Si1 D with faint fluorescence vs Si2 G with none?

[OliverRudy]

Hello all!
I’m trying to figure out if a 1.01 carat Si1 D with faint fluorescence is a better purchase than a Si2 G with no fluorescence.
From online articles the presence of fluorescence at all has me worried. The presence of it in a D sounds ominous from all the articles.

 

[tyty333]

The cut of these stones would worry me more than your question.

But, if we ignore cut, faint fluorescence is rarely an issue. You can ask to see the stone outside. If it goes oily looking then it
is an issue (most likely not going to happen with Faint). What is the grade making inclusion on the SI1?

Where are you reading that stones with Faint fluorescence is an issue? Just curious. Are they recent articles?

 

[OliverRudy]

The cut of these stones would worry me more than your question.

But, if we ignore cut, faint fluorescence is rarely an issue. You can ask to see the stone outside. If it goes oily looking then it
is an issue (most likely not going to happen with Faint). What is the grade making inclusion on the SI1?

Where are you reading that stones with Faint fluorescence is an issue? Just curious. Are they recent articles?

Is Diamond Fluorescence Good or Bad?

What is diamond fluorescence? Should you buy (or not buy) a diamond because of it? GIA sheds some light on this often misunderstood phenomenon.

4cs.gia.edu

Diamond Fluorescence Buying Guide | 4C's Education

Rare Carat

www.rarecarat.com

 

[OliverRudy]

Is Diamond Fluorescence Good or Bad?

What is diamond fluorescence? Should you buy (or not buy) a diamond because of it? GIA sheds some light on this often misunderstood phenomenon.

4cs.gia.edu

Diamond Fluorescence Buying Guide | 4C's Education

Rare Carat

www.rarecarat.com

The cut says “very good”. I am purchasing them from a jeweler out of state, so I do not have the option to see them in person. The stone is for a ring for my husband.

 

[tyty333]

Can you cut and paste the specific lines from the articles that cause you issue? Everything I read pertained to "Strong" or
"Very Strong" fluorescence and those are ones that need to be checked to make sure there is not an issue. Not "Faint".

I would have thought these articles would have alleviated your fear of fluorescence instead of causing it.

Have you considered buying a stone online? We can help you pick nice stones however, we rarely (probably never) go for "Very Good"
cut grade. I hope you are getting a good deal on theses stones.

 

[OliverRudy]

Can you cut and paste the specific lines from the articles that cause you issue? Everything I read pertained to "Strong" or
"Very Strong" fluorescence and those are ones that need to be checked to make sure there is not an issue. Not "Faint".

I would have thought these articles would have alleviated your fear of fluorescence instead of causing it.

Have you considered buying a stone online? We can help you pick nice stones however, we rarely (probably never) go for "Very Good"
cut grade. I hope you are getting a good deal on theses stones.

“The opposite is true for diamonds with higher color grades. In the trade, diamonds in the D to H color range with bluish fluorescence are often considered less desirable than similar grade diamonds without fluorescence, because some people believe that bluish fluorescence may cause diamonds to have a hazy or oily appearance.”

 

[RMOO]

Both of these diamonds face up small for their weight-they are too deep, and have the face up size of a 0.9ct diamond instead of a full carat appearance. Please let the experts here help you find a stone that is well cut. If you post your budget and color/clarity preferences they can help you find a stone online that will be beautiful.

 

[tyty333]

Ah, yes that is an unfortunate line. It has to do with pricing and what people believe and less about reality as far as
actually causing problems in stones. When they refer to causing issues they almost always mean "Strong" or "Very Strong".
That line has more to do with a perception of fluorescence than reality.

The paragraph below that states
"Nonetheless, the association between fluorescence and haziness persists, and diamonds in the D to H range with very strong fluorescence often sell for less than diamonds that do not have fluorescence, even though their color and transparency are most likely unaffected by their fluorescence. "

You are looking at a D but it does not have "Very Strong" fluorescence.

I think one of the articles spelled it out specifically that "Faint" was never an issue but I dont feel like going back to find the exact line.

Anyway, Faint in a D is not an issue. I did want to know what the SI1 grade-making inclusions are and if it said anything under comments.

Like @RMOO posted above though, you are probably not looking at well-cut stones which is more of an issue
then the Faint fluorescence in a D stone.

 

[lala646]

@OliverRudy I own two D graded stones with Strong Blue fluorescence and they are nothing but intensely white. In direct sun they definitely have a blue tint, but no haziness or oily-ness. But as others have cautioned, ask the seller for videos if you have any concerns, or better yet, have the contributors here help you find a truly exceptional stone.

 

[OliverRudy]

Both of these diamonds face up small for their weight-they are too deep, and have the face up size of a 0.9ct diamond instead of a full carat appearance. Please let the experts here help you find a stone that is well cut. If you post your budget and color/clarity preferences they can help you find a stone online that will be beautiful.

Both of these diamonds face up small for their weight-they are too deep, and have the face up size of a 0.9ct diamond instead of a full carat appearance. Please let the experts here help you find a stone that is well cut. If you post your budget and color/clarity preferences they can help you find a stone online that will be beautiful.

I am looking for a man’s ring. He is not flashy or ornate. They are not easy to come by and are stocked nowhere near me. My husbands birthday is June 18th and wanted to give him this for his birthday. He’s been very sick (S4 Met Bladder Cancer) and I wanted to get him something he’d love.
I found a man online that had a close rendition to what I had in my head…these are the diamonds he presented as choices. As I’m sure you can tell, I am not well versed in diamonds and the articles online are confusing and even contradictory to one another. Add in the fear of being scammed by someone online…it’s nerve wracking to say the least.

 

[Dreamer_D]

It sounds like this is a special piece for you, so I would suggest that you ask your jeweler to find you GIA excellent cut diamonds at least. Faint fluorescence is nothing to worry about. I know what articles say online. The trouble with the diamond industry is that it’s very confusing for consumers, and much of the pricing and valuation is based on marketing issues. The scare tactics about fluor is one of the marketing tactics. Also the emphasis on DEF color diamonds is largely based on marketing. Both campaigns are aimed at creating a sense of false scarcity that keeps prices high and consumers dependent on Jewelers for information. This forum is supposed to help break that power dynamic.

What is truly scarce and affects the beauty of a diamond the most is cut quality. Truly well cut diamonds can be seen sparkling across the room. That’s why we recommend you focus on that.

There are a number of very large online vendors that are completely trustworthy to buy from these days. And PayPal offers buyer protections too. So if you wanted to buy online you can do so safely if you choose.

 

[lovedogs]

For a special piece, please don't buy a poorly cut diamond.

 

[OliverRudy]

For a special piece, please don't buy a poorly cut diamond.

I’ve learned (on here) that “very good” may only matter in comparison to depth and other factors. I guess I am very naive to have thought that this purchase would have been much easier than it has proven to be.

 

[lovedogs]

I’ve learned (on here) that “very good” may only matter in comparison to depth and other factors. I guess I am very naive to have thought that this purchase would have been much easier than it has proven to be.

No, unfortunately "very good" usually means a poorly cut stone. Even gia XXX doesn't guarantee a top performer. We are happy to help you!

 

[DejaWiz]

The cut says “very good”. I am purchasing them from a jeweler out of state, so I do not have the option to see them in person. The stone is for a ring for my husband.

Hello and welcome to PriceScope, OliverRudy!
Crucial info taught to us by trade pros whom are present and engaged at PriceScope that place utmost criticality on cut precision, proportions, light return, and optical performance is that about 70% of all round diamonds that get sent to GIA for grading earn their supposed top "3X" grading, which tells us that GIA's criteria is far too broad and loose to benefit consumers looking for a diamond cut for beauty, but GIA is catering to cutters looking to cut for maximum carat weight in order to drive the pricing up. My hunch is that doing so also benefits GIA since they have different pricing based on the carat weight of the diamond sent in for grading.

The grading fees between a 0.99 and a 1.00 are as substantial as the cash register price of a 0.99 and a diamond that hits that magic 1.00 mark.



That being said, the diamonds you are inquiring about are what are called "steep-deep" diamonds, which have overly steep pavilion and/or crown angles and depth.
This is going to have a pretty negative impact in two important ways:
1. It's going to throw off proper light reflection making the diamond have noticeably reduced optical performance and beauty.
2. It's going to make the diamond have face-up physical measurements and appearance of a physically smaller diamond that has proportions and angles within true ideal ranges.

Meaning, you can find an exceptionally well cut diamond with outstanding material quality, proportions and angles within true ideal ranges, much more light return, and maximized optics/beauty in the 0.9-0.99 carat range that will look bigger and brighter than a poorly cut and proportioned 1.00 carat diamond that has an outer diameter within 0.15-0.25mm of the smaller carat diamond. More benefits of being highly selective about cut precision and optics is that you can drop a color grade or two (or three or four..really depends on the subjective color sensitivity and color tolerance of the wearer/viewer), possibly increase the clarity grade, and end up with a diamond that'll look whiter and brighter because of the sheer amount of light return coming back to the eyes.
To analogize, think of it as reflecting the light from an old dim incandescent flashlight off of a smudgy mirror compared to reflecting the light of a modern bright LED flashlight off of a clean mirror.
That well cut and proportioned 0.9-0.99 is going to blow the doors off of the poorly cut and proportioned 1.00 carat, while being about the same price or possibly even offering a cost savings.

 

[OliverRudy]

Thank you to everyone for being so educative, kind, and patient with me. I am not sure if anyone on here helping me on this thread might have what I’m looking for, his birthday is 6/18. I will attach a picture of the general idea. I’m warning you, as a jeweler it will not excite or wow you, but my husband is not a flashy gent. He likes yellow gold.
I thought that I could have answered all of the questions on C,C,C before talking with everyone here but I do not think I can now. I know that I want one carat, because I think he would not like anything larger. I know I want it beautiful for him. At this point, I’m not even sure what that would cost.
I can tell you that I have gained a lot of respect for how hard it is to be a gemologist!

 

[lovedogs]

Whats your budget?

 

[OliverRudy]

Whats your budget?

I don’t want to be the person that listed everything she wants and says some ridiculous number to have it. I’m unsure of what a realistic number would be.

 

[Dreamer_D]

FYI none of us are in the jewelry trade. We are just consumers like you who make diamonds our hobby. We post to help others for fun.

Budget matter because you can find what you are asking for in a wide range of prices. We can’t even begin to help without a ballpark at lest.

 

[OliverRudy]

Please no one trash me if I’m unrealistic, but when I set out on this my thought was around $10k.

 

[DejaWiz]

Should be plenty of budget for a 1 carat diamond if exceptional optical performance.

 

[OliverRudy]

Should be plenty of budget for a 1 carat diamond if exceptional optical performance.

Let me clarify, that was for the whole ring. Is that reasonable?

 

[Kim N]

Let me clarify, that was for the whole ring. Is that reasonable?

Very reasonable. You have the budget for a super ideal cut diamond, like this one, for example.

Diamond | 1.06 ct G VS2 Expert Selection Round Cut Loose Diamond GIA Certified | 4596074

This fabulous 1.06 carat Round Excellent cut diamond has a clarity grade of VS2 and color grade of G.It is an excellent choice for engagement rings. | 4596074

www.whiteflash.com

 

[DejaWiz]

Check out these ACA options:

Diamond | 1.022 ct G VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4553531

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.022 carat G color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4553531

www.whiteflash.com

Diamond | 1.064 ct G VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4553540

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 1.064 carat G color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4553540

www.whiteflash.com

 

[lovedogs]

Yup, that budget is more than adequate. You should choose one of the super ideal diamonds listed above!

 

[OliverRudy]

How do I get the ring made? Wouldn’t I still need a jeweler?

 

[lovedogs]

How do I get the ring made? Wouldn’t I still need a jeweler?

You can work with whiteflash to make the ring. I would call them

 

[lovedogs]

Exampple of something they can order (you would buy the center stone and they'd set it).

Simon G. MR2036 Men's Wedding Ring - Whiteflash | 4096

Showcase your style with Simon G. MR2036 Men's Wedding Ring. Find exceptional craftsmanship and contemporary design at Whiteflash. Shop now and express your love. | 4096

www.whiteflash.com

 

[lovedogs]

I'm sure WF can also order from stuller (which is a company that makes settings and only sells to jewelers).

Example:

14K White 6.5 mm Round Engagement Band Mounting

120262 / Ring / Unset / 14K White / Round / 6.5 mm / Polished / Ring Mounting

www.stuller.com

 

[lovedogs]

Or

14K White 6.5 mm Round Mens Ring Mounting

126231 / Solitaire / Ring / Unset / 14K White / Round / 6.5 mm / Polished / Ring Mounting

www.stuller.com