#JOTW Help find a Padparadscha for an engagement ring.

[T L]

By the way, the Africagems one that many suggested states in the description it is pinkish-orange, but the certificate states pink-orange. Would this be considered the same thing?

It's about 2mm shallower and only 1mm less wide than the finewater one (yet half the carat weight), so I think it will sit much shallower.

TL, is there an issue with this stone having an AGTA report vs AGL?

cheers!

AGTA is good, but they stopped doing lab reports for a long time. I'm not sure if you can still corroborate the report.

 

[T L]

Thanks All.

Damn. Now I'm kind of having second thoughts. I never even thought about how high it would sit. We had gone to a local jeweler to check out some rings and that was actually a concern of hers. So now....Kind of left with a conundrum. I'm hearing it's a bit pricey for what it is and it would sit too high. I haven't bought it yet, and even if I did, Gary has a 7 day return policy. Going to sleep on it first.



Oh, and I did ask about the origin. Apparently he didn't think the $200 extra was worth it since he bought it in Sri Lanka a few miles from the mine and he says African ones are more brownish. He's 100% sure it's Sri Lankan.

I like Gary, he's a really nice guy, so don't get me wrong when I say this, but I don't think dealers should just let people take their word for these things. DOCUMENTED origin on padparadchas is very important, and I think if he's charging $18K, $15K, etc. . . then what is $200 extra to get that origin? I certainly would if I were a vendor selling that stone. It's also important if you have the stone appraised for insurance replacement. Not all African stones are brownish either. I've seen some lovely African padparadchas that can compete with Ceylon material.

 

[T L]

Regarding this stone from AfricaGems:
http://www.africagems.com/sapphire-padparadsha-ja228.html

I love the color, but not the cut. I like ovals, but the cut looks asymmetrical, and that would drive me bananas. I also like ovals that are not so thin and long. I feel like fatter ovals are more aesthetically appealing when the stone is below 3 carats.

For a pad to hold it's maximum value, it needs to come with paperwork that it is from Sri Lanka.

The Asian stones are mostly native cuts, so they'll usually be wonky looking. It seems to me that this one African stone is looking better and better to me despite the smaller size. Nice color, cutting, heated, but great price. I wonder what it looks like in various light sources.

http://www.africagems.com/radiant-sapphire-ic-sa-1683.html

Also, for this stone, the GRS report that it comes with would suffice for me. With African material, I would not worry about origin. Many of these lab reports I'm seeing do not have origin for supposed Ceylon material.

You should read this article from "Modern Jeweler" by the way.

http://www.modernjeweler.com/online/article.jsp?siteSection=1&id=529&pageNum=1

Here's an excerpt:

"Nevertheless, there seems to be growing acceptance of some Tunduru fancy sapphires as padparadschas. These stones do not have the typical African undertones of brown: they have a pastel tone that has changed all the rules regarding origin and color. Undoubtedly some sapphires sold in Sri Lanka today were mined in Tanzania."

 

[Marlow]

Yes, this radiant pad from madagascar is very interesting!!!

I post the map of Pangäa before course the sapphire from Madagascar are very close to the sapphire from Sri Lanka.

And!! Many Sri Lankian buy in Madagascar and mix it with the Material from Sr Lanka - so the orign is difficult to check. I'm not sure how the labs check it. Dr Schmetzer often measure the content of Gallium or Gemanium.

The price, size and cutting is perfect for a ring - it is unheated what you wanted and again - you would save a lot of money!!

 

[T L]

Yes, this radiant pad from madagascar is very interesting!!!

I post the map of Pangäa before course the sapphire from Madagascar are very close to the sapphire from Sri Lanka.

And!! Many Sri Lankian buy in Madagascar and mix it with the Material from Sr Lanka - so the orign is difficult to check. I'm not sure how the labs check it. Dr Schmetzer often measure the content of Gallium or Gemanium.

The price, size and cutting is perfect for a ring - it is unheated what you wanted and again - you would save a lot of money!!

I think the African radiant stone is heated per GRS (code is "H"), but I wouldn't rule out heated stones, as long as nothing else was done to them.

 

[Marlow]

They sell it as unheated - otherwise I agree with you.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Another big padparadscha showed up on LoupeTroop this morning.
http://loupetroop.com/listings/loose-stones-colored-gemstone/aigs-certified-3-dot-60cts-unheated-padparadscha-sapphire-rare

 

[LoversKites]

Great find Elliot. I love the elongated shape.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Another view. I am also a fan of the elongated cushion shape!

 

[saracen]

So confused right now. Need to take a step back and just soak all this up.

I think I will just share photos with her and if she likes one then order it (make sure it has a return policy) and look at it in person.

I do like the one on loupe troop. Unsure of return policy and reputation though. Plus, I think it's too pink for her. She loves the pinkish/orange.

 

[saracen]

Lol. 6.5mm is not that high off the finger as far as these things go! Have the stone set as low as possible. My highest set ring is roughly 10mm from the finger (and these are my reasonably sized rings, not my 8+ ct blue topaz, which is 14-15mm high) and my lowest set ring (my engagement ring) is about 4mm off the finger. One of my favorite rings, a supernova spinel, is set about 6.5mm off the finger, and it's never something that I'd consider bothersome. Have the jeweler set it "as low as possible" and "with the culet just above her finger" and you're good to go.

Just for fun, single best pad sapphire ring I've seen: https://www.pricescope.com/communit...-by-richard-wise-setting-by-leon-mege.127094/

That's actually one of the ones my girl-friend had sent me a photo of stating she loved the design and color.

 

[T L]

Another view. I am also a fan of the elongated cushion shape!

Yes, but the face up size is very large in comparison to Gary's stone. At least there's no window, but for $15K it should have an AGL lab report, and origin. I would forego origin on any African stone.

Why are these people not getting origin for Sri Lankan material?

People always yell and scream at me for bringing this up, but I only do so because searching for a fine padparadscha is so difficult. Why not look at orangy pink spinels too? Some can be very pretty, and they're a lot less costly, and there's not as many pitfalls, treatment, origin issues. I love padparadschas as much as the next person and I would love to own a fine one, but searching for the right one can be very perilous. If all she likes is the color, and having the prestige of owning a true padparadscha doesn't matter, then I would also look at spinels. You might just find the color you want. I have several orangy pink spinels, and a simple gem brief from AIGS would suffice. They're also very hard, durable, and have a beautiful luster, especially when well cut.

Look at the second row of gems here. The one all the way on the right is indistinguishable from some padparadschas I've seen, and isn't too pink.

http://www.gemfix.com/spinel.html

 

[saracen]

Understood. It's not just about the look. It's an engagement ring and would like it to be something more special.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Lots of PSers have very special spinel engagement rings. If she wants the trade name and the premium it comes with, I echo what TL is saying about Sri Lankan origin on the certification. See if Gary will get an AGL prestige report with origin requested as part of the purchase price (if that is the stone you have decided on).

 

[saracen]

Gary is willing to do the Origin on the report. Will take a few weeks, but that would be okay.

I may contact loupe troop for some more images of that stone, but I'm guessing it's a bit more pink than she'd like. But it's unheated and same price as the Finewater.

 

[Niel]

Another big padparadscha showed up on LoupeTroop this morning.
http://loupetroop.com/listings/loose-stones-colored-gemstone/aigs-certified-3-dot-60cts-unheated-padparadscha-sapphire-rare

I love this.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Gary is willing to do the Origin on the report. Will take a few weeks, but that would be okay.

I may contact loupe troop for some more images of that stone, but I'm guessing it's a bit more pink than she'd like. But it's unheated and same price as the Finewater.

Per the LT description:
"PS. A rare piece for this size and color, in its purest UNHEATED state. In real life, it leans towards the orange color. It will look fantastic set in rose gold. Absolutely no traces of brown or any other modifier."

You keep saying she isn't too keen on pink tones, but TGal's ring you have as your example stone definitely favors a strong pink hue... Would she maybe prefer something like a spessartite?

 

[VapidLapid]

Chictomato used to post on Ps.
Both LT pads look a little purpley to me. I don't like them sleepy or silky. I know Im odd man out, but I actually prefer sapphires to be cut deeper, and in steps rather than brilliants. the Africagems one also looks a little purpley to me; would need to see it in person in different lights to make sure it doesnt have brown.

 

[OreoRosies86]

To clarify I guess I am confused because you say she doesn't want a primarily pink stone but used TGal's ring as the basis for wanting a padparadscha in the first place. You've picked a very particular kind of stone that doesn't play nicely with cameras. She may be better off picking from a lineup of sapphires instead of saying yes to a photo stone unseen.

Some more of TGal's ring

 

[OreoRosies86]

They are definitely chameleons...

 

[LoversKites]

Gary is willing to do the Origin on the report. Will take a few weeks, but that would be okay.

I may contact loupe troop for some more images of that stone, but I'm guessing it's a bit more pink than she'd like. But it's unheated and same price as the Finewater.

I think the price is lower because it's pre-owned. The major downside is that it's probably a final sale, i.e no returns, but inquire with the seller first as this is not always the case. Maybe if you describe the situation and link her to this thread she will give you a return window.

Notice in the description it says 'In real life, it leans towards the orange color'. The description is important as gems are very difficult to photograph accurately. It sounds like it's less pink IRL.

You could always buy the Finewater one, observe it, and return it if it doesn't make your or your GF's heart sing. I really think seeing something IRL will help make you know what you want more clearly. For this though, the origin report will have to wait.

I can imagine how overwhelming a lot of new information is, but you'll survive and have a lovely stone to prove it.

 

[LoversKites]

Elliot, I think spess is too soft for a daily wear engagement ring. Spinel would be a better idea if Saracen is open to it, though it does do better in pinks rather than orange, huh?

 

[OreoRosies86]

Elliot, I think spess is too soft for a daily wear engagement ring. Spinel would be a better idea if Saracen is open to it, though it does do better in pinks rather than orange, huh?

Its a 7 on the moh scale. Spinel is what, 7.5? Of course I'm not basing this on much other than MovieZombie's amazing orange spessartite engagement ring.

Maybe a bright fanta orange sapphire?

 

[chrono]

Spinel is 8 on the MOH scale and given that the scale is not linear but rather a J line, the difference between 7 and 8 is bigger than one might think. A garnet as an e-ring will need to be babied.

 

[aljdewey]

http://loupetroop.com/listings/loose-stones-colored-gemstone/3-dot-35ct-unheated-agl-certified-padparadscha-sapphire
This one also has potential but my concern is that the sale is final AND there is clarity enhancement that warrants further questioning.

I don't get it - what are you guys seeing on that listing that I don't see re clarity enhancement?

I see the photo of the AGL grading report, and where it says Additional, it also says "Clarity enhancements: None"

?????

 

[chrono]

http://loupetroop.com/listings/loose-stones-colored-gemstone/3-dot-35ct-unheated-agl-certified-padparadscha-sapphire
This one also has potential but my concern is that the sale is final AND there is clarity enhancement that warrants further questioning.

I don't get it - what are you guys seeing on that listing that I don't see re clarity enhancement?
I see the photo of the AGL grading report, and where it says Additional, it also says "Clarity enhancements: None"
?????

The listing has been updated to show the full declaration, which is "Clarity Enhancement: None". Prior, the word "None" was cut off in the photograph.

 

[OTL]

http://loupetroop.com/listings/loose-stones-colored-gemstone/3-dot-35ct-unheated-agl-certified-padparadscha-sapphire
This one also has potential but my concern is that the sale is final AND there is clarity enhancement that warrants further questioning.

She must have seen this thread because she just updated the listing to state it's not treated at all. Evidently the AGL reports always say "Clarity Enhancement" first, and then in this case, it probably says "None" as in the Finewater AGL report.

I wish the origin was on the report, but for the price, it's a good deal.

Sorry for not showing full report, the clarity enhancement is none. Just want to clarify that Anyway, I have sent OP more photos and report picture (or whoever contacted me yesterday). TL, I didn't ask for origin because I know it is from ceylon, it's bought from a local guy, and has a local certificate as well. To be honest I didn't think origin is that much important for pad sapphire until now.

OP: I hope you can find the ideal pad sapphire for the special girl.

 

[OTL]

OK, I will remain silent now.

 

[aljdewey]

OTL - where in Canada are you?

 

[OTL]

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