Should i replace centre stone or leave alone

[needfullshinythings]

Hi again everyone, I managed to get a day out trawling and " had " to buy another ring.
The main reason for buying it was the diamonds and their setting as the centre stone is not what you would call " desirable ".
Having thought about it for a couple of days I am convinced the ring would look better with an upgrade, this has left several questions though.

1, would the cost be too much ?

2, Is it no longer a vintage ring once altered

3, Do people actually like these sapphires ?

I personally think the centre stone needs to come out but due to its size the cost may be a little prohibitive, unless you can suggest some possibilities.

The Sapphire measures approx. 10mm x 7.5. depth approx. 5.5mm.


As you can see from the pictures it is " black " most of the time, not to my liking at all.

Any suggestions for a replacement will be gratefully received and all comments/ answers to the questions are most welcome.

TIA.

 

[Starzin]

What a pickup!!! Luuuurve the setting but the sapphire does nothing for me. It reminds me of the inky black blobs we get in Australia that they have the temerity to call sapphires - I've never seen one I like!

Sooooo... can you replace it? Yes. Is retaining it's vintage status important? Not if you're going to wear it and love it as your own since there is very little to set it apart as vintage.

How hard are you on your rings and how often would you wear it?
Tough stones - sapphires (including Montana) and spinel
Slightly less tough, the beryls - aqua, chryso
Very easily abraded - tourmaline

To answer your questions-
1, would the cost be too much ? - How much is too much? How much would you be willing to spend to get a mind-blowing alternative? PSers have been known to find the impossible before today.

2, Is it no longer a vintage ring once altered - correct. But who's to say that it's original as is? To my mind the only reason to preserve "vintage" is when it is immediately obvious i.e. Art Deco, Belle Epoque etc

3, Do people actually like these sapphires ? - I don't and never have, see my first para However Diana/Kate's ring has made everyone think they're desirable - they are not, not once you've seen a sapphire that honours the name you don't forget it.

One other alternative you might have is to ask Jerry Newman whether he thinks he could considerably lighten the tone by re-cutting the pavilion (which retains face up size) since it apparently has just enough depth that he might be able to do it. A pavilion recut for a couple of hundred dollars may well improve it sufficiently for you to wear it more readily while deciding/looking for a replacement.

Even if you don't then like it, at least you would have a better/sparklier stone to sell.

(Edited for spelling)

 

[pregcurious]

Do you have a budget?

 

[Niel]

What a pickup!!! Luuuurve the setting but the sapphire does nothing for me. It reminds me of the inky black blobs we get in Australia that they have the temerity to call sapphires - I've never seen one I like!

Sooooo... can you replace it? Yes. Is retaining it's vintage status important? Not if you're going to wear it and love it as your own since there is very little to set it apart as vintage.

How hard are you on your rings and how often would you wear it?
Tough stones - sapphires (including Montana) and spinel
Slightly less tough, the beryls - aqua, chryso
Very easily abraded - tourmaline

To answer your questions-
1, would the cost be too much ? - How much is too much? How much would you be willing to spend to get a mind-blowing alternative? PSers have been known to find the impossible before today.

2, Is it no longer a vintage ring once altered - correct. But who's to say that it's original as is? To my mind the only reason to preserve "vintage" is when it is immediately obvious i.e. Art Deco, Belle Epoque etc

3, Do people actually like these sapphires ? - I don't and never have, see my first para However Diana/Kate's ring has made everyone think they're desirable - they are not, not once you've seen a sapphire that honours the name you don't forget it.

One other alternative you might have is to ask Jerry Newman whether he thinks he could considerably lighten the tone by re-cutting the pavilion (which retains face up size) since it apparently has just enough depth that he might be able to do it. A pavilion recut for a couple of hundred dollars may well improve it sufficiently for you to wear it more readily while deciding/looking for a replacement.

Even if you don't then like it, at least you would have a better/sparklier stone to sell.

(Edited for spelling)

What makes you say a chryso is less tough than spinel? I've heard the opposite

 

[Starzin]

What makes you say a chryso is less tough than spinel? I've heard the opposite

LOL! Caught me. I dithered about putting it on the first line and then decided because it was a beryl to name it with aqua. Also because the prices for beryl are likely to be less.

To all intents and purposes I'd agree that chryso is as tough as spinel, perhaps even a little better.

Sometimes it's not all about the Mohs scale though but a combination of things which change slightly according to cut, origin, viability (inclusions) from gem to gem in the same family.

 

[Niel]

What makes you say a chryso is less tough than spinel? I've heard the opposite

LOL! Caught me. I dithered about putting it on the first line and then decided because it was a beryl to name it with aqua. Also because the prices for beryl are likely to be less.

To all intents and purposes I'd agree that chryso is as tough as spinel, perhaps even a little better.

Sometimes it's not all about the Mohs scale though but a combination of things which change slightly according to cut, origin, viability (inclusions) from gem to gem in the same family.

Chrysoberyl isn't beryl though.

From my understanding, which is limited, it has a greater hardness, as well as the being difficult to chip makes in a nice candidate.

 

[Starzin]

Chrysoberyl isn't beryl though.

From my understanding, which is limited, it has a greater hardness, as well as the being difficult to chip makes in a nice candidate.

Gah! You're right again. I've obviously been on the forum too long this morning, particularly when I'm trying to clean up my computer and not getting very far at all LOL! Mind in too many places.

Chrysoberyl is indeed a good choice for the reasons you state - and you have found some lovely ones over recent months! One only has to look at some of the gorgeous chrysos on PS to see that it's an outstanding choice with it's colour and durablility.

 

[Niel]

Chrysoberyl isn't beryl though.

From my understanding, which is limited, it has a greater hardness, as well as the being difficult to chip makes in a nice candidate.

Gah! You're right again. I've obviously been on the forum too long this morning, particularly when I'm trying to clean up my computer and not getting very far at all LOL! Mind in too many places.

Chrysoberyl is indeed a good choice for the reasons you state - and you have found some lovely ones over recent months! One only has to look at some of the gorgeous chrysos on PS to see that it's an outstanding choice with it's colour and durablility.

Haha. I know the feeling.

Depending on how the measurements are approx, this might work

http://www.ajsgem.com/chrysoberyl/chrysoberyls/chrysoberyl-3.51-carats.html

 

[Marlow]

Multicolorgems

They have many spinel - 10 x 7,5 is quite large ( to expensive for a sapphire?) - nice blue, lavender and pink.

http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?-1573389318

Only an example....

 

[needfullshinythings]

Good morning all.
Starzin & Niel, thanks for your input and suggestions. The 1st thing I will clarify is that the ring wont be worn by me, it will probably end up with either a friend or family member. Most of the items I find are for this purpose, its a time filling hobby I have.
This is why I am a little worried about the potential cost of replacing the stone, its not small !!!
On the other hand I know for a fact that the sapphire will not be well received.

Pregcurious, as cheap as possible is my budget. I would like to keep the cost down to a minimum otherwise I might as well just do a catch and release and let someone else take the project on.

Niel, thanks for the link. Very nice stone.

Marlow, nothing on there at the moment that fits. Yes a sapphire would be far too expensive !!! I have looked at a few sites but the size I want is just ridiculous on price for anything decent.

Please keep the suggestions coming folks, TIA.

 

[Marlow]

http://wsfgems.com/garnet.html

There are 3 Rhodolites (2,66 ct and the next two).

If you know this material it is a darker color but still very attractive and better looking a real live - maybe a cheap solution.
An untreated gem.

 

[LD]

Love the setting - hate the "sapphire"!

You asked whether people like these inky black sapphires and the answer is yes. There's a market for everything! If you look at the late Princess Diana's ring (now Kate Middletons) you'll see the sapphire is very dark too (although not entirely black)! Personally they're not my cup of tea but I know some on this forum do like them. Why don't you sell the sapphire separately to help fund a different centre stone?

The setting I think will be quite forgiving in terms of a centre stone and you can usually find 10x8mm stones that are calibrated for settings. I suspect that one of this size will fit your setting well. Have a look at www.multicolour.com as they have a great range of different stones and I think, from memory, you can even search by size.

In terms of cost - the ring is likely to be more desireable with a decent centre stone but take your time picking one. The ring will look totally different with another colour centre gem.

Here's a search bringing up all stones from 10-10.999 x 8 - 8.999 (some may be too big) http://www.multicolour.com/gallery/index.html?1633829541

And here's one for 9-9.999 x 7-7.999 which may be safer http://www.multicolour.com/gallery/index.html?1114150145

This is lovely and look at the price!!!!! http://www.multicolour.com/detail/?-1728328997

 

[Marlow]

LD last advice - the rhodolite - would be perfect!!!

A small price - better than my link!! Hurry up!!! Only 9 pieces!!!

 

[needfullshinythings]

Thx for the suggestion Marlow.

LD, many thanks for your input and all the info provided on both threads
The things I try to avoid mentioning on the forum are " price/value " for obvious reasons, But you mentioned selling the sapphire to fund a replacement stone. What do you suggest its potential value could be ? I honestly didn't think it had any re-sale value whatsoever !!!
It would be nice to fund it this way instead of emptying my pockets.

 

[LD]

Thx for the suggestion Marlow.

LD, many thanks for your input and all the info provided on both threads
The things I try to avoid mentioning on the forum are " price/value " for obvious reasons, But you mentioned selling the sapphire to fund a replacement stone. What do you suggest its potential value could be ? I honestly didn't think it had any re-sale value whatsoever !!!
It would be nice to fund it this way instead of emptying my pockets.

I have absolutely no idea as it's not something I would normally look to buy. My suggestion is to look at the known selling websites and see if there's anything similar. Even if you only get $40 (and I'm not suggesting that as a figure) you'll be $40 better off for your next purchase!

 

[Marlow]

Ebay - think it is more then 2 ct!

Auction with 99$ starting price - will sell quickly ( maybe ) natural sapphire untreated! See what will happen...

And no return!!!!!

 

[T L]

That's a gorgeous setting, but the stone doesn't do it justice. I agree, like everyone else, replace that stone.

It's even inkier and blacker than the Kate/Diana ring, and I always regarded that as an overhyped lower quality sapphire. Sorry if that sounds snobby, but that stone has accounted for more overpriced, bad gem purchases than any other celebrity piece.

 

[needfullshinythings]

Not snobby at all TL, honest and to the point !!!
Having had a couple of days to think about it & trawl umpteen sites for a replacement stone I have decided to put some items I have lying around up for sale to fund the project. Hopefully once they have sold I will have a better budget to play with.
Lots of nice alternatives but all come with a hefty price tag unfortunately.
I don't want to ruin the prettiness of the setting so probably best not to rush into anything right now.
I would like to reach out to a cutter to see if they have any " big " old stock stones that would be suitable but being in the UK makes me think this is not a viable option. Any thoughts on this idea ?
TIA all.