaining from the gov't worker unions so he could cut expenses to keep financially viable. A good number of states are having the same problem/
I, for one agree with what he did and I'm glad he wasn't recalled. I don't live in Wisconsin, but Il, where I do live, is much worse--on par with california.



There was a time people thought promises made for Gov't pensions wouldn't have a problem bei ng paid. People live longer, just like S.S., and changes have to be made. Life changes, we all have to adapt. I don't know how everyone can expect everything from the Gov't and not pay for it , or don't expect the benefits from the Gov't. I believe in safety nets, but the Gov't has taken over giving, giving giving in all directions.

Annette

 

[Dancing Fire]

Hi,

I'm sorry but I thought the Walker recall election had to do with unfunded pensions. He took away collective bargaining from the gov't worker unions so he could cut expenses to keep financially viable. A good number of states are having the same problem/
I, for one agree with what he did and I'm glad he wasn't recalled. I don't live in Wisconsin, but Il, where I do live, is much worse--on par with california.



There was a time people thought promises made for Gov't pensions wouldn't have a problem bei ng paid. People live longer, just like S.S., and changes have to be made. Life changes, we all have to adapt. I don't know how everyone can expect everything from the Gov't and not pay for it , or don't expect the benefits from the Gov't. I believe in safety nets, but the Gov't has taken over giving, giving giving in all directions.

Annette

yup!!... look what is happening in Europe now... .. we are heading towards the same direction as Europe if we don't stop big Gov't spending now. i don't wanna force our daughter's generation into paying off our debt. no such thing as a free ride.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Danny is completely right.

those that work for the state or have loved ones that do and then complain about how the state over spends confound me.
why isn't she working in the private sector?
you/she should be happy she didn't get laid off because the state woul save more by eliminating her job and the jobs of other state workers.

b/c she's an old geezer and no private Co. would hire her.. but seriously,i wish the government would leave the private sector alone with less regulations so that they can create more jobs.remember the booming economy during the 90's? how the private sector created millions of jobs thus bringing in big tax revenue for Cali.

 

[Lula]

Hi,

I'm sorry but I thought the Walker recall election had to do with unfunded pensions. He took away collective bargaining from the gov't worker unions so he could cut expenses to keep financially viable. A good number of states are having the same problem/
I, for one agree with what he did and I'm glad he wasn't recalled. I don't live in Wisconsin, but Il, where I do live, is much worse--on par with california.



There was a time people thought promises made for Gov't pensions wouldn't have a problem bei ng paid. People live longer, just like S.S., and changes have to be made. Life changes, we all have to adapt. I don't know how everyone can expect everything from the Gov't and not pay for it , or don't expect the benefits from the Gov't. I believe in safety nets, but the Gov't has taken over giving, giving giving in all directions.

Annette

Wrong. Wisconsin's pension system is completely solvent. In fact, it has been held up as a model for the rest of the nation. See the New York Times article on the health of state pension funds from a year or so ago if you don't believe me. And the pension is not a safety net, for god's sake. It is a benefit that was paid for out of the wages from the worker's who earned it. Earned it. The pension contributions were negotiated as part of a benefits package, the same as any employee compensation package, whether it be private or public sector work.

If you want to point fingers at people taking advantage of the government, look no further than the owner of ABC Supply who donated $500,000 plus to Walker's campaign and paid zero -- zero -- in taxes. Yet this corporation uses taxpayer-funded roads, bridges, and water and sewer systems to run their business and make a profit.

You are correct that we have a choice to make -- are we going to go back to the days of the robber barons and poor houses, and continue to allow companies to ship jobs overseas, or are we going to look at countries like Germany, that not only "live within their means" but value education and a skilled workforce that earns a living wage. It might be okay with you to trip over poor people in the street, and allow people to die from lack of health care -- the US has one of the highest infant mortality rate in the world -- but it is not okay with me, and I intend to do everything that I can to educate people about the wool that is being pulled over their eyes. At the very least, do some fact checking before you spout off incorrect information about our state's pension system.

 

[Lula]

Hi,

I'm sorry but I thought the Walker recall election had to do with unfunded pensions. He took away collective bargaining from the gov't worker unions so he could cut expenses to keep financially viable. A good number of states are having the same problem/
I, for one agree with what he did and I'm glad he wasn't recalled. I don't live in Wisconsin, but Il, where I do live, is much worse--on par with california.



There was a time people thought promises made for Gov't pensions wouldn't have a problem bei ng paid. People live longer, just like S.S., and changes have to be made. Life changes, we all have to adapt. I don't know how everyone can expect everything from the Gov't and not pay for it , or don't expect the benefits from the Gov't. I believe in safety nets, but the Gov't has taken over giving, giving giving in all directions.

Annette

yup!!... look what is happening in Europe now... .. we are heading towards the same direction as Europe if we don't stop big Gov't spending now. i don't wanna force our daughter's generation into paying off our debt. no such thing as a free ride.

Europe's woes are much more complicated than this. And reforming the global banking industry in 2008 when we had the chance would have prevented or at least mitigated much of the financial turmoil in the global economy. Both sides of the political aisle had no balls when it came to make the need reforms, though.

 

[nkarma]

Hi,

I'm sorry but I thought the Walker recall election had to do with unfunded pensions. He took away collective bargaining from the gov't worker unions so he could cut expenses to keep financially viable. A good number of states are having the same problem/
I, for one agree with what he did and I'm glad he wasn't recalled. I don't live in Wisconsin, but Il, where I do live, is much worse--on par with california.



There was a time people thought promises made for Gov't pensions wouldn't have a problem bei ng paid. People live longer, just like S.S., and changes have to be made. Life changes, we all have to adapt. I don't know how everyone can expect everything from the Gov't and not pay for it , or don't expect the benefits from the Gov't. I believe in safety nets, but the Gov't has taken over giving, giving giving in all directions.

Annette

Wrong. Wisconsin's pension system is completely solvent. In fact, it has been held up as a model for the rest of the nation. See the New York Times article on the health of state pension funds from a year or so ago if you don't believe me. And the pension is not a safety net, for god's sake. It is a benefit that was paid for out of the wages from the worker's who earned it. Earned it. The pension contributions were negotiated as part of a benefits package, the same as any employee compensation package, whether it be private or public sector work.

If you want to point fingers at people taking advantage of the government, look no further than the owner of ABC Supply who donated $500,000 plus to Walker's campaign and paid zero -- zero -- in taxes. Yet this corporation uses taxpayer-funded roads, bridges, and water and sewer systems to run their business and make a profit.

You are correct that we have a choice to make -- are we going to go back to the days of the robber barons and poor houses, and continue to allow companies to ship jobs overseas, or are we going to look at countries like Germany, that not only "live within their means" but value education and a skilled workforce that earns a living wage. It might be okay with you to trip over poor people in the street, and allow people to die from lack of health care -- the US has one of the highest infant mortality rate in the world -- but it is not okay with me, and I intend to do everything that I can to educate people about the wool that is being pulled over their eyes. At the very least, do some fact checking before you spout off incorrect information about our state's pension system.

Thank you Lula!!!!!!!! That was so eloquent and true.

To those who link pensions for people who were EMPLOYED by the government to hand outs, you really are missing the point. Additionally, DF if your wife cannot be employed by the private sector why are they your God and not the people that actually allows your family to earn a wage?

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

I guess you get your pay check from the State.? Methinks too much self interest i hear.


Annette

 

[ForteKitty]

Annette, I work for a County govt. and am the first to admit that our administration wastes a lot of money on unnecessary programs. (Notice I said programs and not employees) However, regarding pensions, I have to disagree with you.

I put in about 25% of my gross salary each month, and we have a investment department who uses that money to invest during the 50 years while I'm employed. When I receive my pension after retirement, my money will come that money. It does NOT come from taxes or other public funds. Your taxes do not pay for my pensions. Our investment branch has done exceptionally well, and we are well above the red. It is considered a benefit, but we also make about 30% less than the private sector so that "benefit" makes up for it, somewhat.

Hope that clears some confusion up. I like working in the public sector, but it is disheartening to be put down and kicked around by people who have misguided notions about how the pension systems here work.

 

[Lula]

Hi,

I guess you get your pay check from the State.? Methinks too much self interest i hear.


Annette

And I'll bet you're a banker, salivating at the idea of converting a well-funded, solvent pension fund into 401K's that would allow bankers, and Bernie Madoff types, to profit by charging fees on this money. Wisconsin has tough laws preventing politicians -- from either side -- from raiding the state's pension fund. Other states do not have these protections in place, and have consistently raided their pension funds leaving them insolvent, thereby breaking their promises to the workers who trusted that that money would be there. But it's not just states who have broken promises to their workers; one only need to look at Enron to see how a private company screwed their workers out of promised retirement funds. Fiscal mismanagement happens in the private sector as well. But just like in the public sector, the workers get screwed, and management skates.

I note that you are from Illinois. This may interest you: http://illinoispolicy.org/news/article.asp?ArticleSource=4553
Indeed, there are many similarities between former Gov. Blagojevich and Gov. Walker; one only need google "John Doe" and "Scot Walker" to find them.

 

[Lula]

Annette, I work for a County govt. and am the first to admit that our administration wastes a lot of money on unnecessary programs. (Notice I said programs and not employees) However, regarding pensions, I have to disagree with you.

I put in about 25% of my gross salary each month, and we have a investment department who uses that money to invest during the 50 years while I'm employed. When I receive my pension after retirement, my money will come that money. It does NOT come from taxes or other public funds. Your taxes do not pay for my pensions. Our investment branch has done exceptionally well, and we are well above the red. It is considered a benefit, but we also make about 30% less than the private sector so that "benefit" makes up for it, somewhat.

Hope that clears some confusion up. I like working in the public sector, but it is disheartening to be put down and kicked around by people who have misguided notions about how the pension systems here work.

Well said.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Annette, I work for a County govt. and am the first to admit that our administration wastes a lot of money on unnecessary programs. (Notice I said programs and not employees) However, regarding pensions, I have to disagree with you.

I put in about 25% of my gross salary each month, and we have a investment department who uses that money to invest during the 50 years while I'm employed. When I receive my pension after retirement, my money will come that money. It does NOT come from taxes or other public funds. Your taxes do not pay for my pensions. Our investment branch has done exceptionally well, and we are well above the red. It is considered a benefit, but we also make about 30% less than the private sector so that "benefit" makes up for it, somewhat.

Hope that clears some confusion up. I like working in the public sector, but it is disheartening to be put down and kicked around by people who have misguided notions about how the pension systems here work.

FK...you sound like my wife... i'd agree with your post..

 

[qtiekiki]

Annette, I work for a County govt. and am the first to admit that our administration wastes a lot of money on unnecessary programs. (Notice I said programs and not employees) However, regarding pensions, I have to disagree with you.

I put in about 25% of my gross salary each month, and we have a investment department who uses that money to invest during the 50 years while I'm employed. When I receive my pension after retirement, my money will come that money. It does NOT come from taxes or other public funds. Your taxes do not pay for my pensions. Our investment branch has done exceptionally well, and we are well above the red. It is considered a benefit, but we also make about 30% less than the private sector so that "benefit" makes up for it, somewhat.

Hope that clears some confusion up. I like working in the public sector, but it is disheartening to be put down and kicked around by people who have misguided notions about how the pension systems here work.

Yup. Completely agreed.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Hi,

I guess you get your pay check from the State.? Methinks too much self interest i hear.


Annette

wife and daughter are both empolyed by the State.they have to work to receive a pay check each month unlike the millions of people whom are receiving a monthly check for doing nothing.

 

[movie zombie]

there are those that think all state employees are doing nothing and would see your wife and daughter working in the private sector. there are those that would say that if they can't find work in the private sector there is something wrong with them. i do hang out on some rather conservative forums.....and i've actually read this.

given your daughter is young and just starting her work career, i'd be curious as to why she went to the state for employment, especially given your dislike for state wages/retirement/etc. she is young, educated, not married or with children and could accept employment as well as bought a home any where. why did she go to the state for employment?

me thinks you protest too much, DF.
people who live in glass houses should not throw stones at others.
you lack credibility in this instance and no matter how you phrase it, your family members are just the same as any other state employee and gets lumped in with the rest: disrespected, undervalued by some and overpaid, lazy, incompetent, couldn't survive in the private sector by others.

 

[Imdanny]

Danny is completely right.

Thank you.

 

[Imdanny]

don't spent more $$$ than we take in.

Wisconsin had a SURPLUS when Walker took over. Wisconsin's "fiscal crisis" is a BIG LIE. The way you get to a small deficit is through tax cuts WALKER gave. I'm sorry the media don't report what I just said very often but THEY HAVE.

The lesson we should learn is that Citizens United was a very bad decision.

I live in Wisconsin. Danny is absolutely correct.

Thank you.

I don't live in Wisconsin, but I researched these events, thoroughly. I'm very sorry about what's happening there. It's a travesty that the Koch brothers/ ALEC can outspend the Democrat 10:1. That's bad enough, without it all being based on a lie in the first place. And the icing on the cake is that middle class, working class, and upper middle class people are being duped by this propaganda. "Divide and conquer." Scott Walker said to his billionaire donor, and it's on video for heaven's sake, and people still fall for it.

 

[ForteKitty]

MZ, I'm not DF's daughter, but was 24 when I entered the County, not married, and had a good degree from a respectable University. The reason I didn't stay in the private sector was because I didn't respect a lot of companies and didn't care to help them make money. I took the job as a temp solution while I figured out what to do, and ended up loving it. I now understand a lot more than I ever expected to know, and stopped taking certain things for granted, like well paved streets and trash service.

But I was also lazy. My office was 3 miles from home and I didn't want to commute. Plus we're on a 4-10 hr/day schedule. being at work a total of 11 hrs a day sucks, but 3 day weekends are awesome. It's hard to leave.

 

[Dancing Fire]

given your daughter is young and just starting her work career, i'd be curious as to why she went to the state for employment, especially given your dislike for state wages/retirement/etc. she is young, educated, not married or with children and could accept employment as well as bought a home any where. why did she go to the state for employment?

b/c she wants to rip off the taxpayers?..

 

[movie zombie]

DF, it is hard to take you serious anymore re anything other than koi.
your credibility is completely shot.

fortekitty, your honesty is refreshing.

i have worked for a county here in california and in the private sector.
i've seen good employees and bad in both scenarious.
i've seen waste in both....actually, worse in the private sector.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Annette, I work for a County govt. and am the first to admit that our administration wastes a lot of money on unnecessary programs. (Notice I said programs and not employees) However, regarding pensions, I have to disagree with you.

I put in about 25% of my gross salary each month, and we have a investment department who uses that money to invest during the 50 years while I'm employed. When I receive my pension after retirement, my money will come that money. It does NOT come from taxes or other public funds. Your taxes do not pay for my pensions. Our investment branch has done exceptionally well, and we are well above the red. It is considered a benefit, but we also make about 30% less than the private sector so that "benefit" makes up for it, somewhat.

FK
wife said ...if Cali state pension reform goes on a voting ballot she will retire as soon as possible. she was surprised that a very liberal city like San Jose passed the pension reform law on tuesday.

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="Imdanny|

I don't live in Wisconsin, but I researched these events, thoroughly. I'm very sorry about what's happening there. It's a travesty that the Koch brothers/ ALEC can outspend the Democrat 10:1. That's bad enough, without it all being based on a lie in the first place. And the icing on the cake is that middle class, working class, and upper middle class people are being duped by this propaganda. "Divide and conquer." Scott Walker said to his billionaire donor, and it's on video for heaven's sake, and people still fall for it.[/quote]


don't worry Danny...Obama will receive a big check from his billionaire friend George Soros...

 

[Dancing Fire]

DF, it is hard to take you serious anymore re anything other than koi.
your credibility is completely shot.

MZ...i want all levels of our government to run on a balanced budget. what's wrong with that?..

 

[movie zombie]

a government is not a business and it is not a household.
it has responsibilities and obligations that a business and household do not.
it is for the people and by the people.
thus it has obligations to the people.
making $ is the sole goal of a business.
a business is supposed to balance its budget....instead of the corporate welfare system we currently have.
a family should balance its budget....individual responsibility.
government is in deep crayola if it attempts to do so.
if you want the budget balanced in government, expect to pay more taxes.
cutting waste is one thing.
driving people into abject poverty conditions is another.
the economy is in deep downfall.
relying on the trickle down theory hasn't worked well over the last 30 years.
i don't expect it to work now.
yes, expect to pay more taxes, DF.
its the only way to make sure your wife and daughter continue to get their pay check.
i really wish you wouldn't start these political threads.
it always leads to a warning from the Administrator.
yet you persist knowing that the simplicity of your statements do not encompass the reality.
i've had it.
good night.

 

[Imdanny]

I second MZ's comments. It would be better for everyone if none of us started political threads. It's against the rules and it only leads to people being upset. I come here to look at pretty things and escape from stressful topics not to talk about politics. There's no shortage of other forums to talk about politics.