Donald Trump - Guns in Schools

[Calliecake]

Donald Trump is saying one of the first things he will do if elected President is get rid of gun free zones on schools.

 

[kenny]

Donald Trump is saying one of the first things he will do if elected President is get rid of gun free zones on schools.

There are no words.

 

[packrat]

Which means..what, really? If someone is going to shoot up a school, they're not going to say aw shit, I guess I can't b/c of this sign and then walk away. As we've seen. Gun free zones=most law abiding citizens won't carry there.

 

[AGBF]

Donald Trump is saying one of the first things he will do if elected President is get rid of gun free zones on schools.

Two questions:

First, Why? Is he saying why he doesn't want gun-free zones? Whom he wishes to arm?
Second, does the president have the authority to designate gun-free zones all over the country? Are there now gun-free zones around all schools through an executive order? It seems unusual since schools fall under local control.

Maybe one of our attorneys-Molly Malone?-can answer these questions. If not, I will ask my brother. He is a housing attorney, but he is involved in his town's school board (a legacy from when kids were in high school).

AGBF

 

[monarch64]

If he's elected president I will seriously consider leaving this country.

I can't decide what I think about public schools not being gun free zones. It makes me uncomfortable to imagine it, but I think that might be because I'm not used to being around guns or people who carry them regularly. Well, I take that back, I know several who carry concealed but I never think about it when I'm around them because the guns aren't visible. Ok, so when I think about what this would mean I am picturing armed guards standing at school entrances to deter any would-be attackers. Like the guards with machetes and machine guns outside banks in Jamaica? (Sorry that's the first example that popped into my mind.) I don't want to live in a place where this has to happen, and I don't want my child to grow up with this as her "normal," but then again would I feel like she was safer if this became the case? I don't know. I'm gonna go crawl under a chair now and scold myself for considering that this could even be a thing I would be ok with.

 

[redwood66]

It is generally by state law that elementary and high schools are off limits to firearms.

 

[jordyonbass]

Which means..what, really? If someone is going to shoot up a school, they're not going to say aw shit, I guess I can't b/c of this sign and then walk away. As we've seen. Gun free zones=most law abiding citizens won't carry there.

Just out of curiosity and I ask this with all due respect packrat - if it is legal to do so, would you take a gun to a school - just in case? And if not, who do you think should? I have experience with firearms and have dealt with dangerous situations with wild dogs and boars but that sort of thing is a different situation entirely and I am not willing to say I could react effectively to a person shooting up a public place. Not many people can at all under such duress.

I have read a lot of your posts and I do understand you are pro-gun. You could say I am as well for the fact that we need them for protection in the outback from wild animals whenever doing vermin eradication, however I do not keep a firearm within 100 miles of where I live and have no interest in starting to do so. It interests me how we have such varying stances while both being relatively pro-gun.

 

[missy]

Monnie, I'm moving too if Trump is elected.
That man is dangerous in so many ways.

 

[Rhea]

The problem is, moving to where? The world as a whole is very anti-immigrant at the moment. That includes even highly educated, white skinned, high earning immigrants who have no medical problems or criminal history. For English speaking Western countries it's not abnormal for immigrants to only be considered if they are on a skills shortage list and have met age and income requirements. Even then a visa may be temporary, such as tied to an employer or length of time rather than indefinite.

Canada has a quick check for eligibility here www.cic.gc.ca/english/Immigrate/index.asp
Australia here www.border.gov.au/Trav/Visa-1
UK here www.gov.uk/browse/visas-immigration

There are other countries of course, I just went for the large English speaking ones.

 

[missy]

Rhea, thanks for that info. Looks like my first choice Australia (should Trump become president) won't allow us to relocate permanently.

Fortunately I think Trump has no chance of being elected.

 

[jordyonbass]

Rhea, thanks for that info. Looks like my first choice Australia (should Trump become president) won't allow us to relocate permanently.

Fortunately I think Trump has no chance of being elected.

They have to find you to send you back, we're a landmass the same size roughly as the US but with less than 10% of the population so as you can imagine our authorities are much smaller in numbers. Plus I can teach you some of my bush survival tricks which will make it even harder for immigration officers to find you and send you back

 

[missy]

Rhea, thanks for that info. Looks like my first choice Australia (should Trump become president) won't allow us to relocate permanently.

Fortunately I think Trump has no chance of being elected.

They have to find you to send you back, we're a landmass the same size roughly as the US but with less than 10% of the population so as you can imagine our authorities are much smaller in numbers. Plus I can teach you some of my bush survival tricks which will make it even harder for immigration officers to find you and send you back

Thank you Jordy! I appreciate your offer and I will keep that in mind. It's good to have a plan just in case the unthinkable happens.
I would love living in Australia.

 

[monarch64]

The problem is, moving to where? The world as a whole is very anti-immigrant at the moment. That includes even highly educated, white skinned, high earning immigrants who have no medical problems or criminal history. For English speaking Western countries it's not abnormal for immigrants to only be considered if they are on a skills shortage list and have met age and income requirements. Even then a visa may be temporary, such as tied to an employer or length of time rather than indefinite.

Canada has a quick check for eligibility here www.cic.gc.ca/english/Immigrate/index.asp
Australia here www.border.gov.au/Trav/Visa-1
UK here www.gov.uk/browse/visas-immigration

There are other countries of course, I just went for the large English speaking ones.

It's a discussion I've had with my husband for years now. We have a plan and it doesn't include English-speaking countries.

 

[jordyonbass]

Rhea, thanks for that info. Looks like my first choice Australia (should Trump become president) won't allow us to relocate permanently.

Fortunately I think Trump has no chance of being elected.

They have to find you to send you back, we're a landmass the same size roughly as the US but with less than 10% of the population so as you can imagine our authorities are much smaller in numbers. Plus I can teach you some of my bush survival tricks which will make it even harder for immigration officers to find you and send you back

Thank you Jordy! I appreciate your offer and I will keep that in mind. It's good to have a plan just in case the unthinkable happens.
I would love living in Australia.

It's not a bad life, we're on the other side of the world and Trump has no reason to come here since he probably thinks we're just a bunch of drunk convicts. Oh and we've got a beautiful country full of amazing scenery and wildlife. Just need to be careful of some of the wildlife, especially drunk Irish backpackers

 

[Rhea]

It's a discussion I've had with my husband for years now. We have a plan and it doesn't include English-speaking countries.

That sounds exciting! As an immigrant, I just get a bit frustrated when people throw the idea of immigrating around easily. Most people I speak with assume I must have done something wrong because surely it'd be easier to move and cheaper than I made it.

 

[monarch64]

It's a discussion I've had with my husband for years now. We have a plan and it doesn't include English-speaking countries.

That sounds exciting! As an immigrant, I just get a bit frustrated when people throw the idea of immigrating around easily. Most people I speak with assume I must have done something wrong because surely it'd be easier to move and cheaper than I made it.

One of us has been deported once...do you think this will be a problem?

 

[redwood66]

When I was in high school my parents researched moving to Australia. It proved to be very difficult and expensive due to the occupation of my parents. My father was a horse trainer and we lived on our family's large ranch training, breeding, selling high dollar Quarter Horses. The market in Australia was growing quickly for the type of horses we had but the quarantine hurdles were so long and expensive that it was not financially feasible for anyone but the most wealthy. In hindsight it would have been an adventure but I am glad they decided against it.

It is on my bucket list of places to visit and sounds amazing Jordyonbass.

 

[AGBF]

Monnie, I'm moving too if Trump is elected.
That man is dangerous in so many ways.

My question: is he more dangerous to people here or to people abroad?

 

[momhappy]

Which means..what, really? If someone is going to shoot up a school, they're not going to say aw shit, I guess I can't b/c of this sign and then walk away. As we've seen. Gun free zones=most law abiding citizens won't carry there.

This doesn't make sense to me. If a gun-free zone means most law-abiding citizens won't be carrying, then wouldn't that maybe be more appealing to a criminal? If you are a criminal (and you want to inflict as harm as possible) wouldn't you want to choose a place where you know it's unlikely that people can shoot back? This, of course, assumes that criminals put a lot of careful thought and consideration into their plans of action, which is not always the case.

As far as Trump's talk on gun-free school zones, I know very little about it, so I'm not able to comment on it at this time. I wouldn't jump to conclusions one way or another before fact-checking.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Rhea, thanks for that info. Looks like my first choice Australia (should Trump become president) won't allow us to relocate permanently.

Fortunately I think Trump has no chance of being elected.

He will not be the GOP nominee.

 

[packrat]

Which means..what, really? If someone is going to shoot up a school, they're not going to say aw shit, I guess I can't b/c of this sign and then walk away. As we've seen. Gun free zones=most law abiding citizens won't carry there.

This doesn't make sense to me. If a gun-free zone means most law-abiding citizens won't be carrying, then wouldn't that maybe be more appealing to a criminal? If you are a criminal (and you want to inflict as harm as possible) wouldn't you want to choose a place where you know it's unlikely that people can shoot back? This, of course, assumes that criminals put a lot of careful thought and consideration into their plans of action, which is not always the case.

As far as Trump's talk on gun-free school zones, I know very little about it, so I'm not able to comment on it at this time. I wouldn't jump to conclusions one way or another before fact-checking.

That's what I'm saying. Gun free zones mean *I* won't carry there, as a law abiding citizen. Now, were I someone bent on harming as many people as I could, making as much of a statement as I could, that's exactly where I would go, knowing full well people won't have means to protect themselves. I'm not going to get pissed and go to..say, a gun show and start firing. I'm not going to go to the police station and start firing. I'm not going to go to the gun range. I'm going to go where people are the most defenseless.

 

[partgypsy]

For some reason this thread reminds me of this

http://www.theonion.com/article/gorilla-sales-skyrocket-after-latest-gorilla-attac-30860

 

[packrat]

Which means..what, really? If someone is going to shoot up a school, they're not going to say aw shit, I guess I can't b/c of this sign and then walk away. As we've seen. Gun free zones=most law abiding citizens won't carry there.

Just out of curiosity and I ask this with all due respect packrat - if it is legal to do so, would you take a gun to a school - just in case? And if not, who do you think should? I have experience with firearms and have dealt with dangerous situations with wild dogs and boars but that sort of thing is a different situation entirely and I am not willing to say I could react effectively to a person shooting up a public place. Not many people can at all under such duress.

I have read a lot of your posts and I do understand you are pro-gun. You could say I am as well for the fact that we need them for protection in the outback from wild animals whenever doing vermin eradication, however I do not keep a firearm within 100 miles of where I live and have no interest in starting to do so. It interests me how we have such varying stances while both being relatively pro-gun.

Nope, I don't think I would. My husband wants me to. He wants me to train and train and train and be proficient and comfortable, and he wants me to be able to protect myself. I want to train and train and train and be proficient, and I have my CCW, so legally I can, but honestly, I don't know that I'd ever be so comfortable. I've never even been hunting and shot an animal ( tho I will, I don't have an issue w/hunting), and not like oh I need to start w/animals and work my way up to people, that's not what I'm saying at all. I'm just saying, taking a life is a big deal to me. Spiders, wasps, bugs, that's different. I ran over a snake accidentally with the mower a few years ago and sobbed these great gasping sobs b/c I knew he would die, slowly. (Now either I or the kids stomp all over the yard first to make sure any snakes go hide) I can tell you the animals I've hit w/my car over the course of 25 years of driving. (a deer, a possum, two birds, a squirrel and two cats), and I remember each one, and there were tears/feelings with each one.

Now, were it "even stevens" like, someone attacking me or my kids or someone burst into our classroom and started attacking the kids and didn't have a gun/knife and I needed to attack that person to save a child, I think that person would be a smear on the floor and LE would have to drag me kicking and screaming off that person.

A gun is more final than my fists/teeth/nails/kicks/whatever else, and I would be worried I would accidentally hit the child I was trying to save.

As far as just owning a gun to "own" it, I do enjoy shooting at targets. I enjoy the precision, I enjoy that my body/brain have to work together to hit the target, I enjoy the practice of it. I enjoy learning about them, so that I'm not so scared of them, I don't want it to have that power of me. It is a feeling of power to shoot, I don't deny that. To me tho, the word "power" isn't power over someone else, control over someone else, it's power over *myself*, control of *myself*, power over the object in my control of it. That *I* can learn and work at something and practice and I can hit that target. Taekwondo and yoga are like that for me as well. I'm learning to keep myself in a "growth mindset" rather than a fixed mindset, and I've been working on that for a couple years now. It's empowering to me and for me, to see someone else doing something, and think wow, that's really cool..I'd like to be able to do that but I don't think I can...but I'll try at least.

I'm not an either/or person. I'm not a person of extremes. Except for like..eating, and cat ownership...I have troubles staying in the middle there.

 

[packrat]

Rhea, thanks for that info. Looks like my first choice Australia (should Trump become president) won't allow us to relocate permanently.

Fortunately I think Trump has no chance of being elected.

Well..shoot (ha)..that would've been my choice as well. I don't think JD would want to stay here either..but there'd be no place else he'd feel comfortable.

Good. I'm pretty sure he'd get us into WWIII.

 

[kenny]

For some reason this thread reminds me of this

http://www.theonion.com/article/gorilla-sales-skyrocket-after-latest-gorilla-attac-30860

Hahahaha!

 

[Tekate]

Great.. that is not what we need. We need our kids to be safe, not fearful.

 

[Tekate]

Last January I was on NZ and Australia and we checked into the logistics of emigration, but it seemed that they do not want immigrants without being helpful to their economy.. no retirees wanted

 

[Maria D]

Last January I was on NZ and Australia and we checked into the logistics of emigration, but it seemed that they do not want immigrants without being helpful to their economy.. no retirees wanted

Both countries have taxpayer funded universal healthcare - so, makes sense.