Oh! And need another advice...Tsavorite.

[Arkteia]

The owner of a local store called me and told that they had a tsavorite for sale. $ 1000/ct, 3.2 cts, oval cut. They said it was "not deep, light-green, it is bluish but also a little bit yellowish like the demantoids that you like". I do not think yellowish is a desirable modifier in tsavorites, but what do I know? They have fluorescent light and promised to take pictures outside, inside, with fluorescent and incandescent light. I am going to post them here and ask your opinion. I have two small dangling tsavorite earrings, they maybe slightly on a darker side, but beautiful, like better emeralds. And no yellowish. But since I never saw larger tsavorites - what would you advise me to look for? Is the price OK for this stone? Too high? Too low?

 

[MAC-W]

Date: 1/26/2010 4:08:14 AM
Author:crasru
The owner of a local store called me and told that they had a tsavorite for sale. $ 1000/ct, 3.2 cts, oval cut. They said it was 'not deep, light-green, it is bluish but also a little bit yellowish like the demantoids that you like'. I do not think yellowish is a desirable modifier in tsavorites, but what do I know? They have fluorescent light and promised to take pictures outside, inside, with fluorescent and incandescent light. I am going to post them here and ask your opinion. I have two small dangling tsavorite earrings, they maybe slightly on a darker side, but beautiful, like better emeralds. And no yellowish. But since I never saw larger tsavorites - what would you advise me to look for? Is the price OK for this stone? Too high? Too low?

If it has a yellowish tint I would say its too high a price, but I'm only just starting to investigate Tsavorite, so I maybe wrong. Certainly all the research I've done so far seems to indicate yellow is bad and you should be looking for a stone that is lime-green to emerald-green, the best being emerald-green.

Richard Wise in his book Secrets of the Gem Trade says that in personnal communication in 1995 Campbell Bridges identified three mixtures of hue which in his opinion "describe the finest colors in tsavorite garnet: forest, water and grass green. Forest green is visually bluish, eighty-five to ninety percent green, ten to fifteen percent blue. Water green appears a bit yellowish: seventy-five percent green, fifteen percent yellow, and ten percent blue. Standing between the two is grass or leaf green, a visually pure green which contains eighty percent green green hue with approximately equal amounts of yellow and blue".

RW goes on to say "In fact the market tends to favour bluish green stones and I agree. A visually pure green with perhaps fifteen percent secondary blue hue and between seventy-five and eighty percent tone is probably ideal"


Hope this helps, but at the end of the day its all about what YOU like. If you like this stone, perhaps the above quotes might help you negotiate on the price.

 

[chrono]

I am a little confused. How can it be bluish and a little bit yellowish at the same time. It is one or the other, not both, unless he means that it shifts one way and the other way depending on the lighting condition. The reason I say it cannot be both at the same time is because green is made up of blue and yellow. Therefore it is either very slightly bluish green or slightly yellowish green. There is also the possibility of it not being able to hold its colour under certain lighting (usually indoors) and showing a hint of yellow then.

 

[LD]

You really need to see a number of Tsavs in real life if you can. Some people prefer the yellowish tones, some blue but you won''t know until you''ve actually seen them and the colour play. I wouldn''t buy a 3ct stone for $3,000 without being 100% sure I was going to love it. Tsavs (good ones) increase price in accordance with size and the preferred colour is one with a blue tone (and no yellow) but that doesn''t mean that it''ll be your preference! Also, Tsavs are not difficult to find so take your time.

 

[Harriet]

I''m concerned about the "light green" bit. You don''t want it to be so light that it''s actually a green grossular.

 

[PrecisionGem]

A 3 ct stone at $1000 per ct is a good price. Actually that would be a typical wholesale price for a good stone that size.

Tsavorites tend to look more to the colder (blue side) in daylight, and warmer (yellow) in incandescent light.

 

[Arkteia]

OK here is what I shall do. Assuming TL''s tsavorites are as good as one can get, I shall get my pictures and the owner''s puctures as well and compare them to what TL has. Someone here has mentioned tsavorite "glowing". Is it neon-like? (I don''t think so). Or is it fluoresence in fluorescent light?
The store opens by 11 AM so I have some time to ask my questions.

 

[Gailey]

Crasu, there are many tsavorites belonging to Pricescopers. Here's a selection.


Sparkles tsavorite
Moosejaw's tsavorite
Portia's tsavorite
Other tsavorites including one from Lisa Elser that is available
Making the Grade's tsavorite
Tsavvy's tsavorite
Rising Sun's tsavorite
Pokey's tsavorite
Harriet's tsavorite
Pandora's tsavorite
Chrono's tsavorite

 

[Gailey]

And here is a montage of the tsavorites in the links above. I put them all in one place so you can compare them to the one you are considering.

 

[chrono]

Gailey,
Thanks for posting an example picture of my tsavorite but I am aghast at the very poor quality of my picture. If you don’t mind, these are clearer and show the colour a little better as well.

 

[chrono]

Requisite hand shot.

 

[LD]

Date: 1/26/2010 11:57:42 AM
Author: crasru
OK here is what I shall do. Assuming TL''s tsavorites are as good as one can get, I shall get my pictures and the owner''s puctures as well and compare them to what TL has. Someone here has mentioned tsavorite ''glowing''. Is it neon-like? (I don''t think so). Or is it fluoresence in fluorescent light?
The store opens by 11 AM so I have some time to ask my questions.

No - forget fluorescence. Most don''t flouresce. It depends on the chemical composition.

Is it neon-like? Not normally. They perform very well and glitter beautifully but neon isn''t a word I would normally associate with a Tsavorite.

If you look at the montage Gailey posted above, you''ll see that some of the Tsavs are much darker than others. There are collectors who prefer the medium/darker green and those who prefer the much lighter tones. They will also perform differently and, I know you''re sensitive to extinction, so bear that in mind also.

 

[Gailey]

I should say in my defence that I wasn''t too picky about whose tsavorites I selected. Speed was of the essence and it took me best part of an hour and a half to find the links and put together the montage (I am so going to be in trouble for not doing my chores

).

So if I''ve missed anyone out, I apologise.

 

[Harriet]

Crasru,
Tsavorites don''t ''glow.'' As for fluorescence, they exhibit some in short-wave UV. Gailey has assembled a range for you to look at. The colour of Pandora''s is the industry ideal. But, colour is subjective. So, if you prefer a different tone or saturation, it''ll be less inexpensive for you! Good luck.

 

[Gailey]

Date: 1/26/2010 2:57:41 PM
Author: Harriet
Crasru,
Tsavorites don''t ''glow.'' As for fluorescence, they exhibit some in short-wave UV. Gailey has assembled a range for you to look at. The colour of Pandora''s is the industry ideal. But, colour is subjective. So, if you prefer a different tone or saturation, it''ll be less inexpensive for you! Good luck.

Harriet makes a good point. Here is a picture of another one of her tsavorites (geez - just how many does a girl need???) and mine. I think mine was a tad cheaper than Harriet''s!

 

[T L]

Date: 1/26/2010 11:57:42 AM
Author: crasru
OK here is what I shall do. Assuming TL''s tsavorites are as good as one can get, I shall get my pictures and the owner''s puctures as well and compare them to what TL has. Someone here has mentioned tsavorite ''glowing''. Is it neon-like? (I don''t think so). Or is it fluoresence in fluorescent light?
The store opens by 11 AM so I have some time to ask my questions.

Are you talking about TL, as in me???

Confused.

BTW, green is exceptionately difficult to photograph, so many of the beautiful tsavorites here appear slightly olive in the photos, and I know they are probably not. I wish we could capture what they really looked like IRL. I know that many prefer medium dark tone, but I think the medium tone of some tsavorites is delicious as well. Like Harriet said, you don''t want them so light that they no longer look like a tsavorite, but a green grossular. I think Harriet and Gailey both have nice tonalities to their stones since both are both saturated. One is just lighter than the other, nothing wrong with that as long as it''s saturated in color, and not too light.

Many people also prefer the ones that stay blue in all lighting and do not shift towards yellow, and I believe that the ones with less of a color shift to yellow, command a higher price per carat, all else being equal.

 

[Gailey]

I don''t want to get into the whole grossular vs tsavorite debate again. If Crasu desires, she can find that thread. However, I do want to show her the differences. Here is how the Gemology Project describes Grossular

And here is a picture of a grossular garnet, sometimes referred to as a Merelani mint garnet. Picture courtesey of Ben Pfeiffer.

 

[T L]

Date: 1/26/2010 3:43:43 PM
Author: Gailey
I don''t want to get into the whole grossular vs tsavorite debate again. If Crasu desires, she can find that thread. However, I do want to show her the differences. Here is how the Gemology Project describes Grossular

And here is a picture of a grossular garnet, sometimes referred to as a Merelani mint garnet. Picture courtesey of Ben Pfeiffer.

Gailey, you''re a mind reader!!

I was just thinking about how much I love Merelani mints. I love medium light toned grossulars that are slightly bluish green. These are not really considered tsavorites to some. However they are still beautiful if well saturated. Chrono''s tsavorite has so much blue in it, that if it were a lighter in tone, it would probably be classified as a mint garnet.

 

[Arkteia]

Holy...I am in Pennsylvanian forest again. Thank you, Gailey. And everyone else! Now these guys have moved so I have to find that e-mail and off to the store.
LD, I shall remember all of your advices. Cut, and everything else, too.

 

[Harriet]

That photograph of my oval is not a good representation. It's a medium-dark, but does not go extinct, nor does my smaller cushion.

Crasru,
I'm slightly obsessed with Tsavorite and have seen hundreds of carats worth. Don't expect any secondary blue to be strong, unlike, say, a blue-Green tourmaline. With due respect to TL, Tsavorites do not shift colour (or secondary). Also, ask yourself if this stone is for collection or consumption. The medium-darks are what collectors want. But, if you're buying for consumption, buy what YOU like. If it's a medium, go for it! Lastly, quality Tsavorites are rare and do be prepared for sticker shocked.

 

[T L]

Date: 1/26/2010 4:17:05 PM
Author: Harriet
That photograph of my oval is not a good representation. It''s a medium-dark, but does not go extinct, nor does my smaller cushion.

Crasru,
I''m slightly obsessed with Tsavorite and have seen hundreds of carats worth. Don''t expect any secondary blue to be strong, unlike, say, a blue-Green tourmaline. With due respect to TL, Tsavorites do not shift colour (or secondary). Also, ask yourself if this stone is for collection or consumption. The medium-darks are what collectors want. But, if you''re buying for consumption, buy what YOU like. If it''s a medium, go for it! Lastly, quality Tsavorites are rare and do be prepared for sticker shocked.

Harriet,
Richard Hughes, in his tsavorite buying guide, stated that they tend to go yellower in certain lighting, and Chrono noted that as well on several she looked at while shopping around for one, so when I say "shift color," I was referring to the tendency to show more yellow in certain lighting. Some tend to hold their color better.

 

[rosetta]

ok ok so i need a tsavorite.

i actually like the medium to light color.

cushion or oval.

any vendors i should look at?

 

[Harriet]

TL,

I trusted that you were using "colour shift" in its technical sense. As for tsavorites that do not hold their colour, maybe I''m just lucky that I have never encountered one.

 

[RockHugger]

OOOOh, pretty tsavs!!! I actually like the grossular garnet alot though! I know nothing about tsavs....except they are green lol. But I hope you can find one that is a good price!

 

[Gailey]

Date: 1/26/2010 4:34:27 PM
Author: rosetta
ok ok so i need a tsavorite.

i actually like the medium to light color.

cushion or oval.

any vendors i should look at?

Swala Gem Traders
Peter Torraca - has a small but beautiful stone listed.
Lisa Elser - has a gorgeous one listed, but has just come back from Tanzania with more tsavorite rough.
Gene Flannigan - always seems to have a regular supply.
John B -vNice oval medium green on page 2
Gemline
Pala Gems - You will need a jeweller to call any stone in for you, wholesale only.
Richard Homer

 

[rosetta]

thanks gailey!

 

[chrono]

Date: 1/26/2010 4:55:47 PM
Author: Harriet
TL,

I trusted that you were using ''colour shift'' in its technical sense. As for tsavorites that do not hold their colour, maybe I''m just lucky that I have never encountered one.

Harriet,
While shopping around, I encountered one tsav that turned yellower under fluorescent lighting. I also saw several that held their colour very well under fluorescent lighting as well.

 

[Harriet]

Chrono,
I don''t doubt your word. I''m really puzzled as none of the stones I''ve handled have ever done this.

 

[chrono]

I would say that you have been fortunate to only handle very fine quality tsavorites.

I was puzzled by this slight shift which prompted me to do further research, including contacting a highly esteemed & world reknowned coloured stone expert, author and gemologist. He assured me that it is normal for most tsavorites to show some hints of yellow under indoor lighting. It is not a characteristic which I like though, so I kept looking until I found some that held their colour under all lighting conditions.

 

[Arcadian]

Date: 1/26/2010 9:21:48 PM
Author: Chrono
I would say that you have been fortunate to only handle very fine quality tsavorites.

I was puzzled by this slight shift which prompted me to do further research, including contacting a highly esteemed & world reknowned coloured stone expert, author and gemologist. He assured me that it is normal for most tsavorites to show some hints of yellow under indoor lighting.

Really? Mines a medium colored stone, def. not dark anywhere (unless I put my big head over it) It tends to go toward the bluer coloration in the incandescent an fluoro indoor light, as does LD''s does the same apparently....

I wonder what causes that to happen?

-A