what a joke and only can happen in this beloved country of ours...

[VegasAngel]

I have seen cashiers embarass customers using WIC unfortunately- Exactly for the reason Indy mentioned they pick up the wrong item & WIC is very specific about what you get. The cashier will get on speaker, announce the have a WIC customer with a wrong item/go back. WIC can be abused too a lot of women sell the formula on Craigslist or Ebay.

 

[crown1]

Date: 8/18/2008 11:24:45 AM
Author: aliciagirl
I just want to share a personal story that is really hard to share along the lines on not judging other people, even those who are, God forbid, stealing your taxpayer dollars.

My mother gets government assistance. It''s not because she lazy. It''s because she is severely mentally disabled and is totally unable to maintain a normal, adult relationship, let alone have a job. She no longer is able to live on her own, but when she was, she embarrassed herself in the store all the time because she honestly didn''t understand why she could and couldn''t spend money on certain items versus others. When you talk to her, you can''t tell that she''s severely schizophrenic... she seems like a relatively normal person who is a little bit shaky because of her meds and sometimes laughs out loud or talk quietly to herself. When I was younger, I witnessed people just like all of you giving her a hard time at the grocery store because she didn''t understand exactly what was covered and what wasn''t, like that makes her some kind of terrible, awful person. Even as a kid, I wanted to just yell and scream at these people that everything isn''t exactly what it seems. Sure, she seemed mostly normal, but she wasn''t. Not even close.

This isn''t an issue of people abusing the system because I understand that lots of people do. But you don''t understand this man''s situation or anyone else''s that get government assistance. And I truly hope that any one of those people who gave my mom a hard time have to experience just once what it was like to be her shoes.

How about doing something to change the current system instead of assuming everyone who uses it is abusing it. I, personally, would rather have one person''s life be changed or, in my mom''s cased, saved, even if that means there are 50 others who abuse the system.

I guess because of that I should just move to a Socialist nation.

i have true compassion for your mother and others like her. giving her or anyone a hard time is not good. if the op gave the man a hard time i do not recall it. i think he was just "venting" like many of this forum come here to do. it depends on who is doing the venting as to whether it becomes "drama". many who are taking a hard line here have done their share of giving the grief. seems all of us should talk to the person in the mirror. all have judged and it is fine to make your opinion known but there is a line and a way to do so. my best to your mother.

 

[risingsun]

DF~I have read a number of your posts and it appears that you enjoy "stirring the pot." I ''m not sure that I believe this incident ever happened, but giving you the benefit of the doubt, let''s say it did. It bothered you and you decided to open a thread on it here. Why? Did you really think it would not start a controversy...or maybe that was the point

When I was divorced from my first husband, he got into some business problems and couldn''t pay child support for some time. I got a job, but it wasn''t enough to pay the bills. My parents very generously made up the difference so my daughter and I could live independently until things were sorted out--which they were, in time. With my parents'' blessing and support, we did not have to live on beans and franks and peanut butter. Without my parents contribution, I surely would have applied for food stamps. I would also have felt humiliated about the assumptions others would have made about me.

My life is very different today. I worked hard to make it different, but I also had the support of my family, my education, and other socioeconomic advantages. What if I didn''t have these things going for me?

 

[crown1]

Date: 8/18/2008 10:28:09 AM
Author: Skippy123

Date: 8/18/2008 12:15:26 AM
Author: crown1
for all those who are interested in helping kids who need food there is a great program being utilized in my area. volunteers are packing backpacks to be sent home with needy children on the weekends. there are many children dependent on school breakfast and lunch programs for meals. many of those children were not having much to eat over the weekend thus the program. peanut butter, crackers, breakfast bars and the like are being loaded into the packs for the children to have when they need.

there are many things we can do to be part of the solution. i hope all who spoke up for the needy get involved in some way.

Crown, that is a great reminder!

I was reading a lot of the food banks are running on low because many people have not been giving! I will be sure to clean out my cabinets and run to the store and buy some pb jars! Thank you!

hi skipppy! i thank you for the comment. have a great day!

 

[Anna0499]

Alicia - The cost of the lobster would''ve deterred my mother from ever even consider buying it with foodstamps, but I definitely understand that a disabled person might not understand this. As I said earlier, there are a million assumptions that are possible from the OP & we will never know the true details of the man''s life, so we can only give opinions based on our own personal experiences & assumptions. It''s true of ANY post on PS, whether it be a LIW seeking relationship advice or any of the numerous threads on the Hangout. All the talk of assumptions reminded me of the recent thread about loaning someone money & that person using it to treat her BF to concerts. A bunch of PSers chimed in saying that if she can send her BF to concerts then she can pay the loan back, etc., but there are a million assumptions that could''ve been drawn from that situation as well (i.e. what if the concerts were a gift?). I think everyone knows that you shouldn''t just label someone as an "abuser" without all the details, but in cases such as this where there are none, assumptions must be drawn (i.e. assuming he is celebrating once-a-year vs. he buys luxury items everyday with foodstamps - both assumptions).

Vegasangel - That is horrible! I would always allow them to take the items back & get whatever they wanted allowed by the rules in their own way; I would never think to get on the speakerphone! How unnecessary & classless.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 8/18/2008 12:04:19 PM
Author: risingsun
DF~I have read a number of your posts and it appears that you enjoy ''stirring the pot.'' I ''m not sure that I believe this incident ever happened, but giving you the benefit of the doubt, let''s say it did. It bothered you and you decided to open a thread on it here. Why? Did you really think it would not start a controversy...or maybe that was the point

i may joke a lot but not this time. my wife was shock too.

 

[meresal]

Date: 8/18/2008 10:29:22 AM
Author: Skippy123

Date: 8/18/2008 12:32:16 AM
Author: miraclesrule
Yeah, if I had the choice to react with disdain OR offer to buy the person enough lobster to feed their family a lobster dinner,

I would choose the latter every time. If I ever become the former, I would rather not exist.

Of course, I would also strike up a conversation to learn their story.

I hear you! It soo reminds me of the Christmas Shoes, story!

Skippy- Again I feel like we''re sharing a brain!!

After posting, I read thru the entire thread, and by the end of the 2nd page, the first thing I thought of was "Christmas Shoes" and thought to myself "Christmas Lobster".

 

[crown1]

Date: 8/18/2008 12:09:38 PM
Author: IndyGirl22
Alicia - The cost of the lobster would''ve deterred my mother from ever even consider buying it with foodstamps, but I definitely understand that a disabled person might not understand this. As I said earlier, there are a million assumptions that are possible from the OP & we will never know the true details of the man''s life, so we can only give opinions based on our own personal experiences & assumptions. It''s true of ANY post on PS, whether it be a LIW seeking relationship advice or any of the numerous threads on the Hangout. All the talk of assumptions reminded me of the recent thread about loaning someone money & that person using it to treat her BF to concerts. A bunch of PSers chimed in saying that if she can send her BF to concerts then she can pay the loan back, etc., but there are a million assumptions that could''ve been drawn from that situation as well (i.e. what if the concerts were a gift?). I think everyone knows that you shouldn''t just label someone as an ''abuser'' without all the details, but in cases such as this where there are none, assumptions must be drawn (i.e. assuming he is celebrating once-a-year vs. he buys luxury items everyday with foodstamps - both assumptions).

Vegasangel - That is horrible! I would always allow them to take the items back & get whatever they wanted allowed by the rules in their own way; I would never think to get on the speakerphone! How unnecessary & classless.

you have made a good point about the thread you mentioned. i do think we may be thinking along the same line on this. i think another error committed here is telling strangers what they deserve. how many times do we read members telling others to go for something because they deserve it? this is never questioned like this thought that the man may have been abusing the system. i do not know if he was or not but people are fond of making the comment "if it looks like a duck and walks like a duck.....". i am for juding by the same measure. many of us don''t know other posters personally so are not equipped to say who deserves what. it is easiest to just be nice to everybody. wouldn''t that be a great world.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 8/18/2008 10:03:35 AM
Author: Julianna

Date: 8/18/2008 9:38:23 AM
Author: thing2of2
All this talk about tax dollars got me thinking about how much money is being spent on the Iraq war. I did a little poking around and it looks like most estimates say about $300 million a DAY is spent on the Iraq war. Estimates also say we''ve spent almost $1 TRILLION so far. What welfare recipients do with their food stamps is the least of my worries when it comes to misuse of taxpayer dollars.

This country is in the crapper and all people are worried about is ''welfare queens'' popping out kids and buying lobster for dinner? Hilarious.

Actually, yes. More worried about the ''popping out'' of kids than the lobster situation, incidentally, but still. I can hardly name ONE SINGLE use of my personal tax dollars in this country that is not frivilous, ridiculous, shady, or any combination of the three. That includes both a fruitless, lie-based war and some useless waste of skin working on her 5th kid/5th baby daddy on my dime. My 70 hour workweeks support both of these things, neither with my explicit permission. Not that hilarious.

I shall now take a minute of silence for this momentous occassion: the first time I ever disagreed with thing2. Bleh.

Hahaha-sorry Julianna!

 

[Julianna]

Date: 8/18/2008 12:34:17 PM
Author: thing2of2

Date: 8/18/2008 10:03:35 AM
Author: Julianna

Date: 8/18/2008 9:38:23 AM
Author: thing2of2
All this talk about tax dollars got me thinking about how much money is being spent on the Iraq war. I did a little poking around and it looks like most estimates say about $300 million a DAY is spent on the Iraq war. Estimates also say we''ve spent almost $1 TRILLION so far. What welfare recipients do with their food stamps is the least of my worries when it comes to misuse of taxpayer dollars.

This country is in the crapper and all people are worried about is ''welfare queens'' popping out kids and buying lobster for dinner? Hilarious.

Actually, yes. More worried about the ''popping out'' of kids than the lobster situation, incidentally, but still. I can hardly name ONE SINGLE use of my personal tax dollars in this country that is not frivilous, ridiculous, shady, or any combination of the three. That includes both a fruitless, lie-based war and some useless waste of skin working on her 5th kid/5th baby daddy on my dime. My 70 hour workweeks support both of these things, neither with my explicit permission. Not that hilarious.

I shall now take a minute of silence for this momentous occassion: the first time I ever disagreed with thing2. Bleh.

Hahaha-sorry Julianna!

Meh. You still rule.

 

[cara]

DF, are you sure you just didn''t enter some kind of time warp? Lobster once was poor man''s food. There is an old Massachusetts law that set an upper limit for the number of times per week that the poor could be served lobster at soup kitchens. It has gone from "bugs of the sea" to rich delicacy.

Anyway, certainly lobster is a poor use of food stamps these days, but I would want to know the circumstances that inspired this person before condemning them entirely. I support my tax dollars going to food stamps even with a certain amount of misuse. The upside - food for hungry people - is too important, and the overall cost is low compared to, say, this boondoggle in Iraq.

 

[fieryred33143]

This entire thread makes me incredibly sad because to be 100% honest, most of you are talking out of where the sun doesn''t shine.

I am very glad that the majority of you have never had to experience any of this and I would never wish something like government assistance on any of you. I lost a lot of respect for people on here that were usually some of my very favorite posters with this thread.

You can get all political all you want. But when your kids are starving and you have to swallow your pride and ask for assistance, it doesn''t matter who the president is, whether you are a republican or democrat, or if there are millions of Welfare Queens in the world. You do what you have to do for your family.

 

[CrookedRock]

Fiery, I don''t think anyone (and I know I didn''t), put down the people who genuinely need help such as Alicia''s Mother. Those people absolutely need help and should get help. It''s what the American spirit used to be all about... Helping one another.
I just wanted to point out that no one has put down those who are truly in need. It''s the abuse that bothers people, and one reason is bc it creates stereotypes.

 

[fieryred33143]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:00:54 PM
Author: CrookedRock
Fiery, I don''t think anyone (and I know I didn''t), put down the people who genuinely need help such as Alicia''s Mother. Those people absolutely need help and should get help. It''s what the American spirit used to be all about... Helping one another.
I just wanted to point out that no one has put down those who are truly in need. It''s the abuse that bothers people, and one reason is bc it creates stereotypes.

That''s exactly right. Stereotypes. And its because of those stereotypes that everyone assumed this person asking if they could purchase a lobster with their assistance is abusing the system. This entire debate was because of the stereotype that DF lumped everyone into.

I think MC said it best a few pages ago. We are all debating over something when we have no idea what really happened and none of us were even there.

 

[jas]

Although the article is about soup kitchens and not "welfare" (although, if you read the laws, there is no such term used, at least as I recall), I believe it goes to the heart of some of this discussion, particularly the final paragraph.

http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2008/08/18/heather_ryan/

I spend a lot of time working at the Greater Chicago Food Depository. We take a lot of pride in giving people the best possible food items we can. That is more and more difficult as the federal government has taken away subsidies from companies who donated food previously. The people who benefit from the food banks are from all walks of life, and in talking with them, I know it takes a lot of strength to walk in and ask for help.

Ultimately, I cannot imagine trying to make someone ashamed of needing help. I also cannot imagine trying to shame someone because they may or may not be making less-than-stellar purchasing choices.

Is it skin off my nose if someone receiving assistance wants lobster? Maybe it should be, but it''s not.

The cycle of poverty is very complicated, particularly in the "ghetto" areas DF mentioned. The factors are social, economic, political, and at times, very racial. I have worked with some low-income families in my former job. If you are third-generation in the cycle, where is the incentive to work if not working will make you as much or more money? The education in these neighborhoods is sub-par (the drop out rate, especially for males, is ridiculously high), the safety in these neighborhoods is sub-par, the family structure is often tenuous...for many the only "stability" the only "constant" is bleakness and/or a simmering anger. Sometimes that stability is gangs, sometimes that stability is "welfare," sometimes that stability is pushing through, thinking long-term, and getting out...where the real world ain''t so nice either.

And it''s just so much more complicated than that. I am not doing it justice. I believe we have created a system that is very difficult for some people to crawl out of, and as the housing crisis continues, along with other economic factors, it''s going to get worse.

If I receive assistance, what would be ok with you for me to buy?

I''m not trying to make excuses for anyone. Are there people who abuse the system? Of course. Should people in the system want to get off assistance, want to "better themselves"? Probably.

And a special nod to the previous poster who mentioned that people are on assistance for a variety of needs.

But that is awfully easy for me to say as I sit here drinking my flavored water (water, which, when purchased, did not turn heads.)

I''m not trying to provoke an argument with anyone, and I can certainly see how the system has turned into a juggernaut that needs serious taming. I just think we need to take care in how we approach solutions, particularly during a slump in the economy. By next week, that person asking about lobster could be me.

I know this is not articulated or organized well. I have pregnancy brain right now, so putting together more than two sentences is tricky. Please blame me and not the education system in this country.

 

[CrookedRock]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:08:06 PM
Author: fieryred33143

Date: 8/18/2008 2:00:54 PM
Author: CrookedRock
Fiery, I don't think anyone (and I know I didn't), put down the people who genuinely need help such as Alicia's Mother. Those people absolutely need help and should get help. It's what the American spirit used to be all about... Helping one another.
I just wanted to point out that no one has put down those who are truly in need. It's the abuse that bothers people, and one reason is bc it creates stereotypes.

That's exactly right. Stereotypes. And its because of those stereotypes that everyone assumed this person asking if they could purchase a lobster with their assistance is abusing the system. This entire debate was because of the stereotype that DF lumped everyone into.

I think MC said it best a few pages ago. We are all debating over something when we have no idea what really happened and none of us were even there.

That's why I was careful to make my comments not about him in particular but if someone were to do that.

Jas~ "If you are third-generation in the cycle, where is the incentive to work if not working will make you as much or more money?"
That's a big problem, and again we created it for ourselves. Damn, how can I blame 'em?

 

[crown1]

Date: 8/18/2008 1:47:30 PM
Author: fieryred33143
This entire thread makes me incredibly sad because to be 100% honest, most of you are talking out of where the sun doesn''t shine.

I am very glad that the majority of you have never had to experience any of this and I would never wish something like government assistance on any of you. I lost a lot of respect for people on here that were usually some of my very favorite posters with this thread.

You can get all political all you want. But when your kids are starving and you have to swallow your pride and ask for assistance, it doesn''t matter who the president is, whether you are a republican or democrat, or if there are millions of Welfare Queens in the world. You do what you have to do for your family.

i respect your thoughts i wish you offered all here the same respect. everyone doesn''t always see eye to eye but we don''t have to attack each other. working for change in your own neighborhood by offering what you can is one good way to get your point across. if that help is offering your own money or assistance or if it is reporting someone abusing the system it is all good. maybe even starting a vent because it gets people thinking.

 

[meresal]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:08:06 PM
Author: fieryred33143

Date: 8/18/2008 2:00:54 PM
Author: CrookedRock
Fiery, I don't think anyone (and I know I didn't), put down the people who genuinely need help such as Alicia's Mother. Those people absolutely need help and should get help. It's what the American spirit used to be all about... Helping one another.
I just wanted to point out that no one has put down those who are truly in need. It's the abuse that bothers people, and one reason is bc it creates stereotypes.

That's exactly right. Stereotypes. And its because of those stereotypes that everyone assumed this person asking if they could purchase a lobster with their assistance is abusing the system. This entire debate was because of the stereotype that DF lumped everyone into.

I think MC said it best a few pages ago. We are all debating over something when we have no idea what really happened and none of us were even there.

Fiery, I don't mean to be a Bia, and I sure hope I don't come off that way... but not everyone that posted in this thread said things like that. Many of us agreed with what MC said about not knowing the situation. We just didn't post multiple paragraphs, that were as noticable.

 

[HollyS]

Date: 8/18/2008 9:38:23 AM
Author: thing2of2
All this talk about tax dollars got me thinking about how much money is being spent on the Iraq war. I did a little poking around and it looks like most estimates say about $300 million a DAY is spent on the Iraq war. Estimates also say we''ve spent almost $1 TRILLION so far. What welfare recipients do with their food stamps is the least of my worries when it comes to misuse of taxpayer dollars.

This country is in the crapper and all people are worried about is ''welfare queens'' popping out kids and buying lobster for dinner? Hilarious.

One of the reasons your country is in the crapper, as you so eloquently put it, is the welfare queens popping out kids.

 

[fieryred33143]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:26:10 PM
Author: meresal

Date: 8/18/2008 2:08:06 PM
Author: fieryred33143

Date: 8/18/2008 2:00:54 PM
Author: CrookedRock
Fiery, I don''t think anyone (and I know I didn''t), put down the people who genuinely need help such as Alicia''s Mother. Those people absolutely need help and should get help. It''s what the American spirit used to be all about... Helping one another.
I just wanted to point out that no one has put down those who are truly in need. It''s the abuse that bothers people, and one reason is bc it creates stereotypes.

That''s exactly right. Stereotypes. And its because of those stereotypes that everyone assumed this person asking if they could purchase a lobster with their assistance is abusing the system. This entire debate was because of the stereotype that DF lumped everyone into.

I think MC said it best a few pages ago. We are all debating over something when we have no idea what really happened and none of us were even there.

Fiery, I don''t mean to be a Bia, and I sure hope I don''t come off that way... but not everyone that posted in this thread said things like that and that may have been stereotypical. Many of us agreed with what MC said about not knowing the situation. We just didn''t post multiple paragraphs, that were as noticable.

Perhaps my use of "everyone" wasn''t accurate. I didn''t mean everyone. I always use the word "everyone" I need to check that

crown-I respect your thoughts as well and your ideas on how to contribute back were spot on. You''re right, not all will see eye to eye or even have to. But there are people, DF in particular, who refuse to see/respect other opinions and instead resort to "

" only when someone agrees with them. Beebrisk and I didn''t see eye to eye but I agreed with everything she (??) said as a response to my post because it was a thorough, legitimate, and honest argument.

Honestly, I doubt this whole "lobster" thing even happen

 

[Irishgrrrl]

Date: 8/18/2008 1:47:30 PM
Author: fieryred33143
This entire thread makes me incredibly sad because to be 100% honest, most of you are talking out of where the sun doesn''t shine.

I am very glad that the majority of you have never had to experience any of this and I would never wish something like government assistance on any of you. I lost a lot of respect for people on here that were usually some of my very favorite posters with this thread.

You can get all political all you want. But when your kids are starving and you have to swallow your pride and ask for assistance, it doesn''t matter who the president is, whether you are a republican or democrat, or if there are millions of Welfare Queens in the world. You do what you have to do for your family.

Fiery, I''m not sure what the intent behind this post was, but I''m sorry you''ve lost respect for some of your favorite posters due to this thread. I''m not sure how you know that your statement highlighted above is true? Certainly you''re not making assumptions about your fellow PSers, based only on outward appearances?

I''m sure it''s probably a safe assumption (if there is such a thing) that "the majority of [us] have never had to experience any of this," but how do you know who has and who hasn''t? How do you know who is talking out of their a$$ and who is speaking from personal experience?

Also, as CR mentioned, I don''t think anyone is belittling those who actually need the assistance.

And I don''t have any kids, but if I did, and if they were starving, and if I had no other alternative, your darn right I''d swallow my pride and ask for assistance. And I would be even more outraged than I already am at the Welfare Queens.

 

[Irishgrrrl]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:26:10 PM
Author: meresal

Date: 8/18/2008 2:08:06 PM
Author: fieryred33143

Date: 8/18/2008 2:00:54 PM
Author: CrookedRock
Fiery, I don''t think anyone (and I know I didn''t), put down the people who genuinely need help such as Alicia''s Mother. Those people absolutely need help and should get help. It''s what the American spirit used to be all about... Helping one another.
I just wanted to point out that no one has put down those who are truly in need. It''s the abuse that bothers people, and one reason is bc it creates stereotypes.

That''s exactly right. Stereotypes. And its because of those stereotypes that everyone assumed this person asking if they could purchase a lobster with their assistance is abusing the system. This entire debate was because of the stereotype that DF lumped everyone into.

I think MC said it best a few pages ago. We are all debating over something when we have no idea what really happened and none of us were even there.

Fiery, I don''t mean to be a Bia, and I sure hope I don''t come off that way... but not everyone that posted in this thread said things like that. Many of us agreed with what MC said about not knowing the situation. We just didn''t post multiple paragraphs, that were as noticable.

ITA with Meresal!

 

[HollyS]

Date: 8/18/2008 9:53:04 AM
Author: miraclesrule
I''m not afraid of any ''gang'' be it ''Republican'' or ''Democrat'', so I don''t need to watch out for anything.

Except for Rich and I look forward to that.

Having said that...I have to ditto thingof2 because that is what I had to bite my tongue on, and I am glad she said it.

The people in this country have let their countrymen down by not taking back their government and not holding them accountable and by taking the time to post on this thread instead of writing to their government official. Maybe even give them a call on a specific topic you are concerned about. Have you ever even called your senator or congressmen/women?

None of know this ''lobster'' person''s story. Maybe they are on assistance because someone is dying and that was the one thing they wanted or could eat. Maybe they were mentally or develomentally ill and couldn''t keep a job. Personally I would feel grateful that I was not in their predicament.

Dancing Fire,
All your recent posts are fairly negative and bash the US. Instead of complaining about complex issues that you think can be reduced to a simple sentence, why don''t show some love to the country where you were given the freedom to thrive and delve more into issues that YOU can help change. If you think a few people can''t change the government, think again...it''s about to happen. The next generation is sick and tired of the mess our generation has and hasn''t done, and they are not going to do the same.

Happy Monday....I am out of this thread.

Whoa! Who are you to tell anyone how they should behave in their adopted country? JUST WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE? And frankly, I''ve never seen anything from DF that would suggest he is not in this country by choice, and thinks very highly of the principles and freedoms the rest of us take for granted everyday. But, he, like you,( because I''m assuming he is a naturalized citizen), has every right to speak up about anything he feels passionately about.

I don''t want to see any more personal name calling, and finger pointing. Once again, a thread has degenerated into a cyber-brawl.

 

[Anna0499]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:32:38 PM
Author: fieryred33143

Perhaps my use of 'everyone' wasn't accurate. I didn't mean everyone. I always use the word 'everyone' I need to check that

crown-I respect your thoughts as well and your ideas on how to contribute back were spot on. You're right, not all will see eye to eye or even have to. But there are people, DF in particular, who refuse to see/respect other opinions and instead resort to '

' only when someone agrees with them. Beebrisk and I didn't see eye to eye but I agreed with everything she (??) said as a response to my post because it was a thorough, legitimate, and honest argument.

Honestly, I doubt this whole 'lobster' thing even happen

I must say that many stories on PS sound less than believable than this one & once we start looking at every thread with a suspicious eye I think PS is headed in the wrong direction. If I don't believe a post I simply don't respond to it or read it. This thread was, for the most part, thought-provoking & interesting to me & I appreciate everyone's posts. As I recall, almost everyone who has posted has conceded that there are a multitude of facts that would make the OP's situation more...acceptable for lack of a better word...but not one person has suggested the abolition of welfare for those who really need it.

ETA: MC simply called the thread a "drama post" & then "annoying" but then proceeded to act like he/she had been contributing to the discussion...I don't really get it.

 

[jas]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:15:51 PM
Author: CrookedRock
That''s why I was careful to make my comments not about him in particular but if someone were to do that.

Jas~ ''If you are third-generation in the cycle, where is the incentive to work if not working will make you as much or more money?''
That''s a big problem, and again we created it for ourselves. Damn, how can I blame ''em?

Ok, I''m admittedly feeling stupid today...I''m not sure if you are being sarcastic or not.


I think there''s plenty of blame to go around, but once fingers have been pointed, then what? I guess that''s what the real debate is about. I wish I had solutions, but they''d have to be multipronged. What this thread definitely shows is that there is a lot of passion about this subject, and a workable solution that would pass through Congress would be tough to come by.

 

[CrookedRock]

Jas~ I was being a lil of both. Honestly though, what''s the motivation to get a job if sitting around pays you the same. That was my point. So, no, I don''t really blame them for thinking that way. I''ll say it again... we created this. (We=voters)

 

[jas]

Date: 8/18/2008 2:46:10 PM
Author: CrookedRock
Jas~ I was being a lil of both. Honestly though, what''s the motivation to get a job if sitting around pays you the same. That was my point. So, no, I don''t really blame them for thinking that way. I''ll say it again... we created this. (We=voters)

Thanks for clarifying. I swear I''m losing IQ points by the minute.

Agreed that we created this. I honestly wish the national debate focused on issues like this, rather than issues of flag pins or what the potential first wives'' cookie recipes are.

I guess this issue can''t be condensed into a sound bite, though...

We need Great Thinkers back in Washington (to a greater extent than they''re there now). Risk-takers, intellectuals, logicians, smarty-pants folks who see that there''s a lot of work to be done that transcends special interests.

We, the people, need to be the Special Interest of our elected officials.

Quick, someone cue the fireworks!

 

[Ali]

I know that the members of Pricescope are mature and civilized enough to keep this most controversial topic on track but I wanted to make a quick reminder to stay away from any personal attacks.
Thank you in advance for your efforts to keep Pricescope a safe and educational forum.

 

[CrookedRock]

***** Fireworks****LOL

 

[Madam Bijoux]

This is a very complex issue that gets increasingly harder to solve. Corporations are downsizing and outsourcing every day. Employees who were earning good salaries are out of work and can't find jobs. They have no choice but to go on assistance after a while. If educated, intelligent people can't find work, how is a person of minimal intelligence with no marketable skills going to find a good enough job to get off assistance? The jobs are just not there any more and a lot of employers don't want to hire someone who has been on welfare or out of work for a long time.

There will always be people who abuse the system but they are not in the majority. I would rather see people get lobster and steak with food stamps than see tax dollars wasted on $600 toilet seats, $800 hammers or cars with chauffers given to elected officials.

The government should definitely re-think its spending priorities. For example: Russia invaded Georgia on a Monday and the U.S. had aid on the way to Georgia by Thursday but the people in New Orleans got nothing for weeks. What's wrong in this picture?