Friends and Boundaries

[Elmorton]

So, DH and I always read before bed. Last night I decided to read one of my travel journals - this one was from our honeymoon. I started laughing when I saw the page where we''d written down the funny things we heard or said and then I stopped laughing when there was one that I didn''t remember. I read it to DH, and he said "I don''t remember writing that, either." And then I realized...it wasn''t in my handwriting, it wasn''t his, and I recognized the handwriting without a shadow of a doubt.

One of my girlfriends wrote a somewhat lewd "quote" in my travel journal! At first, I didn''t know how to react...DH said that he was angry about it and thought that I should confront her when I see her this weekend. At first, I said that I thought it was something stupid and that I should probably just let it go, what''s the point in making waves? But...I don''t know, it''s still irking me this morning. I don''t know when she did it - I think I MAY have showed the journal to her after our honeymoon (it has all sorts of scraps and stuff in it, too), but otherwise, it has always been on a shelf in our bedroom.

It''s not like the journal has anything personal in it - honestly, it''s more of a record of what we did, what we ate, what we saw, what people''s names were that we met, because I always forget this kind of thing. But still...a journal is a journal and writing in someone else''s is weird.

So...do I bring it up? Do I not? Is this something that I should address before it turns into a larger issue? This friend wrote us the sweetest card as a wedding gift, saying basically that she had always felt that no one could know me as well as she did until she heard DH''s vows and realized that he loved me more, and that''s the best thing a friend can feel for another friend. But, during our last visit, she made a few references that made me uncomfortable, as if she didn''t understand that DH is my husband and not some random "boy" that I''m casually dating. I sortof wonder if the journal writing is indicative of not understanding this boundary, that some things are private, and that my marriage is one of those things. ...Or, is psych 101 rearing its ugly head and I''m reading waaay too much into this?

 

[lumpkin]

I wouldn''t bring it up, but I would guard my boundaries. That is over the line writing in someone else''s journal, but here''s what I think is going on. She was your best friend (or at least a really good one) and her friendship with you has changed since you got married. You aren''t single and free anymore, and your priorities are with your husband first, unlike when he WAS some random guy you were dating. I think she just hadn''t (hasn''t?) gotten the change and if she does, she''s trying to shove back in a little into your priorities. She''s essentially lost her place in line.

It happens when you are in a new marriage, sometimes even up to several years. I had that happen with family more than friends, but your vows, if they were like ours, are spouse above all but God. "Cleaving only unto him..." as I recall. Anyway, just don''t hand her any journals or photo albums without saying, please don''t write in it -- this is private between my husband and me" or something like that. You don''t have to say anything directly about what has already happened, but you can watch for it now.

 

[monarch64]

I agree with Lumpkin, it sounds like your friend has lost her place a little in your life and maybe she got into your journal because she is subconsciously feeling left out. Still, that is NO excuse to meddle in someone''s personal belongings no matter how close your friendship is. I''m with your DH, I would say something to her. It doesn''t have to be confrontational, just mention that you were reading your journal the other night and came across her quote and it made you feel really weird to see her quote written in it. I think it''s better for your friendship to have a short conversation about it and get on with life instead of letting it fester...

 

[door knob solitaire]

Ugghhhh...I can''t believe anyone would take the liberty she did with something obviously so personal. If the comment was something kind and complimentary that left you with a happy thought, I would say how nice.

But that is beyond any decent boundary. What if you had handed it to your grandmother ...and then later found the comment. You would be livid. Embarrassed and ashamed. She would have left you in a terribly uncomfortable situation. Or what if 10 years had passed before you noticed it. It may have caused a rift between the two (you and DH) of you...or if your child had read it...there is just nothing good to have come from that tacky act. Yuck.

I don''t know the best way to handle it...I side with your DH on this one. But when I don''t have a clear answer on what is right, I try to do the BIGGER thing and just walk away. But I would definitely be on guard...this one sounds a little off kilter. And her expression of envy or jealousy is just coming to the surface. No telling what she has up her sleeve next.

 

[Ellen]

Well, I don''t really care if she''s feeling left out or not, I find this weird. And just wrong. She got into something personal of yours, which is bad enough, but she wrote something in it to boot. I just can''t excuse that. Call me a hard@$$.

I''d ask her why she did it. I wouldn''t yell at her, but I wouldn''t be happy. I dunno, I can excuse a lot of things for a lot of reasons, but this just isn''t one of them.

 

[coatimundi_org]

Date: 1/30/2008 4:45:49 PM
Author: Ellen
Well, I don't really care if she's feeling left out or not, I find this weird. And just wrong. She got into something personal of yours, which is bad enough, but she wrote something in it to boot. I just can't excuse that. Call me a hard@$$.


I'd ask her why she did it. I wouldn't yell at her, but I wouldn't be happy. I dunno, I can excuse a lot of things for a lot of reasons, but this just isn't one of them.

Ditto here.
I'd definitely say something to her. If she's feeling left out too bad. That's just too immature. Perhaps I'm projecting, but something similar happened to me with a friend. Ever since I've been with my husband, a friend of mine has performed similar acts of immaturity, and has subsequently stressed our friendship. She's jealous plain and simple. Writing in your journal is not only a violation of trust, 'tis just plain rude.

 

[:)]

Your friend is creepy. That gives me the heebie jeebies.

 

[Elmorton]

Thanks everyone for the replies. I'm still kindof torn as to whether to raise the journal thing/how to raise it, and I keep on trying to rationalize...like, was I sitting there when she did it, laughing with her, and I just don't remember? I'm pretty darned sure that wasn't the case, but the idea of confronting her, even in a non-accusatory way (like "Hey, do you remember writing in my journal? I saw something the other day...") makes me really nervous. I just don't want it to go the wrong way and end up making more out of this than need be. From your reactions, I do think it sounds like this is a "bigger picture" issue, not just about the journal. I mean, the journal is fixable (I already whited out the comment), but the not understanding what is personal and what isn't..that probably does have the potential to become a problem.

For those of you who have dealt with a jealous/"misplaced" (that is probably a great way to explain it, that she doesn't know what her role is) friend after getting married, did the tension just naturally go away after awhile? Did you have to say something? Was the friendship ended as a result of that tension? I'm really curious as to how others have dealt with it, since this seems to be a somewhat common reaction (well, the journal thing is weird, but you know what I'm getting at - the not understanding boundaries thing).

I do want to address the last comment..she's not a creepy person, just a quirky one at times. I'm sure she thought what she was doing was funny and honestly didn't get that it wasn't appropriate. Believe me, if someone was being threatening in some way, I wouldn't hesitate to end the friendship. But in this case, she's a good friend that I've been close to for more than 10 years - I do treasure her friendship, and that's why I'm so confused as to how to look at this. I just think her "filter" might be a little out of whack, and while I'm (temporarily) ticked, I would like our friendship to return to normal as soon as possible.

 

[diamondfan]

Whether or not there is a value or benefit to bringing it up at this point, it most assuredly is a boundaries issue. Even if you told her about it or showed it to her, I think it takes a HUGE leap for her to think of writing IN it. If you had a certain type of friendship, perhaps a post it stuck to the outside would be fine, but honestly, no one should be perusing your private stuff. What you have in there is less at issue than the fact that it is something that should be private, between you and hubby. Even if all you wrote it in was what you ate each day or what sites you saw, it is not something you should open and feel weirdly violated. I am really sorry that this happened to you. I am not sure I would bring it up now, might be a tough one. If the moment arose, you could sort of laugh it off and say, Ha Ha saw your little addendum to our journal...and then when she responded you could calmly tell her that you did not appreciate it and that you felt it was overstepping a bit, even if she did not mean to do so. Otherwise, just let it drop, and keep your private stuff put away and do not really talk about it in front of her. This makes a tough mark on the friendship but I think it is valid to do so. If you cannot get into her head about it, or she has looser boundaries than you would like, it seems like the best option. Not everyone operates the same way, and sometimes we do not see this til later on. Maybe she was trying to be funny and be a part of your memories and really did not think it inappropriate, but it was, and if you feel so too, you need to just be mindful of her views and act accordingly.

 

[somethingshiny]

Would you have found this SO weird if you were single? If at one time, you''d have thought it was cute, then I think she''s still playing into that part of you. She hasn''t realized that there is a whole side that she will never know everything about. So, I think it''s weird and does cross a boundary, but, I don''t think she had any ill intent. I''m a firm believer in taking consideration for how it was meant, not just how it was perceived.

I would mention it to her in passing. Like, "I was really surprised to see you had written in our Honeymoon journal. I know you were trying to be funny (or whatever), but there are some things now that I just want for my husband and I."

 

[Kaleigh]

If it were me I wouldn''t bring it up. Most likely it won''t go over well. She''ll be defensive and play it off as a joke. What she did was really wrong. And kind of creepy. But it''s done and I''d try to move on. She probably didn''t mean any harm, just did it on a whim. A very dumb one, but people make mistakes... Chalk it up to very poor judgement. Only you know what is comfortable for you. I know how shocked you must have been to have discovered this in your Honeymoon journal. Best of luck in dealing with this.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 1/30/2008 6:52:46 PM
Author: Elmorton


I do want to address the last comment..she''s not a creepy person, just a quirky one at times. I''m sure she thought what she was doing was funny and honestly didn''t get that it wasn''t appropriate. Believe me, if someone was being threatening in some way, I wouldn''t hesitate to end the friendship. But in this case, she''s a good friend that I''ve been close to for more than 10 years - I do treasure her friendship, and that''s why I''m so confused as to how to look at this. I just think her ''filter'' might be a little out of whack, and while I''m (temporarily) ticked, I would like our friendship to return to normal as soon as possible.

that was my thought too seems like someones idea of a joke.
Everyone does dumb things every once in a while.
Either forgive and forget it or just mention it and say that it upset you a little and she will likely apologize then you can forgive her and life goes on.

 

[Haven]

I would say something about it in a non-confrontational way, but I''d definitely say something. Even if it was just a little joke it''s obviously irking you and if it were me, I would harbour some ill-feelings after this incident.

While it sounds like she wasn''t trying to be malicious, I think this very much crossed the line of decency and you should gently let her know that you didn''t find it funny. I would be livid if ANYONE wrote ANYTHING in a journal of mine. Heck--I''d be livid if anyone wrote anything in my agenda.

 

[FrekeChild]

Date: 1/30/2008 6:52:46 PM
Author: Elmorton
Thanks everyone for the replies. I''m still kindof torn as to whether to raise the journal thing/how to raise it, and I keep on trying to rationalize...like, was I sitting there when she did it, laughing with her, and I just don''t remember? I''m pretty darned sure that wasn''t the case, but the idea of confronting her, even in a non-accusatory way (like ''Hey, do you remember writing in my journal? I saw something the other day...'') makes me really nervous. I just don''t want it to go the wrong way and end up making more out of this than need be. From your reactions, I do think it sounds like this is a ''bigger picture'' issue, not just about the journal. I mean, the journal is fixable (I already whited out the comment), but the not understanding what is personal and what isn''t..that probably does have the potential to become a problem.

For those of you who have dealt with a jealous/''misplaced'' (that is probably a great way to explain it, that she doesn''t know what her role is) friend after getting married, did the tension just naturally go away after awhile? Did you have to say something? Was the friendship ended as a result of that tension? I''m really curious as to how others have dealt with it, since this seems to be a somewhat common reaction (well, the journal thing is weird, but you know what I''m getting at - the not understanding boundaries thing).

I do want to address the last comment..she''s not a creepy person, just a quirky one at times. I''m sure she thought what she was doing was funny and honestly didn''t get that it wasn''t appropriate. Believe me, if someone was being threatening in some way, I wouldn''t hesitate to end the friendship. But in this case, she''s a good friend that I''ve been close to for more than 10 years - I do treasure her friendship, and that''s why I''m so confused as to how to look at this. I just think her ''filter'' might be a little out of whack, and while I''m (temporarily) ticked, I would like our friendship to return to normal as soon as possible.

I''m not married, but when I first started dating FF I had a friend that never took our relationship seriously, even going so far as to say, "When you and D break up, things will go back to normal between us." She''d also go through my phone and send texts to FF that I didn''t know about. This girl IS most certainly off kilter, sexual molestation is in her past, among many many other issues. She didn''t accept our boundaries and after entirely too many of these episodes, I cut off all ties. It was starting to make D irritated, and I couldn''t see an end in sight.

So I''ve been through kind of a similar situation. Obviously I didn''t stand for it. I don''t think I would say anything unless she says something out of line or starts to do something that doesn''t respect your boundaries. I can''t tell you how creepy I think it is that she violated your privacy like that.

As said: "Your friend is creepy. That gives me the heebie jeebies."

I concur.

 

[diamondfan]

She may really be having a tough time accepting where she fits in your life now. I think that is very typical if you were very close and suddenly the parameters of the relationship have changed. She may not even really see it. I know people like this, and sometimes they have tunnel vision as to what they are doing or how they affect others. If you want to continue the friendship, you might just need to pay a bit more attention to how she is responding to you now that you are married. There may be some transitioning needed, who knows? Time will tell how things work out.

 

[lumpkin]

Date: 1/30/2008 10:58:47 PM
Author: strmrdr

Date: 1/30/2008 6:52:46 PM
Author: Elmorton


I do want to address the last comment..she''s not a creepy person, just a quirky one at times. I''m sure she thought what she was doing was funny and honestly didn''t get that it wasn''t appropriate. Believe me, if someone was being threatening in some way, I wouldn''t hesitate to end the friendship. But in this case, she''s a good friend that I''ve been close to for more than 10 years - I do treasure her friendship, and that''s why I''m so confused as to how to look at this. I just think her ''filter'' might be a little out of whack, and while I''m (temporarily) ticked, I would like our friendship to return to normal as soon as possible.

that was my thought too seems like someones idea of a joke.
Everyone does dumb things every once in a while.
Either forgive and forget it or just mention it and say that it upset you a little and she will likely apologize then you can forgive her and life goes on.

Exactly. I think she just did something dumb on the spur of the moment. Someday when she''s married she will look back on that and be absolutely mortified. I''m guessing she is not married, now, and if she is, then my whole theory goes out the window.

I seriously would not make that big a deal of it, but just be aware. If it''s an issue that keeps coming up then maybe it would be time to have that gentle discussion of how life changes, priorities change, but she''s still very important to you, just in a different perspective.

Sometimes friendships don''t survive the transition. And not just a transition when someone gets married, but even earlier, like going off to a new school, or college, when you leave one company and go to another, or later when you start having kids. Any big life change will challenge some friendships, and some just don''t make it to the next phase. A friend of mine''s mother once said that you choose your friends based on commonalities. When you''re in college you tend to have friends who are in college, when you''re working you choose friends who are also working, and when you get married and have kids, you choose friends who are doing that as well. Where I don''t strictly agree with that, I think there is a real tendency that way, and sometimes friends come into and go out of our lives and friendships ebb and flow.

 

[gwendolyn]

Date: 1/30/2008 10:14:07 PM
Author: somethingshiny
Would you have found this SO weird if you were single? If at one time, you'd have thought it was cute, then I think she's still playing into that part of you. She hasn't realized that there is a whole side that she will never know everything about. So, I think it's weird and does cross a boundary, but, I don't think she had any ill intent. I'm a firm believer in taking consideration for how it was meant, not just how it was perceived.

This was my thought too, that maybe at one time it was something that you'd just laugh off, but now that you're married maybe feels different?

Author: somethingshiny
I would mention it to her in passing. Like, 'I was really surprised to see you had written in our Honeymoon journal. I know you were trying to be funny (or whatever), but there are some things now that I just want for my husband and I.'

That might come across as mixed messages to her, since she was allowed to go through the journal before, so it wasn't off-limits then.

If you do say something to her, I think I'd start with asking what the scene was when it happened because you don't remember letting her write in the journal--if you guys were all drunk and being silly, everyone's equally guilty. If she says she did it on her own as a joke, say that going through your things and then writing in your journal is not ok. I would be upset if anyone did that to me: a family member, friends, don't even think I'd like my SO to write in my journal unless I said it was ok first (unless it concerned the both of us, like your log of your honeymoon, then he'd be allowed

).

I don't think it's ever ok to write in someone else's journal, whether you're married or not, personally, so I don't see why your marriage even has to come into it.

 

[Elmorton]

Whew...well, you guys have said so much that has made me think.

I still think writing in the journal was wrong, weird, and a violation of my (and my husband''s) space, but there were some points that made me realize that maybe for her, it wasn''t the biggest leap in judgement. When we were in HS/college is wasn''t that uncommon my friends to write little notes in my planner and vice versa. But, on that same token, she scrapbooks, and I know she''d be tiiiiiiiiicked if I wrote something on a finished page - so she really should had a better judgement call.

That said, I do think it was a spur of the moment thing and a lapse in common sense. After I whited-out the comment, I realized that were a couple pamphlets from places we saw that I think I probably did show her when we were looking at honeymoon photos, and I might have left the journal out in the living room where she slept that night (we had several people over at the same time she was visiting, so who knows, maybe she was in a goofy, crazy mood from the evening and thought that it was funny), so while she was still violating privacy, it''s not like she went snooping in my bedroom. In this scenario, I just don''t think I need to confront her about it - I feel like I kinda see how it happened now in the first place.

I think that I''m going to play it by ear this weekend. If we start to have a heart-to-heart, then I might mention it. Otherwise, I think I''d just like to let it go, and as lumpkin suggested, just be more aware of my boundaries.

Thanks everyone for weighing in - it really helps to hear so many different perspectives.

 

[HollyS]

This is so ''Lifetime Original Movie'' weird.

I suppose people exist in the real world who don''t have appropriate social, ethical, and moral boundaries; ''48 Hours'' or ''20/20'' kind of prove that. If I knew people like that, I would disengage myself from them. I don''t *do* weird.

That being said, we all have friends who have crossed a line with us at some point; and yet, we''re still friends with them. So, the call is yours. Approach this however your instinct tells you; a gut reaction is always a great indicator of what you should do.

 

[bee*]

Date: 1/30/2008 11:25:45 PM
Author: Haven
I would say something about it in a non-confrontational way, but I''d definitely say something. Even if it was just a little joke it''s obviously irking you and if it were me, I would harbour some ill-feelings after this incident.


While it sounds like she wasn''t trying to be malicious, I think this very much crossed the line of decency and you should gently let her know that you didn''t find it funny. I would be livid if ANYONE wrote ANYTHING in a journal of mine. Heck--I''d be livid if anyone wrote anything in my agenda.

ditto! Even just say to her oh I found that note that you wrote in my journal and see what she says about it. I would definitely say something though.