Burberrygirl
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2009
- Messages
- 1,656
Welcome to PS Tapio!
The Natural Sapphire Company
- Thread starter tapio
- Start date
- Status
Lovinggems
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2009
- Messages
- 3,622
I love the pins, welcome Tapio.
tapio
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2009
- Messages
- 101
I know it''s still early in the morning, but I would like to thank those of you who have welcomed me. Honestly, I had no idea I would have the reaction I would have.
As the website says, "trying to counsel people in the gem market." Which is very daunting and scary indeed, and terribly difficult to find someone you trust. But, search I did for not a few years: through cheap Wal-Marts, Tiffany''s, Winston''s, one-two man shops; until I was in NYC and actually visited these premises. I like to make sure things are real.
I know there are gemstones cutters and goldsmiths on this site - some of whom I have seen their work and really like their craftsmanship. I would mention them by name if it was proper to do so.
It was just not fair to have so much "slagging" (U.K. term for bad talk) about one company the, NSC, when they are a good company, honest as the day is long, and work very hard. I will not engage in slagging. Only compliments where they are deserved.
Most people on this forum seem to be the same way; thank you.
My pointers for coloured stones:
1. research stones (The Smithsonian Handbooks Gemstones is pretty good, get a 10''xs loupe and tweezers), find out what you like (it doesn''t have to be big and expensive to be beautiful) (I found out I much preferred tsavorite over emerald -- the refractive index is closer to diamond so it sparkles more like diamond, when you get a good piece, it is clean and much more stable to work with and the colour really can be like the sun dappling through the leaves on a spring day); (just like a good star sapphire is like a beautiful clear summer day with the odd mares-tail cloud floating by and when that star shines in the sun -- watch out it will mesmerize you - get a deep full-bodied star; not a pancake{stars are much underrated because jewellers can get more for their buck by cutting-but, historically it is Helen of Troy and The Sir Richard Burton who always kept a blue star with them for good luck, Helen never did die in the war she went back to King Menaleaus.
2. know the questions to ask,
3. find out the treatments,
4. go to a few gemstone classes (you''re generally going to be making a large investment in the stones - so a couple of classes will only do you good,
5. trust the experts, one-on-one,
6. remember, the middle man has got to make some money,
7. Unless you''re truly an expert like Campbell Bridges was who discovered Tanzaite and tsavorite, and is now dead from poachers, count your lucky stars your only paying a mark-up and not with your life in the mines. He died and many miners die every year - it''s a horrid business in the field.
8. With corundom remember there are really only a few square miles on this planet that produce really top-notch stones -- that is why they are expensive.
9. Let''s all be thankful we are in a position to enjoy these little marvels of nature.
10. I apologize for my typing, I need to clean my keyboard,
11. Lastly, those that questioned my knowledge I am a PH.D. (c) and now how to research.
Again, for those of you that have welcomed me I am grateful and hope my "proof is in the pudding". And those that have criticised me - I have seen some of your very good work, but now am apprehensive regarding stating your names.
All this shall pass.
Tapio
As the website says, "trying to counsel people in the gem market." Which is very daunting and scary indeed, and terribly difficult to find someone you trust. But, search I did for not a few years: through cheap Wal-Marts, Tiffany''s, Winston''s, one-two man shops; until I was in NYC and actually visited these premises. I like to make sure things are real.
I know there are gemstones cutters and goldsmiths on this site - some of whom I have seen their work and really like their craftsmanship. I would mention them by name if it was proper to do so.
It was just not fair to have so much "slagging" (U.K. term for bad talk) about one company the, NSC, when they are a good company, honest as the day is long, and work very hard. I will not engage in slagging. Only compliments where they are deserved.
Most people on this forum seem to be the same way; thank you.
My pointers for coloured stones:
1. research stones (The Smithsonian Handbooks Gemstones is pretty good, get a 10''xs loupe and tweezers), find out what you like (it doesn''t have to be big and expensive to be beautiful) (I found out I much preferred tsavorite over emerald -- the refractive index is closer to diamond so it sparkles more like diamond, when you get a good piece, it is clean and much more stable to work with and the colour really can be like the sun dappling through the leaves on a spring day); (just like a good star sapphire is like a beautiful clear summer day with the odd mares-tail cloud floating by and when that star shines in the sun -- watch out it will mesmerize you - get a deep full-bodied star; not a pancake{stars are much underrated because jewellers can get more for their buck by cutting-but, historically it is Helen of Troy and The Sir Richard Burton who always kept a blue star with them for good luck, Helen never did die in the war she went back to King Menaleaus.
2. know the questions to ask,
3. find out the treatments,
4. go to a few gemstone classes (you''re generally going to be making a large investment in the stones - so a couple of classes will only do you good,
5. trust the experts, one-on-one,
6. remember, the middle man has got to make some money,
7. Unless you''re truly an expert like Campbell Bridges was who discovered Tanzaite and tsavorite, and is now dead from poachers, count your lucky stars your only paying a mark-up and not with your life in the mines. He died and many miners die every year - it''s a horrid business in the field.
8. With corundom remember there are really only a few square miles on this planet that produce really top-notch stones -- that is why they are expensive.
9. Let''s all be thankful we are in a position to enjoy these little marvels of nature.
10. I apologize for my typing, I need to clean my keyboard,
11. Lastly, those that questioned my knowledge I am a PH.D. (c) and now how to research.
Again, for those of you that have welcomed me I am grateful and hope my "proof is in the pudding". And those that have criticised me - I have seen some of your very good work, but now am apprehensive regarding stating your names.
All this shall pass.
Tapio
tapio
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2009
- Messages
- 101
You''ve hit the nail on the head. They are not common today. Yet I feel there is an entire realm of masculine male jewelry out there as a market. It is truly an individual statement. I do not mean the Elton John jewelry or Bling Bling; but tidy, neat, conservative jewelry for men.
Tapio
Tapio
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2004
- Messages
- 38,364
Hello Tapio,
I’m sorry your very first post on PS was fraught with suspicion and accusation. I think it is because your post sounded shrilly and we’ve had a few bad cases of vendors posting on PS pretending to be satisfied consumers in order to drum up extra business. As a result of this prior experience, a few of the older posters tend to be overly cautious. As a consumer, you are not limited by rules that vendors are and you are indeed free to admire and share the names and pictures of cutters, goldsmiths and vendors whose work you like. You are absolutely correct that it does not have to be big to be beautiful; something with excellent or fine colour will speak for itself even if it is only the size of a melee stone.
I’m sorry your very first post on PS was fraught with suspicion and accusation. I think it is because your post sounded shrilly and we’ve had a few bad cases of vendors posting on PS pretending to be satisfied consumers in order to drum up extra business. As a result of this prior experience, a few of the older posters tend to be overly cautious. As a consumer, you are not limited by rules that vendors are and you are indeed free to admire and share the names and pictures of cutters, goldsmiths and vendors whose work you like. You are absolutely correct that it does not have to be big to be beautiful; something with excellent or fine colour will speak for itself even if it is only the size of a melee stone.
morecarats
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2009
- Messages
- 371
With all due respect to Campbell Bridges, while he did discover tsavorite garnet in Tanzania and Kenya, he was not the discoverer of tanzanite. According to the biography on his website, he was in Tanzania when tanzanite was discovered and consulted with many of the tanzanite miners. He was the first one to bring tanzanite to the USA.
www.tsavorite.com/history/campbell-bridges.html
www.tsavorite.com/history/campbell-bridges.html
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2004
- Messages
- 38,364
I love pins very much and would gladly wear them as I see pins as being very elegant and sophisticated. I am just too self conscious to wear them because I know many would stare, with pins being worn by certain people only and for certain occasions only giving the connotation of being stuffy.
- Joined
- Apr 26, 2007
- Messages
- 8,087
Oh, wow, Tapio - those are beautiful! I especially love the pin with the stand-alone blue - that looks like a gorgeous star!
BTW, I quite agree with you about male jewelry: I think it''s such a shame that men''s clothing was so drab for many years. I''m rejoicing to see color and accessories come back into fashion for men ....
BTW, I quite agree with you about male jewelry: I think it''s such a shame that men''s clothing was so drab for many years. I''m rejoicing to see color and accessories come back into fashion for men ....
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2009
- Messages
- 13,053
The tsavorite I have in my ring was from Mr. Bridges'' mines, it''s such a shame to hear he was victim of such a violent crime.
Lovely pins Tapio. Although having grown up in a "jeans and tshirt" generation, could someone post a photo of how one wears a pin? I honestly haven''t the slightest clue how a man wears a pin...
Lovely pins Tapio. Although having grown up in a "jeans and tshirt" generation, could someone post a photo of how one wears a pin? I honestly haven''t the slightest clue how a man wears a pin...
tapio
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2009
- Messages
- 101
From Tapio:
I would be happy to show people how to wear tie/stick pins with ties and without being stuffy and to be able to wear them with jeans. I do both. None of my friends consider me stuffy or uptight. Men, it is okay to wear conservative jewelry and not feel like you''re sticking out.
Now, use common sense; if you''re wearing a really good piece in NYC in Central Park at night -- you''re not using common sense. And, Central Park is way better than it was 30 years ago! Love NYC.
I would be happy to show people how to wear tie/stick pins with ties and without being stuffy and to be able to wear them with jeans. I do both. None of my friends consider me stuffy or uptight. Men, it is okay to wear conservative jewelry and not feel like you''re sticking out.
Now, use common sense; if you''re wearing a really good piece in NYC in Central Park at night -- you''re not using common sense. And, Central Park is way better than it was 30 years ago! Love NYC.
movie zombie
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2005
- Messages
- 11,879
ah, Tapio, i find in you another soul mate: color stones requires education Education EDUCATION. welcome aboard!
i echo that i think hackles were raised due to the brevity of the first post. it really did read like an unsolicited ad.........again, welcome aboard. your language describing your love of tsav is poetic!
mz
i echo that i think hackles were raised due to the brevity of the first post. it really did read like an unsolicited ad.........again, welcome aboard. your language describing your love of tsav is poetic!
mz
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2008
- Messages
- 10,261
In a lepel Chrono!Date: 12/15/2009 12:39:30 PM
Author: Chrono
And if you don''t mind, also how wears one sans a tie.
Welcome Tapio. You''re amongst fellow collectors on this forum and we all share your sentiments about gemstone buying. I think you''ll find there are many of us like-minded souls who are extremely careful about what we buy and from whom!
Lovely pins by the way!
movie zombie
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2005
- Messages
- 11,879
coat lapel?Date: 12/15/2009 12:39:30 PM
Author: Chrono
And if you don''t mind, also how wears one sans a tie.
hat pin?
mz
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2004
- Messages
- 38,364
Is a coat lapel the only place? I don’t wear hats, although I wish everyone did.Date: 12/15/2009 2:58:55 PM
Author: movie zombie
coat lapel?Date: 12/15/2009 12:39:30 PM
Author: Chrono
And if you don''t mind, also how wears one sans a tie.
hat pin?
mz
StonieGrl
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2009
- Messages
- 647
Since the politics/danger of mining and gemstone acquisition was raised here, I am going to add my voice to say that the local native miners don''t reap the profits, working conditions are horrifying and dangerous, and in most cases the goverment and nonnative mining entities get the much larger portion of the end result.
I did think it was a sad way for Campbell Bridges to die and certainly wrong but he knew the risks and continued on. Why? Huge profit. He made a judgement that he had that situation under control and he guessed wrong.
Most of the natives or indigenous people in gemstone locations live lives of horrifying poverty, terrible infant mortality, and early mortality if you make it to adulthood. Balancing that off against privateering for gemstones, you can see why the terrible anger exists amoung the locals.
I did think it was a sad way for Campbell Bridges to die and certainly wrong but he knew the risks and continued on. Why? Huge profit. He made a judgement that he had that situation under control and he guessed wrong.
Most of the natives or indigenous people in gemstone locations live lives of horrifying poverty, terrible infant mortality, and early mortality if you make it to adulthood. Balancing that off against privateering for gemstones, you can see why the terrible anger exists amoung the locals.
tapio
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2009
- Messages
- 101
Well Tapio here,
I guess it''s my turn to reply. Starting with the last comment. You are correct. Most natives live in appalling and dangerous conditions and they are taken advantage of by greedy people. I agree Campbell knew what he was getting into, but after talking to him and his son in July and August -- they did have the support of the government. Enough politics. If you research Campbell Bridges had set up many positive ways for the natives to help themselves and many, many native peoples knew that. But, again greed, avarice and poachers. He paid the ultimate price so we can have our coloured stones. And, you''re right he brought tanzanite to N.A. with Henry Platt of Tiffany''s. Never the less, if you knew him he was an adventerous,kind, caring soul. He did not deserve to die by machete hacking.
Again, if one looks at these problems through the long term they are very real vestiges of Imperial Colonialism (I''m not going leftist here). Counties that were colonies still feel resentment to their colonial past masters. Can one blame that after the atrocities that took place -- I don''t think we can. But, we do have to try to begin to get along in this world: wether it''s your neighbour or a different country.
Sorry, it''s difficult to get it all right the first time.
Now, wearing tie pins: I have enclosed four photos. They are not in focus and my face is not shown on purpose - I hope you understand for obvious reasons. I also usually wear a waistcoat which can work with formal or informal. I used to have a Harley Davidson chain in my pocket for wallet and keys. But, not find a waistcoat more practical because without a chain I''m always losing my wallet and car keys -- seriously. So that''s why I wear that. My students also think it''s fun: somedays I look like a cowboy other days they call the navy blazer a tux. They are not to chided - they are children and just think it''s fun and why not have fun in life! Some of my students actually wear ties now, some will wear a blazer. They all want to experiment with their individual personas and when you''re young is the time to do it.
Also, as a teacher, when I wear a tie pin it has a dare I say (as uneducated as it is) a magical calming affect on the people/students around. I know when they are looking. I don''t care. They listen and pay attention. I never have to raise my voice and they are all wonderful students - all 300 I teach.
Now wearing them: there are 4 photos. Two informal, tie pin on collar and two formal on ties. On a tie they are usually higher up and just below the dimple of the tie. The downward pin is to keep your tie attached to your shirt so it doesn''t flop about. If you wear a waistcoat not a problem. My wife has worn them as broaches and adores them.
It is extremely important that you have two safety catches on each pin, you cannot afford to loose one of these;even if they are insured. So I always have a top and bottom clutch. Mike and Joe at NSC helped to develop these with me. Anyone can use the ideas. Remember these pins have been a 3 year project of trial and error; since most of this knowledge has been lost from "goldsmithing". I have a few of my ancestors from the mid to late 1800''s with them wearing them so I had a good starting point.
I would not have them made out of palladium as it can be soft, just like I would never have them made from anything more than 18 ct. gold. Silver, 14 ct. brass coated, whatever you want. Mine weigh in at about 1 1/4 - 2 oz. That''s heavy metal. Maybe a bit of overkill, but I wanted substantial pieces. And, it happened.
Okay enough waiting pictures:
Tapio
Feel free to ask questions
I guess it''s my turn to reply. Starting with the last comment. You are correct. Most natives live in appalling and dangerous conditions and they are taken advantage of by greedy people. I agree Campbell knew what he was getting into, but after talking to him and his son in July and August -- they did have the support of the government. Enough politics. If you research Campbell Bridges had set up many positive ways for the natives to help themselves and many, many native peoples knew that. But, again greed, avarice and poachers. He paid the ultimate price so we can have our coloured stones. And, you''re right he brought tanzanite to N.A. with Henry Platt of Tiffany''s. Never the less, if you knew him he was an adventerous,kind, caring soul. He did not deserve to die by machete hacking.
Again, if one looks at these problems through the long term they are very real vestiges of Imperial Colonialism (I''m not going leftist here). Counties that were colonies still feel resentment to their colonial past masters. Can one blame that after the atrocities that took place -- I don''t think we can. But, we do have to try to begin to get along in this world: wether it''s your neighbour or a different country.
Sorry, it''s difficult to get it all right the first time.
Now, wearing tie pins: I have enclosed four photos. They are not in focus and my face is not shown on purpose - I hope you understand for obvious reasons. I also usually wear a waistcoat which can work with formal or informal. I used to have a Harley Davidson chain in my pocket for wallet and keys. But, not find a waistcoat more practical because without a chain I''m always losing my wallet and car keys -- seriously. So that''s why I wear that. My students also think it''s fun: somedays I look like a cowboy other days they call the navy blazer a tux. They are not to chided - they are children and just think it''s fun and why not have fun in life! Some of my students actually wear ties now, some will wear a blazer. They all want to experiment with their individual personas and when you''re young is the time to do it.
Also, as a teacher, when I wear a tie pin it has a dare I say (as uneducated as it is) a magical calming affect on the people/students around. I know when they are looking. I don''t care. They listen and pay attention. I never have to raise my voice and they are all wonderful students - all 300 I teach.
Now wearing them: there are 4 photos. Two informal, tie pin on collar and two formal on ties. On a tie they are usually higher up and just below the dimple of the tie. The downward pin is to keep your tie attached to your shirt so it doesn''t flop about. If you wear a waistcoat not a problem. My wife has worn them as broaches and adores them.
It is extremely important that you have two safety catches on each pin, you cannot afford to loose one of these;even if they are insured. So I always have a top and bottom clutch. Mike and Joe at NSC helped to develop these with me. Anyone can use the ideas. Remember these pins have been a 3 year project of trial and error; since most of this knowledge has been lost from "goldsmithing". I have a few of my ancestors from the mid to late 1800''s with them wearing them so I had a good starting point.
I would not have them made out of palladium as it can be soft, just like I would never have them made from anything more than 18 ct. gold. Silver, 14 ct. brass coated, whatever you want. Mine weigh in at about 1 1/4 - 2 oz. That''s heavy metal. Maybe a bit of overkill, but I wanted substantial pieces. And, it happened.
Okay enough waiting pictures:
Tapio
Feel free to ask questions
SB621
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2009
- Messages
- 7,864
hi there! welcome to PS and very nice pins. I have browsed the NSC several times but never bought from them. They are a little too pricey for me for the products- but I have recommended them to people before that needed a sapphire quickly.
Can''t wait to see more pictures!
Can''t wait to see more pictures!
StonieGrl
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2009
- Messages
- 647
Well darn it, Tapio, I thought I came here for an ARGUMENT!!! {Reference to Monty Python skit.}
Re colonialism/imperialism, I will take the leftie position, someone has too! Although seriously, I have lived in several locations dealing with the legacy of this and its never pretty, is it.
You have a very good nature.
And I do love those pins, striking pieces and we definitely a ring-heavy and pendant-heavy around here. Nice to have some other types of jewelry.
Re colonialism/imperialism, I will take the leftie position, someone has too! Although seriously, I have lived in several locations dealing with the legacy of this and its never pretty, is it.
You have a very good nature.
And I do love those pins, striking pieces and we definitely a ring-heavy and pendant-heavy around here. Nice to have some other types of jewelry.
tapio
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2009
- Messages
- 101
This may seem trivial; but some people have this problem. I am a large man and when I used to have the Harley Davidson pocket wallet and keys I would get a terrible heat rash on my thighs. It hurt terribly, especially in summer. A leather vest was too hot, so I went to light cotton. That is the practical reason why I now wear waistcoats and watch chains. It is practical. I literally need my wallet and car keys chained to me so I don''t forget them. I am very human.
Tapio
Tapio
- Status
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