Buying a new car

[kenny]

Thanks all for the great suggestions and tips.
I'm still shopping.
Hoped to buy one yesterday (last day of that month) but it wasn't to be.
Got close though.

I've learned the Costco price isn't the best deal.
It's just a painless path to not getting screwed too badly ... if you pay cash.
I've already got non-Costco dealers agreeing to a discount that's 10% better.
... and this is after only 5 minutes on the phone, so you know much better is possible after fighting in person for hours.
Interestingly, the Costco price does not take into account whether you have a trade in or pay cash or finance.
It is a final price if paying cash, then they'd adjust the financing and trade in value accordingly to screw you as much as they can get away with.
A Costco representative doesn't sit with you in the negotiating room to protect you.
IMO this makes the Costco thing worthless unless paying cash.

I got my VISA limit increased to cover the whole $20,000 car.
I'd like to get that 1% $200 cash back from my Costco VISA so I called to see if any dealer (and there are zillions here in So. California) would let me put the whole car on it.
Nope.
Maximums ranged from $2500 to $7000.
I got two dealers to raise it to $10,000 and was ready to pull the trigger when one finance guy leaked that they'll lose $300 (3% of the charge) to fees.
My response was, "Then lower the price by $300 and I'll pay all cash; you make the exact same profit.

I think he would have agreed had I not added, "You just showed your cards."
I can't forget I'm dealing with a human, and we all have egos.
Stupid me.

Now I realize putting anything on a VISA card just raises the lowest price they'll agree to.
I don't think there is a VISA card out there that gives you over 3% cash back so I'm gonna nix the card idea.

I love the negotiating process, watching how my emotions get carried away.
I must reign them in so they don't take over my mouth.

You want the car, but want to keep max money too.
They want to take max money.
A fight as old as mankind.
In many countries negotiating is routine on almost every transaction.
It's gotta be easier for customers from those countries to deal with these car salesperson weenies.

Now that end-of-the-month deals are weeks away I have time to research more.
Fun Fun Fun.

 

[the_mother_thing]

On the Costco cash price, was what they quoted a final "out the door" price, including tax, tags, doc fees, etc? And if so, were the dealer quotes also the same in terms of those 'line item' inclusions?

I ask b/c when I made my calls, I was very specific to request an "out the door" price quote so as not to be 'bait-and-switched' when time came to write the check with additional fees they conveniently omitted from quotes in order to better compete.

Just another point of consideration.

 

[kenny]

On the Costco cash price, was what they quoted a final "out the door" price, including tax, tags, doc fees, etc? And if so, were the dealer quotes also the same in terms of those 'line item' inclusions?

I ask b/c when I made my calls, I was very specific to request an "out the door" price quote so as not to be 'bait-and-switched' when time came to write the check with additional fees they conveniently omitted from quotes in order to better compete.

Just another point of consideration.

The Costco price does not include tax, license etc.
This makes sense because those may vary with location.

BTW, sales tax rates vary by county (and I think city) here in California.
I considered buying in a cheaper county till I learned car buyers are charged the sales tax rate of their county/city of residence, not that of that of the purchase location.

But thanks, I'll find out what other BS fees might be added so I'm not surprised after hours of exhausting negotiating.

 

[kenny]

Kenny,

Are you looking for a new car, as in 2017?
If so, JoCoJenn is right; buy those towards the end of the year when car dealers want to clear out room for the 2018s.
Would you want a new 2016?

Actually no.
FWIW, the MSRP for the 2017 is only $100 more and when I go to sell it having a year-newer car increases the resale value.
I doubt any 2016s are left; Fits fly off the lot here in So. Cal.

Lots of good advice here; don't wear your Octavia (let Dancing Fire babysit it until you buy a car), look around the end of the month, and don't appear to be in a rush to buy a car, or specifically one from that particular dealership.

Yes, thanks.
I have a silver band I wear when I want to look poor.
That's better than a skinny white skin ring and a missing ring.
That's how you spot married people looking for sex.
At least that's what I read on Reader's Digest.

Can you borrow a couple of young kids?
Years ago, when mine where young, I had to buy a new car on short notice. It just so happened that I found myself in the dealership, with the kids (who were and still are wonderful, but were still kids), and was negotiating price close to closing time - and at the end of the month. I got the price I wanted and wonder how much might have been the desire to get my little angels out the door.

Ugh, I really don't like being around little kids.
I think I'd rather pay double for the car.

 

[kenny]

FWIW I'm evil so I want a Honda made in Japan.
Some models sold in USA are made here.
Others made only in Japan.
Others both.

If you want one made in Japan make sure the VIN starts with a J.

I want to buy it before Cheeto makes imports cost 20% more.

 

[kenny]

Truecar sucks.

It found 2 local dealers.
(Actually it claimed to find 3 but the third listing has to have bad data since the 'discount' price is hundreds OVER the MSRP. DOH!

Again here's Costco price for a 2017 Fit EX CVT :
MSRP $19,675
Costco $18,618

I've already gotten that down to $18,500 at two non-Costo dealers after just 5 minutes on the phone.

Below are the two Truecar 'discounts'.
They are almost a thousand bucks higher than Costco's price.

Truecar dealer #1's discounted price: $19,494
Truecar dealer #2's discounted price: $19,589

Plus I had to give Truecar lots of personal info ... which I'm sure they'll make money off of and fill my inbox with spam.

My goal now is $18,200 plus tax and license, all cash.

 

[arkieb1]

I think your Honda Fit is called the Honda Jazz here;

https://www.honda.com.au/cars/models/jazz.html

Ours are designed in Japan but manufactured cheaply in Thailand. I think some of yours are made in Mexico...

 

[kenny]

I think your Honda Fit is called the Honda Jazz here;

https://www.honda.com.au/cars/models/jazz.html

Ours are designed in Japan but manufactured cheaply in Thailand. I think some of yours are made in Mexico...

Sorry, I don't recall where "here" is for every one here, but yes the Fit and Jazz are the same car, just for different markets.
Both silly names IMO.

A quick check verifies some ARE made in Mexico.
Again here in the US the VIN, vehicle identification number, starting with J indicates that one was made in Japan.
Country of origin can also be determined by the US-mandated sticker on the driver's side door jamb.

Being near the port of Los Angeles our dealers get lots of Japanese-made Hondas compared to the rest of the US of A.
All my cars have been made in Japan, Nissan Sentra, Honda Accord, Toyota Camry, Honda Civic Hybrid, another HCH, Honda Insight Hybrid, now a Honda Fit.
The only American car I ever had was my first car, a POS Chevy Vega that burned more oil than gas.
The driver side door fell off.
No joke.
Yes, I realize Murikan cars are not all that bad.

Thanks for letting me know some Fits are made in Mexico.
With Cheeto-Racist-in-Cheif in charge maybe the best price negotiable of ALL Fits will rise soon if demand goes up in anticipation of a Mexican import duty.
Maybe I should not wait till the end of the month.

Hmm.

 

[kenny]

Woo Hoo ... got it down to $18,231 (b4 tax and fees) and counting.

Not bad considering I haven't spent one second in a dealer's waterboarding dungeon; this is all email and phone.
But one finance guy was so hunky I would've gladly followed HIM to his dungeon.
According to Truecar's graphic for my car & zip code, 18,231 is much lower than even their Exceptional Price of 18,801.

Too bad this car on their lot not in my color.
But at least it's not hot pink or carrot orange; maybe I should just take it.
But it's kinda a fun game to see how low they will go.

 

[arkieb1]

Sorry I meant my "here" not your "here" but I am more than happy to write Australia, my best friend has one and she loves it, they are great little cars. The point I was making is that some of your parts possibly were made in Thailand, they might have a J stamped on them they might have been "assembled" in Japan, but since I know Australian ones aren't then why would all the American ones be, for example this clearly states it has a Malaysian manufactured engine link;

http://www.torquenews.com/1574/built-japan-2017-honda-fit-15-mexican

Statistically cars that are white or that have a common neutral colour are more likely to retain a higher resale value. Just saying....

 

[kenny]

Sorry I meant my "here" not your "here" but I am more than happy to write Australia, my best friend has one and she loves it, they are great little cars. The point I was making is that some of your parts possibly were made in Thailand, they might have a J stamped on them they might have been "assembled" in Japan, but since I know Australian ones aren't then why would all the American ones be, for example this clearly states it has a Malaysian manufactured engine link;

http://www.torquenews.com/1574/built-japan-2017-honda-fit-15-mexican

Statistically cars that are white or that have a common neutral colour are more likely to retain a higher resale value. Just saying....

I don't mind Mexicans.
They're hot.
My SO's DNA is a Mexican pedigree.
As that old beer commercial says, "Tastes great, less filling."

There are very strict labeling laws in the US.
AFAIC I want the most Japanese juju possible and IIRC these fit EX CVTs for sale here with VINs starting with J have the window sticker and door jamb label stating, Made in Japan.
That is the most Japanese available.

But yes, I'm sure not every part or atom in the car is from Japan.

 

[kenny]

I just got a call from that 3rd Truecar dealer with the bogus price data. ("discount" pricing above MSRP.)
He had the best pricing yet, $17,807 which is much less than my formerly-best of $18,231 ...
Also he had a 2016 in my color for only 17,267. ... and he says there are absolutely NO changes from 2016 to 2017, though when it's time for me to sell this car the KBB value would be lower.
He disagreed ... Uhm, Hello, can you say, Red Flag!?

Fine print alert: his follow-up email quote stated financing required from Honda USA.
Hmmmm
But if the financing is low or zero percent and allows me to pay it off early with no penalites this may end up cheaper, as has been suggested on this thread.

 

[arkieb1]

Check the fine print of finance deals - many of them have penalties or fees if you pay it all off up front, because the whole point is they want to lock you into paying more.

 

[kenny]

It was good for me.
I'm so satisfied.
I need a cigarette now!



Got it in my color for base price of only $18,200, all cash.

The Internet surely has changed the car-buying experience.
Much easier now.
The hardest part (learning and getting my price) all happened on phone and email, instead of a marathon session in the dealer's dreary torture chamber.
Today they did beg, and plead poverty and 3 starving children at home, for me to finance it but I stuck to my guns.

I love the rear-facing camera attached to the passenger side mirror.
When you signal right you see a very wide view on the 7" dash display of what use to be the dreaded blind spot.

A separate back up camera is standard at the middle of the back of the car ... even on Honda's cheapest!
It can even look straight down while backing up to parallel park, making it a breeze to close that wasteful gap with the car behind you.
Keyless entry, push button start, moonroof, alloy wheels, tons of room for cargo, excellent MPG and stellar resale value.
Very smooth, quiet, & firm ride for a cheapo car.

Suddenly I no longer think their ad slogan is so stupid: The Fit is Go!

 

[Matata]

Congrats Kenny! Sounds like a sweet ride.

 

[rainwood]

Congrats! You did good. Both my nieces drive Honda Fits and love them.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Congrats Kenny!...

 

[arkieb1]

So Kenny have you been racing little old ladies at Traffic lights and doing burnouts in your new wheels?

 

[kenny]

Congrats Kenny!...

Thanks.
I wanted to buy it before your buddy slaps 20% duty on imports.

 

[kenny]

So Kenny have you been racing little old ladies at Traffic lights and doing burnouts in your new wheels?

Aw hecks no.
I'm a hypermiler.

Instead of getting there ASAP we get there OALGAP, on as little gas as possible.
Little old ladies in walkers pass me up all the time.

 

[tyty333]

Congrats Kenny...I loved my 2006 Honda Odyssey! I also looked at Honda Pilots and loved the passengar side camera (which
they do put on all their cars).

Sounds like you did good...with minimal headache! I felt like I needed a drink on the 2 days we went to the dealers .
Your salesman only had 3 kids??? Mine had 8 with another two grandchildren living at his house and I think our salesman was
still in his 40s! Not my problem...I didnt tell you to have 8 kids (or tell your 16 year old to get 2 different girls pregnant)!

Plenty of stories nobody wants to hear...

 

[december-fire]

Congrats, Kenny!

Loved my Accord and love my Acura!

Suddenly I no longer think their ad slogan is so stupid: The Fit is Go!

For a slogan, I think they should have gone with:

Wanna have a Fit?

I'm sure you'll have lots of problem-free miles out of your new car! Enjoy!

 

[the_mother_thing]

Congrats Kenny!!! Glad the experience was (relatively) smooth & you got a great deal on a great car! I love the side & back-up cameras on my Honda; just wish they'd have made it a trifecta & put one on the driver's side mirror as well.