Amber St. Clare
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2009
- Messages
- 1,683
Kenny, you didn't offer my option:
Moving to Canada.
Moving to Canada.
Amber St. Clare|1457143682|4000027 said:Kenny, you didn't offer my option:
Moving to Canada.
msop04|1457120532|3999869 said:liaerfbv|1457119953|3999862 said:msop04|1457119338|3999857 said:And honestly, in this day and age, being a white male is a bit scary as well. I would say they are discriminated against -- for purposes of "political correctness".
No. Just no.
It happens all the time, especially in government jobs. I know first hand.
My husband (when applying for a "city landscape supervisor" type of job) was told by the HR person (with whom he graduated from college) that if he were black/Hispanic or female that they could give him the job because he was certainly the most qualified applicant and had the most experience... but since the city had to meet their "quota" for minorities, he wouldn't get it. According to him, this type of thing "happens all the time" and he ends up hiring someone who is not qualified because of their race and/or sex.
That is discrimination as well...
Dee*Jay|1457185146|4000157 said:I'm not sure where you're located, but if you want a City job in Chicago you need to be white, male AND IRISH go get it. No discrimination in this town! (And BTW, I'm not bashing the Irish because I am one myself! )
AGBF|1457187935|4000172 said:Dee*Jay|1457185146|4000157 said:I'm not sure where you're located, but if you want a City job in Chicago you need to be white, male AND IRISH go get it. No discrimination in this town! (And BTW, I'm not bashing the Irish because I am one myself! )
There was, indeed, a time when some white men were discriminated against. And some white men from minority/immigrant groups are still discriminated against. But white Anglo Saxon Protestant men are not discriminated against any longer. Unless they are disabled or openly homosexual or otherwise in a group that is traditionally picked on by their WASP male peers, who can be nasty sons of bitches. Reverse discrimination is a sham argument.
And I hear you, Dee Jay. My tall, fair, blue-eyed grandfather from the Austro-Hungarian Empire pretended to be German (he spoke German) rather than Eastern European to get work here because people didn't like Slavs here in the late 19th century. But that was then and this is now.
AGBF
Lil Misfit|1457141081|4000009 said:momhappy|1457119745|3999861 said:I don't think that voting for Trump because he is on the Republican ticket is the same as voting for Clinton because she's a woman. Voting for someone simply because you both have a vagina is not the same as voting for someone who shares many of your political views/beliefs. I do not agree with voting for someone just because they are black/female - that goes well beyond "acknowledging" their race/sex and just because almost all of the presidents have been white/male, doesn't make it right. Discrimination is not just about who's in power.
Agree with this 100%. And I don't discuss politics so I will not be divulging who my vote will go to.
msop04|1457188874|4000183 said:AGBF|1457187935|4000172 said:Dee*Jay|1457185146|4000157 said:I'm not sure where you're located, but if you want a City job in Chicago you need to be white, male AND IRISH go get it. No discrimination in this town! (And BTW, I'm not bashing the Irish because I am one myself! )
There was, indeed, a time when some white men were discriminated against. And some white men from minority/immigrant groups are still discriminated against. But white Anglo Saxon Protestant men are not discriminated against any longer. Unless they are disabled or openly homosexual or otherwise in a group that is traditionally picked on by their WASP male peers, who can be nasty sons of bitches. Reverse discrimination is a sham argument.
And I hear you, Dee Jay. My tall, fair, blue-eyed grandfather from the Austro-Hungarian Empire pretended to be German (he spoke German) rather than Eastern European to get work here because people didn't like Slavs here in the late 19th century. But that was then and this is now.
AGBF
If someone is treated differently or rewarded simply because of the color of his/her skin, it is discrimination. Period. It doesn't matter if they're white, black, yellow, brown, pink, or blue. Just because a person is in the majority (white, male) doesn't mean they cannot (or will not) be discriminated against. Discrimination is discrimination. To say that white men can't and aren't discriminated against is ridiculous.
AGBF|1457207314|4000294 said:msop04|1457188874|4000183 said:AGBF|1457187935|4000172 said:Dee*Jay|1457185146|4000157 said:I'm not sure where you're located, but if you want a City job in Chicago you need to be white, male AND IRISH go get it. No discrimination in this town! (And BTW, I'm not bashing the Irish because I am one myself! )
There was, indeed, a time when some white men were discriminated against. And some white men from minority/immigrant groups are still discriminated against. But white Anglo Saxon Protestant men are not discriminated against any longer. Unless they are disabled or openly homosexual or otherwise in a group that is traditionally picked on by their WASP male peers, who can be nasty sons of bitches. Reverse discrimination is a sham argument.
And I hear you, Dee Jay. My tall, fair, blue-eyed grandfather from the Austro-Hungarian Empire pretended to be German (he spoke German) rather than Eastern European to get work here because people didn't like Slavs here in the late 19th century. But that was then and this is now.
AGBF
If someone is treated differently or rewarded simply because of the color of his/her skin, it is discrimination. Period. It doesn't matter if they're white, black, yellow, brown, pink, or blue. Just because a person is in the majority (white, male) doesn't mean they cannot (or will not) be discriminated against. Discrimination is discrimination. To say that white men can't and aren't discriminated against is ridiculous.
Really? How many white men have been made to ride at the back of a bus? Or to urinate outdoors because there were no restrooms other than "colored" restrooms available at a gas station where they stopped? Know any court rooms where they are still forced to wear skirts if they are attorneys?
packrat|1457221547|4000332 said:ahhh but in this day and age, it does. We believe that white people will always do better, be better, score better, make more, do more, have more, get things handed to them b/c they're white and it's preordained for us, so white people can not possibly be discriminated against b/c we already have a leg up on every other person on the planet b/c we are born white and therefore, the playing field must be leveled, we must be knocked down pegs for our presumed superiority that we all just naturally are born w/ and we must pay for things that happened that we had no part in. That can never and will never excuse us from our sin of being white. We must pay our penance. We should quit trying and working hard, b/c we're white and shouldn't be allowed to be a part of anything. And those who are not white, should never try or work hard, it should just be handed to them b/c they're non white and they automatically deserve it..that's kinda the vibe I get anymore. White people should be sorry they're white and they should be sorry they were born.
kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
msop04|1457223456|4000341 said:kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
Affirmative action is known as "positive discrimination". Yep, nothing like having to get [potentially] lesser qualified people working for you just because of their sex or race...
kenny said:msop04|1457223456|4000341 said:kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
Affirmative action is known as "positive discrimination". Yep, nothing like having to get [potentially] lesser qualified people working for you just because of their sex or race...
That's the short view.
The long view is equality.
liaerfbv said:In fact it IS your privilege talking. Attitudes like yours are a major contributor to the race relation problems we have in this country. I'm sorry your husband didn't get ONE job but maybe step outside your very narrow point of view and realize there are people living in this country who still get NO jobs because the color of their skin. Does your husband fear for his life at a routine traffic stop? Is he more likely to experience sexual assault? Likely not.
msop04|1457224074|4000346 said:kenny said:msop04|1457223456|4000341 said:kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
Affirmative action is known as "positive discrimination". Yep, nothing like having to get [potentially] lesser qualified people working for you just because of their sex or race...
That's the short view.
The long view is equality.
If a white male is more qualified for something, but it's given to a Hispanic female (who does not have the same qualifications), that does not in any way ensure future equality. It means minorities have no incentive to try as hard as their majority counterparts. No one wants to work hard, only to be told they can't have something bc of their race/sex.
It seems to me that it's not true equality that some are seeking... it's special treatment.
kenny said:msop04|1457224074|4000346 said:kenny said:msop04|1457223456|4000341 said:kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
Affirmative action is known as "positive discrimination". Yep, nothing like having to get [potentially] lesser qualified people working for you just because of their sex or race...
That's the short view.
The long view is equality.
If a white male is more qualified for something, but it's given to a Hispanic female (who does not have the same qualifications), that does not in any way ensure future equality. It means minorities have no incentive to try as hard as their majority counterparts. No one wants to work hard, only to be told they can't have something bc of their race/sex.
It seems to me that it's not true equality that some are seeking... it's special treatment.
Groups with, overall, lower economic status getting better jobs helps their kids do better.
Kids may get better nutrition, health care, education and grow up with something whites have long take for granted, hope and high expectations for themselves.
Over time inequality will be reduced and affirmative action can end.
msop04|1457225347|4000350 said:kenny said:msop04|1457224074|4000346 said:kenny said:msop04|1457223456|4000341 said:kenny|1457222765|4000337 said:I support affirmative action.
It's not discrimination.
In a zillion or so generations, when we're all equal (yeah right ), I'll stop supporting it.
Affirmative action is known as "positive discrimination". Yep, nothing like having to get [potentially] lesser qualified people working for you just because of their sex or race...
That's the short view.
The long view is equality.
If a white male is more qualified for something, but it's given to a Hispanic female (who does not have the same qualifications), that does not in any way ensure future equality. It means minorities have no incentive to try as hard as their majority counterparts. No one wants to work hard, only to be told they can't have something bc of their race/sex.
It seems to me that it's not true equality that some are seeking... it's special treatment.
Groups with, overall, lower economic status getting better jobs helps their kids do better.
Kids may get better nutrition, health care, education and grow up with something whites have long take for granted, hope and high expectations for themselves.
Over time inequality will be reduced and affirmative action can end.
In theory, that sounds great… Reality is that you have to want to do better to really do better. From what I have seen and witnessed, very few want to do better when all they have to do is exist to reap the benefits for which others work hard. When there is no incentive, everyone will eventually stop trying. That's just common sense.
msop04|1457224704|4000348 said:liaerfbv said:In fact it IS your privilege talking. Attitudes like yours are a major contributor to the race relation problems we have in this country. I'm sorry your husband didn't get ONE job but maybe step outside your very narrow point of view and realize there are people living in this country who still get NO jobs because the color of their skin. Does your husband fear for his life at a routine traffic stop? Is he more likely to experience sexual assault? Likely not.
That's fine. You can work hard and let someone else have what you've worked for... I guess you like that. The fact is we are not all equal in every way. That's not a bad thing. That just makes us individuals with different qualities.
And, no, I'm sure he doesn't. He acts like an upstanding citizen and abides by the law.
I'm so sick of all the race baiting bs... I guess we white folks will continue to pay for the sins of our great great great grandfathers until the end of time. [emoji849]
packrat said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
packrat|1457228921|4000370 said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
kenny|1457229951|4000381 said:packrat|1457228921|4000370 said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
Someone from a group that is statistically more likely to be disenfranchised finally getting a decent job with benefits IS making it better 'in the beginning' ... AKA their kids.
That's no band aide.
We can't exactly take a way their kids and give them to be raised in 'nice' families on the right side of the tracks, with hope, the right values, language clothing & mannerisms of the more successful classes, high expectations, middle+ income and career connections.
A parent getting a decent job is just one step in the right direction out of the never-ending cycle of hopelessness, but a big one.
Must stop having babies born out of wedlock.katharath|1457234058|4000393 said:kenny|1457229951|4000381 said:packrat|1457228921|4000370 said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
Someone from a group that is statistically more likely to be disenfranchised finally getting a decent job with benefits IS making it better 'in the beginning' ... AKA their kids.
That's no band aide.
We can't exactly take a way their kids and give them to be raised in 'nice' families on the right side of the tracks, with hope, the right values, language clothing & mannerisms of the more successful classes, high expectations, middle+ income and career connections.
A parent getting a decent job is just one step in the right direction out of the never-ending cycle of hopelessness, but a big one.
This. That is how you break a cycle and move forward.
Dancing Fire|1457241053|4000421 said:Must stop having babies born out of wedlock.katharath|1457234058|4000393 said:kenny|1457229951|4000381 said:packrat|1457228921|4000370 said:Then maybe we should work to change *that* rather than oh well your home life sucks, so here's this to make it better for you now as an adult. Why don't we work to change things in the beginning rather than putting a band aid on it?
Someone from a group that is statistically more likely to be disenfranchised finally getting a decent job with benefits IS making it better 'in the beginning' ... AKA their kids.
That's no band aide.
We can't exactly take a way their kids and give them to be raised in 'nice' families on the right side of the tracks, with hope, the right values, language clothing & mannerisms of the more successful classes, high expectations, middle+ income and career connections.
A parent getting a decent job is just one step in the right direction out of the never-ending cycle of hopelessness, but a big one.
This. That is how you break a cycle and move forward.
Amber St. Clare|1457274595|4000524 said:Dancing Fire|1457241053|4000421 said:Must stop having babies born out of wedlock.
Must hold FATHERS of these children accountable.