Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat RB..

[AndyDiamond]

Hi everyone,

I have been trying to look for an engagement diamond for about a month, and no luck so far given my requirements. Either the price is too high, cut isn't great, or the fluorescence actually created some haziness in the stone.

I am looking for around 2.5 carats, and trying to stay as close as possible to that as possible, 2.5 or greater ideally. G color or better, VS2, or possibly an SI1 that has no visible inclusions to the naked eye from any distance. I don't mind fluorescence as long as it doesn't affect the brilliance of the stone. I am mostly looking at GIA certed stones but open to AGS.

I found a 2.46 carat stone that is VS2 E color with strong fluorescence. It is priced well at around 36k, and scores a 1.1 on the HCA. The stone specs are below. I am concerned the crown angle is too shallow. Your thoughts?


Stone specs:
GIA Cut: Excellent
GIA Polish: Very Good
GIA Symmetry: Excellent
Measurements: 8.79 x 8.83 x 5.27 mm
Table: 59 %
Depth: 59.7%
Crown angle: 32.5 degrees
Pavilion angle: 41 degrees
Girdle: Thin to Medium

 

[rolexman1974]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

recommend some lower grades than what you were looking at.

Excellent cut, I color, si1 or 2 is fine for a round. You are going big though, so maybe VS isn't bad option. I've never bothered looking at any that big ;-(

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/I-SI1-Premium-Cut-Round-Diamond-1437286.asp
27.9K

This will be eye clean imo. check gia cert, has some inclusions on the edge, Probably not visible but a jeweler can put prong over it anyway.

save yourself several thousand, drop 1 or 2 color grades below G. H &I. Unless your lady is a jeweler or is holding it next to other stones, you just can't tell the difference with naked eye. No fluorescence on that stone either.

what color ring are you going with. Yellow gold, you can go even lower color.

also clarity SI1 or si2 is fine if you make sure no dark spots in the middle.

That stone is GIA excellent. Don't go worrying about HCA. HCA is good tool for screening stones that don't have paperwork. If you have a GIA cert telling you excellent, I wouldn't worry about the HCA number. Many GIA excellent have poor HCA, you have professional grader giving excellent, that's good enough for me. You can request idealscope image from James allen. even some degree of leakage on idealscope isn't discernible to naked eye. Many excellent GIA have some leakage and HCA lower than 2, side by side, you could never tell the difference, they're GIA excellent... just my opinion.

 

[Silvia]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Hiya,

I'm a very new member here, but have been lurking for a very long time.

I don't think any of the veterans on here would tell you to 'disregard' HCA scores unless it's on an AGS0 stone. Especially with that amount of money and that size stone.

I'm sure someone experienced will be on later to help you, so good luck!

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Hiya,

I'm a very new member here, but have been lurking for a very long time.

I don't think any of the veterans on here would tell you to 'disregard' HCA scores unless it's on an AGS0 stone. Especially with that amount of money and that size stone.

I'm sure someone experienced will be on later to help you, so good luck!

Correct! You don't use the HCA on AGS graded stones. You do use it on GIA Excellents because that is a wider range than AGS0 and some stones are better than others. You also do need an idealscope to see if there is leakage.

Andy, I think the reason you haven't found a diamond yet is that you are going to have to sacrifice something considering your specs and the budget. I know sna77 just found in the last couple of weeks that he couldn't find an ideal/excellent cut close to 2.5 ct. diamond, E-F SI1, for $35k. A G VS2 is going to be about as much as an F SI1 or maybe more, so I think your objective is going to be hard to achieve. I think the last stone he found was a 2.25 in the upper 30's. If you'd adjust your size to 2.25, we could probably find you some great stones. Or if you look at H color or SI1. I do like G VS myself, so I understand the desire. But H would provide a nice drop in price and maybe get you to the 2.5 range. I personally wouldn't do I color, but many here have and they have beautiful rings.

Nice choice here at $34k+:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2400044.htm

and one at $36k:

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/8952/

You are not going to be able to do a 2.5 G VS2 at 2.5 cts unless you buy second hand.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Andy, I would just suggest that you choose a vendor such as Good Old Gold or WhiteFlash who can call in stones for you and evaluate them. That is really the only way to accomplish this. There are a lot of virtual G SI1 and H VS2 stones listed, and you just need someone to call some in and see if they meet ideal light performance, eyeclean, etc. Good Old Gold is about to do that for me. There may be a charge for the shipping if you have to have many called in, but better to spend a little money to find a great stone than to order one sight unseen by anyone, in my opinion. GOG will make picture and videos of the stones for you.

Oh, and I think fluorescence is a bonus! That is one thing that can help you since there might be a slight discount in price!

 

[slg47]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

you could ask if these are eye-clean?
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Premium-Cut-Round-Diamond-1421475.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1364223.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1437549.asp

 

[Ravinmad]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

You are going to have to call, but here is a 2.66 G SI1 that whiteflash has as part of their virtual collection

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2725699.htm

Found this looking around a bit later, quite close in many ways and it looks decent

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-2684388.htm

 

[distracts]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

You could fairly easily find a stone around 2.30 cts for that price - that's only about a fourth of a millimeter difference in face-up size from a 2.5 ct stone. Good Old Gold has a few around that size for around your price. I would consider it. In order to get 2.5 cts you may need to spend more money or give up some of your other criteria, but you could get 2.3 cts, which will look alllllmost the same, for your budget.

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

@rolexman1974, I am sensitive to color, so I need to stay with at least G color.

To everyone, what about the 2.46 carat VS2 E color diamond in question for 36k? Any comments about that?

My 35k budget is not fixed, but I want to get value, and don't want to overpay so I want to stay as close to that as possible. If you recall initially, I did find some VS2 G color stones around 2.5 carats for 30k, but the HCA was not good, so I think I can definitely do it within my budget. Unless the pricing has gone up in the last month or so.

Thanks

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Andy, you're going to find that most of us are going to put cut quality at the top of our list, and I personally wouldn't choose a 32.5 crown angle. But since your top priority is the largest size possible, you seem more willing to get less than ideal cut. I think stones with fluorescence can be a great value since they usually have a discount, but someone does need to examine the stone for you to make sure there are no negative effects. And I already mentioned that you just need to choose a vendor to call in a couple and examine them for you. Just choose one more and let someone call them in, do the idealscope images, check for eyeclean-ness, and choose the best one!

(Yes, you can get a poorly cut stone with your specs for $30k. You probably cannot get an ideal cut, 2.5 G VS2 for $35k. As I said, you have to sacrifice something if you really want a 2.5 ct. stone.)

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Andy, you're going to find that most of us are going to put cut quality at the top of our list, and I personally wouldn't choose a 32.5 crown angle. But since your top priority is the largest size possible, you seem more willing to get less than ideal cut. I think stones with fluorescence can be a great value since they usually have a discount, but someone does need to examine the stone for you to make sure there are no negative effects. And I already mentioned that you just need to choose a vendor to call in a couple and examine them for you. Just choose one more and let someone call them in, do the idealscope images, check for eyeclean-ness, and choose the best one!

(Yes, you can get a poorly cut stone with your specs for $30k. You probably cannot get an ideal cut, 2.5 G VS2 for $35k. As I said, you have to sacrifice something if you really want a 2.5 ct. stone.)

@Diamondseeker,

What's wrong with a 32.5 crown angle if the HCA still scores well? As far as a poorly cut stone for 30k, the previous one I looked at didn't score well with the HCA, but still was graded GIA triple excellent.

 

[yssie]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

GIA, AGS, HCA... all tools.

Depending on what you're looking for GIA-EX is not the answer.
Depending on what you're looking for HCA "pass" is not the answer.
Depending on what you're looking for AGS0 is not the answer.

Some GIA-EXs pass HCA and have excellent optical symmetry. Some pass HCA and have poor optical symmetry.
Some GIA-EXs fail HCA and look beautiful. Some GIA-EXs fail HCA and don't look as beautiful.
Some GIA-EXs would be graded 0 if sent to AGS. Some GIA-Exs would not be graded 0 if sent to AGS. Some AGS0s would not be graded EX if sent to GIA.
Some AGS0s pass HCA and have excellent optical symmetry. Some pass HCA and have poor optical symmetry.
Some AGS0s fail HCA and look beautiful. Some AGS0s fail HCA and don't look as beautiful.
Some GIA-VGs will be prettier than some GIA-EXs and some AGS0s. Some AGS1s will be prettier than some GIA-EXs and some AGS0s.

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/gia-excellent-cut-but-5-5-hca-what-gives.169515/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/gia-excellent-cut-but-5-5-hca-what-gives.169515/[/URL]

 

[marygrace]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Blue Nile

2.59 ct RB H VS2 $35,599
GIA Grade EX/EX/EX
http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search?pt=findsimilar#diamonds_pid=LD02300147

2.47 ct RB H VS2 $35,397
GIA Grade EX/EX/EX, Heart & Arrows
http://www.bluenile.com/diamond-search?pt=findsimilar#diamonds_pid=LD02255369

 

[OCgirl]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

I think slg listed this one already.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1437549.asp
HCA: 1.4; $34k after PS discount

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

I think slg listed this one already.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1437549.asp
HCA: 1.4; $34k after PS discount

Price is within budget, but price is too high for the quality. I don't want to feel like I am over paying. That is above RAP pricing of $13,000 per carat which would make it just $32,500.

 

[soulwindy]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

@rolexman1974, I am sensitive to color, so I need to stay with at least G color.

To everyone, what about the 2.46 carat VS2 E color diamond in question for 36k? Any comments about that?

My 35k budget is not fixed, but I want to get value, and don't want to overpay so I want to stay as close to that as possible. If you recall initially, I did find some VS2 G color stones around 2.5 carats for 30k, but the HCA was not good, so I think I can definitely do it within my budget. Unless the pricing has gone up in the last month or so.

Thanks

yup,i agree

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Talked with Good Old Gold, and Whiteflash, and waiting to see what they come up with for me.

 

[TheGreatTwizz]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

I think slg listed this one already.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1437549.asp
HCA: 1.4; $34k after PS discount

Price is within budget, but price is too high for the quality. I don't want to feel like I am over paying. That is above RAP pricing of $13,000 per carat which would make it just $32,500.

Have you offered them $32.5 for that stone? Are you paying cash (wire)? There's an additional discount (below the $33,980) listed. Going by standards, that would put it at or below $33.5, and I suspect you may be able to get that additional $1k off, or have your local jeweler see if it is listed in virtual inventory and will get it for you for $32.5 (or less). Remember, RAP is a GUIDE, not a 'list'. While it's always possible to get something back, each stone will stand on its own with regard to any discounts. It being JUST at 2.5 commands a premium, as does ex/ex/ex. IF that stone is on RAPnet (which many of JA's are NOT), I wouldn't expect it to be available for more than 5-8 back, and this isn't a stone that someone has had in inventory for years and paid half of current prices.

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

What do you guys think of this one?

Priced well at $31,495 for a VS2 G color 2.51 carat round. I am a bit concerned about the strong blue fluorescence. HCA score is 2.7.

Stone specs:
GIA Cut: Excellent
GIA Polish: Excellent
GIA Symmetry: Very Good
Measurements: 8.68 x 8.72 x 5.36 mm
Table: 58 %
Depth: 61.6%
Crown angle: 35.5 degrees
Pavilion angle: 40.8 degrees
Girdle: Medium to Slightly Thick
Fluorescence: Very Strong Blue

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

I think slg listed this one already.

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/G-SI1-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1437549.asp
HCA: 1.4; $34k after PS discount

Price is within budget, but price is too high for the quality. I don't want to feel like I am over paying. That is above RAP pricing of $13,000 per carat which would make it just $32,500.

Have you offered them $32.5 for that stone? Are you paying cash (wire)? There's an additional discount (below the $33,980) listed. Going by standards, that would put it at or below $33.5, and I suspect you may be able to get that additional $1k off, or have your local jeweler see if it is listed in virtual inventory and will get it for you for $32.5 (or less). Remember, RAP is a GUIDE, not a 'list'. While it's always possible to get something back, each stone will stand on its own with regard to any discounts. It being JUST at 2.5 commands a premium, as does ex/ex/ex. IF that stone is on RAPnet (which many of JA's are NOT), I wouldn't expect it to be available for more than 5-8 back, and this isn't a stone that someone has had in inventory for years and paid half of current prices.

No, I haven't asked as I wasn't really that interested in that stone, and really want to get below RAP price. Plus, I prefer to pay by credit card for the protection and points.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

You are going to get the best price if you pay by wire, and you don't need the credit card protection if you buy from someone like James Allen, Good Old Gold, WhiteFlash, etc.

Have you asked the vendor of the 2.51 stone about the very strong blue fluorescence? They'd have to evaluate that for you to determine if the stone looks milky or cloudy. I am a fan of fluorescence because it does usually discount the price of the stone, but you do have to be cautious with very strong blue as opposed to lesser degrees of fluorescence.

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

You are going to get the best price if you pay by wire, and you don't need the credit card protection if you buy from someone like James Allen, Good Old Gold, WhiteFlash, etc.

Have you asked the vendor of the 2.51 stone about the very strong blue fluorescence? They'd have to evaluate that for you to determine if the stone looks milky or cloudy. I am a fan of fluorescence because it does usually discount the price of the stone, but you do have to be cautious with very strong blue as opposed to lesser degrees of fluorescence.

I rather get the credit card points as the marginal discount is not worth it to me. It's a virtual stone from Bluenile, so they are calling to check it for me. Aside from the fluorescence, what do you think of the stone with the 2.7 HCA?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

The very good on symmetry would concern me a little, but it might be okay. If you decide to try it, your best bet would be to have it sent directly to one of the independent appraisers such as Neil Beatty so they could evaluate the stone for you. Then if you decided against it based on their evaluation, they could send it on back to Blue Nile for you. But I think with that cut and the very strong Fluor., you will have to have an independent appraisal.

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

The very good on symmetry would concern me a little, but it might be okay. If you decide to try it, your best bet would be to have it sent directly to one of the independent appraisers such as Neil Beatty so they could evaluate the stone for you. Then if you decided against it based on their evaluation, they could send it on back to Blue Nile for you. But I think with that cut and the very strong Fluor., you will have to have an independent appraisal.

How about the proportions? Is the HCA score of over 2 a concern?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

It could be, so that is why I'd have the independent appraiser look at it. I don't think you're going to find a true ideal cut G VS2 2.5 cts. in that price range, so you have to have some negatives to get the price where you want it. An appraiser can tell you how much of a negative effect the cut has, if any.

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Hi everyone,

Previous stone turned out to be a dud. I think I found a well cut stone, but Whiteflash is telling me that the stone may not be eye clean from the side. It does look a bit "dirty" to be graded a VS2. What do you guys think? Attached is the cert. Thanks


Stone specs:
GIA Cut: Excellent
GIA Polish: Excellent
GIA Symmetry: Excellent
Measurements: 8.74 x 8.80 x 5.32 mm
Table: 57 %
Depth: 60.6%
Crown angle: 34 degrees
Pavilion angle: 40.6 degrees
Girdle: Medium to Slightly Thick
Fluorescence: None

 

[sna77]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

it's also an indented natural....

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

You can't tell a thing about how visible inclusions are by those inclusions charts. But I agree with sna, that indented natural would bother me if visible.

 

[backwardsandinheels]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Gary Holloway recently posted a well-cut H will face up whiter than a poorly cut G, so keep that in mind.

 

[AndyDiamond]

Re: Help me find a diamond, budget around 35k for 2.5 carat

Hi everyone,

I think I may have found the one. Below are the specs, and I had Whiteflash bring it in for me, so attached are the cert, and the images they took. Let me know what you guys think as I am not really sure how to look at it. To me, the arrows are off, as the base of the arrow is not aligned with the top part of the arrow, and some of the hearts are not perfectly uniform with some having a deeper cut into the curve of the heart. As far as the Idealscope, it looks OK to me, but the ASET seems to show some leakage, but I need some help in interpreting it.

Thanks in advance.

Stone specs:
GIA Cut: Excellent
GIA Polish: Excellent
GIA Symmetry: Excellent
Measurements: 8.76 x 8.82 x 5.33 mm
Table: 56 %
Depth: 60.7%
Crown angle: 34 degrees
Pavilion angle: 40.6 degrees
Girdle: Medium
Fluorescence: None