PhD / doctoral student stress - help :(

[PastryGirl]

Hi all,

I know there are some members here on PS that have PhDs. How did you all deal with the stress? I am close to getting out of my program... for some reason, this semester has ruined my mental health, and I don't know what to do. I have severe anxiety and feel myself spiraling. I meet all the clinical requirements for PTSD. How could this happen from one stupid course?

I am open to any and all suggestions, advice, and pretty much anything anyone has to offer. I cannot go on like this. I don't want to drop out, but I don't know if I can make it through the semester. If I don't finish this course, I will be set back a year. I'm on track to defend next spring and want to get the hell out.

Thank you. <3

 

[Dreamer_D]

I’m a professor at a well-respected research institution and I have been supervising PhD students for about 10 years. If my student came to me and said what you wrote here I would tell them that a degree is not worth your mental health and that there are many interesting career options for people with MSc degrees in our field. I would tell them that there is no shame in withdrawing from a program and that it is not failure to change your mind. I would say that if they need it, they have my permission to leave and I will support them and help them figure out their next steps. I have had this conversation with two students, once initiated by me after I watched them wilt over the course of six months and once initiated by the student. Both are eminently happy in their careers and have no regrets.

 

[PinkAndBlueBling]

First, deep breath. The stress can be horrible. What is so stressful, exactly? Load, peers, professors, your field in general? Let's start with that. You don't need a program to ruin your mental health, so examine what is causing the stress in order to take any further steps. Also, is a PhD necessary?

I am not one to exercise, but swimming and walking helped, as did venting to friends and family. But I also examined the reasons for my stress and made changes where I could.

 

[PastryGirl]

I’m a professor at a well-respected research institution and I have been supervising PhD students for about 10 years. If my student came to me and said what you wrote here I would tell them that a degree is not worth your mental health and that there are many interesting career options for people with MSc degrees in our field. I would tell them that there is no shame in withdrawing from a program and that it is not failure to change your mind. I would say that if they need it, they have my permission to leave and I will support them and help them figure out their next steps. I have had this conversation with two students, once initiated by me after I watched them wilt over the course of six months and once initiated by the student. Both are eminently happy in their careers and have no regrets.

Thank you thank you thank you for replying.

I have cumulative stress from a number of things (having a baby during covid, family crap) and was doing fine in my program until this particular semester/course. The professor is someone I admire and respect as I have known them for a few years. They are also overwhelmed--dare I say this is a case of my professor being a workaholic--so lectures at the end of the day become inconsistent, confusing, and just awful. I've been able to compartmentalize and remove some of my external stressors and am being treated by a professional for this.

I'm a practitioner with a great career, so no, I don't really need the PhD. I have a masters already from before this. I've been teaching for five years at my school (since before I started this program) and would likely say the same to my students if they were this stressed. I need the course for a qualifying exam. I am so ahead of most of my cohort and even the next cohort and know if I can make it through the rest of it if I get through the semester. I want to finish. I just hate this particular course and semester.

*** When I said I am close to getting out of the program I meant close to finishing, not dropping out. ***

 

[PastryGirl]

First, deep breath. The stress can be horrible. What is so stressful, exactly? Load, peers, professors, your field in general? Let's start with that. You don't need a program to ruin your mental health, so examine what is causing the stress in order to take any further steps. Also, is a PhD necessary?

I am not one to exercise, but swimming and walking helped, as did venting to friends and family. But I also examined the reasons for my stress and made changes where I could.

Thank you for replying too.

Yah I love to work out and take walks and be in nature. I've been venting but I feel that I'm becoming obsessive which is not good. My entire class feels this way, it is not just me. The program is aware of that.

Also I'm a mom of two, one teenager and the other is little. A PhD is definitely not necessary, but it is something I've been wanting forever. I love research and I'm really good at it.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

@PastryGirl im afraid i dont know anything about university study of any kind but be kind to yourself and put yourself first
you must be incediblty smart to be studying at that level but health is the most important thing here now i think

 

[Tartansparkles]

If you want it, you breathe and put one foot in front of the other. Only you can decide.

 

[PastryGirl]

@PastryGirl im afraid i dont know anything about university study of any kind but be kind to yourself and put yourself first
you must be incediblty smart to be studying at that level but health is the most important thing here now i think

Thank you. I don't think being smart has anything to do with it; it is more about grit and determination. I never thought I'd have a bachelor's, let alone this. Maybe I just need a vacation.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Another option is lowering your standards a little right now. Just passing might be good enough! Especially with a disorganized prof.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Thank you thank you thank you for replying.

I have cumulative stress from a number of things (having a baby during covid, family crap) and was doing fine in my program until this particular semester/course. The professor is someone I admire and respect as I have known them for a few years. They are also overwhelmed--dare I say this is a case of my professor being a workaholic--so lectures at the end of the day become inconsistent, confusing, and just awful. I've been able to compartmentalize and remove some of my external stressors and am being treated by a professional for this.

I'm a practitioner with a great career, so no, I don't really need the PhD. I have a masters already from before this. I've been teaching for five years at my school (since before I started this program) and would likely say the same to my students if they were this stressed. I need the course for a qualifying exam. I am so ahead of most of my cohort and even the next cohort and know if I can make it through the rest of it if I get through the semester. I want to finish. I just hate this particular course and semester.

*** When I said I am close to getting out of the program I meant close to finishing, not dropping out. ***

Well there is your answer then! Sometimes you need to affirm the way out to affirm you want and can stay in.

 

[PastryGirl]

Another option is lowering your standards a little right now. Just passing might be good enough! Especially with a disorganized prof.

I would be very happy just to pass. Then, I can finish my proposal draft with a clear mind. I don't know if I will stay in academia. I'd love to talk to you more offline; I am curious about your research, I know you're also in social sciences too, right? Maybe I need one of those energizing research idea convos haha.

 

[lovedogs]

Feel free to contact me on one of my LT links. Like @Dreamer_D I'm a professor at a research university and have been supervising PhD students since 2016. I would echo others in that no degree is worth your mental health

 

[PastryGirl]

Feel free to contact me on one of my LT links. Like @Dreamer_D I'm a professor at a research university and have been supervising PhD students since 2016. I would echo others in that no degree is worth your mental health

Thank you.

 

[ItsMainelyYou]

This is why I love PS, and you can do this @PastryGirl it's just a reprioritize and respite you need.
And if no one has said so today in real life, I'm proud of the work and effort you've put in. It's no small effort to take this on.

 

[Dreamer_D]

I would be very happy just to pass. Then, I can finish my proposal draft with a clear mind. I don't know if I will stay in academia. I'd love to talk to you more offline; I am curious about your research, I know you're also in social sciences too, right? Maybe I need one of those energizing research idea convos haha.

Psychology! These days I prefer to mostly stay anonymous online, but energizing convos are a must! Ideally you can have those with your supervisor? Maybe time for a check in? I also often encourage my students to join department or university grad student organizations for conraderie. I know some programs are better at creating that culture than others. My cohort in grad school was so important for my success. And your feelings are super common and normal, I’m sure others will relate.

 

[Roselina]

Just one day after another. You will be fine. You can do it. And if you feel you can‘t, it‘s ok. Take a rest, come back later. If you don‘t, it‘s ok. But take care of yourself. It‘s more important than any title in the world. I did my Dr. degree years ago but have almost forgotten about it. I never use it. Nice to have but that is about it. Take care!!

 

[LilAlex]

How could this happen from one stupid course?

I don't meet every criterion to reply but I have a graduate degree and live and work in this world every day as did my spouse. Our kids are in grad school. I give career advice (solicited!) to trainees and faculty. I am not a superstar but I've done a lot of things.

What you are describing must be pretty close to universal. If you were talking this way about your actual career path and you had 29 more years of this feeling to go, I'd say get out. But this is one semester -- it is finite and self-limited and you can do it. Applying the principle of "minimization of future regret," it makes sense to push through to completion.

Not what you asked but I was at a total low-point early in my training. Exhausted, overworked, overwhelmed, incompetent (as we all were), and had just been dumped by my GF. I had never been really sad before (lucky life, I know) and had never felt so hopeless. I pushed forward and got past it and the world slowly opened up again. And it was so helpful because the next time I encountered this feeling, I could say "I recognize this -- it's not permanent." I don't mean to say that a bad experience is "good experience" -- but I have found that a bad experience can be an important experience. Still, I wish you weren't dealing with this.

I agree with @Dreamer_D: lower your standards a little if it will protect your mental health.

 

[josieKat]

Psychology! These days I prefer to mostly stay anonymous online, but energizing convos are a must! Ideally you can have those with your supervisor? Maybe time for a check in? I also often encourage my students to join department or university grad student organizations for conraderie. I know some programs are better at creating that culture than others. My cohort in grad school was so important for my success. And your feelings are super common and normal, I’m sure others will relate.

I’m also in Psych but at a teaching focused university with less emphasis on my research after largely burning out through a brutal tenure process.

I had an extremely rough semester in grad school (dumped by a boyfriend in a cruel way, resulting in off-the-charts self criticism and depression). Luckily my advisor was supportive when I asked to audit the one class I just wasn’t up to mentally (a regression course taught in the dank basement of our building; luckily I’d already completed a computational modeling course that would count instead). I really just put one foot in front of the other to get through. I had far fewer responsibilities then than you do now (young without kids or partner at the time).

Is there something else in your daily life that you could get a break from to give you a little breathing room as you push through, since it sounds like this is quite situation/course specific? Arrange for a meal delivery service, some extra childcare or activities that give you a break? Have a friend text you just before/after class to remind you it’s the prof and not you and to keep your eye on the goal? Heck, I might make a paper chain and rip off a piece for each class that’s over to help myself focus on getting through!

Moments of great stress and overwhelm are more the norm than not, even in great programs with supportive profs. I don’t train grad students but often have undergrads in my office in crisis over what feel like insurmountable challenges in their thesis projects. We cry, breathe, and focus on those baby steps. It is easier said than done but if you know your goal and have come this far you absolutely can get through.

 

[PinkAndBlueBling]

Does your semester end in May? I used to count the days ahead in the best possible way: xx days left of class with xx days of vacation in between = xx days then break then xx days, days left minus days off for this & that = xx days, get through xx days until a three-day weekend, etc. It really helped me get through the overwhelming sensation of "I can't do this much longer." (My special math also helped during those long days of summer vacation when my kids drove me crazy! )
Try to break it down into manageable chunks.

I hated my cohort. A few of us just banded together and laughed a lot, which was huge for relieving stress and knowing I wasn't alone. I know all too well that a crappy professor can taint your experience and success. You want to do this for yourself, so please find ways to take baby steps through this and to relieve some stress. Maybe your teen can babysit and you can go out once a week or so, or even take a long bubblebath. Hugs to you!

 

[qubitasaurus]

Does your school have a councilor or a psychologist? I think maybe it could be useful to step back and talk to someone in real life about the pressure of keeping all these responsibilities together-- kids, household during/after the pandemic, PhD program, and presumably financials.

Usually phds are marathons, once your coursework ends there is the research and then usually you have a busy period at the end where you're trying to finish up and figure out what you're going to do next. I think maybe some support now in a structured reliable way would be a good idea.

I have roughly 20 scientist now working for me. They all supervise their own (MsC/PhD/research officer) students. As long as the research projects are OK I actually dont worry about the course work outcomes -- it really doesn't matter in the long term.

 

[PastryGirl]

Hey everyone @Dreamer_D @PinkAndBlueBling @Daisys and Diamonds @Tartansparkles @LilAlex @Roselina @josieKat @qubitasaurus @ItsMainelyYou @lovedogs

Thank you for your support during my hard few weeks. It got really bad. I'm sorry I disappeared, but as most of you probably understand, I was a bit consumed with the tasks in front of me. The semester is almost over, thankfully, and my professor has made some very positive changes which have helped all of us in the class. I also bought a really sweet ring from @YadaYadaYada that I decided would be a beacon of hope. I stare at it and it makes me feel better.

I am feeling much better and have been trying to manage my stress. Knowing that I am not alone through this has been really helpful, I think especially more from strangers here on PS than in my cohort, because there isn't anyone quite in my situation in my program. Nobody to fully relate to. Part of that is my own doing since I decided to take on more to finish faster. It can be hard feeling like I am straddling two worlds sometimes. I feel like I don't belong here or there.

For my dissertation, I am SO LUCKY to have the incredible chair that I have. I have complete faith in her. And I also have all of my data! For me, the dissertation is the easy part. Also, thankfully, I do not have to worry about finances. My husband is a little old-fashioned and culturally (in his mind), he is supposed to be the breadwinner anyway. I'm thankful to be where I am after the life I have had.

 

[LilAlex]

I'm thankful to be where I am after the life I have had.

So happy and relieved to hear this positive update!

There will be more ups and downs, as you know. Congratulations on getting yourself past a very dispiriting "low."

 

[Old_Fossil]

@lovedogs gives sage advice - nothing is worth sacrificing your well being. However, it is good to hear you are feeling better about yourself and the process. When I was in my program, I kept telling myself that if it were easy, everyone would do it. I also focused on the positive.

I am interested in your dissertation - what is/are the research questions you seek to answer - or more generally, what are you examining in your paper? When are you scheduled to defend your proposal? Like others here, I have helped many doctoral students through their journey, and have sat on several committees.

You said you weren't considering dropping out, but just are not happy in your current coursework. What is the worst part of the process, and what do you enjoy? Talking it out always helped me, as the conversation always came back to why I was taking it on in the first place. Remember, you aren't boiling the ocean or curing hunger in equatorial Africa with your dissertation, just demonstrating that you can do doctoral level research and writing, and are able to speak to the topic with confidence and evidence based data.

I would love to hear about your topic and how your approach. Stay strong, and remember that it feels really good when you are done.