Need opinions on choosing "budget" rubies

[balasruby]

Hi, first let me introduce myself.. Tony, a new member in this full-of-knowledge forum. I have been silent reader here.. Now I need for opinions from senior and experienced fellow member.. Please help.. Thank you..

I have 3 choices of ruby, each stone is priced under US$ 700.

First stone is 1.71 carats
8.82 x 6.18 x 3.70 (60% depth)
Heat treated or H(a)

Second stone is 1.59 carats
8.34 x 6.91 x 3.08 (44.5% depth, this is my main concern of this stone)
Heat treated or H(a)

Third stone is 1.13 carats
6.82

 

[dk168]

Welcome to PS.

Any chance of pics and/or videos?

Need to see the colour, inclusions and quality of the cutting in order to be able advise.

In CS, colour is king, so please tell us your colour preferences, some inspiration pics of the ones you like would be good.

The depth of a stone in CS is not indicative of its overall quality, as some CSs have to be cut deep in order to bring out their brilliance.

I would strongly advise you to read this thread for those who are new to Coloured Stones:

CS for Newbies Thread

DK

 

[Bron357]

Rubies are expensive. Good rubies are very expensive.
With rubies, Colour, treatment and origin have a huge impact on price.
Colour is important. What some people call a ruby, others would call a pink sapphire. In some Countries it is common to refer to corundum of any pink/ purple/ red hue as a ruby.
Some treatments ie flux filling or BE treatment (both associated with heat treatment) are not desirable at all and you need a reputable lab report to discount the presence of these treatments.
Origin can also dramatically affect price, a Burmese origin is very desirable, in part because of the high level of fluorescence in such rubies creates a “glow”.
With all things, you get what you pay for.
If you would like some opinions on the actual gemstones you are considering , post up some photos of the rubies and their lab reports

 

[chrono]

H (a) is Heat with insignificant residue so I suspect this stone might have a GRS lab memo. What is important to make the next decision is to see pictures to gauge colour, clarity and cut.

 

[balasruby]

I am very sorry.. There was problem with my cellphone while creating this first thread of mine.

Here is the complete message:

Hi, first let me introduce myself.. I am Tony from small nation Indonesia (south east Asia), a new member in this full-of-knowledge forum. I have been silent reader here.. Now I need for opinions from senior and experienced fellow member.. Please help me to choose my best stone.. Thank you All for your kindness.

I have 3 choices of ruby, each stone is priced under US$ 700.


First stone is 1.71 carats
8.82 x 6.18 x 3.70 (60% depth)
Heat treated or H(a)
From Burma
Comes with lab. certificate from a major lab. from Indonesia
Video link 1st stone:

Second stone is 1.59 carats
8.34 x 6.91 x 3.08 (44.5% depth, this is my main concern of this stone)
Heat treated or H(a)
From Madagascar
Comes with lab. certificate from a major lab. from Indonesia
Video link 2nd stone:

Batu Natural INCREDIBLE VividRed Ruby Madagascar 1.59 Ct GRI Certified

Deskripsi : 1. Origin : Madagascar2. Dimensions : 08.34x06.91x03.08 mm3. HQ Material4. Warna Rata dan Nyala Siang Malem5. Burn Luster 6. Clean Eye 99%, Masih...

youtu.be

Third stone is 1.13 carats
6.82 x 5.06 x 3.38 (over 60% depth = ideal proportion?)
Heat treated or H(a)
From Burma
Comes with lab. certificate from a major lab. from Indonesia
Video link 3rd stone:

My main priority is color that can look bright in both indoor flourescent lighting (my office) and outdoor natural skylight (open cafe or public garden).

Pardon my bad English.
Thank you All for your support.

 

[balasruby]

I shared video link in the latter post but it doesn't work, so i use this way.. Sorry..

video link, please edit the "youtube" word (* replace with "u")

1st stone
https://yo*tu.be/yRATTTFkH1U

2nd stone
https://yo*tu.be/DfcDaV1oBWI
https://yo*tu.be/yFmIh2YCYx8
https://yo*tu.be/1TigSlWXpxg

3rd stone
https://yo*tu.be/ox-IS23wCj8
https://yo*tu.be/FNv07aysEc0

 

[balasruby]

Thanks to dk168, Bron357 and chrono..

I have red the CS for newbie thread.. It is a very good guidance..

 

[chrono]

Can you please name the "major lab" from Indonesia? If all were equal, stone 2 captures my attention the most due to colour and clarity. As of now, the lab is a concern.

 

[balasruby]

Can you please name the "major lab" from Indonesia? If all were equal, stone 2 captures my attention the most due to colour and clarity. As of now, the lab is a concern.

First stone is certified by "Big Lab Research"

Second and third stone is certified by "GRI Lab" (Gem Research International Lab)

 

[balasruby]

Photos for stone number 3

 

[voce]

I actually dislike stone 2 because it veers orange and does not look bright, but somewhat muddy in the second video.

Stone 3 looks good in both videos. There is only one video for stone 1, but it has that hot pinkish red look that suggests fluorescence, so my guess is that it will look good in all environments. If you cannot tolerate the pink, go with stone 3, but otherwise I think stone 1 is a better deal because of fluorescence and the bigger face up size.

Are you able to evaluate the stones in person before you purchase?

 

[balasruby]

I actually dislike stone 2 because it veers orange and does not look bright, but somewhat muddy in the second video.

Stone 3 looks good in both videos. There is only one video for stone 1, but it has that hot pinkish red look that suggests fluorescence, so my guess is that it will look good in all environments. If you cannot tolerate the pink, go with stone 3, but otherwise I think stone 1 is a better deal because of fluorescence and the bigger face up size.

Are you able to evaluate the stones in person before you purchase?

Hi voce.. Thanks for your suggestion and will consider that.. Unfortunately I can't see the stone in person. Because my location is far away from all the sellers' and in my country there is no custom of return policy

 

[dk168]

Based on the pics and video links as seen in this thread, and I have not tried the other links, my personal choice would be Stone #1 as I like its colour being a pink red rather than an orange red.

It also has a nice even silkiness in appearance to me.

Never heard of the labs mentioned, sorry, however, I am not an expert.

DK

 

[chrono]

because my location is far away from all the sellers' and in my country there is no custom of return policy

Due to your shipping situation, I would pass on all three.

 

[balasruby]

Thanks to all replies from experienced fellow here..

Now i add one last alternative, i call it the stone number 4:

1.31 carats
7.54 x 5.47 x 2.68 (49% depth)
Heated or heated only
From Burma
Certified by DGL (Dufau Gemological Lab.)






Video link:

I need your final opinion. Thanks..

 

[Bron357]

Hi, I would advise caution if there is no facility for return and refund.
The prices are very very cheap for heat only rubies over 1 carat. The prices would be very expensive for flux filled rubies.
The problem is photos and videos cant show if there has been flux filling. That’s filling cracks and fissures with a sealing material. It turns worthless gems into gems that LOOK fabulous. That’s why reputable lab certificates are essential.
The designation H (a) does mean that flux has been identified within the gemstone. This is a treated gemstone. The problem with a H (a) grade is that it’s subjective and differs between labs. What is “a little flux” vs “more flux” vs “a lot of flux” ?
My concern is that “if” the rubies are indeed heat only, why is the vendor selling them to you so cheaply? If you look elsewhere on the internet for Burmese heat only rubies, the prices start in the thousands of dollars. Burmese rubies are extremely desirable and readily sold.
Treated rubies can and do look just as beautiful but are virtually worthless. A vendor with such rubies hopes to sell the rubies to an unsuspecting, naive buyer.
Thats my concern.
If you are indeed buying heat only rubies from Burma for around $500 a carat, good luck to you, that exceptional buying. I’d buy them all.
BUT if these rubies aren’t as they appear, they are highly treated, then you will have spent good dollars on rubbish.

 

[lovedogs]

Hi, I would advise caution if there is no facility for return and refund.
The prices are very very cheap for heat only rubies over 1 carat. The prices would be very expensive for flux filled rubies.
The problem is photos and videos cant show if there has been flux filling. That’s filling cracks and fissures with a sealing material. It turns worthless gems into gems that LOOK fabulous. That’s why reputable lab certificates are essential.
My concern is that “if” the rubies are indeed heat only, why is the vendor selling them to you so cheaply? If you look elsewhere on the internet for Burmese heat only rubies, the prices start in the thousands of dollars. Burmese rubies are extremely desirable and readily sold.
Treated rubies can and do look just as beautiful but are virtually worthless. A vendor with such rubies hopes to sell the rubies to an unsuspecting, naive buyer.
Thats my concern.
If you are indeed buying heat only rubies from Burma for around $500 a carat, good luck to you, that exceptional buying. I’d buy them all.
BUT if these rubies aren’t as they appear, they are highly treated, then you will have spent good dollars on rubbish.

This. I am concerned that for the price they are heavily treated and therefore not worth anything close to the asking price

 

[MollyMalone]

Also, keep in mind that there's no guarantee that what you see is actually what you'll get in terms of color. Even when vendors are very conscientious about posting videos and/or photos that duplicate, on their monitor/screen, what they themselves see, odds are slim to none that your own display is color-calibrated precisely in sync with theirs. (If you have more than 1 device -- e.g., a laptop and a phone -- look at the listing photos and videos on both & I predict you'll see that photos on your different devices don't exactly mirror each other.)

Plus, photos and videos are still only 2 dimensional renderings. And last but not least imo, our eyes and brains don't all "see" colors exactly the same. E.g., I'm super sensitive to the nuances in whites and beiges, but far less so with reds.

My own bottom line: I will never purchase a colored stone or piece of jewelry with a colored stone unless I can return it, after seeing it in real life, with a minimum of hassle-expense -- or the stone is priced so low that I don't mind if the stone is a "loser" & I can't recoup the purchase price.

 

[Bron357]

And I’m assuming the rubies in question are already set in rings?
If you look closer you can see that they’ve all been set into ”reflective gold cups”. Not that there’s anything wrong with that except that it helps conceal any poor cutting. And it will improve the colour. The cups also make the rubies seem much larger.
Are the white stones CZ ?
Unless the white gems are diamonds and the metal solid gold (not sterling silver or gold clad silver/base metal) then that’s a definite indication of the rubies being of lower quality.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with rings being made or designed to look more expensive than they really are. The problem is if you pay a price too high for what you are actually buying.

 

[Bron357]

H (a) is Heat with insignificant residue so I suspect this stone might have a GRS lab memo. What is important to make the next decision is to see pictures to gauge colour, clarity and cut.

The Dufau gem lab, according to their website, differentiates H (a) as moderate residues from H (c) if the flux is visible under 10x magnification.
My understanding is that the top labs use H (a) for only minute traces of flux. Anything else is H (b) moderate or H (c) Significant. So my concern would be the rubies are graded H (b) by a top labs standard if not actually H (c).

 

[balasruby]

Hi, I really appreciate for all sugestions given..

For fact, all the rings is made of sterling silver and the all white accent stones is cubic zirconia.

 

[LilAlex]

For fact, all the rings is made of sterling silver and the all white accent stones is cubic zirconia.

= rubies of very low value (e.g., heavily treated, etc.)

At this price point, you are buying for appearance only, imo, and need to recognize that resale value will be roughly $0.

You can buy a Mercedes for $700. (It will not be a nice one .) Would you do that just to look at it and to say you own a Mercedes? It's like that.

 

[MollyMalone]

Hi, I really appreciate for all sugestions given..

For fact, all the rings is made of sterling silver and the all white accent stones is cubic zirconia.

Does the "under US$700" price you mentioned in your first post include the ring setting and the cost of mounting the ruby in the setting?

Since you're fine with the accent stones being cz's, let me ask you this:
Would you consider a synthetic, lab-grown ruby? Unlike cz's which are diamond simulants & don't mimic mined diamonds, a true synthetic ruby (not to be confused with a "fake" ruby) has all the chemical properties of a mined ruby, so looks and performs like a mined ruby -- but deciding to go with a synthetic ruby should enable you to get a nicer ruby for less money.

Since I live in the US, I don't know if synthetic lab-grown rubies are readily available to you in Indonesia, but here's a useful page from Precision Gem here in the US that will give you more information in general, along with his per carat prices, so I think you will find it useful:

Lab Created Gems Precision Cut

Lab Created Precision Cut Gemstones

www.precisiongem.com

P.S. Your English is admirable, perfectly fine!!

 

[lovedogs]

I think a lab grown ruby thats excellently cut is a much better decision than any of these.

 

[Bron357]

Hi, I really appreciate for all sugestions given..

For fact, all the rings is made of sterling silver and the all white accent stones is cubic zirconia.

I would pass.
For sterling silver and CZ with a treated ruby , $700 US is too much.
Here is a similar type ring from ebay.
It is $115 US.
With eBay you have protection if the item is not as described.

 

[balasruby]

Does the "under US$700" price you mentioned in your first post include the ring setting and the cost of mounting the ruby in the setting?

Since you're fine with the accent stones being cz's, let me ask you this:
Would you consider a synthetic, lab-grown ruby? Unlike cz's which are diamond simulants & don't mimic mined diamonds, a true synthetic ruby (not to be confused with a "fake" ruby) has all the chemical properties of a mined ruby, so looks and performs like a mined ruby -- but deciding to go with a synthetic ruby should enable you to get a nicer ruby for less money.

Since I live in the US, I don't know if synthetic lab-grown rubies are readily available to you in Indonesia, but here's a useful page from Precision Gem here in the US that will give you more information in general, along with his per carat prices, so I think you will find it useful:

Lab Created Gems Precision Cut

Lab Created Precision Cut Gemstones

www.precisiongem.com

P.S. Your English is admirable, perfectly fine!!

thanks, MollyMalone for your insight.. Surely, now I will browse a lot of lab-grown rubies articles and visit the website that you gave.

 

[balasruby]

thanks for All, @LilAlex, @lovedogs , @Bron357

 

[LD]

Hi, I really appreciate for all sugestions given..

For fact, all the rings is made of sterling silver and the all white accent stones is cubic zirconia.

This causes alarm bells. Nobody puts too class rubies in silver with cubic zirconia. Highly treated, diffused rubies yes. The labs you mention are not ones that PSers would use and I’m afraid not all labs are equal.

 

[Cinders]

It looks like the ring is just for display purposes----possibly to show how the gemstones could look when set.

 

[Cinders]

Funnily enough, one of the major gem dealers said he encountered similar fake display rings near the beginning of his career & waved all the stones away with annoyance. He regrets it now because he said he waved away a lot of really good material.