Question about contracts with custom jeweler

[effie]

As talked about here, we are having problems with the ring created for us by a custom jeweler.

the jeweler will give us a partial refund but wants to keep 500 dollars for the labor. Of course I think this is ridiculous since it''s the labor we have a problem with (the ring looked nothing like the drawing we were provided and the jeweler cats the metal before we could see a wax)

but anyway, since there was NO contract or agreement regarding his policies for refunding custom work brought to the attention of my fiance, can he REALLY do this? I know he probably feels he''s entitled to some protection, but isnt that what a contract is for? and isn''t that essentially what making a wax is for?

experts et al, what is your position? Legally and ethically? is there some policy regarding this with any professional jewelers organization that i could gently remind this jeweler about? Is this something the JVC would have a position on?

Since we paid for this partially with a visa debit card, it''s covered by the visa resolutions service. Visa''s opinion is that the merch. is "defective" since it''s not what we paid for and that a full refund is in order, but if he refuses we should take him to small claims court. Definitely NOT how I want to remember the beginning of my engagement. I''m hoping to be as informed as possible before i meet with him so that I can reason with him and persuade him to the right (IMO) thing.

Thanks in advance for any insight.

-Effie

 

[mrssalvo]

I think it was mentioned in your other thread to contact the Chamber of Commerce. I would also print out the info you''ve gained on this site in your previous threads. I might be a good idea to have an indepentant appraiser look at the ring. That would verify the ring was put together and not cast and may help to get you your full refund. No way i''d let him keep a penny.

 

[mrssalvo]

also, did you talk to your bank and credit card company about stoping payment?

 

[effie]

well we cant really stop payment anymore, because the check has already cleared and the debit we made for the deposit was like a month ago. i suppose we could have stopped the check, but we didnt feel comfortable taking his merchandise w/o having paid for it. We wanted to keep it all in "good faith" which seems so innocent and naive now, doesnt it?

what would contacting the chamber of commerce do? We are meeting with him on tues so i dont know if we have enough time to go to an appraiser.

it''s so funny- we were so excited about the engagement ring that we didn''t pay attention to the details. (not that any details about his policy were brought to our attention.) a definite learning experience that i hope ends well.

 

[mrssalvo]

Bill Pearlman suggested it and I''m not sure what they will exactly do. I''d guess your local chapter can help you file a claim with the better business bureau and guide you in any further steps you can take. i believe they are non-profit so you can get their help for free.

 

[effie]

mrssalvo-

you mentioned in my other thread that you were afraid we wouldnt get our money back b/c nothing was on paper ( i think thats what you said)

i didnt consider that- i figured that he was the less protected party since there was no contract. Do you mean that jewelers (or any business) can refuse a full refund no matter what? Ack.

 

[mrssalvo]

effie,
you''re really going to need to find an expert. All of the jewelers I have worked with have specific guidelines on refund/return options on custom work so these types of things don''t come up. WF gives 80% back I think, JamesAllen gives a full refund and Quest will make it over and over until you are 100% satified. Since he now has all of your money you are relying on him to give it all back. He said he''d refund all but $500 so i''m not sure, without some help from an outside source he''ll refund the full amount unless he decided to do out of the goodness of his heart. You can''t find anything that says his custom policy on it? Does he have a website? I think you need to name him so others will know what they might be getting into...

 

[valeria101]

Date: 12/3/2005 12:41:31 PM
Author: effie

i didnt consider that- i figured that he was the less protected party since there was no contract. Do you mean that jewelers (or any business) can refuse a full refund no matter what? Ack.

I suppose so... At this point there isn''t much motivation for them to do anything else but get rid of a project they obviously had no interest in doing right to begin with with the least possible loss

$500 seems expensive for the ring you have received anyway. That may make an argument, if you want to haggle.

Doesn''t it look like one of the $275 settings at Blue Nile (here). Not to mention one of those is listed elsewhere for less elsewhere and... well, I suppose thins gives an idea. The shape of the head (pear versus rond) does not change the scenario a bit.

Kind''a sad...

 

[mrssalvo]

ana,
her setting has sidestones in the band that you can't see in the pics and she paid $1500 for the custom job not $500

 

[valeria101]

Date: 12/3/2005 1:10:48 PM
Author: mrssalvo
ana,
her setting has sidestones in the band that you can't see in the pics and she paid $1500 for the custom job not $500

Ok. I did not remember about side stones and they do not show. That makes a bit more sense.

... not that I feel less furious about the lack of full refund

Another thing that does not show in the picture is ... why is this called 'custom'. In the picture the ring it looks very close if not identical to something like THESE. It would make the whole thing sound even worse if a setting Blue Nile can assemble from pre-made parts for $700 was sold as 'custom work' for twice. No wonder no one has ever seen a wax - if there never was one. I hope I am wrong, and things are not so bad.

If the $500 are being claimed for the 'custom work' aspect, it may be helpful to bring up that the piece is not that to any extent (if true, of course). I cannot tell that for sure - this is merely a suggestion for reality check to be considered with the ring at hand.

 

[mrssalvo]

I agree completely ana which is why i think she needs some experts to help out. an independant appraiser would be a great start and help i would think as well as the BBB.

 

[effie]

Oh my god valeria...you''re making me feel awful

just kidding, but seriously i really thought i knew what i was getting into here...what was a fair price etc. but i do think it makes my case stronger- we paid extra for quality and service, which was not provided.

now as for whether or not it was truly custom, we know that the head is not. we knew that from the beginning. we were told that for our budget he couldnt make custom prongs and that he would have to order commercial ones. AND THEN he drew the picture he gave us. Weird right? So naturally we assumed that though he wouldn''t himself be making the prongs, somehow he was going to produce what he drew. What fools. As for the shank, we really want to give him the benefit of the doubt...but off the record I agree with you. It doesnt look particularly custom. But I really think we need to pick our battles. My fiance admittedly left the research to me, and when he would come home from the jewelers he would say things like "oh he''s going to cast the shank etc" and then when he found out that there was no wax he told me "he already cast the ring" so, somewhere he picked up the new vocab of "cast." I know also that he asked the jeweler how he bead set the diamonds, and the jeweler described it as "digging out the metal" So, I''m no expert, but it sounds like the jeweler did cast the ring and work on the settings. At least thats what he says and I don''t know how much I can prove otherwise. Even if an appraiser said it wasnt, and we accused him of this, I think it would really take away some of our leverage. I think we need to pound home 2 points:
-that it just doesnt look like the picture.
- that theres no contract or policy that we have been made aware of, therefore I don''t think he can withhold the money.
Anything more just might make him more indignant.

As for revealing the mysterious ID of this jeweler, I have mixed feelings. It''s just a small store in Charlottesville, and according to windowshopper, they ordinarily do nice work. So when it''s all over I''ll write a post for the record that will either say "yeah he was a jerk at first but he came around and it ended well" or "buyer beware, we had to take the guy to small claims ct" and I''ll name him then. We have yet to meet face to face, because of conflicting schedules, so who knows? maybe he''ll see the error of his ways and recant. Until then, I want to have as much information as possible. And I''m so grateful for everyone''s help.

So it keeping it coming if anyone has another opinion!

 

[gailrmv]

No way should you have to live with this ring you don''t like and that isn''t what you paid for, but I''m not sure if the BBB or chamber of commerce will help or not. The MIGHT, but no way to know until you try. I would do this:
1) Monday, get all the info you can from the BBB and CofC.
2) Tuesday I think you said is when you had the meeting with him. See how it goes - maybe you can get things resolved.
3) Depending on how that goes, if it doesn''t go well, you need to decide if you want to eat the $500 or get a lawyer.

It makes sense to me, and I know what you want is to get a 100% refund. I do believe you deserve that. however as you already know this jeweler does not agree with you and you''ll have to decide what is the best of the practical alternatives. So at this point I would consider, how much am I willing to pay to avoid dealing with a lawyer, court, etc. If you''d be willing to "spend" say $300 to stay out of small claims court, you''d be willing to accept a refund of $1200.

If it were me I would try to find a pre-made piece even if it is not precisely what you want just so that you can enjoy wearing your ring and put this all behind you. Maybe in a few years give the custom thing another try!

Let us know how it turns out.