Jeff White 3+ carat GIA Unheated Sapphire

[Gypsy]

Never seen a color shifter in real life before. I can see more purple in it at night than during the dat but it's not dramatic at all
I can ask the appraiser if it is though.

 

[marymm]

Mary, if it wasn't a Jeff White would you feel better about it?

Well, if it wasn't a Jeff White my expectation in terms of cutting would be different - but I am guessing it is priced as a Jeff White stone? And, while I could probably deal with the wonky symmetry, for me extinction is a deal-killer - extinction makes me unhappy to the extent that, while I do own a few stones with extinction, I don't set them and I no longer buy them. But, that's me.

I definitely can see the appeal of this sapphire and do think it would be beautiful in the half-moon setting - it just comes down to whether your eyes will be drawn to the beauty of the stone when you look down at the ring, or if you will be more likely to fixate on the extinction.

 

[Gypsy]

I promise I understand how hard pricing is with so little info but can you give me a range? More than... 1k... 2k ...3k...5k....

The heated sapphires I was looking at were at 1200-1600 a carat. Unheated didn't have enough comps for me to judge?

 

[chrono]

Depending on quality and who you buy it from, Simply Sapphires has a 2 ct unheated stone for $1.6K total and AJS has a 2 ct unheated stone for $5K.

 

[0-0-0]

For reference, Gemfix has a couple unheated stones between 2 -3 ct that lists for around 1k/ct.

http://www.gemfix.com/sapphire_blue.html

 

[Gypsy]

Yeah.. but the stones over 3 carats jump to more than that per carat, I know that from my own hunt. So it's not as helpful as it might be if there was a three carat unheated for a comp. Believe me I was shopping all those sites and couldn't find a heated 3 sapphires carat for under 4k that didn't have a huge window plus zoning.

ETA: Looks like I have my answer: I need the appraiser and need to live with the stone to decide.

Mary, that was a very good post. Your are right. Whichever it is that I see when I look at the stone is the key. If I see color and size that I like. Good. If I see wonk and extinction, then it's not good. That was a very helpful post.

You've all been really helpful. I'll update when the appraiser looks at it.

 

[FrekeChild]

I have a similar stone, in that it's blue and an elongated cushion. However it's smaller, spinel and not precision cut.

It also has the half and half extinction and the "rolling" effect.

I'm intrigued by your quest. These are for price comparison only as I cannot stand Natural Sapphire Company. But since you wanted unheated comparisons, I went straight to the source.

This stone is Ceylon, has a little bit of a bowtie:
http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com/Sapphires/Blue/B4108/Cushion/stoneid=B4108

This stone is Kashmir, has a window:
http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com/Sapphires/Blue/B2670/Cushion/stoneid=B2670

I feel like this one might be the closest to the color of yours? Also has a bowtie.
http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com/Sapphires/Blue/B4488/Cushion/stoneid=B4488

Oval, window
http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com/Sapphires/Blue/B4446/Oval/stoneid=B4446

 

[decodelighted]

The outline doesn't bother me at all .... but the stripey appearance kinda does. Is that the extinction? I am a B**B when it comes to colored stones -- TOTAL novice/amateur/tool!

 

[Starzin]

The outline doesn't bother me at all .... but the stripey appearance kinda does. Is that the extinction? I am a B**B when it comes to colored stones -- TOTAL novice/amateur/tool!

LOL! Yes The "black" stripes are where the stone is not returning light and the colour is therefore "extinct". It happens most often with ovals/cushions though can happen to any shape if the cutter isn't determined for there not to be one. Pears will often have a "bow tie" (it looks just like one) across the middle which is effectively the same thing.

Gypsy: Firstly I like the colour but I wear a (red) garnet every day that is "half and half". I didn't know that's what it was when I got it years ago, not sure I even realised it had extinction, I just knew I felt naked without a garnet - not that it's THAT big mind you If I had the choice to buy/not buy today I would be torn because I love this particular colour and there are times the light hits it just right and most of the extinction becomes secondary. So...I love my garnet's colour but I soooo wish it wasn't extinct. I hope I'll never buy another extinct gem. I think I feel the same way about your blue. Only you know how deeply you love the colour, the price you paid and whether they outweigh the extinction. You're right in that Mary's post says it, I'm just duplicating I guess.

Freke's links just go to show that comparison is useless really - somewhere between $4,000 and $76,000 for a 3+ct sapphire. Though I'll take any of them if they're giving them away It comes back to: is it worth it to you? Do you love it that much?

 

[Gypsy]

I have a similar stone, in that it's blue and an elongated cushion. However it's smaller, spinel and not precision cut.

It also has the half and half extinction and the "rolling" effect.

I'm intrigued by your quest. These are for price comparison only as I cannot stand Natural Sapphire Company. But since you wanted unheated comparisons, I went straight to the source.



I feel like this one might be the closest to the color of yours? Also has a bowtie.
http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com/Sapphires/Blue/B4488/Cushion/stoneid=B4488

This one is close. Okay. That was helpful Freke.

What's the "rolling effect"?

Does heating do anything to the sapphire's color?

 

[chrono]

The rolling effect is when the extinction moves around. When you move the stone one way, the extinction might be on the left. When you move it the opposite way, the extinction is now on the right hand side, hence the term "rolling effect".

Heating improves the colour of less than desireable sapphires. As an example, a darker grayish blue sapphire can be heated to become a bright almost pure blue sapphire (eliminating most of the gray), thereby increasing its value from pittance to several hundred/thousand dollars.

 

[violet3]

Not to get off topic Gypsy, but I wondered where you were getting your half moon sides for the sapphire? I keep my eyes open in case a future possibility arises to make a ring like that, but I never see half moons online. I think the setting you chose is fluid and beautiful too!

 

[Gypsy]

Thanks so much for the explanation. I pulled it out again today and it's still the perfect color for me. Extinction is there, but I'm not fixated on it. Color and size make me smile.

I'm going to wait till Saturday to take it in to the appraiser, but the way I figure it is: you guys are giving me your opinions based on your experiences, which are many more than mine. But ultimately even if I spend 75k on a stone, it might still have window, or a bow tie, or some extinction. It's not a matter of finding the perfect stone for the board, it's about finding one with 'flaws' I can live with, and only I can make that call.

Violet, call any of the diamond vendors that are considered lower priced: ERD, IDJ, Eternity Diamonds and try to stick with what they have in house (usually a lot cheaper). I like the setting a lot too, I'm glad you did as well. I originally wanted Steven to do a three stone for me, but I just can't justify the price of a handforged setting. I really can't. So, CAD and cast it is.

 

[movie zombie]

..... It's not a matter of finding the perfect stone for the board, it's about finding one with 'flaws' I can live with, and only I can make that call. .......

very very very true!

 

[Lula]

..... It's not a matter of finding the perfect stone for the board, it's about finding one with 'flaws' I can live with, and only I can make that call. .......

very very very true!

I agree. This has been my experience. Sure, I can see the half-half extinction, the wonkiness to the cut, and the slightly grey tone, but despite those things, I think it is a beautiful stone and a great size -- and unheated! If the price is right and if the size and shape are what you are looking for, I think it is a smart purchase, provided the appraisal doesn't raise any red flags. I think it will be even more beautiful when set with diamonds in the design you've chosen.

It's been my experience that a) photography never captures what we see in real life and can make extinction, bowties, etc., look either worse (or better) when the stone is seen in 3-D under a variety of lighting conditions; b) every one's monitor is different, and color is really hard to judge on the computer screen; c) gemstones that you intend to wear should flatter your skin tone, and sometimes the textbook perfect color does not compliment a wide variety of skin tones.

I've found through some expensive trial and error that stones with red and pink undertones are really unattractive on me, and the textbook-perfect, electric blue of many Ceylon sapphires is much too harsh with my skin tone -- though I am drawn like a moth to a flame to that color! I just can't wear it. Stones with a bit of grey actually look better on me. However, for collecting (leave-it-in-the-gembox) purposes, I'd look for perfect color, and have to compromise a lot on size.

 

[Gypsy]

I talked to the seller, apparently the stone was cut for weight and was not fully precision cut. Jeff bought it as a native cut and improved it, but couldn't go below 3 carats without significant loss of worth. So he knows it has flaws.

That makes sense to me.

 

[LD]

Gypsy a few thoughts from me.

I don't think your stone is a colour shifter. I think what you're seeing is simply the colour shifting very slighting in different light settings which is normal for most gemstones. I could be wrong but I don't see any evidence in your photos that it might be a shifter as the photos are very very similar. If it were a shifter I would expect the photos to be less uniform.

I do see the extinction half/half effect. This will unfortunately not go even with a recut unless you lose a substantial amount of weight and that would be very silly to do! I have a couple of half/half stones - one of them I couldn't live without because the half/half is so incredibly different that it actually MAKES the gem! The others I can't bear because it bugs the life out of me! Think seriously whether the dark half will become an issue for you before you decide to set or keep.

Because of the extinction the stone is looking darker than it might do otherwise. I suspect it will darken once set. Probably not a huge amount but it will be darker. Would you still love it if that happened?

As for the cut - well for me that's part of nature! Some of the most beautiful things on earth are not symmetrical, think of mountains, clouds, sunsets etc! Gemstones are the same! What I wouldn't factor into the equation is who cut it. For me, that's a non-starter because it doesn't add value - if it's a beautiful gem, it's a beautiful gem. I most definitely wouldn't re-cut it though because to get it as you may want I think you'd have to lose a significant amount of weight that may have a knock on effect to the colour also.

 

[Gypsy]

LD, that was a fabulous post. Thank you so much for taking the time to explain your experience.

NOW, I spent the day at Joe Escobar with a TON of sapphires in every time of setting, most of which were slightly lighter than mine. Some of which were bluer, some of which were grayer, some of which were more violet.

I REALLY love the color of my stone. It's not a color shifter. And it looks great to me, even with the extinction because of the faceting, even the rolling dark half shows life. And if I wear it with the wider side up, then the outline doesn't bother me. I see color when I see it, not extinction.

It will darken a little when set. I popped it into 8-9 settings to see what I thought. And overall, I'm very pleased but would NOT bezel it (was never planning on it, but it was solidified).

They are very experienced with colored stones there and several of their GIA graduate appraisers looked at it and enjoyed it.

It apparently has some very cool inclusions specific to unheated stones.

They did say that it's hue is darker than the ones they prefer to stock but still a nice blue, and that at full retail they would expect the stone to fetch about 3,000 a carat since it's not just unheated but has a GIA certificate that states that, adding to it's value.

I tried it on in many different settings and enjoyed watching it perform in different ways, depending on the setting style.

Over all, I don't think I can get a nicer stone in my budget that suits me as much as this one does in color. So I'm keeping it!

YAY!

 

[Starzin]

Congratulations Gypsy! You've done everything you possibly could as far as advice, viewing other sapphires, trying settings and it STILL speaks to you - I hope it brings you much joy every time you look at your hand once it's set It's a bonus that Joe Escobar (staff) confirmed that it's a good price also.

I think the 3-stone with moonstones will be beautiful - onward to the setting!!! I hope you're feeling very proud and happy right now

 

[Gypsy]

Thank you Starzin! It will be set with diamonds. I accidentally wrote Moonstones cause my mind is on them for a different reason. D'oh.

I'm happy with the decision. Also I have a possible vintage setting that might work with it. So it may not be a three stone after all. We'll see how it goes!

I will need 5x3, not 4x2.6 halfmoons if I do a three stone though. I verified that today as well. Lots of options for a classic sapphire setting. Which is FUN!

 

[Gypsy]

OKAY.

PICS, thanks to Clairetek, of the sapphire in different settings.

 

[Starzin]

Rofl! I said moonstones yet knew very well you were contemplating diamond half-moons

I like all of those settings! The last one's a bit different but I have to admit, wonky or no, it does seem to perk up a bit in the halo.

 

[Gypsy]

I KNOW! And the last thing I wanted was a halo. Argh. And I can't afford a decent halo right now and since this is my only RHR and ONLY colored stone I refuse to settle for inferior pave. Damn it.

I keep seeing a split shank halo though.

 

[minousbijoux]

Hi Gypsy So I went looking at Joe Escobar's stock and I found a halo with side half moon diamonds! Its probably way too much bling for you, but I wanted to point it out as it seemed to have the components you are looking for...

Hopefully, I can attach a photo

 

[LD]

Gypsy - I love your last post explaining your experience at the jewellers. What's absolutely crystal clear is that you LOVE the sapphire and that's exactly what it's all about. I'm so pleased for you.

It's interesting seeing the different settings. I have setting #1 and it's not my favourite and looks a little "blah" in real life (I've got a tanzanite in mine). I adore adore adore the second setting with the halo. The sapphire seems to breathe in that setting and WOW doesn't it look substantial! That is absolutely my favourite. The other I like is the design with the half moons - that will be a very substantial ring. Are you okay with that much bling? If so, I think that might be a contender as well! I would wear that happily but not sure if it's an every day ring.

What I would say is to save up for THE setting. Don't settle for second best. You've found a sapphire that speaks to you so make sure the setting does too.

 

[movie zombie]

your pictures, my preference: #1 and #3.
not that you asked!

i think you've done very thing right. you spent time with as many sapphires as you could to see the differences. this is a mistake that many people make: not spending the time with the stones themselves...as many as possible whether in one location or many locations. w/o seeing the stones, its impossible to develop the eye and your taste. and know what is available in your budget.

to get a sapphire w/o extinction at all would be in the liz taylor budget range. most of us do not have that. we make compromises. and we all have different eyes and likes as well as dislikes. what we dislike in one stone we might accept in another because of other "virtues". i think you have one of those stones!

congratulations and welcome to the wonderful world of color stones, gypsy!

 

[distracts]

I love the color! From your pictures, I think mine is a somewhat similar color (not the same, but in the same family). I find the purple tone in mine does look significantly more purple at times, but darned if I could tell you what lighting situations are causing that.

My sapphire also has some extinction. It's not ideal, but I too looked at a billion sapphires in person, and while many of them were quite nice, this was The One. If I could have found this color in bigger and less extinct, I'd have gotten it, but I couldn't (or at least couldn't from a brick-and-mortar jeweler in our city, and my fiance wasn't comfortable buying online), so I got this one. And have been perfectly happy with it. It may not be ideal to PS standards, but I cannot count the number of people who have told me it's the most beautiful, bluest sapphire they've ever seen. I get a comment like that about every week, and have for the past year since I got my ring. I'd probably have taken your sapphire if they had it at my jeweler instead of mine!

 

[T L]

I have to say in this case, as much as I love halos, please do not halo this stone, as it will look like the million billion copies of the Kate/Diana ring. Of course, if that ring never existed, I think it would look nice in a halo, but as everyone knows, I'm halo crazy.

 

[Gypsy]

Thanks so much for your posts!

I am looking at a second hand deco setting right now, hoping to make it work for my stone. That's my first choice.

But if I DO go for a halo, as this is for a RHR it won't look anything like Princess Diana's. I would do a split or twist shank and play with the design a bit. Something like this in concept: http://www.gabrielengaged.com/style/ER7804W44JJ

 

[Gypsy]

Minous! That's Maya's ring, she's Erik's wife. It's gorgeous and looks perfect on her. I agree it has a lot of elements I am considering!

LD, I really do appreciate it and going to the jeweler was the exact right choice. I agree that it really seems to 'breathe' in the halos. And there are so many cool halo styles out there to explore. So... definitely on the list! I won't settle. If it takes a while, it takes a while. But since I DO love it, I want it on my finger, darn it!

MZ-- yeah, it was invaluable to have so many different sapphires there. It really made me realize what I prefer in terms of color and what I can live with and what I can't. Of course, that's much easier with sapphires than with other stones as there is more selection. Thank you for the congratulations! ((HUGS))

DIstracts, great post! Thank you. Yeah, for me this thread has been great because it really illustrates the difference between colored stones and diamonds. And as I'm usually dealing with diamonds on RT, realizing what is right for me and I really enjoy this color. Yours sounds lovely too! Now I have to find a setting!

TL, I posted the type of halo I would consider above. It won't look anything like those copies.