What is the ''best'' color for Tourmaline & spinel?

[chictomato]

Pls excuse me if you find the question silly.. as I understand that its all down to personal preference. I was just wondering that Tourmaline & spinel comes in so many colors. Which type of color is the most sought-after for a collector? For instance I understand that for Peridot, a fine grass green is more preferred than one with yellow or brownish tone. Can someone provide some color guide for tourmaline and spinel?

 

[Pandora II]

Tourmaline - probably a true and fine quality Paraiba with a neon glow (and a budget that allows you to pay $10k a carat). On the less expensive side a great chrome tourmaline is hard to beat - they''re a fabulous green colour.

Spinel - a fine cobalt blue. I''ve only seen them in pictures, it''s like hunting a needle in a haystack and they come with a price tag to match.

 

[Pandora II]

Here''s a paraiba from Cherrypicked.com

It''s 2.94ct and can be yours for $47,070...

 

[chrono]

Tourmalines and spinels come in many different colours and all are sought after. What makes one better than the other is the purity of hue, intensity of saturation and the tone. Some colours are rarer than others, therefore, rarity then increases the market price. It is not, however, better than a different colour, just more difficult to find, thus the price reflects that. In terms of price, I believe a Brazilian original mine unheated Paraiba tourmaline with that unmistakable glow is the most expensive with prices up to $40K/ct. Red spinels (and Mahenges) are now some of the most expensive spinels, in particular, the ones that are dead ringers for a top ruby. Cobalt spinels of a bright blue (not the common darkish ones seen) are also rare, and as such expensive. Depending on the size you are looking for, expect to pay well over $1K/ct for these spinels. I have seen the Mahenges go over $3K/ct as well for the very best colour.

Hue: the purer the colour, the more desired it is.
Saturation: Stronger intensity means no gray nor brown undertones. It also means the colour is so vivid, it appears to glow
Tone: Medium or Medium dark is desired but this varies. Basically, stones that are too light or too dark are not in demand.

 

[ma re]

Besides those already mentioned;

Really good blue tourmalines (non-cuprians) with a bright color are not exactly easy to find either. Bi-color ones with balanced hues (of similar lightness) and about equal portions of each color are hard to find also (and pricey). Yellow tourmalines are not too rare, but can be hard to find in pure lemony shades, especially in larger sizes.

When it comes to spinels, purple ones of intense color are quite rare, while orangy-pink ones (sometimes called flame spinels) are rare, expensive and sought after.

 

[T L]

I prefer tourmaline that does not go extinct in certain lighting, or has an "open double axis." Most tourmaline also tends to change color in certain lighting to a less desirable color with some brown or grey in it. Mint colors, rubellites (neon red/pink that holds it's color in all lighting) are also in demand right now in tourmaline.

As far as spinel, neon red/pink spinel is also very high in demand. Spinel has a tendency to go grey, or turn more grey in certain lighting, and that's generally looked at as an unwanted characteristic.

Basically, in any stone species, you want the most vivid color saturation without secondary modifiers of brown, grey or sometimes yellow. That's typically the standard. Top quality Burma rubies, Paraiba tourmalines are some of the most vivid gems in the world, and have the pricetag to match.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Usually the most expensive correlates to the most sought after (market forces etc) which correlates to the most collectable.

In which case Paraiba tourmalines and cobalt blue or ruby red spinels.

The next bracket down price wise would probably be the chrome green tourmalines (though personally I like the bright non-cuprian blues better). Not sure for spinels, but I''d guess the bright hot pink ones (though I may be biased based on the posting on this board, haha)

 

[Harriet]

"Flame" is generally used to refer to orangish-red spinels, not orangish-pinks.

 

[Barrett]

I have to agree with chrono on all points..one tourmaline that i saw was the most fantastic ever..it was a portuguese type cut with a watermelon center of pink and green..half the center was pink the other half green..well around the outside of the stone it was orange, yellow, and pink with all colors showing..stone came from nigeria..Jason brims saw it too. I have no idea how the colors came out that way seems impossible but it was a real deal tourmaline It was either 11 or 21cts...don''t remember..never seen a stone like that before..

 

[ma re]

Date: 10/8/2009 9:09:52 PM
Author: Harriet
''Flame'' is generally used to refer to orangish-red spinels, not orangish-pinks.

Thanks for the correction

 

[brandy_z28]

Date: 10/9/2009 12:18:15 AM
Author: amethystguy
I have to agree with chrono on all points..one tourmaline that i saw was the most fantastic ever..it was a portuguese type cut with a watermelon center of pink and green..half the center was pink the other half green..well around the outside of the stone it was orange, yellow, and pink with all colors showing..stone came from nigeria..Jason brims saw it too. I have no idea how the colors came out that way seems impossible but it was a real deal tourmaline It was either 11 or 21cts...don''t remember..never seen a stone like that before..

Oh wow amethystguy! I love quirky unique stones like the one you described! I can only imagine how pretty it was!

 

[Arcadian]

Date: 10/8/2009 9:09:52 PM
Author: Harriet
''Flame'' is generally used to refer to orangish-red spinels, not orangish-pinks.

Do you know where I can find any examples Harriet? I''ve never seen one.



-A

 

[Harriet]

Here! I have a 1.66, but I have trouble capturing the colour.

 

[Richard M.]

This 1.99 ct. gem -- which needs and will get a re-cut -- is a nearly perfect example of Flame Spinel color. These stones truly glow like fire and are probably my favorite spinel hue although it''s hard to choose just one. Some Flame Spinels are a bit more orange with the same "neon" glow.

Richard M. (Rick Martin)

 

[Arcadian]

OOOOOO thats purdy

-A

 

[chrono]

Richard,
That stone has such an incredibly rich fiery colour. Fabulous!

 

[T L]

Date: 10/9/2009 9:42:17 PM
Author: Richard M.
This 1.99 ct. gem -- which needs and will get a re-cut -- is a nearly perfect example of Flame Spinel color. These stones truly glow like fire and are probably my favorite spinel hue although it''s hard to choose just one. Some Flame Spinels are a bit more orange with the same ''neon'' glow.

Richard M. (Rick Martin)

Great stone Richard. No "brick red" there!! Most "flame spinels" I see tend to photograph a brick red color. I wonder why????

 

[chictomato]

Thanks to all the input! So what do you think of a Tourmaline in this color? Is it considered intense? tks

 

[chrono]

No, not to my eye as I see the picture on my monitor. It has a slight orange brown undertone.

 

[T L]

Date: 10/16/2009 7:51:41 AM
Author: Chrono
No, not to my eye as I see the picture on my monitor. It has a slight orange brown undertone.

Ditto. There's a window in that stone as well. I know these are apples and oranges, but compare it to the red spinel Richard posted above. Both stones are in the red color family, and the vivid spinel makes this stone look dull and bland.

 

[Gailey]

Date: 10/9/2009 9:42:17 PM
Author: Richard M.
This 1.99 ct. gem -- which needs and will get a re-cut -- is a nearly perfect example of Flame Spinel color. These stones truly glow like fire and are probably my favorite spinel hue although it''s hard to choose just one. Some Flame Spinels are a bit more orange with the same ''neon'' glow.

Richard M. (Rick Martin)

NOW THAT''S MY KIND OF RED!!!!!

That''s gorgeous Rick, will it be re-cut for inventory or is it already spoken for?

 

[ma re]

Date: 10/16/2009 4:10:10 AM
Author: chictomato
Thanks to all the input! So what do you think of a Tourmaline in this color? Is it considered intense? tks

Not particularly, those shades are rather common. In fact, I''m pretty sure a good Mozambique garnet can look much better and not cost much more (while having a similar shade of color). If you''d like to find a really fine red tourmaline (they''re called rubelites) try finding some that have a bright shade of red with a bit of pink. HERE is some info and nice pics, but you can find a lot more online.

 

[chictomato]

Thanks how about this color AJS

 

[chrono]

In terms of saturation, the AJS stone isn’t intense or vivid either. As Ma Re suggested, I like the idea of rubellites. I’ve seen some very intense rubellites at Paraiba International.

 

[AustenNut]

I think that AJS is very striking, though I can''t comment as to the saturation or vividness that the experts here are referring to. It''s a pretty stone, regardless if it''s one of the "best" colors.

And yes, Paraiba has some GORGEOUS rubellites. I''m still drooling over a pair there.

 

[Stone Hunter]

Personally I just go for what color I like. I''m not buying stones as an investment, but for enjoyment!

As far as Spinels go I like the blues and violets and I''d love to see some more unusual colors. Red just isn''t for me, and I''m not into pink either.

Are you buying for yourself or do you want what''s IN right now?

 

[chictomato]

Date: 10/16/2009 10:44:08 PM
Author: Stone Hunter

Personally I just go for what color I like. I''m not buying stones as an investment, but for enjoyment!

As far as Spinels go I like the blues and violets and I''d love to see some more unusual colors. Red just isn''t for me, and I''m not into pink either.

Are you buying for yourself or do you want what''s IN right now?

Mm.. not buying Just ''learning''

 

[ma re]

That AJS stone is an interesting one, but so are most bi-colored tourmalines out there - really unique gems. However, if you''d like to know what is considered good quality in these bi-colored tourmalines, it''s the following. Both colors should be on the light side, and similar in tone (darkness) and saturation (richness). Colors should also be evenly devided across the gemstone, or at least come close to that. HERE''s a good guide to bi-colored tourmalines, and there are also many other gem varieties covered there under "Dictionary" -> "Gemstones, Quality and Value".

 

[Sagebrush]

mr. ma re,

I find I have to take issue with Mr. Suwa''s opinion. The richer and more saturated the hue, the more desirable the gem. A red/green bi-color, though rare, will command a higher price than a pastel pink/light green. Tonally the red could be as much as 80% tone, the green 75%. I do agree that a 50/50 ratio is the more desirable. Truly the finest bi-colors when cut into an opposed bar cut with patterns of light running up and down the stone as it is turned in the light, is truly magnificent.

We used to buy flawless tourmaline crystals as long as your finger in Teofilo Otoni, in the mid to late 80s and have them cut into bars at a local lapidary. Sometimes you could find a green/blue bi-color that would cut a truly magnificent bi-color bar.

 

[ma re]

Interesting point there Richard, and I''m sure that intensly colored bi-colors command higher prices, but I think that Mr. Suwa was probably refering to a gem''s use in jewellery, where two intense colors in a single gem are usually not so coveted, especially in high-end jewellery where subtlety and elegance are desired (think padparadscha sapphire). Two bright colors can also be tricky to use due to colors easily clashing with those of other materials used in the piece. It''s either that, or he just left that information out, knowing how rare those vivid red/green ones are, who knows.